EdwinLi Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I may be still new to the game but it still kind of bothers me how many people are judging this game when it is still new. New MMOs need time to become the good MMO people expect it to be despite how you may feel now. Currently now I'm enjoying this game but I do see somethings that need to be added in the future. I don't completely disagree with most of the arguments about SWTOR being bad now when it is still a New MMO but that is basically the point about SWTOR. This game now is in the New MMO stages which like all New MMOs will have some kind of major issues that will need some fixing or improving. Yes, currently there is a limit to SWTOR being fun but that is also because this MMO is still new. As the SWTOR becomes older with more updates and content it will become better. For Example, WoW started in 2004 and back then it didn't have the major PvP battle Maps Alterac Valley and Warsong Gulch until 2005 and it faced many bugs and glitches as well during its first year. Most of the content WoW has now didn't even exist. Yes this was 8 years ago but did you really think WoW became the Major MMO it is now by simply putting up all the things they have now in one simple release? No, it took them time and patience from the players to become the Major MMO it is today. This concept is the basics for MMO development and still follows with MMOs being created today. Just give SWTOR time to become better because a Good MMO is not created within a year but through time and patience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBadEdward Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I'm really tired of the "it's new so it is OK for it to suck" argument because it's total BS. The Galactic Trade waste of time is a good example. Why does that have to suck when there are several examples of how to do it right? Why was it necessary to go live without auto-stacking in your corgo hold? How many examples do you need? Bugs I can handle, every new application has bugs but just poor design choices and lack of basic features is unacceptable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronPenick Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 (edited) New is not a argument. Lets look at Rift as a example. AT LAUNCH it had A LOT more features then TOR. Guild love (guild trees and missions were awesome) Being able to queue for the WZ you actually WANT to do (GD HUTTBALL!) dye system, macros, pvp brakets.....................see were im going with this? Edited January 27, 2012 by AaronPenick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draylore Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I agree, the ""it's new so it is OK for it to suck" argument/defense is getting old. Time change, genres change.........companies need to understand that. In the case of MMOs....there are certain things that customers are going to expect and that there simply is no excuse not to provide......stuff that EQ1 and WoW may have not had until several years in. Your competition is what is out there NOW not what was out there 6 years ago. If you expect to pull customers from your competition you have to offer something at least as good as what they have NOW......not something they had 6 years ago. There is a thing in software development called "Lessons learned".......it not only applies to learning from things you have done in the past but also from things others in your field have done in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eadnams Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 New is not a argument. Lets look at Rift as a example. AT LAUNCH it had A LOT more features then TOR. Guild love (guild trees and missions were awesome) Being able to queue for the WZ you actually WANT to do (GD HUTTBALL!) dye system, macros, pvp brakets.....................see were im going with this? I think so... You're saying that different companies put different priorities on different features due to many variables. I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyACT Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I may be still new to the game but it still kind of bothers me how many people are judging this game when it is still new. New MMOs need time to become the good MMO people expect it to be despite how you may feel now. Currently now I'm enjoying this game but I do see somethings that need to be added in the future. I don't completely disagree with most of the arguments about SWTOR being bad now when it is still a New MMO but that is basically the point about SWTOR. This game now is in the New MMO stages which like all New MMOs will have some kind of major issues that will need some fixing or improving. Yes, currently there is a limit to SWTOR being fun but that is also because this MMO is still new. As the SWTOR becomes older with more updates and content it will become better. For Example, WoW started in 2004 and back then it didn't have the major PvP battle Maps Alterac Valley and Warsong Gulch until 2005 and it faced many bugs and glitches as well during its first year. Most of the content WoW has now didn't even exist. Yes this was 8 years ago but did you really think WoW became the Major MMO it is now by simply putting up all the things they have now in one simple release? No, it took them time and patience from the players to become the Major MMO it is today. This concept is the basics for MMO development and still follows with MMOs being created today. Just give SWTOR time to become better because a Good MMO is not created within a year but through time and patience. It may be new - they still want your $15 a month to play. Should folks subsidise them until it gets better is the question. I happen to like it but will only sub one more month as the game stands just now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elladan Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I don't think people are complaining about how poorly several things are implemented (or not implemented at all) with a new MMO. They are complaining about a game that has been in development for 5 years and has gone through extensive beta-testing, with plenty of feedback, still has so many broken/lacking features. In order to compete, you have to have at least the same basic functionalities as well-established MMOs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcfabulous Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I don't think people are complaining about how poorly several things are implemented (or not implemented at all) with a new MMO. They are complaining about a game that has been in development for 5 years and has gone through extensive beta-testing, with plenty of feedback, still has so many broken/lacking features. In order to compete, you have to have at least the same basic functionalities as well-established MMOs. According to the die-hard fans, if it has an action bar its up to par. