Why not a SWG 2 instead of a similar Kotor 3?

[Iskareot]

You can't licence the same licence twice (admittely Lucasarts might like too).

 

You mean how SOE still has Clone Wars? Or that let's face it and if SWG was making money it would still be active.

 

I mean really... lol this is not a LIC issue.

 

If SWG was making 15.00 a month on 1 million people... you think it would have been shut down?????

 

Right... it was close at launch and that was it.

 

While I am SURE the LIC played a role in the renew process I would think that the server merging and DELETING of some of the servers taking it down to like 4 would have been the writing on the wall prior to DELETING the game itself.

 

Anytime you have to merge servers down to like 4... that could not be good and when some of us had the free (LOG IN AND SEE YOUR FRIENDS) and your list of 250 people is empty that tells you something.

 

Not to mention you can CLICK ON LUKES HEAD AND BE INSTANT JEDI!!! lol..

 

Right....lol I can give you a list of 100 things of why SWG failed and that was after it was up for 8 years/.

[sanctified]

ThemePARK? In SWTOR your clearly on a train on a railtrack.

 

A Themepark and Sandbox in 1 mmorpg would be awesome.

 

No one will argue that TOR isn't linear. Yes, it is on a rail. There are even green glowing walls to tell you where to proceed, and red glowing ones that indicate where to stop.

 

But it's fun. I sincerely believe that there will never be a game that will offer the total freedom that people seem to crave. Something like that will never exist in a game, ever. It's an impossible fantasy. It's like finding fault with Tahiti for not being the the Elysian fields.

[shdwfx]

Maybe the people can look and see when SWG closed it servers and then see when SWTOR opened it servers.

 

LA shut down SWG because they are now with SWTOR

 

Despite people liking to think it was due to subs.....

 

People saying SWG shut down due to low subs is sort of mis-information.

 

SWG shut down because the license ran out. SWG is a "canon" game that had to be approved by LA SWTOR is not in the cannon universe.

Edited February 15, 2012 by shdwfx

[Emeda]

It did fail, and it failed harder post CU/NGE. Even one of their senior devs admits it. The SWG fanboys live in a world of SWG tinted spectacles however.

 

That said, BioWare could have implemented more sandbox features.

 

Keeping 300,000 subs over 2 years isnt a failure. Making changes to the game and calling them combat upgrades and new game enhancements and having your subs drop about 40% is a failure.

[shdwfx]

Right....lol I can give you a list of 100 things of why SWG failed and that was after it was up for 8 years/.

 

 

They had about 300,000 subs when it shut down. That did not cover the cost of re-upping a new license for the cannon star wars universe. That's what shut it down, not lack of subs otherwise people wouldn't be telling you, "hey you're wrong"

Edited February 15, 2012 by shdwfx

[mecher]

They are exactly the same. So how can one be better than the other.

 

SWTOR PVP is a exact copy from WOW

 

PVE is the same. level your toon to max level then run older dungeons that were upgraded to level 50 to collect tokens or crystals to get new gear. DO a bunch or repetative daily quests to get tokens to get new gear.

 

The only difference really is in SWTOR you get a companion and WoW you get more of an MMO.

 

Uh, no. What you just described is every non-sandbox MMO.

 

WoW was NOT the first MMO of it's kind.

[shdwfx]

Uh, no. What you just described is every non-sandbox MMO.

 

WoW was NOT the first MMO of it's kind.

 

The first polished one ;p

[DarthKhaos]

Yup, using one's imagination in today's world is quite rare and is considered niche.

In actuality it has been for a very long time. Creativity, like common sense is practically a super power.

[Iskareot]

SWG was the 4th or 5th highest sub MMO in that timeframe out of 20 or so games (dont remember off hand). It wasnt in the crapper it was close to the top. Then WoW came and made every other game subs look weak. Would you call every game but WoW crap since they couldnt get 12 million subs?

