Ansultares Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 So that's what the defense force has come to? Wow...Well, when you can't argue on the merits of the game.... I've never been more suspicious of paid forum users than I have been in this game; partially it's because I'm sure the habit of paying employees to troll your own forums is still fairly new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solosus Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Blizzard is a business. In order to make their product a success and make money, their end goal, they need to be able to market their game to an increasingly bigger audience with time. They started with the more "MMO" heavy players that seek a bigger challenge then spread to the more so-called "casual-friendly" gamers who don't have the time to spend but still wished to have a slice of the action. Think of it as a pyramid. In order to cater to as many players as possible, maybe the game has been dumbed down at entry point, but the challenge is still there for the Bear Grylls of MMO players. Don't blame the players. Blame the market - it has expanded from being more of a niche thing to a global phenomenon. you Sir are absolutely right as sad as it is for those of us who prefer the old wow and other mmos which are challenging and more rewarding, i'm not saying Swtor is a challenging mmo, far from it, but i has old school elements i do enjoy but sadly i fear the the new market as you put it will dictate the path Bioware will follow, and if thats the case, i possibly wont enjoy it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorun Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 "Bonus" series on the game is a huge time sink. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knewt Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Vanilla didn't have those raids on release. 2004 vs 2012. TOR is not competing with vanilla WoW. It is competing with the current WoW, Rift and several subscription based MMOs coming out later this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckoneful Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 They also didnt have people hitting level 60 in a week. And most people were new to MMOs, and WoW wasn't fully fleshed out quest-wise. You had to grind or do instances at certain lvls because you ran out. People here generally aren't new, and there's quests for EVERY LEVEL. Took me a month to cap in Vanilla btw. Also, I do have to admit WoW raiding is much harder than here but this is Bioware's first go. Heroic Ragnaros was quite possibly the hardest fight I've ever done or will do, Soa doesn't hold a candle to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRainstater Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 I agree with the OP. I have played many MMO's and so far this one has been the most enjoyable. Since its new it will only get better imo. People can say what ever they want to boast WoW but all WoW is, is a copy of every thing every one else did first. WoW has done nothing original and offers nothing new you cant get in any other MMO. It's sad that all you WoW fanboys have to hate on some one taking the time to say they like the game. Nothing but doom and gloom for any new game. I can tell people (non gamers or consul gamers) I like to play SWTOR with no shame. I would never tell any one or speak in public that I play(ed) WoW. WoW = the Herpes of the MMO industry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckoneful Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 2004 vs 2012. TOR is not competing with vanilla WoW. It is competing with the current WoW, Rift and several subscription based MMOs coming out later this year. I know. But whoever I quoted was talking about vanilla raids, not current raids so I mentioned that. I did not say SWTOR now should be compared to WoW then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhealThar Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) But he has to come onto the forums to tell us its such a better game than WoW so maybe some of the people on the forums would actually log into the game. So let me get this straight, you dislike this game so much you make this stupid signature to post on said game's forum talking about how people posting on a gaming forum are here because they dislike the game the forum is for? What? Why does anyone talk on game forums? I guess World of Warcraft is a failure because people sit on the forums all day talking to eachother about the game. Great logic. Thanks for coming out. 2004 vs 2012. TOR is not competing with vanilla WoW. It is competing with the current WoW, Rift and several subscription based MMOs coming out later this year. No MMO will ever compete with WoW's level of content. It's physically impossible. The game doesn't need to have a dungeon finder, raid finder, addon support and macros to be successful. It always boggles my mind when people complain a game is like WoW, then they complain how it's not like WoW and how to make it more like WoW. No wonder the MMO genre is filled with WoW clones, the game developers aren't allowed to do anything different. Edited February 15, 2012 by KhealThar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEwokKiss Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Lmao, now i know you talking complete and utter garbage, epic world pvp ?? haha, world pvp was fun, but hardly epic, i rolled on a pvp server, i should know, epic my arse, as for fps issues, update your crap hardware, i'm running 110fps on an old gtx460 and one of the first quad cores from intel, the Q series, its old and runs this game just fine. Vanilla wow had NOTHING to do NOTHING, i played it, i should know, you obviously didnt, the world pvp and the challenging raids was the only thing it had, but the people like you killed it, in favour of the WoTLK crap, cos even burning crusade was too hard for you, please go back and play that kids pile of crap, thats what the once great mmo has been reduced to and people like you prefer it to this.... dont make me laugh. And you think swtor is hard lmao? ppl cleared this games piece of **** raids in the first week not to mention their buggy as hell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowlan Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 to be honest... nobody asked for your opinion on the game either To be honest...no one asked for anyone's opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knewt Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 I know. But whoever I quoted was talking about vanilla raids, not current raids so I mentioned that. I did not say SWTOR now should be compared to WoW then. Ok. Sorry for the misinterpretation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grueber Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Vanilla didn't have those raids on release. True. Then again most guilds couldn't field 40 level 60s with all the blue set equipment you could find in the 5 man dungeons at release. I remember my guild got owned by the two lava giants at the front when we first tried lol. It took a long time to find enough good players to complete that instance. Onyxia was the first real raid back then since it only took 25. Hard as hell too as you didn't have all the raid mods back then. Still have fond memories of the time I spent with people spent doing those raids. Memories I don't see happening in swtor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grueber Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) And you think swtor is hard lmao? ppl cleared this games piece of **** raids in the first week not to mention their buggy as hell O rly? That's news to me. So people were able to down Ragnaros a week after MC was released? Edited February 15, 2012 by grueber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azzras Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 And you think swtor is hard lmao? ppl cleared this games piece of **** raids in the first week not to mention their buggy as hell They do the same with every raid in WoW... