The reason Sorcerers/Sages are OP in PvP

[DestyOwn]

O yea i see spamming sorc running out of energy all the time.

 

NOT

[shaidarlol]

LOL?

 

Snipers need the 4 quickslots bars to function.

 

a sorc need what 2? max 2. just look at the stream of Atroxcis he uses about 8 spells and just ***** everyone.

 

Sniper (have) energy management, when you go below 60 your regen becomes trash, and every spells cost 20.... and by default you have 100 energy.

 

no evasion skills, no sprint, no shield...

 

no dot cleanse, no heals

 

exaggeration is key, and i've seen atroxcis play just because he only uses 2 quick slots doesn't mean sorcerer is op. i've seen him stream as well, most of ppl that he plays against is like most ppl that complain on the forums, none of them interrupt him.

 

and if you see him play you'll also notice he runs out of force a lot, and uses consumption. which is a way to manage force and life. but i guess that doesn't require any skill to use right? you probably have no idea what consumption even is.

 

and i'm really sorry that your class plays differently than sorcerers, i'd trade the shield for a massive cd like yours any day of the week, 20% less damage taken for 15 seconds is a LOT better than a 3.2k shield every 20s but that's just my opinion tho.

 

why aren't you complaining about force leap? you don't have that either. or stealth, you don't have that either. must make your other AC op huh because you don't have it?

 

and you do have evasion, that let's you dodge 100% of weapon dmg skills, gosh wish sorcerers had one

Edited February 13, 2012 by shaidarlol

[Wyrdstar]

Sorc/Sage brought to you by the guys that gave you Bright Wizards in Warhammer. Faceroll as this class is it won't be touched because like the Bright Wizard it's a cash cow catering to the facerollers of the mmo world.

[Varicite]

Don't forget that the interrupt actually has a cooldown as well, interrupt them once and they'll soon be there doing the same thing to you again, this time you being completely unable to do jack **** about it.

 

8 seconds, 4 second lockout (PTs can talent this down to 6 seconds, as can a few other classes. It helps a LOT). So you can interrupt every other cast if necessary, IF they aren't letting your interrupt cool down by trying to kite you.

 

If not, you can Interrupt > Stun > Interrupt to completely deny casting for a decent amount of time. I generally try to time this for the latter half of their life, when they've burned most of their escapes.

 

Just eat the 2 second root and get back on them, keeping them snared and using gap closers when they Force Sprint. Trinket the 4 second stun if he uses it, and just eat the 2 second stun from Whirlwind if they opt for that instead (which they most likely won't unless the stun is on cd, since it completely fills the Resolve bar). The blind from Static Barrier breaking will break instantly if there is at least 1 dot on you, which there should be if the Sorc is actively engaging you, so don't worry about it when the bubble breaks and just stay on him.

 

If he did use the whirlwind stun and you had to wait the 2 seconds, gap close again if it's off cd.

 

Basically, do not let them breathe, EVER, and you will have a very good chance of a win.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Varicite

[Kanthric]

Why aren't you interrupting their main skill that procs everything else, then?

 

Who cares how much Force they have, they will never get a chance to use it all if you know what you're doing.

 

Not always that easy.

 

For an arsenal merc, of our three potential interrupts two are melee range only (we have no jump-to-melee abilities and we'd be at a significant disadvantage if we closed to melee just to be able to interrupt) and all three are rendered inoperable if the target has immunity via resolve.

 

On paper, neither of our classes are particularly 'good' or 'bad' at taking down the other. A well-played hybrid sorc has a bit more flexibility, but even if I can't kill them I can force them to focus on dealing with me or defending themselves.

 

1v1 isn't really the issue, though. Where things go south is in objective-based PvP. In a game like Huttball, that additional flexibility and superior mobility counts for a lot more in terms of the value they can bring to the team. In that sense they're OP, because they're able to handle more situations more effectively than 'pure' builds or, indeed, the hybrid builds of most other classes.