 

You never tell the truth do you, your facts have nothing to do with the game.

 

YOU NEVER tell the truth of how bad it failed.. your speaking of numbers it had at the start... NOT after the NGE hit...

 

YES SWG had some potential at the start but then it became useless. YOU are off the mark if you are saying SWG was good business model and had room to grow after the NGE concept.

 

See, in most peoples minds that were there KNOW that there was THREE DIFFERENT GAMES really with SWG

 

Vanilla -- best -

 

CU - bad change.. tried to WOW up some.. BAD but not as bad as what was to come.. this was the one change they had to do good and failed.

 

NGE.. Nobody should even count this as a product as this was the nail... we all know it.

 

 

NOW< while you may think the NGE was good, you have a lot of businessmen and companies, websites masses.. and everyone in the MMO industry with a brain including the DEV team of that said product because even they said "DO NOT MAKE THE SAME MISTAKES WE DID"...

 

AND IF YOU NEED TO READ that.. or see it first hand I will give you these links...

 

These will pretty much sum it up.. and from the makers mouths themselves... answers it all.

 

If you want to see more reasons... I am sure I can get you all of them, while sadly Jeff Freeman killed himself we do still have the dialog of him saying he WISHES HE NEVER HELPED CHANGE SWG AND STOOD UP TO NOT MAKE IT SO BAD....

 

So I mean.. we can do this all day... no prob of why SWG failed and why it was bad...

 

Here is some fun reading from the Dev team..

 

DEV TEAM: DO NOT MAKE OUR MISTAKES..

 

http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=10830

 

HERE IS THE GAME YOUR SPEAKING OF AND ITS LEADERSHIP??? REALLY????

 

http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/12/21/soes-john-smedley-expresses-regrets-over-swg-mishaps/3

 

SO BAD THEY HAD TO GIVE US MONEY BACK!! lol (FIRST TIME IN MMO HISTORY)..

 

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/7182/RoundUp_SWG_Refund_FFIV_Micro_SAIS_Source.php

 

 

So in short based on these facts.. SWTOR AND BW would do GOOD to stay away from these concepts based on what the makers and people that ran this game said in these factual links.

 

No opinion... just facts LOL..

Edited February 15, 2012 by Iskareot

[shdwfx]

 

They are exactly the same. So how can one be better than the other.

 

SWTOR PVP is a exact copy from WOW

 

PVE is the same. level your toon to max level then run older dungeons that were upgraded to level 50 to collect tokens or crystals to get new gear. DO a bunch or repetative daily quests to get tokens to get new gear.

 

The only difference really is in SWTOR you get a companion and WoW you get more of an MMO.

 

 

Nope, good try though.

 

Instead of thinking where they may have stolen and idea from, you should be asking yourself why they haven't made something more awesome. We're talking about EA/Vivendi the largest game company in the world in conjunction with bioware and lucas arts. Not one of those companies is short on money. They own perfectworld entertainment, are partnered with companies with MMO experience.... so why is sw:tor buggy and craptastic...

 

You should be asking that question to yourself rather then thinking they stole everything from wow. That's one game. Look at the rest of them, especially perfect world games.

[Vlacke]

That and people saying SWG shut down due to low subs mis-information.

Misinformation, seriously?

So in your opinion SWG was this amazing game, doing so good and making loads of money from it's enormous player base and yet someone decided to pull the plug?

Hilarious.

 

Some people here cannot accept the hard fact that SWG with all it's flaws and qualities failed miserably in the end, which is why they decided to kill the game.

 

If that weren't the case it would still exist, making significant profit which is by far the most important thing, anyone who thinks that this is not the case is simply wrong.

No one in his right mind would decide to shut down a good and very profitable game with legions of followers, SWG just wasn't that game apparently.

[Goretzu]

You mean how SOE still has Clone Wars? Or that let's face it and if SWG was making money it would still be active.

