ghezundheit Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) Lately, I've seen terms so misused that they have become accepted where misapplied. Let's look at a couple. Ninja. Perhaps the most iconic term that needs to be changed is the Ninja term. Much like the old term Player Killer (PK) was misused long after its original intent had faded, ganking is now used in it's place for proper designation. Unfortunately, Ninja is so widely misused, its definition has long been lost through misapplication. Yes, there are people that will intercept your kills, take your nodes and other moves that can and do annoy people, even myself. Payback for that is to return the favor to the person who did it to you. What came first then, the Ninja or the Ninja payback. Rolling need/greed on loot is NOT a ninja move. Its a game mechanic to allow players to show their desire for gear or items that have dropped. Simply put you are there with your character and companion. If something drops your companion could use it, you could be nice and roll greed or as you tend to rely on your companion roll need. The result of the roll does NOT determine if someone is a ninja, they simply won a roll they felt they needed and the gear is theirs. More often than not when I am in a group and I start seeing the ninja name thrown about it is by sore losers who expect everything they can use to come to them. Hey, wait are they not to be considered ninjas as well? It would seem so. Must be a look who's calling who what sorta thing. Main/Alt Pointedly, these terms come from Guilds more-so than the casual players. Unless you multi-box, you can only play one character on your account at a time. Guilds tend to prefer that you stay in one role or another as they plan raids. Hardcore casuals have no such designation. I currently have eight (8) active characters that I play. When asked which is my main character, I simply say all of them are. Only one can be active at a time, but I play through all of them enough that they are leveling at the pace of how I choose to play them. All my active characters are within ten levels of one other and I will keep them that way as they all are leveled. It's how a hardcore casual such as myself enjoys the game. To call someones character an alt is, and can be, taken as an insult and reacted to accordingly. They are characters of the owner, played as the owner wishes them and not held under anyone elses rules or perviews. Banker character. An offshoot of the previously mentioned term alt. This term still does have some validity. I have created characters simply to act as a interim bank until the guild bank system comes out. Same with crafting materials. If these banking characters become leveling characters then thier respective hold storage is used for their respective banking role. Perhaps if we stopped using the specific terms, new ones will come that actually mean what is being said. Next time you hear them, ask the person who used it what exactly they meant and why they chose that term. They probably won't know and will probably care even less. Thats how the terms have gotten so mused and misapplied. Just a thought to mix in with the QQing. I personally think Bioware did and is doing a great job with SWTOR. Edited February 10, 2012 by ghezundheit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gehoornde Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) I agree, this is exactly why so many people don't log in anymore. Good post OP. Edited February 10, 2012 by Gehoornde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fentz Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 uh, people get called out for a being a ninja when they need on an item they can't use/for a role they aren't doing in the dungeon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilsildor Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Ok, or language and terminology evolves and you don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scar Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 KS - Kill Steal. Anyway, yeah, Ninja meant and ENTIRELY different thing back in early EQ days. Like you would have someone invis follow a raid and actually ninja the loot on the boss kill from the entire raid. Now THAT was a Ninja. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balrizangor Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Main\Alt are still very applicable. I have a Main character, I use it to raid, it has collected all the datacrons, it has the highest PvP rank, it is the best geared, it is the main class I wanted to play in SW, etc ... I also have several other characters I have made and are at various levels, none of these I could call main or even equal to my main. These would be alts ... I do not mean this as pointing at you but I have found that people that want to say ALL characters on their accounts are "mains" are usually ones that want to bring any character they want to on to raids/flashpoints and get whatever loot that drops by saying "the character I am logged into is my main" ... The easiest way to know which of your character's is your main is easy, it will be the one you favor, that has the character name that is what you are known by to your friends in the game, that is the class you most like playing so end up spending most of your time on, etc ... For instance, no matter which character I am on, my guildmates/friends still call me Balz or Bal .