I miss the Horde

[Ichikitsune]

Alot of guys here are missing the point. I have nothing to fight FOR. So I play the good guy in an evil empire, half my world quests are just evil. I don't want to do them.

 

There is no faction pride, no leader that is wise beyond belief you would give your life for.

 

The Emperor? Doing all that fighting on Illum flashpoints to keep him seated and prepare for his return to the Dark Council?

[Jett-Rinn]

I hate loathe and detest the so called faction pride and I am so glad Bioware remains faction neutral.

 

Hordeco...I mean Blizzcon was canceled this year due to faction pride; Terry Cements (the really Attractive girl in the NE costume last year) is suing Blizzard and Activision after being physically assaulted while a security Guard watch by three people showing their faction pride at last years con.

 

If you Miss the Horde so much WoW is still there and Blizzard is still making the game all about them.

[Lundli]

 

BW always focuses on the Empire as pure bad guys, blood thirsty and murderous killing machines. This is very black/white and not levels of grey.

 

To me it seems more like black / grey so far.. more like evil / dodgy

[Khryn]

I went pure Dark Side on my Guardian. It is pretty well hilarious to watch the reactions of my companions when you kill someone.

 

The Esseles had me cracking up when the whole group chose Light Side and I chose Dark and won the social roll.

[PjPablo]

I hate loathe and detest the so called faction pride and I am so glad Bioware remains faction neutral.

 

Wouldn't true faction neutral be no factions?

 

I don't see a problem with some faction pride. Seems like it creates a sense of engagement in the player when they dedicate to one faction or the other. Granted some fools take it waaay too far like your Blizzcon example. That's just over the top. But, like all things I think 'faction pride' in moderation can be healthy for a MMO.

[Scar]

Is the Horde not available any longer in WoW, or something?

[Azzras]

Alot of guys here are missing the point. I have nothing to fight FOR. So I play the good guy in an evil empire, half my world quests are just evil. I don't want to do them.

 

There is no faction pride, no leader that is wise beyond belief you would give your life for.

 

That's because your leader will TAKE your life.

 

You do not give it to him, it is his by right.

 

Maybe you should roll Republic and blast the imps into oblivion.

 

If the force is your thing, the Jedi do not have to live by the code: Obi Wan, Qui Gon, Anakin, etc.

 

You can be as twisted as you want to be, or as honorable.

[Icebaron]

I hate loathe and detest the so called faction pride and I am so glad Bioware remains faction neutral.

 

Hordeco...I mean Blizzcon was canceled this year due to faction pride; Terry Cements (the really Attractive girl in the NE costume last year) is suing Blizzard and Activision after being physically assaulted while a security Guard watch by three people showing their faction pride at last years con.

 

If you Miss the Horde so much WoW is still there and Blizzard is still making the game all about them.

 

Nothing you said here makes any sense to me at all.

[el_pinko_grande]

I think you missed something in WoW if you think that the Horde were "misunderstood, honorable bad guys." They weren't supposed to be bad guys at all! The Horde and Alliance were supposed to have equally defensible points of view.

[Jett-Rinn]

I think you missed something in WoW if you think that the Horde were "misunderstood, honorable bad guys." They weren't supposed to be bad guys at all! The Horde and Alliance were supposed to have equally defensible points of view.

 

Actually Metzen said many times that the Alliance was created more or less for the Horde to beat up on; that is why the Alliance lore is so thin and the Hordes is much more fleshed out.

[Knockerz]

I only miss my blood elves. They look cute and angry all time. You can't exactly replicate that with swtor. However, I don't miss their awful animations of blood elves. Thus, ultimately I have to say I like swtor more due to better animation and better human proportions. I do agree with a previous poster that said horde players at Blizzcon were getting out of hand. I read a few cases where people were assault at Blizzcon for simply showing they were alliance players. The wow horde fan base is just awful now. Edited February 15, 2012 by Knockerz

[Yuuj]

Actually Metzen said many times that the Alliance was created more or less for the Horde to beat up on; that is why the Alliance lore is so thin and the Hordes is much more fleshed out.

 

Hahahahaha. Oh God, you're one of those.

[Ichikitsune]

Hahahahaha. Oh God, you're one of those.

 

It's actually true, it was said back in the Warcraft days.

[Jett-Rinn]

Hahahahaha. Oh God, you're one of those.

 

Yes I am one of those people that actually reads and comprehends what the Blizzard developers tell us.

 

No applause....just throw money

[Yuuj]

Yes I am one of those people that actually reads and comprehends what the Blizzard developers tell us.

 

No applause....just throw money

 

Pfthahahahahahaha.

 

It's actually true, it was said back in the Warcraft days.

 

Back in... Warcraft days? You mean back when Warcraft was only an RTS? /boggles

[Jett-Rinn]

Pfthahahahahahaha.

 

 

 

Back in... Warcraft days? You mean back when Warcraft was only an RTS? /boggles

 

 

Actually if you were at Blizzcon 2005 you would have heard Chris Metzen and Rob Pardo say the same thing at the WoW Q&A panel.

