Dungeon Finder Needed Badly

[RachelAnne]

I agree that the LFD program is conevenient and easy, but I would still prefer only being to access the dungeons physically. But, perhaps an LFD tool that works per server, not cross-server, and doesnt teleport players to the dungeon, but rather forms groups, that then show up togother for the dungeon. This allows groups to be formed all over the various planets of the server, and is basicly a compromise between the two majorities of opinions on the subject - Being able to teleport there instantly and fully grouped, and not being able to teleport at all and taking the time to find a group of players.

 

I dont think that the teleport is bad tbh, there are many games where you can port to your group and at SWTOR its available too allready, just not for dungeons yet.

 

To be able to group with whom you want to, this is key - in that way people dont have to play with unfriendly, unskilled or unsocial players except they want to.

 

Wow totally failed there, the hardcore kid does end up with the mom - its understandable that then 2 worlds collide and the group cant work.

 

Welcome! Great feedback.

 

I had the exact opposite feeling towards WoW's LFR. It was an "about time" feature for me. I was never able to run the raid content unless, like you did, my guild would run it after the next tier came out. But that never seemed like fun. Like I was missing out on the "story" of the current tier. LFR let me kill Deathwing and I was a happy player. Then I unsubscribed becuase of SWTOR and am now completely missing an Operation finder (or will be once I reach 50).

 

The LFR wasnt that bad actually, I did support that tool since I was suggesting it 4 years ago, when WOTLK hit with all those hardmodes, normal - hardcore and 10 & 25 raid sizes and achivements.

 

The reason why I wanted the tool was simple. It could had given you the chance to finish the game, in my guild I could never motivate the guys to kick a dead boss again - we were casuals and most of us saw the game as done, when the boss had died. We much rather started a new char then and did it all again...

 

Unfortunately the way how Blizz introduced the tool was just as much a fail like the LFD, which is quite disappointing to say the least.

 

Only 25 men raids, only the newest raid and then only the easymode + the usual problems of the LFD taken over.

Edited February 2, 2012 by RachelAnne

[Touchbass]

I agree that the LFD program is conevenient and easy, but I would still prefer only being to access the dungeons physically. But, perhaps an LFD tool that works per server, not cross-server, and doesnt teleport players to the dungeon, but rather forms groups, that then show up togother for the dungeon. This allows groups to be formed all over the various planets of the server, and is basicly a compromise between the two majorities of opinions on the subject - Being able to teleport there instantly and fully grouped, and not being able to teleport at all and taking the time to find a group of players.

 

The teleport is one of the bigger reasons why we need a LFD and it has to be automated. What happens if you are playing off peak times (6-11~) and you lose a tank? Someone is suppose to leave the dungeon, goto the fleet and hope a tank comes? Groups are falling apart because of that and it's a simple remedy.

[MalignX]

The teleport is one of the bigger reasons why we need a LFD and it has to be automated. What happens if you are playing off peak times (6-11~) and you lose a tank? Someone is suppose to leave the dungeon, goto the fleet and hope a tank comes? Groups are falling apart because of that and it's a simple remedy.

 

Can't see why WZs would get a teleport and RDF(LFFP?) wouldn't.

[Rilauven]

I just want to say that I only support a dungeon finder (Flashpoint Finder?) if it's same server only.

 

WoW's Dungeon Finder ruined the sense of server community and is one of the reasons I left.

 

I have a growing friends list outside of my guild that I'm quite proud of. Walking around the Fleet Stations has become alot like walking into Cheers! to have everyone Shout your name! I don't want to lose that!

 

I would also rather wait 2 hours to get a group of people on my server than 5 minutes to get 3 people I'll never see again.

[Touchbass]

Can't see why WZs would get a teleport and RDF(LFFP?) wouldn't.

 

Currently we can queue for a warzone, join a bunch of random same server players and perform coordinated attacks without any in server punishmenet if i go /afk. The fact that this is working perfectly fine minus a kick feature just shows that X-LFD is ready and should work fine.