 

Sorcs aren't OP. Its just the hybrid (18/0/23 and similar variations in particular) that causes the major griping - the OP's analysis is reasonably sound on this. Talent trees just need a little reworking to prevent that spec from rearing its head again and the grumbles will fade away.

[Kenmuir]

8 seconds, 4 second lockout (PTs can talent this down to 6 seconds, as can a few other classes. It helps a LOT). So you can interrupt every other cast if necessary, IF they aren't letting your interrupt cool down by trying to kite you.

 

If not, you can Interrupt > Stun > Interrupt to completely deny casting for a decent amount of time. I generally try to time this for the latter half of their life, when they've burned most of their escapes.

 

Just eat the 2 second root and get back on them, keeping them snared and using gap closers when they Force Sprint. Trinket the 4 second stun if he uses it, and just eat the 2 second stun from Whirlwind if they opt for that instead (which they most likely won't unless the stun is on cd, since it completely fills the Resolve bar). The blind from Static Barrier breaking will break instantly if there is at least 1 dot on you, which there should be if the Sorc is actively engaging you, so don't worry about it when the bubble breaks and just stay on him.

 

If he did use the whirlwind stun and you had to wait the 2 seconds, gap close again if it's off cd.

 

Basically, do not let them breathe, EVER, and you will have a very good chance of a win.

 

Just to compare Sage/Sorc to Commando/Merc:

 

Shield(Insta cast heal, awesome scaling, appliable to others, run speed buff(talented)) -> nothing

aoe knockback(20s cooldown, 8m range), with talents immoblizes for up to 5s, unlimited targets -> aoe knockback(30s(20s talented) cooldown, 4m range(8m talented), with 4s slow, max 5 targets

speed boost -> nothing

30m 6s slow, 12s cooldown -> nothing

30m Ranged Interupt, 4s(6s talented) lockout, 12s cooldown-> nothing

Extrication -> nothing

4s stun 60s cooldown(50s talented), deals damage -> 4s stun 60s cooldown, no damage

3s 50% channeled slow -> nothing or 25 pts in gunnery for 50% channeld slow

force armor aoe sleep(talented) -> stock strike single target knockback(talented)

in combat rez -> nothing

 

That's a lot of nothing that the other ranged dps/healer class gets. It's also nice that i get to spend talent points to make my abilities have the same effects that sage/sorc get base line. The only thing that commando/mercenary gets base line that sage/sorc doesn't is a 12second 25% damage reduction with a 2 minute cooldown. Your opponent would have to do 12k damage or more in 12seconds for that to be better. The downside is that reactive shield has a 2 minute cooldown, compared to the 20s cooldown on force armor and reactive shield can not be cast on other people.

 

On armor:

Most dps classes have ~50% armor reduction, or deal elemental/internal damage, so to say that 30% mitigation vs 15% mitigation is meaningful is about as truthful as saying that sorc/sage has better defense due to having twice the base avoidance chance(10% vs 5%).

[shaidarlol]

Not always that easy.

 

For an arsenal merc, of our three potential interrupts two are melee range only (we have no jump-to-melee abilities and we'd be at a significant disadvantage if we closed to melee just to be able to interrupt) and all three are rendered inoperable if the target has immunity via resolve.

 

On paper, neither of our classes are particularly 'good' or 'bad' at taking down the other. A well-played hybrid sorc has a bit more flexibility, but even if I can't kill them I can force them to focus on dealing with me or defending themselves.

 

1v1 isn't really the issue, though. Where things go south is in objective-based PvP. In a game like Huttball, that additional flexibility and superior mobility counts for a lot more in terms of the value they can bring to the team. In that sense they're OP, because they're able to handle more situations more effectively than 'pure' builds or, indeed, the hybrid builds of most other classes.

 

Sorcs aren't OP. Its just the hybrid (18/0/23 and similar variations in particular) that causes the major griping - the OP's analysis is reasonably sound on this. Talent trees just need a little reworking to prevent that spec from rearing its head again and the grumbles will fade away.