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HavenAE Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 (edited) New is not a argument. Lets look at Rift as a example. AT LAUNCH it had A LOT more features then TOR. Guild love (guild trees and missions were awesome) Being able to queue for the WZ you actually WANT to do (GD HUTTBALL!) dye system, macros, pvp brakets.....................see were im going with this? I see that you're going to a place where it doesn't matter what features you have at launch. Rift had a lot of things people consider "standard", which really aren't because most of these "standard" features are relatively new features. But anyway Rift had a lot of stuff and still plummeted in it's subscriptions 3 months out. So apparently having all of those nice extras doesn't have any bearing on whether or not your game wins or fails. Although people like to pretend it does. Edited January 27, 2012 by HavenAE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dumpiduke Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 New is not a argument. Lets look at Rift as a example. AT LAUNCH it had A LOT more features then TOR. Guild love (guild trees and missions were awesome) Being able to queue for the WZ you actually WANT to do (GD HUTTBALL!) dye system, macros, pvp brakets.....................see were im going with this? Rift was so mind-numblingly boring and EXACTLY like WoW that I couldn't even make it past level 14. The things that have kept me going in TOR are the only things that it has over games like WoW and Rift, story and science fiction. At least in TOR I'll actually be able to stomach making it to end game... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eadnams Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Rift was so mind-numblingly boring and EXACTLY like WoW that I couldn't even make it past level 14. The things that have kept me going in TOR are the only things that it has over games like WoW and Rift, story and science fiction. At least in TOR I'll actually be able to stomach making it to end game... WoW always got boring for me around ~20-15 lvls from the top level(Always re-subbed after each expansion). In ToR, I'm not bored at lvl 42, and already excited about my next toon. ToR has something, and its kept me longer than WoW did. /anecdote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyACT Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Rift was so mind-numblingly boring and EXACTLY like WoW that I couldn't even make it past level 14. The things that have kept me going in TOR are the only things that it has over games like WoW and Rift, story and science fiction. At least in TOR I'll actually be able to stomach making it to end game... Same. I got to the first new area in Rift and realised I couldn't do the same fantasy grind again. I even had the CE, but deleted it off my disk the same day. I am giving this a couple of months, but want to see more basic MMO features and a few more 'out of the box' ones as well to continue giving them my money any longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zannis Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I'm a total fanboy. I really am, I love this game, and I am not going anywhere anytime soon. But the fact of the matter is that this game is very feature poor. Just because games were like this seven years ago doesn't mean we can ignore all the advances since then. By that logic, a new game company could start out by making coin-op Arcades that resemble Pong since that's how the industry as a whole started. We understand that Bioware did what it had to do, but the pressure is on to introduce MMO features that have become staples since 2004, such as third party mods, combat logs, a group matchmaking service, etc. Bioware does not have seven years to implement these features. They've got another six months tops before even the die hard fanboys such as myself lose patience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zarrot Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 (edited) WoW at launch you couldn't even log in for days at a time. Anarchy Online released a patch that bricked your hard drive. Edited January 27, 2012 by Zarrot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronPenick Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I am giving this a couple of months, but want to see more basic MMO features and a few more 'out of the box' ones as well to continue giving them my money any longer. This is my stance and allow me to clarify I am not saying Rift is the end all game. I canceled after 2 months cause I got bored with it. I am however saying that it at least got some key features in that are considered a standard. I would also like to say I have played WoW for a total of 15-20 hours back around vanilla so I am not basing this off of that game (also probably why Rift didnt bore me asap?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcfabulous Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 This is my stance and allow me to clarify I am not saying Rift is the end all game. I canceled after 2 months cause I got bored with it. I am however saying that it at least got some key features in that are considered a standard. I would also like to say I have played WoW for a total of 15-20 hours back around vanilla so I am not basing this off of that game (also probably why Rift didnt bore me asap?) point trying to be made here is its obviously possibly stop meat shielding bioware Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeacefulViolence Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I may be still new to the game but it still kind of bothers me how many people are judging this game when it is still new. New MMOs need time to become the good MMO people expect it to be despite how you may feel now. Currently now I'm enjoying this game but I do see somethings that need to be added in the future. I don't completely disagree with most of the arguments about SWTOR being bad now when it is still a New MMO but that is basically the point about SWTOR. This game now is in the New MMO stages which like all New MMOs will have some kind of major issues that will need some fixing or improving. Yes, currently there is a limit to SWTOR being fun but that is also because this MMO is still new. As the SWTOR becomes older with more updates and content it will become better. For Example, WoW started in 2004 and back then it didn't have the major PvP battle Maps Alterac Valley and Warsong Gulch until 2005 and it faced many bugs and glitches as well during its first year. Most of the content WoW has now didn't even exist. Yes this was 8 years ago but did you really think WoW became the Major MMO it is now by simply putting up all the things they have now in one simple release? No, it took them time and patience from the players to become the