I can't AOE heal

[oredith]

ok, i know not every healing class can be the same, nor SHOULD they, but seriously, Sorc heals is just so much more polished than BH, and it really shows when there's raid damage.

 

kolto missile hitting 3 targets, not smart? if it's going to only hit 3 targets on a 6s CD, at least make it so it's a smart heal and heals the lowest HP first?

 

and aoe heal? i don't need to have reviv like sorc, but come on! couldn't you do something like, when you activate the 30 combat support, your kolto missile now hit all in area? you can only use it 2x within the activation time period anyways, hardly OP?

[Aluo]

I like the idea of using your 30 charges to make Kolto Missle hit 6-8 people.

 

I would settle for it only hitting 6.

 

Also when consuming 30 charges Kolot Missle should heal anybody standing in the green mist the same way the Sorc AoE heal works.

 

As it is right now BH can heal quit well, it is just that Sorcs heal SOOOOOO much better.

 

Also we need more utility to AID our team, we have enough for ourself. When it comes to support a team during Huttball.... I can't do much but heal.... and even that is limited since everybody is running around LOSing the crap out of you on that WZ.

 

We need a friendly player pull like the sorc.

[oredith]

Also we need more utility to AID our team, we have enough for ourself. When it comes to support a team during Huttball.... I can't do much but heal.... and even that is limited since everybody is running around LOSing the crap out of you on that WZ.

 

i avoid using rapid shots to heal in WZ simply because everyone seem to know that a Merc Bodyguard is a free kill. the second someone sees that stream of green shots, it's like sharks to blood.

[Rageon_Vart]

As it stands, BH is kind of a junk class.

 

as DPS, we fall well short of the other classes.

 

as heals, we fall well short of the other classes.

 

and thats all we really have to pick from. no tanking abilities, sub-par healing, and sub-par "stationary" DPS

[Stormlorr]

As it stands, BH is kind of a junk class.

 

as DPS, we fall well short of the other classes.

 

as heals, we fall well short of the other classes.

 

and thats all we really have to pick from. no tanking abilities, sub-par healing, and sub-par "stationary" DPS

 

healing, maybe but not DPS (at least not mercenary). I can full on replace another DPS slot if I manage my heat correctly.

[TempestasSilva]

because everyone seem to know that a Merc Bodyguard is a free kill.

 

I am Terribad at PvP and I find this statement to be absurd. The only time I am an easy kill is when I am being gang-***** by 4+ which I try to avoid as much as possible.

 

Most of the time I am unkillable and frequently people give up and find someone easier to kill. And this is PvE speced.

 

Try to not be in the middle of a clump but be away and were you are in LOS for who you need to heal but out of LOS from opponents beating on them. Try to heal from on top of catwalks etc.

 

In hutball, I could probably pimp my numbers, but instead I try help score, so I try to get ahead of ball carriers so they can pass to me, I run the ball frequently, etc. Kill myself to get to our side for defense, etc. I still usually do like 130k healing. I die a lot more here than I would if I was just trying to heal.

 

In voidstar, I am usually over 200k healing, frequently over 300k. Again, make use of LOS. If you start to get focused, pop shield, your self hot, emergency scan, deterrence if needed, an instant rapid scan. Thats a lot for them to chew through. Try to get away, recover, and re-engage. Way better than the healing loss by dieing and waiting to respawn and get back into the fight.

 

Hopefully that advice will make you feel less squishy and maybe others can give you better advice.

 

As for AoE, I think we could use a small bump in this area. We have the weakest heals in this area. Nothing major and its really for PvE reasons, not PvP, though I may be missing something.

[TempestasSilva]

As it stands, BH is kind of a junk class.

 

as DPS, we fall well short of the other classes.

 

as heals, we fall well short of the other classes.

 

and thats all we really have to pick from. no tanking abilities, sub-par healing, and sub-par "stationary" DPS

 

You are going to have lots of people disagreeing with that.