 

I mean really... lol this is not a LIC issue.

 

If SWG was making 15.00 a month on 1 million people... you think it would have been shut down?????

 

Right... it was close at launch and that was it.

 

While I am SURE the LIC played a role in the renew process I would think that the server merging and DELETING of some of the servers taking it down to like 4 would have been the writing on the wall prior to DELETING the game itself.

 

Anytime you have to merge servers down to like 4... that could not be good and when some of us had the free (LOG IN AND SEE YOUR FRIENDS) and your list of 250 people is empty that tells you something.

 

Not to mention you can CLICK ON LUKES HEAD AND BE INSTANT JEDI!!! lol..

 

Right....lol I can give you a list of 100 things of why SWG failed and that was after it was up for 8 years/.

 

 

Star Wars: Clone Wars Adventures would not be the same licence as SWG or SWTOR as it's a complete different thing.

 

Although in fairness it's hard to tell the different between SWCWA and SWTOR space combat.

 

 

SWTOR really needs to be merging servers now, it needs to expand its scope and expand it yesterday.

[Emeda]

So the fact that SWG's player base has diminished to obscure numbers because people (aside from the hard core fans who think that sandbox concept is the way to go) left the game had nothing to do with it, seriously?

 

You know paying attention? The reason that SWG lost all their subs was because of the CU/NGE. It had a consistant base of 300,000 players for 2 years. Thats with all the bugs that never got fixed at all since beta.

 

The CU/NGE made it a wow clone so if you are saying that SWG was a failure because it lost all its subs you are in fact saying that trying to copy wow will lose subs. What do you know its true copying wow will lose your subs.

 

Remember give it time and the subs will keep dropping and dropping. They will start adding in LFG and server transfer and all the other goodies that show a game is failing just so they can keep milking as much money out of the people.

 

I will say it again. What would you call a game that has less subs that SWG after a year? What if they spent over 200 million dollars in the making of it. My guess is you will just go back to wow and act like you never played SWTOR before because you knew it was going to fail.

[shdwfx]

Misinformation, seriously?

So in your opinion SWG ......

 

 

I quit reading after that since you seem to think you know what my opinion is.

 

They shut down cause their license ran out. Period. They said it themselves.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Notannos
rude

[Goretzu]

Misinformation, seriously?

So in your opinion SWG was this amazing game, doing so good and making loads of money from it's enormous player base and yet someone decided to pull the plug?

Hilarious.

 

Some people here cannot accept the hard fact that SWG with all it's flaws and qualities failed miserably in the end, which is why they decided to kill the game.

 

If that weren't the case it would still exist, making significant profit which is by far the most important thing, anyone who thinks that this is not the case is simply wrong.

No one in his right mind would decide to shut down a good and very profitable game with legions of followers, SWG just wasn't that game apparently.

 

 

 

You can't licence the already licensed.

 

All things must pass, do you really think SWTOR will be around in 2022?

[jarjarloves]

The first polished one ;p

 

EQ2 was far more polished then WoW when it launched and when WoW did launch it was a HUGE buggy mess.

 

 

 

http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/4862

[shdwfx]

EQ2 was far more polished then WoW when it launched and when WoW did launch it was a HUGE buggy mess.

 

 

 

http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/4862

 

 

Being a wow player from beta 2 through today I can say, yep it sucked in the beginning. They fixed their stuff though. They're still around, they continue to add, can't fault them for that. They lose subs because people got what they asked for. Nothing more nothing less.

 

Let's just add though, EQ2 has failed big time. They followed the vanguard/eq model and the only thing they had to beat at the time was SWG or MxO.... come on lol.

 

However, EQ and EQ2 are still around as unpolished in comparison as they may be they are still polished and well tuned.

Edited February 15, 2012 by shdwfx

[Aristopantys]

You can't licence the already licensed.

 

All things must pass, do you really think SWTOR will be around in 2022?