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeroempathy Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 I miss being a PK:( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knewt Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Rolling need/greed on loot is NOT a ninja move. Its a game mechanic to allow players to show their desire for gear or items that have dropped. Simply put you are there with your character and companion. If something drops your companion could use it, you could be nice and roll greed or as you tend to rely on your companion roll need. Rolling need for a companion against someone who can actually equip it on their character is rude. This is especially the case if you are rolling need for a companion at level 50. There is nothing in end-game (FPs, Ops, PvP) that is designed for you to bring a companion. BW should expand the Need/Greed system to take companions into account. They should have 2 need options: one for PCs and one for companions. The PC always gets priority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanzoV Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Ok, or language and terminology evolves and you don't. This^. But we should all do as the OP says, because, you know, he says so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avenloc Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) All I can say is that I disagree with pretty much everything you've said. The loot system in this game works, but not without its flaws. Players shouldn't ever have to roll need for their companions after they hit 50. The majority of content at end game doesn't favor or allow companions, anyway. If I am in a 16-man operation, and one guy rolls need for his companion on gear that I can use, he is essentially a loot ninja. Edit: This is simply a hypothetical. Most groups would use master loot in this situation. If he asks, and / or adheres to the loot rules disclosed through chat, that is a different story. You main character is typically the character you have spent the most game time playing. An alt, or "alternate character", is a character other than the one you play the most. By definition, you'd be more accurate to say you have a bunch of alts, not a bunch of mains. It doesn't have much to do with the superficial labels you seem to think they are. Edited February 10, 2012 by Avenloc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharagonIGN Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Rolling on items you were not expected to roll on IS proper use of the word ninja and unless all eight of your characters are of the same level and wearing the same strength of gear, you do have a main whether you admit it or not. I think you're the one not using words correctly here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galbatorrix Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 uh, people get called out for a being a ninja when they need on an item they can't use/for a role they aren't doing in the dungeon There was already a huge 5K post thread on this topic. It seems a lot of people believe that since the need button is lit for all, all have equal rights to the loot. Them being able to fully take advantage of it is irrelevant it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eliezer Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Rolling need for a companion against someone who can actually equip it on their character is rude. This is especially the case if you are rolling need for a companion at level 50. There is nothing in end-game (FPs, Ops, PvP) that is designed for you to bring a companion. BW should expand the Need/Greed system to take companions into account. They should have 2 need options: one for PCs and one for companions. The PC always gets priority. It is still going to boil down to opinion. There is nothing to stop people from rolling "Character Need" and still giving the Loot to a companion that uses the same loot as they do (Jedi with a Jedi companion, Trooper with a Trooper companion, etc.) Some people will view the Companion as simply more gear slots on /their character/ and some people will view the companion as a separate entity altogether. There is no way for Bioware to get everyone on the same page. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain_b Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) Main/Alt Pointedly, these terms come from Guilds more-so than the casual players. Unless you multi-box, you can only play one character on your account at a time. Guilds tend to prefer that you stay in one role or another as they plan raids. Hardcore casuals have no such designation. I currently have eight (8) active characters that I play. When asked which is my main character, I simply say all of them are. Only one can be active at a time, but I play through all of them enough that they are leveling at the pace of how I choose to play them. All my active characters are within ten levels of one other and I will keep them that way as they all are leveled. It's how a hardcore casual such as myself enjoys the game. So because you don't fit the main/alt definition everyone should stop using the terms? Please get over yourself. Oh, and "hardcore casual" is an oxymoron. Edited February 10, 2012 by iain_b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincynt Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Rolling need for a companion against someone who can actually equip it on their character is rude. This is especially the case if you are rolling need for a companion at level 50. There is nothing in end-game (FPs, Ops, PvP) that is designed for you to bring a companion. I agree with you completely that it's rude but I agree with the OP as well that that is not really ninja'ing. Someone not holding the door for you is rude, someone purposefully waiting until you're just at the door and slamming it into you to cause injury on purpose is assault. Maybe that's not the best anaology but hey, it's what I came up with. BW should expand the Need/Greed system to take companions into account. They should have 2 need options: one for PCs and one for companions. The PC always gets priority. The only problem I have with this is that it wouldn't negate me from rolling need for my PC anyways and then giving it to my companion. Unless you start talking about putting restrictions on it so say a Sith Assassin couldn't roll on medium or light armor since they can't use it. But that doesn't work both ways. Say you're a Merc, you MAY choose to equip a piece of medium armor that has great stats for you that is better stat wise then your old heavy piece of armor. In my opinion that is completely acceptable. Since a