 

As a DPS in PVE we are considered one of the strongest. As DPS in PvP who whines about anything as much as people whine that TM is OP?

 

If you feel you are to stationary as DPS, try Pyro.

 

As heals in PvP, I think we are fine, but we could use a small utility bump.

 

As heals in PvE, I think we could use a bump in utility and AoE. In AOE heals we may fall short of other classes, but not healing in general or especially single target.

 

 

BH is far form broken or being in a bad place.

Edited February 14, 2012 by TempestasSilva

[oredith]

I am Terribad at PvP and I find this statement to be absurd. The only time I am an easy kill is when I am being gang-***** by 4+ which I try to avoid as much as possible.

 

Most of the time I am unkillable and frequently people give up and find someone easier to kill. And this is PvE speced.

 

Try to not be in the middle of a clump but be away and were you are in LOS for who you need to heal but out of LOS from opponents beating on them. Try to heal from on top of catwalks etc.

 

In hutball, I could probably pimp my numbers, but instead I try help score, so I try to get ahead of ball carriers so they can pass to me, I run the ball frequently, etc. Kill myself to get to our side for defense, etc. I still usually do like 130k healing. I die a lot more here than I would if I was just trying to heal.

 

In voidstar, I am usually over 200k healing, frequently over 300k. Again, make use of LOS. If you start to get focused, pop shield, your self hot, emergency scan, deterrence if needed, an instant rapid scan. Thats a lot for them to chew through. Try to get away, recover, and re-engage. Way better than the healing loss by dieing and waiting to respawn and get back into the fight.

 

Hopefully that advice will make you feel less squishy and maybe others can give you better advice.

 

As for AoE, I think we could use a small bump in this area. We have the weakest heals in this area. Nothing major and its really for PvE reasons, not PvP, though I may be missing something.

i'm not going to take anything away from what you say, since it's all good advice, but you have not said a single thing that is BH specific.

 

everything you have said you do in WZ, another healer can do, except better. other healers can LOS too, except they have better heals that either doesn't require long cast time, or can be targetted on the ground around the corner.

 

the biggest problem with merc heal in pvp is that we have 1 interrupt on a 2 min cooldown.

 

if you are able to heal uninterrupted in your WZ, then you have a luxury which i do not have.

 

edit to clarify: yes, i'm hard to kill 1 on 1, since i can just keep running around and missile myself, but what i'm saying is, everyone (at least on my server) recongnizes that the BH is the easiest healer to nuke down, since they can't interrupt you, so the second they see a healing BH, 4 people are on you.

Edited February 14, 2012 by oredith

[Rageon_Vart]

i'm not going to take anything away from what you say, since it's all good advice, but you have not said a single thing that is BH specific.

 

everything you have said you do in WZ, another healer can do, except better. other healers can LOS too, except they have better heals that either doesn't require long cast time, or can be targetted on the ground around the corner.

 

the biggest problem with merc heal in pvp is that we have 1 interrupt on a 2 min cooldown.

 

if you are able to heal uninterrupted in your WZ, then you have a luxury which i do not have.

 

edit to clarify: yes, i'm hard to kill 1 on 1, since i can just keep running around and missile myself, but what i'm saying is, everyone (at least on my server) recongnizes that the BH is the easiest healer to nuke down, since they can't interrupt you, so the second they see a healing BH, 4 people are on you.

 

minor correction, we have 0 interrupts. We have 1 instant stun, which everyone gets. 1 cast stun which breaks on combat and does no damage, and 1 knockback which at best will snare for a few seconds ONLY if points are spent in that tree. This utility is sub-par to every other class save for our mirror, and leaps and bounds behind a class like sorc/sage which has all of those tools in a better version AND better damage, better healing, better kiting ability, better escape ability, along with having a ranged interrupt

 

in essence, if you want DPS, there are better classes for it. if you want healing, there are better classes for it. if you want survivability there are better classes for it.

