NOW = 1.7 Million Active Subscribers | 3 Months from now = Guess What

[VenthiosLestaran]

When monthly fee MMORPGs started to hit over 500k players.

 

Mm. Point taken.

[DarthSakh]

You can find more infos here :

 

http://www.darthhater.com/articles/swtor-news/19915-electronic-arts-q3-fy12-earnings-call

[Gankstah]

If GW2 wasn't sword & sorcery I'd try it out.

 

As it stands I've had enough of elves and orcs to last several life times.

[Wolfeisberg]

If GW2 wasn't sword & sorcery I'd try it out.

 

As it stands I've had enough of elves and orcs to last several life times.

 

GW2 has no elves or any Orcs

[VenthiosLestaran]

If GW2 wasn't sword & sorcery I'd try it out.

 

As it stands I've had enough of elves and orcs to last several life times.

 

You shouldn't let the setting deter you. Missing a good thing would be worse than trying something that you might not like. There are no elves in GW2 thankfully! Or Orcs! But there are swords, and sorcery. However the way you command them is vastly different from other MMO's. You might like it, check it out. Can't hurt.

[DarthSakh]

If GW2 wasn't sword & sorcery I'd try it out.

 

As it stands I've had enough of elves and orcs to last several life times.

 

GW2 is a sand box, nothing to compare with this or WOW, that are theme park based.

 

 

you are looking at the pixel of the games not at the substance that the games contain.

Edited February 6, 2012 by DarthSakh

[VenthiosLestaran]

GW2 is a sand box, nothing to compare with this or WOW, that are theme park based.

 

 

you are looking at the pixel of the game not at the substance that the game contain.

 

Mmm. I wouldn't call GW2 a Sandbox. It's more of a Sandpark. It had an overlying story that you play through while not being constricted by a linear quest path while at the same time roaming through an open world, however there is the direction that flows from one area to a next. It's melding the two a bit.

 

Sandpark or Themebox, you pick. I like Sandpark.

[DarthSakh]

Mmm. I wouldn't call GW2 a Sandbox. It's more of a Sandpark. It had an overlying story that you play through while not being constricted by a linear quest path while at the same time roaming through an open world, however there is the direction that flows from one area to a next. It's melding the two a bit.

 

Sandpark or Themebox, you pick. I like Sandpark.

 

 

agree, anyway it is sign of changes, not the same copy of another theme park, that replies the same mistakes seen before.

Edited February 6, 2012 by DarthSakh

[Wolfeisberg]

agree, anyway it is sign of changes, not the same copy of another theme park, that replies the same mistakes seen before.

 

 

Not to mention they are setting themselves up so they don't have to compete for peoples subscription money. People will be able to play GW2 and a subscription based game without paying for 2 subscriptions.

[VenthiosLestaran]

agree, anyway it is sign of changes, not the same copy of another theme park, that replies the same mistakes seen before.

 

That's what one of the Penny Arcade guys said at pax. Tycho I think. He wrote on the side of the GW2 truck that he doesn't care if the game even comes out, it's presence alone has inspired change and is pushing the genre forward. Which is wonderful. No one likes stagnation in one thing for over a decade. Which is where we've been.

[Thargrim]

Honestly depends on what they add the next couple months. Im losing interest and starting to play other games already. There just isnt enough features/hooks or substance to keep me playing longer than 1 month from now.

[Alianar]

Three things to keep in mind :

 

1) This depends on the new markets they open up to. WoW can be proud of having reached 10 Million+ subs at some point. They did not mentionned that at that time they introduced the game to the asian/Russian market. This did give them a big boost.

 

2) New content :

 

The game is great, but you quickly run out of things to do once you reach level 50. This isn't due to a lack of content despite what some might say, but rather a bad design which leads me to :

 

3) Fixing things like :

 

- the dropping system : Dosn't reward player effort at all. In so many ways, it's a really bad design for both PvP and PvE.

 

- HM or NM mode/ 8 or 16 man? No reasons to bother : Other than the challenge it self, they are no reasons to run Nightmare operations or 16 man version.

 

- Normal to HM to NM mode. Add new boss mechanics, don't symply boost it's HP, damage and enrage: Increasing difficulty should be a skill check, not a gear check.

 

- PvE at end game is a little bit too easy : Like i said, it's only a matter of gear check. We never seen a boss that required for us to adapt. This isn't to say that a boss in this game is just a tank and spank, but it's mechanics (While well designed and fun in most cases) are not much of a challenge. The best moments i had when i was raiding in WoW was when we downed a boss that took us weeks to get right. i remermber those nights when we all screamed in our mics. Sadly, we never had that in ToR at the moment. Some boss did caused many failures however, but mainly that's were :

 

- BUGGED : yes, that's probably the biggest challenge we had on some bosses. Adapt to the many bugs.