 

Hell ya! We'll be in The Esseles grinding out Social 30 on our level 400s!

[ptwonline]

Gosh, let's see...

 

Model yourself after 2 franchises (WoW and KOTOR) that have been extremely successful?

 

Or model yourself after a game that failed so much that you had to find a replacement for it?

 

This was a no-brainer. Bioware showed that they could make great Star Wars games, and so they were picked to make an MMO that was a based on the most successful MMO of all time and their own successful KOTOR games.

 

Let's face it: SWG was a failure overall. Based on the IP it was expected to do better than it did, and the loss of subs and falling down to barely maintenance level meant that any successor would have to do something different.

[chton]

Because the other model , dumed down no effort made for kids model introduce my Blizzard makes more money whats so hard to understand? dose not mean its superior.

 

See again I never said superior, I said successful. What's so hard to understand for the SWG fans? No one will waste their money making a AAA game for a niche market.

[shdwfx]

Gosh, let's see...

 

Model yourself after 2 franchises (WoW and KOTOR) that have been extremely successful?

 

Or model yourself after a game that failed so much that you had to find a replacement for it?

 

This was a no-brainer. Bioware showed that they could make great Star Wars games, and so they were picked to make an MMO that was a based on the most successful MMO of all time and their own successful KOTOR games.

 

Let's face it: SWG was a failure overall. Based on the IP it was expected to do better than it did, and the loss of subs and falling down to barely maintenance level meant that any successor would have to do something different.

 

Yes and no, but still the license ran out be perfectly aware of that. Good thing bioware chose to go with the non-canon license. Much less expensive. Much less of a lucas arts headache.

[Emeda]

You can't licence the already licensed.

 

All things must pass, do you really think SWTOR will be around in 2022?

 

I dont even think it will make it to 2014

[TUXs]

I quit reading after that since you seem to think you know what my opinion is.

 

They shut down cause their license ran out. Period. They said it themselves. I've given my opinion on the game before on these forums and have an internal warning because of it. Don't assume playing devil's advocate is being stupid. Next time don't assume idiot.

 

Smed (SOE) elected to not renew the license. In fact, they didn't even TRY to renew it...Smedley didn't even try to renegotiate it. So...while you're factually correct, the license DID indeed expire, you seem to want to make it look like it wasn't SOEs choice.

 

http://games.slashdot.org/story/11/07/11/219257/Why-SOE-Decided-To-Cancel-Star-Wars-Galaxies

 

I'm sure your warning was from your tone/temper, not your opinion. Calling people names will probably lead to more.

[TUXs]

Star Wars: Clone Wars Adventures would not be the same licence as SWG or SWTOR as it's a complete different thing.

 

I assume you have proof of this claim? Please link it...because I don't believe it.

[Vlacke]

You know paying attention? The reason that SWG lost all their subs was because of the CU/NGE. It had a consistant base of 300,000 players for 2 years. Thats with all the bugs that never got fixed at all since beta.

 

The CU/NGE made it a wow clone so if you are saying that SWG was a failure because it lost all its subs you are in fact saying that trying to copy wow will lose subs. What do you know its true copying wow will lose your subs.

 

Remember give it time and the subs will keep dropping and dropping. They will start adding in LFG and server transfer and all the other goodies that show a game is failing just so they can keep milking as much money out of the people.

 

Your consistent player base of 300k is ridiculous when compared to SWTOR, a game that will grow undoubtedly because it's good and has a lot of potential...surprise surprise.

Also what you see as signs of failing, LFG, server transfer, others see as signs of progress because those are some features that almost all MMO's have nowadays because it looks like many people want those things, weather you like it or not.

 

Face it, SWG is deservedly dead, and it will stay that way.

 

People like you are hypocrites, bashing SWTOR on forum constantly, saying how bad it is, how Bioware has no idea what they are doing, how it is a WoW clone, and yet at the same time paying subscription and playing the game.