 

ppl will never stop QQing, 1 poster mentioned atroxis who streams as a bm sorc, he doesn't even use the "overpowered" hybrid spec and ppl use him as an example about how overpowered he is. that is the logic, when 9/0/32 is considered OP when he lacks all of the stuff that most ppl complain about...

[Varicite]

Just to compare Sage/Sorc to Commando/Merc:

 

Shield(Insta cast heal, awesome scaling, appliable to others, run speed buff(talented)) -> nothing

aoe knockback(20s cooldown, 8m range), with talents immoblizes for up to 5s, unlimited targets -> aoe knockback(30s(20s talented) cooldown, 4m range(8m talented), with 4s slow, max 5 targets

speed boost -> nothing

30m 6s slow, 12s cooldown -> nothing

30m Ranged Interupt, 4s(6s talented) lockout, 12s cooldown-> nothing

Extrication -> nothing

4s stun 60s cooldown(50s talented), deals damage -> 4s stun 60s cooldown, no damage

3s 50% channeled slow -> nothing or 25 pts in gunnery for 50% channeld slow

force armor aoe sleep(talented) -> stock strike single target knockback(talented)

in combat rez -> nothing

 

That's a lot of nothing that the other ranged dps/healer class gets. It's also nice that i get to spend talent points to make my abilities have the same effects that sage/sorc get base line. The only thing that commando/mercenary gets base line that sage/sorc doesn't is a 12second 25% damage reduction with a 2 minute cooldown. Your opponent would have to do 12k damage or more in 12seconds for that to be better. The downside is that reactive shield has a 2 minute cooldown, compared to the 20s cooldown on force armor and reactive shield can not be cast on other people.

 

On armor:

Most dps classes have ~50% armor reduction, or deal elemental/internal damage, so to say that 30% mitigation vs 15% mitigation is meaningful is about as truthful as saying that sorc/sage has better defense due to having twice the base avoidance chance(10% vs 5%).

 

We already covered the fact that the Arsenal merc still has more/better options available for damage while forced to move, while Sorcs/Sages do not. Rapid Shots alone outclasses pretty much everything a hybrid Sorc has for mobile damage outside of Deathfield on a 15 sec cd, and can even proc your canister for free, which can also snare (if talented) and places a dot on your target that is far stronger than Affliction. All for free.

 

You may also feel that the armor difference is negligible, but that's easy to do when you ARE the guy wearing higher armor. I can tell you that the difference is NOT negligible when playing my dps PT compared to when I used to play my Sorc. If it were, then you would not see the tank specs bending over backward to pick up that extra 2% mitigation from another tree, etc. Mitigation is key in pvp.

 

Different classes are different. You have more mobile damage options available to you, thus you get less CC than a Sorc/Sage.

 

Also, you said that interrupting isn't always that easy. So I elaborated a bit to show you that yes, it actually is pretty easy if you understand the class you're dealing with.

 

I'm not sure why you're comparing Merc abilities in a full dps spec to a hybrid spec that SACRIFICES all of their best damage talents for utility. A Merc has a FAR higher burst capacity than a hybrid Sorc/Sage, on top of having better mobile damage options, and a higher armor class.

 

What makes you think a Merc should have all that AND Sorc/Sage utility? And vice-versa, if you want to nerf the utility, are you willing to see them burst like Mercenaries and have better damage on the move to compensate?