 

my point is that for everything BH does, there is a class that can that job better.

 

PVE dps ok, sure.. but who the f*** cares about pve..?

[oredith]

PVE dps ok, sure.. but who the f*** cares about pve..?

lets not muddy the waters. I am primarily concerned about how short merc healers measure up to op/sorc heals.

 

I hope BW has plans to polish up BH and IA to where the SI are with regards to healing. right now, it seems like you're just gimping yourself if you're bringing a non-SI healer to your raids.

[TempestasSilva]

but you have not said a single thing that is BH specific.

 

everything you have said you do in WZ, another healer can do, except better. other healers can LOS too

 

Well to be fair, I think any healer getting gang ***** by 4+ will have the same problem.

 

 

 

the biggest problem with merc heal in pvp is that we have 1 interrupt on a 2 min coldown.

 

Actually, I'd argue that we have no interrupt. We have nothing that locks them out of something for 4 seconds like every other AC.

 

the second they see a healing BH, 4 people are on you.

Instead of seeing this as a weakness of the class, I think its a strength. I think we are so good that they know they better kill us.

 

So I think we agree more than disagree. Our differences are more perspective and presentation. You are kind of "the glass is 1/2 empty" I am more "the glass is 1/2 full". I see BH as being a great class that could use a little buffing. I don't see it as broken and in need of buffing.

 

What I do think is broken is sorcs doing 200k+ damage and 200k+ healing in the same WZ. But that's a whole different issue and they are just padding numbers, not helping to win, so meh.

[oredith]

Well to be fair, I think any healer getting gang ***** by 4+ will have the same problem.

agree on the problem, but not the cause. I think we get jumped by 4 people, because they see us as the weakest link. in pvp, you pick off the weakest first, in order to gain a numerical advantage. you don't look for the guy in full battlemaster gear sporting 28K HP.

 

Instead of seeing this as a weakness of the class, I think its a strength. I think we are so good that they know they better kill us.

a more accurate comparison would be that we're like the normal mobs in a flashpoint. anyone can kill them easily, but left alone, they can do a lot of damage, so why not just take them out first?

 

So I think we agree more than disagree. Our differences are more perspective and presentation. You are kind of "the glass is 1/2 empty" I am more "the glass is 1/2 full". I see BH as being a great class that could use a little buffing. I don't see it as broken and in need of buffing.

i agree that we're not broken, but it's like we're in a marathon race, and everyone else is riding sleek road bikes, while we're forced to ride a mountain bike with big knobby tires. we have to work harder, to achieve the same result - if our goal is to be mediocre. it would be impossible to win the race though.

 

What I do think is broken is sorcs doing 200k+ damage and 200k+ healing in the same WZ. But that's a whole different issue and they are just padding numbers, not helping to win, so meh.

that's where you're wrong. sorc dishing out damage is just part of their healing. their damage (crit) allows them to replenish their force AND casts instant.

 

a Sorc doing 200k damage + 200k healing is just "doing it right"..

Edited February 14, 2012 by oredith

[Rageon_Vart]

lets not muddy the waters. I am primarily concerned about how short merc healers measure up to op/sorc heals.

 

I hope BW has plans to polish up BH and IA to where the SI are with regards to healing. right now, it seems like you're just gimping yourself if you're bringing a non-SI healer to your raids.

 

ya I can dig it.

 

I like bodyguard merc and Im having a lot more fun with it than the glass turret, but when it come to a direct comparison or even a 1v1 with a sorc/sage; we fall far behind.

[oredith]

my favorite 'working as intended' merc mechanics has got to be the kolto shell.

 

my guildies love chanting "run away, RUN AWAY!" whenever i'm healing, because that's what I have to do, the second the tank pulls.

 

who was the brilliant designer that thought it a good idea to attribute the healing threat generated by the shell, to be delivered to the healer?

