Gregory-IRL-Bria Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 No, people just post things without understanding anything more than "SKILL HIT ME FOR A LOT". Then they post stupid things that aren't true such as "It's a tank" class, when a Focus specced, offensively geared Guardian/Jugg is most definitely not a tank. Given the brief history, Bioware caves into these things. They got their way when your class got hit. Ours will be next, I'm sure. Meh bioware seems to be pretty capable of testing **** to see if it actually does need a nerf or not. Idk why, but before the ops got nerfed i was being 2 shotted by 5k hits as a full defensive tank, so obviously some thing was up. Though i think they should of reduced it by 10%, not 20 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Treplos Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 (edited) Meh bioware seems to be pretty capable of testing **** to see if it actually does need a nerf or not. Idk why, but before the ops got nerfed i was being 2 shotted by 5k hits as a full defensive tank, so obviously some thing was up. Though i think they should of reduced it by 10%, not 20 You have a lot of faith in BW. The same testing they did on things that went through beta. The same testing they did on Illum. Cool. Now how in the heck would you know that? You got a combat log we don't know about? I got screenshots? Edited February 4, 2012 by Treplos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory-IRL-Bria Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I got screenshots? What you say isnt impossible. But a Guardian/Jug hitting you that hard is not a tank. Thats the whole point of this thread, the OP thinks that Guardians and Jugs with DPS spec some how retain the Godlike defense when they dont. Its one or the other Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pawlaar Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I wouldn't rly call my immortal jugg's defenses "godlike" but i appreciate the compliment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory-IRL-Bria Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I wouldn't rly call my immortal jugg's defenses "godlike" but i appreciate the compliment I've come out of fights where i have had less than 30% hp half the time. Maybe its not "godlike" but its certainly the best tank class ive played in an MMO to date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Treplos Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 What you say isnt impossible. But a Guardian/Jug hitting you that hard is not a tank. Thats the whole point of this thread, the OP thinks that Guardians and Jugs with DPS spec some how retain the Godlike defense when they dont. Its one or the other Does it matter if they are a tank or not? One class got nerfed for bursting for that much, but it's ok for other classes to do it. Ok lol. At least you bring other things to the table. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdnyc Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I got screenshots? Great let's see them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory-IRL-Bria Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Does it matter if they are a tank or not? One class got nerfed for bursting for that much, but it's ok for other classes to do it. Ok lol. At least you bring other things to the table. They had 1 ability nerfed to 20% damage. Id hardly call that a "Class nerf" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pawlaar Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I've come out of fights where i have had less than 30% hp half the time. Maybe its not "godlike" but its certainly the best tank class ive played in an MMO to date. Agreed I do enjoy it. PvE threat is a lil silly against more than 2 targets, but that's why there's CC n stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdnyc Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Does it matter if they are a tank or not? One class got nerfed for bursting for that much, but it's ok for other classes to do it. Ok lol. At least you bring other things to the table. Translation: I don't care if I have a valid point or not. I'm upset I was nerfed and therefore every class should have a nerf. Suggestion: Roll an alt. You'll feel less defensive about one class being adjusted. Like I said - I have a 50 scoundrel. I got hit with this nerf. I'm not happy about it because it affects my PvE end game runs, but it is what it is. I'm not for dissing other classes 'just because.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
copasetic Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Does it matter if they are a tank or not? One class got nerfed for bursting for that much, but it's ok for other classes to do it. Ok lol. At least you bring other things to the table. Operative/Scoundrel burst could only be countered by one ability: your CC breaker. There was no other way to avoid it. If this was on cooldown, you're guaranteed to be dead/nearly dead against a geared Operative/Scoundrel. You can't see when their burst is coming because they are stealthed. Juggernaut/Guardian burst can be countered by SEVERAL different methods that aren't based on one single ability. - CC them - Knockback - Run away. Their Smash/Sweep animation is very buggy and often will completely miss moving targets - Pop your defensive CD when they use Smash/Sweep and take anywhere between 0-2k dmg depending on CD and laugh as the Jugg/Guardian has to spend another 10-30 seconds building charges again There's 4 perfectly viable methods of avoiding Guardian/Juggernaut burst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdnyc Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 The funny thing is they didn't just lower the damage for the OP/Scoundrel. The also decreased the amount of resolve of ability generation. You hit 700 doing the same rotation of CC that you did before over 1000 (maxing resolve.) But I guess we only look at damage numbers and not CC elements of a heavy CC/utility class. But w/e. