KilllerRock Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Does anyone still actually play Combat at 50? And if you do, have you even tried the other 2 trees? Then if you have, why have you chose to stay with combat? I ask because i use to be combat, and then i tried the other 2 and decided both were better, but watchman i favored the most. And everyone who i see defend combat either is sub 50, or never even tried the other 2 specs at 50. I would like to see someone seriously defend the quality of the combat tree from a person who is 50 and has played both other specs at 50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noon Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Does anyone still actually play Combat at 50? And if you do, have you even tried the other 2 trees? Then if you have, why have you chose to stay with combat? I ask because i use to be combat, and then i tried the other 2 and decided both were better, but watchman i favored the most. And everyone who i see defend combat either is sub 50, or never even tried the other 2 specs at 50. I would like to see someone seriously defend the quality of the combat tree from a person who is 50 and has played both other specs at 50. I leveled from 10-50 with it, and enjoyed it. I gave Watchmen a shot after hearing how amazing it is, took some getting used to and it wasn't bad... But I wasn't feeling it, so I gave focus a shot; with it I did a little better in wz than I had with Watchmen, but it wasn't all that fun for me. So I ended up switching back to Combat, and am sticking with it for now. I leveled with it, and I just feel comfortable using it. Not going to feed you any bull on which of the three is statistically better; just telling you straight up which I enjoyed playing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weizzeger Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Why are you asking someone to defend it? It's like asking someone to defend their preferring to drive a pickup truck versus a hatchback. Both function, both have their specific uses. Watchman: Death by 1000 burns Combat: Customer Appreciation Bat Focus: AoE Nuke with PvP-centric perks. Unless someone provides a definitive number as to which is better, I'll continue to tell Sentinels (and other classes) to play whatever you bloody well feel like. Will I favor Combat over Watchman? Yes, because I enjoy how Combat feels. Being stuck with the tight rotation and buff monitoring of Watchman isn't enjoyable to me. Does it do well? Apparently yes, since so many people stand by it. As Combat, I give my fellow Sentinel and Scoundrel Ops partners (Sorry, the Commando is... not impressive enough to count) a damn fun run for their money in Grand Theft Agro. Plus, I enjoy saying I have two DPS Speeds: "La-dee-da I'm hitting you," and "AHH! MAKE IT GO AWAY!" (Inspiration + Surge/Crit relic + Call -> Zen Ataru Form + Precision Slash -> Blade Rush spam) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mal-Sharran Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 (edited) I stayed Combat for a long time after hitting 50. Leveled with it, hit 50 around the middle of January, only swapped to Watchman two days ago. WHEN I get smooth combat with Combat (no Master Strike misfires or BR/BS stutter) it does almost as well as Watchman. Leap (4) - 500 damage Zealous (10) - 1000 Precision (7) - 1500 Master Strike (7) - 7000 Blade Storm (5) - 3100 Strike (7) - 1200 Zen (either with Valorous Call or if I simply have enough Centering from elsewhere) Blade Rush (6) - 2000 + 900 Ataru proc Blade Rush (5) - 2000 + 900 Ataru proc Blade Rush (4) - 2000 + 900 Blade Rush (3) - 2000 + 900 Blade Rush (2) - 2000 + 900 Blade Rush (1) - 2000 + 900 That all just happened in 15 seconds. I'll do the math for you. It comes out to 31700, or the average health of an elite mob. And you can make it an even 32000 probably from random Ataru procs. Master Strike and Blade Storm are both under the influence of 100% armor pen. Your two hardest hitting abilities. Now I fully admit my Blade Rush numbers are crits, not hits, but with a 35% base crit chance and popping a crit/surge relic, I crit extremely frequently. The relic lasts 20 seconds so I can pop it as I leap in and it lasts right up to the last BR. As I said, Combat only comes close to Watchman when I experience stutter free gameplay. When/if BW ever fixes the mechanics bugs in Combat, I believe it will be pretty close to on par in PvP, and superior in PvE for sustained. Watchman Zen translates into six burn crits that do what, 5-7k damage total? Combat Zen translates into 6 BR attacks that can easily double that damage, over a slightly longer period (6 seconds in a perfect world, probably more like 7). Combat also doesn't rely on Leap for focus generation, so therefore it is available for the MYRIAD of knockbacks this game loves to give mobs, meaning you're potentially back in the fight sooner. Admit it, BW loves to give everybody and their mom's dog a knockback. I've been Watchman two days now and I can already tell you I've found Leap on cd when I really needed it to get back in a fight. The only reason Watchman burst is better right now is because two dots that ignore armor, allowing you to be dpsing while they burn. The dots themselves are pretty meh. My OS three stack crits do like 1500. My Slash does about the same. A single hit from Blade Rush as Combat hits for 3k with a crit. I've rambled enough. I will be going back Combat when they fix the mechanics, and Combat will be on par at that point, or close enough as to make no difference. Oh and btw, Zen heals as Watchman are garbage, they only look good because it heals everybody a tiny bit. Ohhhhh, 160 health x6 for everybody. No no healer, just take a vacation, I got this. Edited February 11, 2012 by Mal-Sharran Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtfimblue Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Played combat and watchman. Don't even need to play focus to know I'd hate it. I run around with 33% crit, 90% surge regularly with 136 rated weapons. Both specs work well. I find combat very strong vs ranged dps compared to watchman. Crippling throw immobilize and force camo is nothing short of amazing for staying on someone. I also tend to just kill anyone faster than they'd kill me if left to spam blade rush+blade storm. Dealing 5k+ damage in under 2 seconds without adrenals is fairly easy to manage. Watchman is good damage as well if you know what you're doing. I have taken unexpecting sorcs without their