 

 

I honestly like the game and i see great potential in it. However, BW will need a lot of work on the end-game part to make this game the new AAA reference in the MMo genre.

[Fyurii]

You shouldnt take the europe pick, They useally have alot of full/very heavys at their peak times.

 

I know. I'm in Aberdeen, Scotland.

 

To be honest when I looked at them I didnt know what side you were on.

 

Why do I have to be on any side?

Edited February 6, 2012 by Fyurii

[tufy]

1) This depends on the new markets they open up to. WoW can be proud of having reached 10 Million+ subs at some point. They did not mentionned that at that time they introduced the game to the asian/Russian market. This did give them a big boost.

 

True. That's why I keep reminding people that at the end of vanilla, WoW had "mere" 3 million subscribers - and that was after one of the *******st launches any MMO might have had. It wasn't until the end of TBC that it crossed the 10 mental million barrier.

 

2) New content :

The game is great, but you quickly run out of things to do once you reach level 50. This isn't due to a lack of content despite what some might say, but rather a bad design

 

I wouldn't say so. A few days ago I was chasing after datacrons and realized there's loads of missions around the world that I didn't even find while leveling. The amount of content right now is about equal to the amount of content available at the launch of WoW (plus BGs that came in a content patch later, plus heroics that we haven't seen until TBC), with two major exceptions:

 

1. there's no reputation grinds

2. there's no attunement questlines

 

That's two major timesinks that TOR doesn't have. In all honesty though, at least the first is something I can live without. Unfortunately, that puts more pressure on Bioware to devise content for others. Still, we got one flashpoint a month after the game was launched and another due to come in march. Combined with plenty of bug fixes, I'd say they're doing it rather well so far.

 

That said:

 

- the dropping system : Dosn't reward player effort at all. In so many ways, it's a really bad design for both PvP and PvE.

 

I absolutely agree. The fixed drops are annoying as hell and need to go. If one has master looter, he should be master looter, period, no fixed drops at all. The pvp system is equally silly, but at least they're fixing that in next patch.

 

The best moments i had when i was raiding in WoW was when we downed a boss that took us weeks to get right. i remermber those nights when we all screamed in our mics. Sadly, we never had that in ToR at the moment.

 

Are you comparing Soa with Ragnaros (the original) or M'uru / Arthas? Remember, we're talking entry raid here and already we have mechanics such as Towers of Hanoi or combination locks - puzzles that can be figured out fast, but are fun nontheless. Truth be told, given the puzzle system in place now, I'm looking forward to what they can come up with in the future. Imagine for instance a boss with the "simon says" game included, which gets progressively harder the longer you do it - sort of like a soft enrage timer

 

Long story short, I enjoy TOR right now. There are bugs or annoyances around, but then, no MMOs come without them to begin with. Hopefully, it'll see a long and lasting future.

 

As for GW2: I'm not trying it out, to be honest. Not because I don't see the game as successful, but because I'm sick and tired of the same old fantasy setting. Right now, TOR is good enough, though I'd give a soulshard for Mass Effect or Starcraft MMO, a proper spy MMO or even just Funcom not messing up the Secret World (hey, one can dream, right? ). In a year or two... who knows, perhaps EVE will have a fun expansion or perhaps TOR will be awesomest MMO ever?

[Runeshard]

Seriously, how can people can claim nobody is leaving? It's just funny.

 

Who has ever made that claim? No one I've seen on this forum, certainly not EA since they announced that they have approx 1.7 million subscribers and have sold 2 million copies of the game.

[-sasori]

Which means you'll be paying for expansions or "campaigns" in gw1 speak every year or so. I played the first one.

Guild Wars Prophecies (originally named Guild Wars), was released on April 28, 2005. A year later we had Guild Wars Factions on April 28, 2006. Guild Wars Nightfall, was released on October 27, 2006 not even another year. And then Eye of the North about a year after that. So yes B2P is nice on paper but you pay for it either way.

 

As for games co-existing I could honestly care less and that's not my concern one bit. My concern is you people flooding this forum championing your game.

 

You still are just buying boxes compared to a sub of roughly 130$ a year AND boxes for expansions. It would be more than suprising if TOR wouldn't charge for expansions additionally like almost all AAA MMOs from western creators do.