 

• put kolto shell on tank
  
• tank charges into a mob of 6 guys
  
• tank takes 1 hit
  
• kolto shell heals for 200
  
• 5 mobs instantly focus on the fat bounty hunter
  
• bounty hunter starts running away with 1/4 HP
  

The PoM threat bug was fixed by blizz almost immediately when they were notified. as far as I know, BW hasn't even acknowledged that this is a problem.

Edited February 14, 2012 by oredith

[Ewert]

Well to be fair, I think any healer getting gang ***** by 4+ will have the same problem.

If they have equal gear and half a brain, that's a dead healer. If they don't, which happens often, I can outlive their dmg till help comes often enough.

Actually, I'd argue that we have no interrupt. We have nothing that locks them out of something for 4 seconds like every other AC.

That is quite true. Not sure we need it, I'd like some other type of utility honestly.

What I do think is broken is sorcs doing 200k+ damage and 200k+ healing in the same WZ. But that's a whole different issue and they are just padding numbers, not helping to win, so meh.

Well I can do 600k+ healing (nerf sorc aoe heal, guildy did 800k in voidstar with sorc) if the fighting is even and intense. 100-200k dmg 200-300k healing is easy, and most of that dmg is actually single target with 0 heat cost power shots shooting out at under 1.2 secs each.

 

My BH heals are single target, my dmg is mostly single target, both very significant in pvp (keeping people alive or dead, not just filling up heal meters with sorc aoe heals). I don't know, maybe I would rule supreme as a sorc, but calling BH weak in pvp is not true. Hell, I even play with my single, pve maxed spec, not a spesific pvp spec...

[afootdoc]

If they have equal gear and half a brain, that's a dead healer. If they don't, which happens often, I can outlive their dmg till help comes often enough.

 

That is quite true. Not sure we need it, I'd like some other type of utility honestly.

 

Well I can do 600k+ healing (nerf sorc aoe heal, guildy did 800k in voidstar with sorc) if the fighting is even and intense. 100-200k dmg 200-300k healing is easy, and most of that dmg is actually single target with 0 heat cost power shots shooting out at under 1.2 secs each.

 

My BH heals are single target, my dmg is mostly single target, both very significant in pvp (keeping people alive or dead, not just filling up heal meters with sorc aoe heals). I don't know, maybe I would rule supreme as a sorc, but calling BH weak in pvp is not true. Hell, I even play with my single, pve maxed spec, not a spesific pvp spec...

 

Show me the screenshot where you do 600k+ healing as a merc healer please. Maybe if you have a premade vs a terrible pug and its voidstar and it runs the full time and pigs fly? Without aoe spam (sorc) or hot spam (ops) I don't believe that is possible. Numberswise we will never beat them. We are not bad healers, but I do believe we need a little polish before we can stand on equal footing with sorc/ops. What's sad is that was the general consensus in the beta community too, but nothing has ever been done about it.

[Aluo]

lets not muddy the waters. I am primarily concerned about how short merc healers measure up to op/sorc heals.

 

I hope BW has plans to polish up BH and IA to where the SI are with regards to healing. right now, it seems like you're just gimping yourself if you're bringing a non-SI healer to your raids.

 

FYI You are 100% wrong. Just click on my signature and feel free to look at what my guild and I have done. Very few BH Have any right to claim that BH Heals are no good for PVE. So please unless you have healed all endgame content on 16man Nightmare, don't stand on a soap box and say ignorant things.

 

P.S. In game my name is Healbot.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Aluo

[oredith]

FYI You are 100% wrong. Just click on my signature and feel free to look at what my guild and I have done. Very few BH Have any right to claim that BH Heals are no good for PVE. So please unless you have healed all endgame content on 16man Nightmare, don't stand on a soap box and say ignorant things.

 

P.S. In game my name is Healbot.

welcome to making false positive statements.