Edited February 13, 2012 by Varicite

[shaidarlol]

Just to compare Sage/Sorc to Commando/Merc:

 

Shield(Insta cast heal, awesome scaling, appliable to others, run speed buff(talented)) -> nothing

aoe knockback(20s cooldown, 8m range), with talents immoblizes for up to 5s, unlimited targets -> aoe knockback(30s(20s talented) cooldown, 4m range(8m talented), with 4s slow, max 5 targets

speed boost -> nothing

30m 6s slow, 12s cooldown -> nothing

30m Ranged Interupt, 4s(6s talented) lockout, 12s cooldown-> nothing

Extrication -> nothing

4s stun 60s cooldown(50s talented), deals damage -> 4s stun 60s cooldown, no damage

3s 50% channeled slow -> nothing or 25 pts in gunnery for 50% channeld slow

force armor aoe sleep(talented) -> stock strike single target knockback(talented)

in combat rez -> nothing

 

That's a lot of nothing that the other ranged dps/healer class gets. It's also nice that i get to spend talent points to make my abilities have the same effects that sage/sorc get base line. The only thing that commando/mercenary gets base line that sage/sorc doesn't is a 12second 25% damage reduction with a 2 minute cooldown. Your opponent would have to do 12k damage or more in 12seconds for that to be better. The downside is that reactive shield has a 2 minute cooldown, compared to the 20s cooldown on force armor and reactive shield can not be cast on other people.

 

On armor:

Most dps classes have ~50% armor reduction, or deal elemental/internal damage, so to say that 30% mitigation vs 15% mitigation is meaningful is about as truthful as saying that sorc/sage has better defense due to having twice the base avoidance chance(10% vs 5%).

 

yea let's not mention about the 9s cd single target knockback that you have which basically makes you a god when you stand on any ledge. and btw, your aoe knockback once talented and have pvp gear is only on a 15s cd, it also knocks back ppl farther, not to mention it comes with an auto slow base line...

 

edit: both of your knockbacks are also instant, sorc/sage knock back has at least a .5s animation delay which actually gives ppl the ability to change their position to avoid being knocked off, but who cares about that right? OP OP

 

it's easy to be biased...

Edited February 13, 2012 by shaidarlol

[Sirolos]

yea let's not mention about the 9s cd single target knockback that you have which basically makes you a god when you stand on any ledge. and btw, your aoe knockback once talented and have pvp gear is only on a 15s cd, it also knocks back ppl farther, not to mention it comes with an auto slow base line...

 

it's easy to be biased...

 

He also forgot to mention that his tracer-heatseeker rotation can drop people in a few seconds..

[Lormif]

Just to compare Sage/Sorc to Commando/Merc:

 

Shield(Insta cast heal, awesome scaling, appliable to others, run speed buff(talented)) -> nothing

aoe knockback(20s cooldown, 8m range), with talents immoblizes for up to 5s, unlimited targets -> aoe knockback(30s(20s talented) cooldown, 4m range(8m talented), with 4s slow, max 5 targets

speed boost -> nothing

30m 6s slow, 12s cooldown -> nothing

30m Ranged Interupt, 4s(6s talented) lockout, 12s cooldown-> nothing

Extrication -> nothing

4s stun 60s cooldown(50s talented), deals damage -> 4s stun 60s cooldown, no damage

3s 50% channeled slow -> nothing or 25 pts in gunnery for 50% channeld slow

force armor aoe sleep(talented) -> stock strike single target knockback(talented)

in combat rez -> nothing

 

That's a lot of nothing that the other ranged dps/healer class gets. It's also nice that i get to spend talent points to make my abilities have the same effects that sage/sorc get base line. The only thing that commando/mercenary gets base line that sage/sorc doesn't is a 12second 25% damage reduction with a 2 minute cooldown. Your opponent would have to do 12k damage or more in 12seconds for that to be better. The downside is that reactive shield has a 2 minute cooldown, compared to the 20s cooldown on force armor and reactive shield can not be cast on other people.

 

On armor:

Most dps classes have ~50% armor reduction, or deal elemental/internal damage, so to say that 30% mitigation vs 15% mitigation is meaningful is about as truthful as saying that sorc/sage has better defense due to having twice the base avoidance chance(10% vs 5%).

 

So is that the mythical sage 51/51/51 build?