Merc isn't really designed to take damage you MAY want to give up some armor protection for more output, that's a play style choice imo. I don't think there is an easy solution that BW could implement that would make everyone happy. Therefore I put it to the player. Choose who you play with, if you find someone that takes gear you truely feel should have been yours choose not to play with that person any longer. Ignore them, move on with your game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clemsonalum Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Lately, I've seen terms so misused that they have become accepted where misapplied. Let's look at a couple. Ninja. Perhaps the most iconic term that needs to be changed is the Ninja term. Much like the old term Player Killer (PK) was misused long after its original intent had faded, ganking is now used in it's place for proper designation. Unfortunately, Ninja is so widely misused, its definition has long been lost through misapplication. Yes, there are people that will intercept your kills, take your nodes and other moves that can and do annoy people, even myself. Payback for that is to return the favor to the person who did it to you. What came first then, the Ninja or the Ninja payback. Rolling need/greed on loot is NOT a ninja move. Its a game mechanic to allow players to show their desire for gear or items that have dropped. Simply put you are there with your character and companion. If something drops your companion could use it, you could be nice and roll greed or as you tend to rely on your companion roll need. The result of the roll does NOT determine if someone is a ninja, they simply won a roll they felt they needed and the gear is theirs. More often than not when I am in a group and I start seeing the ninja name thrown about it is by sore losers who expect everything they can use to come to them. Hey, wait are they not to be considered ninjas as well? It would seem so. Must be a look who's calling who what sorta thing. Main/Alt Pointedly, these terms come from Guilds more-so than the casual players. Unless you multi-box, you can only play one character on your account at a time. Guilds tend to prefer that you stay in one role or another as they plan raids. Hardcore casuals have no such designation. I currently have eight (8) active characters that I play. When asked which is my main character, I simply say all of them are. Only one can be active at a time, but I play through all of them enough that they are leveling at the pace of how I choose to play them. All my active characters are within ten levels of one other and I will keep them that way as they all are leveled. It's how a hardcore casual such as myself enjoys the game. To call someones character an alt is, and can be, taken as an insult and reacted to accordingly. They are characters of the owner, played as the owner wishes them and not held under anyone elses rules or perviews. Banker character. An offshoot of the previously mentioned term alt. This term still does have some validity. I have created characters simply to act as a interim bank until the guild bank system comes out. Same with crafting materials. If these banking characters become leveling characters then thier respective hold storage is used for their respective banking role. Perhaps if we stopped using the specific terms, new ones will come that actually mean what is being said. Next time you hear them, ask the person who used it what exactly they meant and why they chose that term. They probably won't know and will probably care even less. Thats how the terms have gotten so mused and misapplied. Just a thought to mix in with the QQing. I personally think Bioware did and is doing a great job with SWTOR. Congrats on the most long winded post that said absolutely nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincynt Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Rolling on items you were not expected to roll on IS proper use of the word ninja and unless all eight of your characters are of the same level and wearing the same strength of gear, you do have a main whether you admit it or not. I disagree with that statement. Just because someone wasn't expecting you too does not a ninja make. Now if you were the group leader and changed the looting to master looter just before the boss died and then took all the gear, left the group, and took off THAT makes you a ninja. IMO this comes down to opinion. The person who shouldn't be expected to roll on a piece of gear, lets use the example of a Powertech rolling on a sniper rifle for Gault, prior to rolling should make his/her intentions clear and see if anyone has a problem with it. Lets say a Sniper is in the group and does have a problem with it let them work it out. Again this comes down to being rude or polite imo. The proper polite thing to do would be for the PT to pass for the Sniper. If the PT is out for number one and rolls away despite the sniper asking the pt not too then it's up to the Sniper if he/she wishes to continue playing with someone who's rude /shrug. Like someone else said this is all going to come down to opinion... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flowerslayer Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 (edited) Welcome to the world of linguistics. Have you ever wondered how we accents are formed and why not all people speak the same language? Remember when the word gay used to be happy? Words are not absolute. Someome is a little uptight. Edited February 10, 2012 by Flowerslayer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dayfax Posted February 10, 2012 Share Posted February 10, 2012 Can't tell if serious. Gotta be a joke/troll thread, right? What kind of doofus refers to themselves as a "hardcore casual"? Main/Alt still holds, btw, in serious raiding guilds. Nobody is going to take you & your 8 "mains" seriously, much less guarantee any of them a slot come progression night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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