[Touchbass]

I just want to say that I only support a dungeon finder (Flashpoint Finder?) if it's same server only.

 

WoW's Dungeon Finder ruined the sense of server community and is one of the reasons I left.

 

I have a growing friends list outside of my guild that I'm quite proud of. Walking around the Fleet Stations has become alot like walking into Cheers! to have everyone Shout your name! I don't want to lose that!

 

I would also rather wait 2 hours to get a group of people on my server than 5 minutes to get 3 people I'll never see again.

 

You can always find groups the old way, you are telling me you can't find a full group within 2 hours the /who, check your friends list and ask in fleet method?

 

EDIT: That is why we want 2 options when looking for group: 1 is X-LFD and the other is Introserver with a bit of a time penalty.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Touchbass

[MalignX]

I just want to say that I only support a dungeon finder (Flashpoint Finder?) if it's same server only.

 

WoW's Dungeon Finder ruined the sense of server community and is one of the reasons I left.

 

I have a growing friends list outside of my guild that I'm quite proud of. Walking around the Fleet Stations has become alot like walking into Cheers! to have everyone Shout your name! I don't want to lose that!

 

I would also rather wait 2 hours to get a group of people on my server than 5 minutes to get 3 people I'll never see again.

I would rather get a group in 5 minutes and run a Flash Point with 3 people I'll never talk to again, than ever spend another 2-6 hours trying to get a group together.

[Touchbass]

You knew that was the size before you bought the game, So you tell me who's more retarded you for knowing this and buying the game and then complaining about it or them for trying to make groups smaller therefore easier to make? I think I'll go with you...

 

 

No I didn't, tell me where on the cardbox it says groups of 4? Besides I'd buy the game anyways whether or not this game even had grouping functions so your opinion is invalid. Everybody I know thinks groups should be bigger, at least 5 people, 4 is too small. It makes finding groups more difficult cause half the group is support and typically support is the hardest part of the group to find.

 

Maybe you should educate yourself on the issues before you continue to post?

Edited February 2, 2012 by Touchbass

[MalignX]

Truth is we dont NEED a LFG, But all you WoW babies are so used to insta everything that you WANT one. Gimme Gimme Gimme players like you are KILLING MMO's.

 

This is the kind if intelligent posts you can expect from this guy.

Edited February 2, 2012 by MalignX

[Touchbass]

Did I miss another useless post he made Mal or did you look up his post history?

[MalignX]

Did I miss another useless post he made Mal or did you look up his post history?

 

He made it in another thread I just happen to be reading right after he piped up here.

[Touchbass]

He made it in another thread I just happen to be reading right after he piped up here.

 

haha, owned.

[Touchbass]

Good news, from the looks of it it appears the mass majority of players posting on these threads want at minimal, an improved dungeon finder tool. Support for X-LFD is also up on the rise as well, it could be hovering around at least 40%

[Touchbass]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amkywcdK1RI

 

Not sure if everyone has seen this, guy from Tankspot talks about the LFD/LFR

[SushaBrancaleone]

hey ive said things pertinent to this thread elsewhere. I tend to write walls of text. forgive me if i copy and paste 3 comments i posted elsewere out of context. I hope they are selfexplanatory and apologize if not so.

 

 

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I am in swtor terms a decemberist.

for those who don't have a clue wot im on about, it means i bought the game for early acess but did so a month before release.

It might seem boring but its pertinent to my arugment and i would spend a couple of words explaining this better for those who dont know.

 

Bioware decided to provide early access to all players who pre-oredered the game. the window of early access was planed to be of 5 days before release. People started ordering in august. when in december they opened the server early for said service access was provided to clients giving priority to prior bookings. in simple words people who booked 1st got in 1rst and those who booked last, had to wait more. I got in 3-2 days before launch as did most late bookers.