Major MMO it is today. This concept is the basics for MMO development and still follows with MMOs being created today. Just give SWTOR time to become better because a Good MMO is not created within a year but through time and patience. There is nothing you can do about it, people will judge everything because that's the way they are, the smartest thing anyone can do is completely ignore it, you will be a much happier person that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBadEdward Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 WoW at launch you couldn't even log in for days at a time. Anarchy Online released a patch that bricked your hard drive. I played late Beta and from launch for about a year. I never had any of those problems. If I remember correctly, WoW had a pretty smooth launch. SWToR launch was pretty smooth as well but WoW just started, over 5 years ago, with more features and more content than SWToR has today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taurusaud Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Oh come off it! They've had 6 years to develop a responsive UI that doesn't lag. 6 freaking years!!! How much longer do you think they need????? How much longer you gonna keep paying them for incompetence!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dumpiduke Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I played late Beta and from launch for about a year. I never had any of those problems. If I remember correctly, WoW had a pretty smooth launch. SWToR launch was pretty smooth as well but WoW just started, over 5 years ago, with more features and more content than SWToR has today. If you call grinding mobs content There weren't even enough quests to make it to 60. There is no way that todays generation of MMO players would stand for a game like vanilla WoW were it to come out today. Wouldn't stand a chance. This genre has the harshest critics of any, and that's because people have to pay money to play. I feel sorry for new MMO developers...tough to go up against a behemoth that has almost 10 years of development under its belt. Guild Wars 2 is going to suffer the same fate. People will cry that it's too easy and casual and that there's no content. Luckily, the game will be F2P so we may not have as many people crying about the amount of content they get for their money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skaara Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Yeah, I remember when I used to support new games as well with promises of fixes and future content like Matrix online and Vanguard. I wonder how they are doing these days ... oh wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthTorne Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Just give SWTOR time to become better because a Good MMO is not created within a year but through time and patience. While I'm going to be holding out for a while ( I've payed my first sub, and will most likely pay for several more) I do hate this argument. People complain about "not comparing TOR to WoW" but I want you guys to think on something. WoW (and other Blizzard games) build off the success of previous games in their genre. If you want to compete, you not only need to make something similar, but build on it. TOR sadly hasn't done this. There are a lot of great things in TOR; epic story-lines, an interactive companion system, revamped crafting...these are great things. But it's missing a lot which has already been beat to the ground by players. Now, I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt that BW dev's have had a decent LFG system in the works and didn't have it ready for when they had to release TOR. The same goes for various other issues. Level 50 WZ's got added pretty quick after release. These things take time to code, test, and implement properly. That's why I'm not going to jump ship, I *want* this game to live and stay out of the F2P graveyard. Unfortunately, I have no clue if what I'm hoping is true or not. Saying it's okay for it to be missing a lot of important features is asinine. Are these things going to make the game unplayable? No. But they contribute to how fun the game is. When you pay a monthly fee, the less fun someone has the less likely they will continue to play. I want people to keep playing. The more people play, the more money BW gets, the more likely Big Brother won't tell the devs they had their chance. Please stop with the "it's okay!" arguments. It's not okay. We're in a theme park that doesn't have a scary roller coaster, only carries Pepsi, and doesn't have a gift shop. That park isn't going to make it unless it fixes these problems. Ignoring them and telling other people that it's fine without them is counter-productive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HelluvaJedi Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 In other words: Pay no attention to the average MMO behind the curtain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zarrot Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I played late Beta and from launch for about a year. I never had any of those problems. If I remember correctly, WoW had a pretty smooth launch. SWToR launch was pretty smooth as well but WoW just started, over 5 years ago, with more features and more content than SWToR has today. You have a poor memory then... http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/10/feature/4862/The-Worst-MMORPG-Launches.html 1.) World of Warcraft However, as far as player-aggravation goes, Blizzard’s behemoth will probably own the title of most hair-pulling for a while. No one, not even Blizzard, expected WoW to become the juggernaut it has during its monumental six-year run. When it launched the fact that the developer was caught off guard by the response to its first MMO release was painfully obvious. Servers were down for days at a time, players couldn’t loot, server-side lag was abundant and no matter how many new shards the studio launched, they filled to peak population incredibly quickly. The early days of WoW were hampered by its own success. So much so that the developer began handing out free days in accordance with how many days the servers were inaccessible. In the end, let’s just hope that everyone has learned from all five of these games’ mistakes. I shudder to think about what Blizzard’s next MMO launch will be like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quip Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 You have a poor memory then... http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/10/feature/4862/The-Worst-MMORPG-Launches.html 1.) World of Warcraft *Snip* People seem to forget that one. While WoW was somewhat light on bugs at launch it more than made up for that by being REALLY light on infrastructure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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