[Lormif]

Just to compare Sage/Sorc to Commando/Merc:

 

Shield(Insta cast heal, awesome scaling, appliable to others, run speed buff(talented)) -> nothing

aoe knockback(20s cooldown, 8m range), with talents immoblizes for up to 5s, unlimited targets -> aoe knockback(30s(20s talented) cooldown, 4m range(8m talented), with 4s slow, max 5 targets

speed boost -> nothing

30m 6s slow, 12s cooldown -> nothing

30m Ranged Interupt, 4s(6s talented) lockout, 12s cooldown-> nothing

Extrication -> nothing

4s stun 60s cooldown(50s talented), deals damage -> 4s stun 60s cooldown, no damage

3s 50% channeled slow -> nothing or 25 pts in gunnery for 50% channeld slow

force armor aoe sleep(talented) -> stock strike single target knockback(talented)

in combat rez -> nothing

 

That's a lot of nothing that the other ranged dps/healer class gets. It's also nice that i get to spend talent points to make my abilities have the same effects that sage/sorc get base line. The only thing that commando/mercenary gets base line that sage/sorc doesn't is a 12second 25% damage reduction with a 2 minute cooldown. Your opponent would have to do 12k damage or more in 12seconds for that to be better. The downside is that reactive shield has a 2 minute cooldown, compared to the 20s cooldown on force armor and reactive shield can not be cast on other people.

 

On armor:

Most dps classes have ~50% armor reduction, or deal elemental/internal damage, so to say that 30% mitigation vs 15% mitigation is meaningful is about as truthful as saying that sorc/sage has better defense due to having twice the base avoidance chance(10% vs 5%).

 

Oh, one more thing, unless you are full spec you only get 1 internal damage ability, which I am not sure if used very often, so dont give me that, when all the complaints is about hybrid.

[Kelticfury]

Don't forget they can buff their own main stat (ie stim pack) and have an instant heal as well (med pack)...

 

Nerf stims and medpacks!

[shaidarlol]

Just to compare Sage/Sorc to Commando/Merc:

 

Shield(Insta cast heal, awesome scaling, appliable to others, run speed buff(talented)) -> nothing

aoe knockback(20s cooldown, 8m range), with talents immoblizes for up to 5s, unlimited targets -> aoe knockback(30s(20s talented) cooldown, 4m range(8m talented), with 4s slow, max 5 targets

speed boost -> nothing

30m 6s slow, 12s cooldown -> nothing

30m Ranged Interupt, 4s(6s talented) lockout, 12s cooldown-> nothing

Extrication -> nothing

4s stun 60s cooldown(50s talented), deals damage -> 4s stun 60s cooldown, no damage

3s 50% channeled slow -> nothing or 25 pts in gunnery for 50% channeld slow

force armor aoe sleep(talented) -> stock strike single target knockback(talented)

in combat rez -> nothing

 

That's a lot of nothing that the other ranged dps/healer class gets. It's also nice that i get to spend talent points to make my abilities have the same effects that sage/sorc get base line. The only thing that commando/mercenary gets base line that sage/sorc doesn't is a 12second 25% damage reduction with a 2 minute cooldown. Your opponent would have to do 12k damage or more in 12seconds for that to be better. The downside is that reactive shield has a 2 minute cooldown, compared to the 20s cooldown on force armor and reactive shield can not be cast on other people.

 

On armor:

Most dps classes have ~50% armor reduction, or deal elemental/internal damage, so to say that 30% mitigation vs 15% mitigation is meaningful is about as truthful as saying that sorc/sage has better defense due to having twice the base avoidance chance(10% vs 5%).

 

also just to give you an idea of 12k damage in 12 seconds is like

i assume you have the standard gcd of 1.5s, your tracer missile on average crits for about 3k so every 1.5s you are doing around 3k dmg in 3s you've done 6k, a normal merc rotation, 3x tracer, heatseeker, unload, maybe railshot to finish, so that's 6 globals or 9s, you tell me during that 9s that you don't do over 12k damage, and then tell me how much worse your 20% less damage taken shield is compared to 3.2k every 20s.