 

And even if they didn't (lol) you are still comparing 130$ to what? 30$?

 

[Runeshard]

So then my question is what percent of that is still here bc its a Star Wars IP. I mean if this game used a different IP would it have been able to hold that many subs with its mechanics? I love this game but I would say no way.

How many started playing wow and stuck with it because it was the warcraft universe? I know a major reason I tried it was because I love the old warcraft games. If that game had a different IP would it have attracted as much initial attention? Hard to say really. It all depends, if they had gone with my little pony it wouldn't have been much of a hit. Bottom line is your argument applies to both games.

[Runeshard]

300,000 +

 

 

and by + I mean the + could be bigger than the number before it

 

Could be, sure, just as the announced 1.7 million could be a bit more than that.

[Geosiis]

Honestly, the 1.7 mil cannot be correct. I'm sure they counted the gamecard players as well, which doesn't say much since a lot of people without a CC had no other option than to buy a gamecard to activate the sub in the first place.

 

It all really, REALLY depends on what they do with those months. But I don't see this game growing in the long term. Doesn't justify a monthly fee for what's been given.

[Alianar]

 

Are you comparing Soa with Ragnaros (the original) or M'uru / Arthas? Remember, we're talking entry raid here and already we have mechanics such as Towers of Hanoi or combination locks - puzzles that can be figured out fast, but are fun nontheless. Truth be told, given the puzzle system in place now, I'm looking forward to what they can come up with in the future. Imagine for instance a boss with the "simon says" game included, which gets progressively harder the longer you do it - sort of like a soft enrage timer

 

mm i think i should go more into details. I am not suggesting that ToR lacks of clever boss mechanics, but i do say that they don't punish you enough when you make a mistake. But that is just me.

 

I am not going to compare ToR with WoW at it's early stage but i will compare it Wotlk. BW decided to use a Normal-HardMode-Nightmare more? Fine, but if that's how you want to do it at the very least do it right. Don't just make HM mode a version of the boss as just %+ of damage and HP. It dosn't make the fight more difficult it just forces your guild to gear up a little before they can reach the next level.

 

I kinda agree with the mormal mode game difficulty, it's a really nice way to make all the content in the game available to more casual players. But, HM and Nm as they stand now are very accessible to even the most casual guilds provided that they have enough dps and heal to stand the fight. That for might part is a flaw. Hardmode should be hard, regardless of how early this game is. That is the whole point of it.

 

I agree with your other remarks.

Edited February 6, 2012 by Alianar

[Hokonoso]

I just discovered the website Guild Wars 2 Guru and went through all the information the guys collected from Guild Wars 2 so far. In terms of features and how cool those features are, I think GW2 tops SW: TOR in every way. This game has potential, but damn GW2 will be launching with **** load of features when compared to what this game launched with. Kind of scary when compared to this game, feature wise. Bioware need to step it up. That's just what I think.

 

more features at launch = more bugs = more problems = delayed launch again... last summer the game wasnt even ready to be tested yet they keep adding more features... generally things that are too good to be true are...

[Drewser]

I don't know how many subs are active now, but I can see how many active players logs in the game on the last weekend - about 1500-2500 per server. Well, there is about 215 servers, so we have about - 2500 x 215 = 537.5k active players on the weekend (peak of the activity!) in the most optimistic way.

 

 

I could make up a number too...

[DarthKong]

I think 3 months is a bit quick to expect a 50% sub increase...

 

Most of those who were really on the lookout have probably already tried the game.

 

I think if BW does things well and improves the game and listens to the playerbase, the subs will keep growing slowly but surely.

[Stelakh]

at lease 1.6 million , what do you think dose that sound about right?

 

I think it'll take a couple of months for things to level out before any truly substantially relevant figures show up.

[Stelakh]

Ok, the two points you chose to argue are beyond terrible and your grasping for straws. The key numbers we should be looking at is the average retention rates after a few months from other big ticket MMORPG's. I think it's somewhere around 40-45%, so this game will most likely hold anywhere between 900k-1.1 million in the next few months.

 

I'm not grasping at anything. I'm not sure why I'd want to grasp at straws.

 

I'm simply saying - oddly enough - exactly the same thing you are. "The key numbers we should be looking at is the average retention rate after a few months..."

 

We just said it differently.

 

Once the hoopla dies down and the people who aren't staying peter out, that's when it'll be time to look at the numbers.

 

For now, it's just too soon to tell (although I'm relatively certain that the massive (and often rabid) Star Wars fan community will keep this game going for a long, long time).