 

Now, first of all due to the apparently high number of clients, they started early access 2 days earlier. And then they started opening servers according to need. What they had originally planed and what was their strategy i can only guess. However, this is what i observed and thus deduce. They seemed to be opening new servers by demand, so as they sent out invites and people logged in and chose a server, when they saw that the population on servers provided was full they would open a new one. During those days all servers had heavy populations and ques to enter were up to 20-30 minutes long. go check these same forums for proof..

So in those 7 days they just popped servers like crazy.. If they had already decided in advance that they would open X number of services or if they just followed demand i do not know.

 

REgardless, it doesnt take a master in economy nor sociology r IT to look at the servers now and see that the servers are much less crammed. supposidly there are just 1.7 subscribers left atm so Bioware can pretent not to see the king is naked But the server policy they applied turned out to be lacking at the least. and that is undebatable.

 

 

My second point. I could start by talking about how to create sense of a place in a virtual world. but this is long enough. I've read posts people seem to be adverse at the idea of a crosserver pve lfg system. I don't understand why. Moreover, i see it as the only thing that can save the game atm. it widens the comunity. besides its not as if we walk to instances. we just pass from one loading screen to another and besides, most flashpoints are on fleet so there is very little travellin implied.

now when wow introduced the crosserver lfg system the game was already 2-3 years old. players had had to travel all over to get to remote isntances, and going to RFK for an alliance player meant finding a group in Irongorge and travelling with it all the way to southbarrens, using flyers, ships and mounts. it was a 10-15 minute voyage, and diffused that sense of going somewhere to go somewhere and taking time to do so which gave u the impression of place even in a virtual place.

now as i mentioned there is no real travelling to FP's in SWTOR, frankly there is very little travelling in swtor at all, as ships take the same time to travel from fleet to crouscaunt as it does to go to tatooine or illum. No sense of distance, no sense of space nor place...

why is it we dont want a crosserver lfg system?? not sure...

 

sooo.. my point.

 

servers are getting depopulated finding groups is getting harder, the game is still young if population keeps decrising at this rate in a 364 days ull just need 2 servers...

new content, bug fixes etc. sure.

before that allow the comunity to exist, either merge some servers real fast, or introduce crosserver lfg so being on an isolated server isnt all that bad. Also allow for character migrations (paid or not even if paid wont help much), people have lvled characters on dead servers or servers that have formed foreign languages, they might not be too inclined to restart from 0 to go play with friends or simple in their own language. allow them to transfer chars before they quit the game..

 

just do something thats relates to these problems instead of working on the legacy system which is nice but frankly secondary atm

 

---------

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voidence

Truth is we dont NEED a LFG, But all you WoW babies are so used to insta everything that you WANT one. Gimme Gimme Gimme players like you are KILLING MMO's.

now, in wow youd sometimes have to travel 12-15 minutes to get to the instance once u had found a group (group of 5 not 4 btw). the number of instances (or fp) available at launch was very high, both as far as lvling instances and cap lvl instances. Heroic instances were only introduced after the 1st expansion. the looking for group system was introduced after the 2nd expanion, 4 or 5 years after release. as i had pointed out, players in wow had done a lot more walking an traveling that u'll ever do in swtor.

 

so dont really know whot your point is cos u aint got 1...

 

 

as far as crosserver lfg systems not allowing for community building or bonding i disagree.

For one the MAIN CITY (or fleet) does not foster socialiazation. it is symetrical and boring and one tends not to keep an eye out for other players etc etc...

moreover this game has proven to be a more truly RPG experience and is more adapt for a small group of friends rather than wider gaming comunities. not that im against, but it would be a change to have a game where uberguilds have it best etc etc.. to the point, random groups for instances are always at the best a random experience, where some1 is farming the fp for the 7nth time and wants to skip all dialogues and dash trough content while another is there for the first time and would like more time... U can always lfg on /gerneral and do FP with players from your server, having a lfg crosserver system can only help tbh

 

another consideration.