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vindianajones Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 (edited) Does it matter if they are a tank or not? One class got nerfed for bursting for that much, but it's ok for other classes to do it. Ok lol. At least you bring other things to the table. The one burst skill they have is not the same as what Operatives had. I still don't think Operatives needed a nerf, but they can still burst and DPS more and in a shorter period of time than a Sweep-bomb Guardian/Jugg. They have that one situational/conditional skill that can hit for a lot (assuming adrenals/relics popped and all skills used at the right time, in the right order, and without being CC'ed, avoided), but their follow up attacks are not on par with what a Scoundrel/Operative can put out. It's not like we can just run around spamming Force Sweep and get tons of kills. You have to build the ability up and a lot of players will avoid it, or they won't get hit to due to lag if they're moving, or we don't have the 3-minute surge adrenal up and it hits for 25% less, or plenty of other things. This is why I don't like it when other classes call for nerfs on something that they don't play. Unless you have a lot of information and have researched the class in question, basing it off of one ability, one player, a few select situations or a PvP video in which the creator surely posted only their best clips, it's not useful to the discussion. Edited February 3, 2012 by vindianajones Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kolbenito Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Rage/Focus Juggs have a pattern for when they are going to use Smash/Force Sweep. Look for stacks of http://www.torhead.com/ability/93kzlR7/shockwave http://www.torhead.com/ability/c6KPeec/singularity Spam the 99 ways to stop a melee and focus them down, never take a crit Smash again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hydrolix Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 You don't nerf a skill solely on the basis that it hits hard. You nerf a skill because it hits TOO hard AND no one can defend it. If this move is easily defensible, then no nerf is needed. The high dam is the reward for being able to successfully pull it off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiTaNsFaN Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 You don't nerf a skill solely on the basis that it hits hard. You nerf a skill because it hits TOO hard AND no one can defend it. If this move is easily defensible, then no nerf is needed. The high dam is the reward for being able to successfully pull it off. Tell that to an operative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pherball Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 They had 1 ability nerfed to 20% damage. Id hardly call that a "Class nerf" 20% damage reduction and 40% nerf to armor penetration. I have guildies that are still hitting 6-7k on Slam. With the way the combat flag works, saying the Slam spec takes any amount of time/skill to setup is laughable. If you're not hitting that hard, then you're not min/max on gear, and not stacking buffs --- like all SM/Ops did to hit the higher numbers. A good crit for me on a Scoundel is in the 4k's on SF post-nerf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedKremlin Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 i just want every class nerfed that i'm not playing, that way i always win, oh, and full battlemaster while i'm at it. and a puppy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiTaNsFaN Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 20% damage reduction and 40% nerf to armor penetration. I have guildies that are still hitting 6-7k on Slam. With the way the combat flag works, saying the Slam spec takes any amount of time/skill to setup is laughable. If you're not hitting that hard, then you're not min/max on gear, and not stacking buffs --- like all SM/Ops did to hit the higher numbers. A good crit for me on a Scoundel is in the 4k's on SF post-nerf. ^Oh look, someone who isn't completely delusional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory-IRL-Bria Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Tell that to an operative. You must of failed to read anything he just wrote. An operative backstab is not Easily defensible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiTaNsFaN Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 You must of failed to read anything he just wrote. An operative backstab is not Easily defensible I mean tell an operative how to "easily defend" against an lolslam jugg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spyde Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I play Rage spec for pvp. I can Crit for 3-4k dmg with my gear. If... I get knockback while im using slam.. it doesnt work. If target is moving, most of the time slam doesnt hit them. Im not tanky, im squishy as a merc and i have to be up close. If i ran tank stance, i lose dmg. The AoE size is tiny. I hit for 3-4k ever 10-15 sec. OMGZ I have to charge my skill up, keep you in range.. to do it. You can nerf this, thats fine. Give me a 3k-4k dmg ability on a 3 sec cooldown to match what Mercs can spam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImSaved Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 You must of failed to read anything he just wrote. An operative backstab is not Easily defensible Operatives are barely breaking 4k+ now with their opener. It's hardly comparable to a 6k+ AoE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiTaNsFaN Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 I play Rage spec for pvp. I can Crit for 3-4k dmg with my gear. If... I get knockback while im using slam.. it doesnt work. If target is moving, most of the time slam doesnt hit them. Im not tanky, im squishy as a merc and i have to be up close. If i ran tank stance, i lose dmg. The AoE size is tiny. I hit for 3-4k ever 10-15 sec. OMGZ I have to charge my skill up, keep you in range.. to do it. You can nerf this, thats fine. Give me a 3k-4k dmg ability on a 3 sec cooldown to match what Mercs can spam. WHERE ARE THESE MAGICAL ~5-6k AOE CRITS + ~3K follow-up bursts COMING FROM THEN!? Arrow in the knee? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seriasx Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I mean tell an operative how to "easily defend" against an lolslam jugg. back up 5 meters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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