Nerf tracer missle now

[Sickboy_]

tracer missile is fine

[Definity]

No, operatives were doing half your hp in ONE hit (7k), in 3 hits you were dead. Taking half your health in 4,5 seconds IF they crit on all of them which is a very sllim chance is not exactly overpowered. Every class can do the same. Melees can even do it with instants. Tracermissile is very vulnerable to interrupts and LoS.

 

I mean, if you cant deal with someone spamming tracermissile you have nothing to do in PvP. Even the "supposedly" weakest class, gunslinger can do way more dmg than a guy spamming tracermissile in the same amount of time. Gunnerycommando is the easiest class to play against in the game. They got so little utility. Arguably the weakest class in a 1v1 scenario with all CD clean, given equal gear.

 

Stop ranting about a basic skill that is by no means overpowered and learn to play the game.

 

Could you please tell me what move i have that is instant and can take 3/4 of your health or even three instants that can do that ? Please also don't forget that you all get mitigation vs my jug warriors damage and i get none vs half of the range class moves.

 

( please don't include smash as this involves a ramp up of other moves and by the end of that ramp up i will be dead from you missiles. )

 

thanks

[ImperialSun]

Name ONE other AC, not including your mirror, that has ONE ability that does 4 things.

 

You also forgot the ARMOR debuff. So that's 5.

 

 

 

Lower the damage and the crit multiplier of that ONE ability and we're all pretty OK with it doing multiple things for you.

 

I spam pebbles, I accept that. But my spamming of pebbles does nothing in the way of what this one ability does for you.

 

So by your own admission TM is working exactly as intended? Its fine as it is.

 

People just need to learn to ignore certain posters like Jediduckling et al who come on here with their blatant lies, misinformation and other crap like "TM hits me for 11k per crit every single time - FACT"

 

Mercs have high dps in turret mode and minimal CC / mobility in return for it. How is that NOT balanced. The problem here is people need to actually use LOS and interupt - if they did that you would find that Mercs are not hard to take down at all - the problem is you all want to use your OWN 2-3 button spam to burn us down like you do for every other class - if you meet us toe to toe you will get a tonne of damage but if you use the abilities at your disposal we go down like a tonne of bricks...your all just being as lazy as you accuse Mercs of being - the difference we have to spam one ability because thats how our class is intended to be played.

 

You nerf tards simply cant be bothered to throw interupts and LOS breaks into your usual facemelt cookie cutter rotations imo - the arguement cuts both ways.

 

Driz

Edited February 1, 2012 by ImperialSun

[GrymTruth]

Fixed that for you. It's the main filler in PVE too

 

Oooo thanks, was only thinking about PvP.

[Slashtwo]

Arsenal is such a laughable PvP spec. I mean, I play a merc and I PvP all the time. But I can't believe kids are still dying to arsenal. They're probably the most squishy spec in pvp.

 

I play pyro merc and I think I died maybe 3 times in the last 30 or so wz's to some arsenal noob. Spec has horrible mobility and slightly above average dps output. So they're pretty much useless unless you let them stand on a ledge and beat the crap out of you.

 

It's the WoW equiv of Arcane mage with slightly more passive mitigation and 0 mobility.

Edited February 1, 2012 by Slashtwo

[Endusima]

I'm not saying they are OP or anything but for what Tracer does it should really be a 31-talent.

 

I also kinda dislike the fact that all they need to do is spam tracertracertracer for phat dps whereas me as a Lethalithy operative has to use 3-4 different abilities in order to even come close to said dps.

[GrumpySwe]

Name ONE other AC, not including your mirror, that has ONE ability that does 4 things.

 

You also forgot the ARMOR debuff. So that's 5.

 

 

 

Lower the damage and the crit multiplier of that ONE ability and we're all pretty OK with it doing multiple things for you.

 

I spam pebbles, I accept that. But my spamming of pebbles does nothing in the way of what this one ability does for you.

 

Actually heat signatures give the armor debuff and the increased HSM damage increase, HSM does very little damage without the heat signatures tho.

[Gwal]

I'm not saying they are OP or anything but for what Tracer does it should really be a 31-talent.

 

I also kinda dislike the fact that all they need to do is spam tracertracertracer for phat dps whereas me as a Lethalithy operative has to use 3-4 different abilities in order to even come close to said dps.

 

They are actually normally using at least 4 abilities (I used to have 6 in contanst use as gunnery commando) to do all that juicy damage, but 2 of them are instant cast with easily missed animations.

 

I don't know why people are fussing so much, having played gunnery from about 35-45 before switching assault, I know unless a grav spammer catches you in the open or has support/healing they are not very dangerous. They completely rely on 1 skill but have to use 4 minimum to get reasonable damage, interrupt/pushback that skill and they might aswell be hitting you with an inflatable hammer.

[buttski]

best armor, best knockback, best burst.

 

gg.

[Biboonz]

i like spammers they are just free kills walking around .