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edage Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 The trolls are strong with this thread... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glenbruton Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 The only thing TOR excells at is the storylines. Of course the simple quests from WoW don't beat that. The thing is, you get bored extremely fast once you're at max lvl, whereas WoW actually BEGINS when you've reached max lvl. That's where Bioware gone horribly wrong. How does WoW begin once you hit max level? Theres the loot grind, is that what you mean? Other than its loot grind being longer I see no difference at all. Arenas maybe? Although you would have to pretend WoW's PvP was anything other than an afterthought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansultares Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Still have fond memories of the time I spent with people spent doing those raids. Memories I don't see happening in swtor.But they've got cutscenes; clearly it must be the greatest MMO of all time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TokyoZeplin Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 WoW has a story line, one better than one im player here, however, there is a difference. WoW's story is played out in raids where SWTOR is done through leveling...obviously. Just quickly wanted to point this out: If you actually bother reading the quest logs in WoW, you'd realize there is quite an epic storyline, starting from a very low level, going up all the way to max level, expanding with every Expansion. The storylines in the raids are more like the punchlines of the storylines. It's the ending of them, the conclusion. But hardly the only storyline there. Read. Questlogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansultares Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) They do the same with every raid in WoW...You mean with every raid...currently. But hardly the only storyline there. Read. Questlogs.If it can't be presented in 3-5 cutscene shots, then clearly it's inappropriate for an MMO. You'd think they designed this game for 2nd graders who are just learning to read, or something. Ironic that it's apparently very appealing to baby boomers. Edited February 15, 2012 by Ansultares Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zennsu Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 No MMO will ever compete with WoW's level of content. It's physically impossible. The game doesn't need to have a dungeon finder, raid finder, addon support and macros to be successful. It always boggles my mind when people complain a game is like WoW, then they complain how it's not like WoW and how to make it more like WoW. No wonder the MMO genre is filled with WoW clones, the game developers aren't allowed to do anything different. You're right, it doesn't need any of those features. However, there is no harm in adding those in as a quality-of-life improvement for gamers. Fortunately or unfortunately (depending on your views) many of the current audience targeted by Bioware and EA have come from a background where World of Warcraft have at least influenced, if not altered, the way that they see MMOs. Whether they have played it or not, it is the dominant force on the market and has been for the past few years. Innovation is in short supply as other games have tried (AOC - combat; WAR - PvP and public quests; Aion - the GRIND) and ultimately failed. Companies wish to make money, this is the world we live in. The market dictates that the MMO model championed by Blizzard is making the money, therefore others wish to butt in. Until a developing company with no ties to any other publisher, with no monetary constraint and having the balls to really go for a new design come forward, this is the industry for the forseeable future. Will GW2 break the mold? Who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracithius Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 There is a 40k que to buy the new mount in WOW atm, clearly the game fails lol. We can't even get working instances, reliable pvp, disappearing sabers when you run......on and on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TokyoZeplin Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 They do the same with every raid in WoW... With the new raids... yes... they get beaten in about a month after release, and the heroic mode gets beaten 2 or 3 months after release. Back in Vanilla though, and BC too (though less), that was hardly the case. I think it took about 3 months (after raid release, which was months after the game released) before anyone cleared Molten Core on my server. Just having enough 60's, then gearing everyone up in blues, then getting enough fireresist, then getting past the gear-check bosses, figuring out tactics, and so forth... **** took time! I think it took my guild around 5 months before we cleared MC the first time o0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azzras Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 (edited) With the new raids... yes... they get beaten in about a month after release, and the heroic mode gets beaten 2 or 3 months after release. Back in Vanilla though, and BC too (though less), that was hardly the case. I think it took about 3 months (after raid release, which was months after the game released) before anyone cleared Molten Core on my server. Just having enough 60's, then gearing everyone up in blues, then getting enough fireresist, then getting past the gear-check bosses, figuring out tactics, and so forth... **** took time! I think it took my guild around 5 months before we cleared MC the first time o0 Wrong. week 1: Normal mode all bosses downed week 2: After lockout all Heroic bosses downed. We are comparing modern WoW, yes? I hope not the grind fest, unstable, unbalanced launch of WoW....that didn't have any battlegrounds and only like 1 or 2 raids. Edited February 15, 2012 by Azzras Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grueber Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 Wrong. week 1: Normal mode all bosses downed week 2: After lockout all Heroic bosses downed. We are comparing modern WoW, yes? I hope not the grind fest, unstable, unbalanced launch of WoW....that didn't have any battlegrounds and only like 1 or 2 raids. No. WoW at launch in late 2004. I don't remember this lame normal/heroic options back then. It was hard period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoj Posted February 15, 2012 Share Posted February 15, 2012 The difference is, WoW had epic open world PvP which this game lacks. And again, you keep saying that WoW had problems with starting up too, etc. But we are in 2012 now, 2011 at release of this game. Developers should have learned from mistakes made in the past by other developers. And Bioware obviously didn't learn at all. I hate this argument. Game developing is not like some exponentially improving scale where eventually no games released will ever have issues or bugs. It's more like the flu virus. You get a new mutation (software, engine, technology, etc), and you have to develop a vaccine each year (debug, problem solve, etc.) The "WoW released in 2004, it's 2012" argument is like saying "People caught the flu in 2004, it's 2012." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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