 

it's great that you've healed all nightmare mode stuff, but the question isn't whether or not a BH is capable. the question is whether or not we're on par with others. and barring being equal, at least have tradeoffs (you're better at this, i'm better at that, etc).

 

that's not the case with BH.

 

i guess a better question for you would be: can you do all nightmare with only BH healers. it's great if you're BH healing nightmare, and your job is to keep the tanks alive. but if you don't have a SI / OP to raid heal, can you do the same thing with ONLY BH? 3 target dumb heals on 6s CD?

 

pau-leeze.

Edited February 15, 2012 by oredith

[Ewert]

Show me the screenshot where you do 600k+ healing as a merc healer please. Maybe if you have a premade vs a terrible pug and its voidstar and it runs the full time and pigs fly? Without aoe spam (sorc) or hot spam (ops) I don't believe that is possible. Numberswise we will never beat them. We are not bad healers, but I do believe we need a little polish before we can stand on equal footing with sorc/ops. What's sad is that was the general consensus in the beta community too, but nothing has ever been done about it.

Sorry I don't run around grabbing screenshots, but I have done over 600k in voidstar, a premade vs premade. Also have done 220k ish dmg 440k ish healing, etc.

 

If it is a terrible pug vs a premade, you dont get that kind of heal numbers lol. You need a fully drawn out fight with constant intense fighting going on. The 220k/440k was versus the top republic premade on our server with our guild premade, and neither side went past the first doors, and the 605k heal one was also versus a good premade with a premade, neither side going past 1st doors.

 

Numberswise, sorcs will pull ahead only with their silly "no max targets" aoe heal. That is kinda overpowered. I can't touch the 800k our guildy broke in that kind of standoff fight ... but that is a special case.

Edited February 15, 2012 by Ewert

[Exertim]

I wouldn't be surprised if he was telling the truth. I recall doing 175k-200k+ dmg and 250k-300k+ healing consistently in sub level 50 Warzones on my Merc not too long ago in full duration pug vs pug Huttball/Voidstar games. I can only imagine how much higher you could push that number once you hit 50 and get geared. Edited February 15, 2012 by Exertim

[Corran]

lets not muddy the waters. I am primarily concerned about how short merc healers measure up to op/sorc heals.

 

I hope BW has plans to polish up BH and IA to where the SI are with regards to healing. right now, it seems like you're just gimping yourself if you're bringing a non-SI healer to your raids.

 

son, i have a 50 scoundrel. my 31 bodyguard merc already outperforms her in a healing role due to not having to have upper hand to use our equivalent of healing scan, and kolto pack is > kolto cloud

 

you could make an argument about emergency med pack but again requires upper hand to use, which can only be obtained by casting the big heal or every 6s if you have 4 people hotted up which is energy draining.

[germil]

my favorite 'working as intended' merc mechanics has got to be the kolto shell.

 

my guildies love chanting "run away, RUN AWAY!" whenever i'm healing, because that's what I have to do, the second the tank pulls.

 

who was the brilliant designer that thought it a good idea to attribute the healing threat generated by the shell, to be delivered to the healer?

 

• put kolto shell on tank
  
• tank charges into a mob of 6 guys
  
• tank takes 1 hit
  
• kolto shell heals for 200
  
• 5 mobs instantly focus on the fat bounty hunter
  
• bounty hunter starts running away with 1/4 HP
  

The PoM threat bug was fixed by blizz almost immediately when they were notified. as far as I know, BW hasn't even acknowledged that this is a problem.

 

Well you can cast it after the pull.

 

Anyway I believe we are a litlle behind sorc regarding heal power, especially on AOE. But I fell we are very strong PVP healer, as we can cope well wih focus fire (both on ourself and/or target). We are a little less mobile than other healers, but in organized PVP we can shine because if we are focused that means we should be guarded, and mobility is not that usefull as one must be close to the tank. I can see commandos/bodyguards be a very good option for rated BGs.