[PulseRazor]

Republic vs Empire is a political faction theme, and within any political system there is room for good and ill, hemce the constant themes of Republic Corruption, implying that is isnt against cannon for a Republic citizen to be dark side alligned. There have even been instances in the Clone Wars cartoons where Empire citizens were very moral and 'light alligned'. Being conquered by an evil empire doesent make you evil.

 

There is plenty opportunity for a emp to be 'good'

[Spartanik]

The Sith are fueled by passions, not purely rage. Happyness, Love, Hate, Friendship, etc. Whatever the emotion is, the Sith embrace it fully, where the Jedi attempt to be without emotions which will cloud their decisions.

yes sith are fueld by passions... love is not one of them. LOVE isnt a passion love for a sith would be an obsession not true love. Get your facts straight the jedi arent without emotions. They just dont let them rule them they prefer reason over their self needs.

Sith fueled by happyness? lol

Hey dont get me wrong i like the whole sith thing, but lets not make them the good guys, because they are realy not.

The jedi dont put emotion aside, they accept emotion, but in order to not be overcome by raw emotions that lead to the darkside(wich is bad it corrupts your very being) they created the mantra.

The best jedi code starst like this Emotion, yet peace.

[Baalazar]

I actually do understand it, but they forgot to add a Mandalorian faction, which would of along the lines of what I am talking about.

 

So, left with evil empire or pansy Republic.

 

Mandalorians are incredibly evil. They commit mass genocides and destroy unarmed civiliians.

[Yuuj]

 

 

Actually if you were at Blizzcon 2005 you would have heard Chris Metzen and Rob Pardo say the same thing at the WoW Q&A panel.

 

I was at the 2005 Blizzcon. Murlocs were the topic of discussion, not faction favoritism. I do remember something Metzen said at a Blizzcon though that contradicts the whole favoritism argument and makes it seem more like the Blizzard crew was trying to get people to roll Horde... Metzen's favorite lore character is still Malfurion, not Thrall.

 

You got played. Blizzard started hyping the Horde because of a faction imbalance that existed early on in the game and it worked. Conspiracy nuts who started inventing their own 'evidence' just took off and made the whole thing spread like wildfire. Saved them from having to make pro-Horde commercials. They just drop a 'for the horde' comment and sit back and laugh when the nuts lose their heads.

 

Metzen's ingame NPC character is a Human and Rob Pardo's trading card character is a Night Elf cuz they love dem Hordies so much.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Yuuj

[purrcatnip]

yes sith are fueld by passions... love is not one of them. LOVE isnt a passion love for a sith would be an obsession not true love. Get your facts straight the jedi arent without emotions. They just dont let them rule them they prefer reason over their self needs.

Sith fueled by happyness? lol

Hey dont get me wrong i like the whole sith thing, but lets not make them the good guys, because they are realy not.

The jedi dont put emotion aside, they accept emotion, but in order to not be overcome by raw emotions that lead to the darkside(wich is bad it corrupts your very being) they created the mantra.

The best jedi code starst like this Emotion, yet peace.

 

You clearly have not read any of the canon. Jedi strive to live without emotion, or to distance themselves from it whenever possible. Emotion clouds judgement. It is impossible to be truely without it entirely, and that of course is something many accept.

 

While the Dark Side is most commonly associated with hatred, there are plenty of individuals who are 'loving' and the such who are still dark side.

 

A quick note; the core of Sith teachings, more so in the pre naga sadow days, is Passion.

 

Peace is a lie, there is only passion.

Through passion, I gain strength.

Through strength, I gain power.

Through power, I gain victory.

Through victory, my chains are broken.

The Force shall free me.

 

 

Nothing here says

"With Passion, I grow hateful, and murder everyone"

 

Passion is the root of power, through power you conquer obstacles, and through conquering obstacles, you are free of the concepts that bind you.

 

The Sith is about empowerment, not about mass genocide and wearing black. Sadly in modern media (film, games) we tend to portray only this side of the sith, instead of the much richer group that is alive in the cannon books.

 

Look at Jacen Solo from Legacy, he does not fit the bill of 'i wear black and must murder everyone' sith, despite the fact he wasnt the nicest Sith Lord, he becomes one over his immense love for his child, and wants nothing other than to protect his progeny from the threats of the galaxy. His passion drives him to become stronger, to gain power, to gain victory over those that would threaten his child (either real threats or those he may have imagined).

 

Regardless point is, the Sith BW portrays are one sided and sad, which is a shame given KOTOR and KOTOR2 attempted to show the Sith in more shades of gray than simply bad guys.

[Zatoni]

yes sith are fueld by passions... love is not one of them. LOVE isnt a passion love for a sith would be an obsession not true love. Get your facts straight the jedi arent without emotions. They just dont let them rule them they prefer reason over their self needs.

Sith fueled by happyness? lol

Hey dont get me wrong i like the whole sith thing, but lets not make them the good guys, because they are realy not.

The jedi dont put emotion aside, they accept emotion, but in order to not be overcome by raw emotions that lead to the darkside(wich is bad it corrupts your very being) they created the mantra.