shield on from 100-35% in 4 seconds. It's great when you're stuck fighting any other melee that isn't an operative/scoundrel. Also effective in beating tanks in wars of attrition. I'd avoid it if possible, but it's a more guaranteed win as watchman. Combat: Better uptime/harder to kite, less of a need to strike if at all compared to watchman (having 5 focus for dots every 12ish seconds, and another 5 for mercless slash is a tall order even with burning focus on many occasions), more GCDs spent into dealing direct damage of at least 2k total per blade rush, instead of re-applying carteurize every 6 seconds at best. Watchman: Dots have better synergy with force stasis/dispatch. Much easier to fight tanks, and other unfavorable matchups with the healing except for decent snipers/sorcerers. As for pve, I love them both. The number of times i have to use strike on occasion as watchman is a bit uncomfortable for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mal-Sharran Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Played combat and watchman. Don't even need to play focus to know I'd hate it. I run around with 33% crit, 90% surge regularly with 136 rated weapons. Both specs work well. I find combat very strong vs ranged dps compared to watchman. Crippling throw immobilize and force camo is nothing short of amazing for staying on someone. I also tend to just kill anyone faster than they'd kill me if left to spam blade rush+blade storm. Dealing 5k+ damage in under 2 seconds without adrenals is fairly easy to manage. Watchman is good damage as well if you know what you're doing. I have taken unexpecting sorcs without their shield on from 100-35% in 4 seconds. It's great when you're stuck fighting any other melee that isn't an operative/scoundrel. Also effective in beating tanks in wars of attrition. I'd avoid it if possible, but it's a more guaranteed win as watchman. Combat: Better uptime/harder to kite, less of a need to strike if at all compared to watchman (having 5 focus for dots every 12ish seconds, and another 5 for mercless slash is a tall order even with burning focus on many occasions), more GCDs spent into dealing direct damage of at least 2k total per blade rush, instead of re-applying carteurize every 6 seconds at best. Watchman: Dots have better synergy with force stasis/dispatch. Much easier to fight tanks, and other unfavorable matchups with the healing except for decent snipers/sorcerers. As for pve, I love them both. The number of times i have to use strike on occasion as watchman is a bit uncomfortable for me. Well put. Pretty much agree with everything you said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiveandDieinLA Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I play combat at 50. Focus felt kind of gimmicky to me, and since i run in a pre-made about half the time I didn't want to rely on a aoe to be my main damage dealer (since many ccs are broken on damage). As for watchman, yeah it good, but I prefer the on demand burst I get from combat, as well as the mobility and control with the roots. The one issue I seem to have with combat spec is fighting the top bounty hunter healers on my server, but I had the same issues with watchman. Heavy armor + uninterruptable = really annoying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KilllerRock Posted February 11, 2012 Author Share Posted February 11, 2012 good point about having leap always ready after a knockback for combat as i did notice combat, having focus at all times was easy. And as watchman i do use it for focus more often, but the 3 seconds of the cooldown of it truly does help. I also loved the roots, but the amount of times master strike goes into its animation without actually going off is just so frustrating and rooting yourself while they run away kind of cancels the positives of the anti kiting in the tree. Maybe if they fix that. Then the problems of getting CC'd right after using precision slash just made me always sink into depression as i miss out on the burst buff. I just wish a few tweaks to certain abilities would be nice for combat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MotarMotar Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 have played watchmen and combat but haven't tried focus yet. watchmen was good damage but wasn't very fun, didn't really seem to matter what attacks i did as long as i kept the burns going. combat feels more connected, i like seeing the big numbers during a focus dump. not idea how much damage i am doing to compared to watchmen i can tell it's not gimped. also popping your relic right before a zen focus dump really helps your damage, never see anyone mentioning their relic in their rotation so i thought i would throw that in there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ziljin Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 I'm combat at heart but I finally gave in and tried Watchman tonight for pvp and I have to say I survived a lot more as watchman which equated into more damage since I was dead less. As far as I could tell, the dps was about the same but I'm still getting used to the abilities. I was actually shocked at how well I survived each encounter as watchman. For those who still use combat, as much as I like it, I think Watchman is the way to go in pvp. I have yet to do an Ops with it. My theory is that it's better in Ops as well since melee has to run in and out from some bosses, I figure the DoTs would help more as I'm running away from pounces and such. I'll see how it goes tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepilk Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 I've played all 3 of the specs post 50 competitivly and change between them quite often, I leveled combat 1-50 and on another server am leveling up Watchman 1-50 just so I can say Ive "taken the ride" all the way on both. Combat is still my favorite all around. The only thing I REALLY miss from Watchman when in Combat is the much stronger interupt game from Close Quarters and Watchguard boxes. PVE wise though, Combat doesnt shine as much since many of its abilities revolve around movment control and kite-countering. So you dont get full use of all your abilities outside of PVP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vasinar Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 I havent tried watchmen yet, so I cant comment, but its great to see people thoughts on it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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