 

i bet you every good sorc/sage will gladly trade their supposed op shield for a massive defensive CD like yours.

[sithgrizley]

I just wanted to point out that while being rooted might be extremely frustrating to a melee, as it is not effected by Resolve..

 

..being chain interrupted is equally frustrating for casters.

 

You can't move, so you can't do damage. They can't cast, so they can't do damage.

 

I see them as much the same thing, and neither is effected by any sort of diminishing return.

 

(It's times like this that I'm glad that I have ranged weapons, and very very few cast time abilities... and a root immunity. lol.)

 

Here is a fun difference for you.

 

If you get interrupted AND it happens to be an ability that locks out that spell for a couple seconds you switch to a different spell since you know they can't interrupt.

 

If you kick a Sorcs lightning, he can heal, if you kick a sorcs heal he can lightning. Better yet for him, he KNOWS your interrupt is down and you can't stop anything he wants to do.

 

If you are a rooted melee, MAYBE you have a 10 yard ability that is off cooldown. You can't melee, you can't jump, you have at best a couple of abilities with long cooldowns.

 

They are far from the same thing. If a kick locked out casting OF ANY TYPE for 4 seconds that would be pretty much the same thing. Maybe allow instants only for 4 seconds after a kick.

[shaidarlol]

Here is a fun difference for you.

 

If you get interrupted AND it happens to be an ability that locks out that spell for a couple seconds you switch to a different spell since you know they can't interrupt.

 

If you kick a Sorcs lightning, he can heal, if you kick a sorcs heal he can lightning. Better yet for him, he KNOWS your interrupt is down and you can't stop anything he wants to do.

 

If you are a rooted melee, MAYBE you have a 10 yard ability that is off cooldown. You can't melee, you can't jump, you have at best a couple of abilities with long cooldowns.

 

They are far from the same thing. If a kick locked out casting OF ANY TYPE for 4 seconds that would be pretty much the same thing. Maybe allow instants only for 4 seconds after a kick.

 

yes heal that takes 3s to cast with push back that only heals for around 2k or maybe 3.5k if it crits so in 3s a melee can't do that amount of damage huh. stop being bad

[Varicite]

Here is a fun difference for you.

 

If you get interrupted AND it happens to be an ability that locks out that spell for a couple seconds you switch to a different spell since you know they can't interrupt.

 

If you kick a Sorcs lightning, he can heal, if you kick a sorcs heal he can lightning. Better yet for him, he KNOWS your interrupt is down and you can't stop anything he wants to do.

 

If you are a rooted melee, MAYBE you have a 10 yard ability that is off cooldown. You can't melee, you can't jump, you have at best a couple of abilities with long cooldowns.

 

They are far from the same thing. If a kick locked out casting OF ANY TYPE for 4 seconds that would be pretty much the same thing. Maybe allow instants only for 4 seconds after a kick.

 

If a hybrid Sorc is standing next to you and casting a THREE SECOND heal and you are unable to do anything about it.. I really just don't know what to tell you.

 

Maybe pvp isn't the thing for you. <.<

[shaidarlol]

If a hybrid Sorc is standing next to you and casting a THREE SECOND heal and you are unable to do anything about it.. I really just don't know what to tell you.

 

Maybe pvp isn't the thing for you. <.<

 

look at his post history dude, he's an assassin complaining about sorcerers....

he thought force slow had a 15s cd

i'm not even sure if he knows what force shroud does...

he didn't even know assassins had a 15% movement speed over everyone cept operatives

Edited February 13, 2012 by shaidarlol

[Dadydimsum]

Put stuns on longer cooldown, whirldwind on no cooldown(polymorph) more mezzes less stuns. So you can cc chains set up on you without exploding.

 

Need CL/Wrath for PvE as without wrath CL is worthless(3 seconds cast) minus lighting storm.