The best jedi code starst like this Emotion, yet peace.

 

'Love is not one of them' because it clashes with most of the boring writers who want to make sure people don't have to be challenged by defining Good and Evil by more than whether you throw rocks or lightning.

 

The Sith Code is about using your passions to break free of the restrictions that other people place on you. It only says strong emotions and the willingness to act on them are the keys to setting yourself free, it doesn't say you have to be a sociopathic murderer.

 

Kamina would find the Sith Code to be right up his alley. If you want an example of what a zealous Light Side, positive emotion Sith might look like, watch Gurren Lagann.

[OldVengeance]

 

Regardless point is, the Sith BW portrays are one sided and sad, which is a shame given KOTOR and KOTOR2 attempted to show the Sith in more shades of gray than simply bad guys.

 

When? There wasn't a single sith that wasn't evil in either game.

 

Sith were always intended to be the bad guys in Star Wars fiction. It isn't recent portrayals given them a bad rep, they've always been that way because they were always supposed to be. Sith doctrine is about more than just passion, at it's core it's about extreme selfishness and unrestricted pursuit of power at all costs.

Edited February 15, 2012 by OldVengeance

[Spartanik]

You clearly have not read any of the canon. Jedi strive to live without emotion, or to distance themselves from it whenever possible. Emotion clouds judgement. It is impossible to be truely without it entirely, and that of course is something many accept.

 

While the Dark Side is most commonly associated with hatred, there are plenty of individuals who are 'loving' and the such who are still dark side.

 

A quick note; the core of Sith teachings, more so in the pre naga sadow days, is Passion.

 

Peace is a lie, there is only passion.

Through passion, I gain strength.

Through strength, I gain power.

Through power, I gain victory.

Through victory, my chains are broken.

The Force shall free me.

 

 

Nothing here says

"With Passion, I grow hateful, and murder everyone"

 

Passion is the root of power, through power you conquer obstacles, and through conquering obstacles, you are free of the concepts that bind you.

 

The Sith is about empowerment, not about mass genocide and wearing black. Sadly in modern media (film, games) we tend to portray only this side of the sith, instead of the much richer group that is alive in the cannon books.

 

Look at Jacen Solo from Legacy, he does not fit the bill of 'i wear black and must murder everyone' sith, despite the fact he wasnt the nicest Sith Lord, he becomes one over his immense love for his child, and wants nothing other than to protect his progeny from the threats of the galaxy. His passion drives him to become stronger, to gain power, to gain victory over those that would threaten his child (either real threats or those he may have imagined).

 

Regardless point is, the Sith BW portrays are one sided and sad, which is a shame given KOTOR and KOTOR2 attempted to show the Sith in more shades of gray than simply bad guys.

I did read some of the canon, in every single time the sith are the bad guys.... what is up to you?

In KOTORs the sith werent grey... they were also evil... the main characters story might have been greish but not their enemies. God for you to say that KOTOR is grey.... its one of the most black and white games i played. KOTOR 2 was much more darker and grey on that aspec yet the darksiders were all evil... name one that it wasnt? Kreia? lol no she was evil. sion was evil.. nihilius? realy? the diference is they realy had interesting personal stories.

 

The way i see it to portrait jedi as a "robots" without emotions is a wrong picture, and the wrong ideia what the jedi are. they strive to not let their emotions to have the better of them, because that could lead to the dark side, and corrupt them.

True to be told the sith arent as complex has you think they are. Nor the jedi for that matter. when you put your own feelings above reason and others nothing good comes out of it. It makes sense to me. that is one of the reasons why the sith are the way they are. whataver goals they have.

 

Nothing here says

"With Passion, I grow hateful, and murder everyone"

yet that is what they mostly end up doing in most of the canon, the philosophy cant live without conflict, so they will end up always bringing war and death. This code is there to help Darksider users to tap on to Dark side power of the force, wich george Lucas cleary states its evil...because the darkside of the force fuels on hanger and hate, and all of these are ruled by fear.. its not fueled by true love or happyness or reason. It requires raw agressive emotions to tap into the darkside fully. that is why the sith cant be Good philosophycaly speaking. Unless you are sugesting you can tap teh darkside of tehforce by using positive emotions like compassion, and happyness.... cleary not so.

'Love is not one of them' because it clashes with most of the boring writers who want to make sure people don't have to be challenged by defining Good and Evil by more than whether you throw rocks or lightning.

well yes ultimatly you can blame the writers and george it self for things not being the way you invision it... but hey thats the way they made it. sith evil jedi good. The end.

You can ask if there is good people and bad people in both sides? off course there are. But You cant argue philosicaly, to say the sith ideia is moraly good.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Spartanik

[AriochX]

I dont miss the horde. I know exactly where they are... maybe you should go visit them.

 

Just because the Sith do not respect non Sith, doesnt mean they have no honor, just a twisted version of it. They see others as weak and see it as their duty to eradicate weakness.

 

Why should they show honor to worms who are beneath them?

 

Show them strength to get their respect.