[Gwal]

I like spammers they are just free kills standing still.

 

I had to fix that.

Edited February 1, 2012 by Gwal

[Machr]

As a shield spec vanguard, I've no issues at all with these TM spamming mercs. Storm-interupting their first one, interrupt their second one. AoE stun when interrupt effect wears off, interrupt again, cryo grenade etc etc. This is a 1v1 scenario ofc, not counting for external effects. As assault-specced, I really get hurt by not having the charge as he will get off several TMs before I get on top of him. But that's where harpoon comes in handy I guess.

 

That said, troopers aren't the class lacking utility. I can absolutely see how classes with less can find the TM/GM spam frustratin. The thing is that, like other people have said: a ragned dps class that is left alone WILL do lots of damage. I think the main issue is that people become frustrated that the dmg potential is so great with so little effort. Not the dmg itself. Snipers in cover left alone will deal atleast the same amount of dmg, but they use more than one ability so they get less hate.

 

Yes, you will do better with a non-TM-spam rotation, but the truth is that no other class can do as well with such a simple rotation. I can't see how people WANT a 1-2 button spam, and I can't see how BW wants it. So emphasizing the rest of the toolbox will probably solve part of the spam-issue, which will lead to less hate, even if the total dmg output stays the same.

[Edex]

Hope you can LoS otherwise tuck your head between your legs and.. well you know the rest. Seriously though, tracer IS ridiculous. I can't believe people like to claim its not when one can run through a WZ spamming only that and not only get high on the damage charts, but ALSO reliably get kills. With most classes its one or the other, you do a lot of damage that's easily healed (AoEs and DoTs, etc), or your damage comes in bursts that's harder to heal. Not huge burst that slowly ramps up and can be followed up by more powerful abilities if needed.

 

My main is an assasin and i laugh at tracer/grav spams. I think the biggest issue here is people just refusing to learn how to pvp. I even posted a thread with various suggestions on how to counter this. It is not hard in the least and los is your best,fastest, easiest way. Missile going around corner? he hit it off before you broke los obviouslly. Why do people defend it? to be blunt it is as easy to use as it is to avoid and only someone who charges in blindly and gets focused fired on will lose to it easily. Stick with your team, learn some pvp basics.

[Keinhoran]

Ok Lets go over again.

3 x Grav Round with average cast time 1.2 secs and a travelling time of 0.5 secs = 5.1 secs to deliver an average crit of 2.3k per hit= 6.9k damage in 5.1 seconds. Full auto is 2.7 chanelled ability. Lets say that all of the hits crit hit for 2,2k damage therefore 6.6k damage.

Total damage in 8 secs 13.5k. When all the attacks are critical hits.

 

HiB and Demo round will be casted after the two above abilities.

 

So for almost 8 secs you are letting someone to hit you.

 

Of course in a warzone it is very likely while you are fighting with one person one of his teammates to assist him therefore you will loose your hitpoint due to combined abilities. But since the problem is the grav round/ tracer missile that means you are actually know what is hitting you but you are not counter acting........

 

Sorry Edex i had to edit the text because i did some stupid math mistakes.

Edited February 1, 2012 by Keinhoran

[Edex]

Ok Lets go over again.

3 x Grav Round with average cast time 1.2 secs and a travelling time of 0.5 secs = 5.1 secs to deliver an average crit of 2.3k per hit= 6.4k damage in 5.1 seconds. Full auto is 2.7 chanelled ability. Lets say that all of the hits crit hit for 2,2k damage therefore 6.6k damage.

 

HiB and Demo round will be casted after the two above abilities.

 

So for almost 8 secs you are letting someone to hit you.

 

Of course in a warzone it is very likely while you are fighting with one person one of his teammates to assist him therefore you will loose your hitpoint due to combined abilities. But since the problem is the grav round/ tracer missile that means you are actually know what is hitting you but you are not counter acting........

 

^

this.. situational awareness is key to pvp.

[Endusima]

They are actually normally using at least 4 abilities (I used to have 6 in contanst use as gunnery commando) to do all that juicy damage, but 2 of them are instant cast with easily missed animations.

 

I don't know why people are fussing so much, having played gunnery from about 35-45 before switching assault, I know unless a grav spammer catches you in the open or has support/healing they are not very dangerous. They completely rely on 1 skill but have to use 4 minimum to get reasonable damage, interrupt/pushback that skill and they might aswell be hitting you with an inflatable hammer.

 

 

So you played a spec 35-45? C'mon man get real :/

[PhilCanuck]

If they fixed the animation on TM most of these QQers wouldn't even realize they were being hit by it. It's loud, has an obnoxious animation, and sets up stacking buffs/debuffs that are the foundation of the Arsenal tree. Of course you see it getting fired a lot.