Edited February 13, 2012 by Dadydimsum

[Varicite]

look at his post history dude, he's an assassin complaining about sorcerers....

he thought force slow had a 15s cd

i'm not even sure if he knows what force shroud does...

he didn't even know assassins had a 15% movement speed over everyone cept operatives

 

Unfortunately, he's the rule, not the exception right now.

 

Most people on these forums don't even fully know their own classes, have little clue about the other classes, but demand nerfs to things they do not understand.

[sithgrizley]

also just to give you an idea of 12k damage in 12 seconds is like

i assume you have the standard gcd of 1.5s, your tracer missile on average crits for about 3k so every 1.5s you are doing around 3k dmg in 3s you've done 6k, a normal merc rotation, 3x tracer, heatseeker, unload, maybe railshot to finish, so that's 6 globals or 9s, you tell me during that 9s that you don't do over 12k damage, and then tell me how much worse your 20% less damage taken shield is compared to 3.2k every 20s.

 

i bet you every good sorc/sage will gladly trade their supposed op shield for a massive defensive CD like yours.

 

Because Mercs have 100% crit amirite?

 

Also you magically cast a 3 second channel Unload in a single gcd, which is a pretty good trick.

 

You're either just ignorant of mechanics or trolling. In either case, ignoring everything that comes out of your mouth is the right thing to do.

 

If a Mercs shield was on a 20s cooldown you would be correct, it would be better than 3200 hp. Unfortunately, it's on a much much longer cooldown while the Sorc bubble is not.

[sithgrizley]

If a hybrid Sorc is standing next to you and casting a THREE SECOND heal and you are unable to do anything about it.. I really just don't know what to tell you.

 

Maybe pvp isn't the thing for you. <.<

 

So which is it? Kick the heal or kick the lightning? It's pick one and live with the other.

[shaidarlol]

Because Mercs have 100% crit amirite?

 

Also you magically cast a 3 second channel Unload in a single gcd, which is a pretty good trick.

 

You're either just ignorant of mechanics or trolling. In either case, ignoring everything that comes out of your mouth is the right thing to do.

 

If a Mercs shield was on a 20s cooldown you would be correct, it would be better than 3200 hp. Unfortunately, it's on a much much longer cooldown while the Sorc bubble is not.

 

i said on average, and excuse me for messing up on 1 skill, so instead of 9s it's it's 10.5s OH NO.

 

let's just say it's 50% crit chance how much damage do you think that is? do you think they dont pump out that kind of dps?

 

yes the reason the sorc bubble isnt' on a longer cooldown is because it's NOT AS GOOD....

and you dont even know what your own class does and you call me ignorant? seriously?

[shaidarlol]

So which is it? Kick the heal or kick the lightning? It's pick one and live with the other.

 

well since it isn't obvious enough to you, i can spell it out for you, you ignore the heal, because in 3s you'll do more damage then they can heal anyways. get it? 3s heal that can maybe crit for 3.5k or melee can do 2 globals and probably crit for about that amount each time?

 

is math really that hard?

[sithgrizley]

look at his post history dude, he's an assassin complaining about sorcerers....

he thought force slow had a 15s cd

i'm not even sure if he knows what force shroud does...

he didn't even know assassins had a 15% movement speed over everyone cept operatives

 

Oh so sorry, it's a 12s cooldown not a 15s. Clearly that makes all the difference in the world.

 

I do in fact know what force shroud does. I'm pretty sure you don't get that it has a 60 second cooldown, make it 20s and you'd have somewhat of a grounds to mention it.

 

I'm pretty sure the talent you have in mind is stealth speed, not normal speed. I know for a fact that it's 5 points into Deception which odds are, you won't be. After the nerf to hybrid assassin specs Deception is unplayably squishy except against truly terrible people who just ignore you.

 

BTW, Marauders have 15% movespeed always on. Even that is not nearly enough, so you pretty much can stop crying about it.