[Buddhalux]

As a shield spec vanguard, I've no issues at all with these TM spamming mercs. Storm-interupting their first one, interrupt their second one. AoE stun when interrupt effect wears off, interrupt again, cryo grenade etc etc. This is a 1v1 scenario ofc, not counting for external effects. As assault-specced, I really get hurt by not having the charge as he will get off several TMs before I get on top of him. But that's where harpoon comes in handy I guess.

 

That said, troopers aren't the class lacking utility. I can absolutely see how classes with less can find the TM/GM spam frustratin. The thing is that, like other people have said: a ragned dps class that is left alone WILL do lots of damage. I think the main issue is that people become frustrated that the dmg potential is so great with so little effort. Not the dmg itself. Snipers in cover left alone will deal atleast the same amount of dmg, but they use more than one ability so they get less hate.

 

Yes, you will do better with a non-TM-spam rotation, but the truth is that no other class can do as well with such a simple rotation. I can't see how people WANT a 1-2 button spam, and I can't see how BW wants it. So emphasizing the rest of the toolbox will probably solve part of the spam-issue, which will lead to less hate, even if the total dmg output stays the same.

 

If the Arsenal Merc is only using 1-2 buttons then they are fail. I use 5-6 different attacks in my rotations.

 

Also, TM is on a 1.4 sec CD not 1.2 like everyone's quoting. Of course that isn't including any alacrity either.

[Orrow]

So many bad people losing to tracer missile/Grav round spam. Its so unbelievably easy to avoid, it doesn't even hit that hard. I would never admit to losing to one, let alone QQ about it on the forums. Its like letting the entire world know your a terrible player.

[Edex]

If the Arsenal Merc is only using 1-2 buttons then they are fail. I use 5-6 different attacks in my rotations.

 

Also, TM is on a 1.4 sec CD not 1.2 like everyone's quoting. Of course that isn't including any alacrity either.

 

1.5 actually, at least thats what it says in game for mine with no alacrity.

[RycheMykola]

Tracer can be spammed over and over until your energy runs out. I know they are not supposed to but it sure seems they go around conrers under walkways. It is probally delay but when you get the first hit and you drop down under the merc spamming and you get 2 more times with the curving missles it drives you crazy. As a commando I have an interupt if I am right on top of you or spec the 3sec cast hold by that time I am pretty much dead.

 

All this is fine it really is I understand not all classes are truely balanced some can just kick *** on others. The problem comes when its the flavor of the month and you have 3-4 mercs spamming missle its impossible to play against for any class.

 

The comparable ability is mortar and it paints a nice circle on the ground for you to get out of before the first mortar is even launched. Change it so the mortar is exploding when the circle shows and every BH would be on the forums screaming unfair.

 

 

They should not get nerfed because of the damage the nerf will come because its the easy win button when you have more than 1 merc in a match and right now everyone is leaving ops to do merc its just a fact that people want the easy way to win. if not everyone would be playing the sentinal version on each side.

BHers don't use energy, they have heat build up.

 

I'd love to play against another team where 3-4 BHers are just spamming tracer missile, easy win for our team.

[Machr]

If the Arsenal Merc is only using 1-2 buttons then they are fail. I use 5-6 different attacks in my rotations.

 

Also, TM is on a 1.4 sec CD not 1.2 like everyone's quoting. Of course that isn't including any alacrity either.

 

Like I said in my pots: Yes you will do better with not spamming. That doesn't change the fact that you can do well enough with the spamming. And that's what people are having issues with. Call it jealousy or w/e. But as long as people can get good dmg done and medals with the spamming, it is an issue. And since you alread use a diversified rotation, I would assume you would welcome more emphasis on that aspect. I don't want dmg reduction, just some way to give an incentive to use other abilities, even to the bad/mediocre players

[RycheMykola]

Could you please tell me what move i have that is instant and can take 3/4 of your health or even three instants that can do that ? Please also don't forget that you all get mitigation vs my jug warriors damage and i get none vs half of the range class moves.

 

( please don't include smash as this involves a ramp up of other moves and by the end of that ramp up i will be dead from you missiles. )

 

thanks

I think the OP is PVPing at level 50 with the same gear they got on the starter planet.

[neurosisxeno]

I don't think anyone is arguing that TM is the staple of the tree as the many BH's seem to be claiming. The argument is actually that it's too good for a staple\filler skill. Yes, it works as intended, but the way it's intended to work is the problem. As Lethality, just to get the most out of my best skill I would have to cast 3 separate abilities. A BH? Just 1. I know the tree is built that way, I'm not arguing that fact. I'm saying that no tree should make it so a filler move is spammable for acceptable dps. No other spec has that, BH's should be no exception.

[Buddhalux]

Since I'm 31 Arsenal my rotation is loosely this depending on the situation.

 

3xTM (spec'd maxes debuff in 3 shots instead of 5)

HSM (nice bonus damage after 3xTM)

RG

1xTM

Unload

PS

1xTM

rinse and repeat.

 

This doesn't include using electro dart, both KB's, self shield, the timed dart, and an occasional missle while moving.