 

This game seems to be a bit more casual friendly than the average mmo. So to this end, lets say a casual player can dedicate 9-12 hours a week at best to the game? know, work family etc.. How do you think that player feels about having to stand in fleet 2-3 hours to MAYBE find a group to a fp?

 

scenario: he will be pissed cos he spent 2 hours infront of the pc without doing anything instead of spending the evening with the misses. the misses is pissed cos he didn't spend the evening with her, (she ofc doesn't care if he did or did not find a group to fp).

 

scenario. Hardcore player who wants a sense of comunity and whatever, can keep LFG on genreal chat. and, honestly the hardcore player (or just not casual), who plays lets say 30 hours a week, most probably is part of an active guild and spending more time playing bonds more with other members. In other words the less casual player should have plenty of chances of grouping with friends without having to use a lfg crosserver tool.

while those who want a fast run can use it without harming anyone.

 

 

Let me just say something of the so "Hated" crosserver lfg tool from WoW. I remember when it was implemented, ot exactly sure if befre or after wrath of the litch kind (2nd expansion) but it was some time after they had implented the heroic mode for instances, (which was with the 1st expansion). the lfg tool was all very nice but also rather unused as, most of the population in TBC (expansion 1) had already done normal instances and were keen on doing heroic, yet the lfg tool did not give any restrictions and they had also removed some of the pre requisites to Heroic mode instances. the consequence was that using the crosserver LFG tool for heroic instances was wild guess which often wasnt worth the gamble. yet for the above mentioned casual player, it was a handy tool which helped make mmorpgs more popular. hell the rest of us also kept using it. comunities in wow died for other reasons, mostly i think cos after 5 years it was time to move on..

 

regardless, back to the point.

There was one other factor that helped to make this tool "accepted" and after that popular. it was the amount of players wow had. with 11 million subscriptions the LFG crosserver tool transformed wow into a 7/11 and with the festivity events it was truly 24/7/365, hell if you had been dumped on xmas eve and decided to go raiding at 24:00 on the 24 of december you probably would find some1 else who wanted to too with crosserver lfgs.

 

another side note. pvp crosservers.

wow made pvp crossrealms. pvp groups were devided in groups of 4 servers almost since the very begining. eventually, they widened it to all servers at the same time they implmented the lfg system..

 

ill pass on conclusions and thaughts. just like to point out that i havn't said all the above just to rage against swtor and praise wow, but rather to point out what others have done in particular the most succesfull with the hope that it can be used or considered witha constructive approach.

Edited February 2, 2012 by SushaBrancaleone

[Cylliano]

Been thinking about this for a while...and I found, I am also in favor of a X-Server grouping tool. As it is, most if not all lvl 50 activity centers around the Fleet Stations, because thats where you see people post in general chat looking for groups to do stuff. Doesn't matter if it is for premade pvp or HM FPs, the station is basically the big game lobby where players meet.

 

Now that is where you have your community right in front of your eyes. They are all on that station, you can see them, talk to them, RP, whatever. Would a X-Server tool take away from that experience? No, not at all. In WoW I still felt that there was a server community, even though you were able to group cross server wide. You still met the same people in front of the instances and in the big social hubs. You had special chat channels solely for the server community like a dedicated PuG channel or PvP channel. You knew where to go for RP or friendly dueling. You still had your community.

 

That being said, I really don't think having the X-Server FLG option is destroying anything other than long wait times and WZ queues.

[LordValkyran]

What this game really needs at this point...is a Dungeon Finder. It was a huge success in other MMO's, no reason for it not to be in this game.

 

Pros:

 

1. Can continue questing while waiting for group to form.

2. Prevents trolls from sitting there ruining General Chat while they are bored trying to fill a group.

3. Proves that BioWare can do something like this. Buys street creds.

 

Cons:

 

1. Some people think it ruins the community...but I think they are wrong. They obviously have not sat for an hour trying to fill a Flashpoint group.

2. People who think like that are probably in a huge guild and have no trouble filling groups. We're usually filling 2-3 of 4 and just need that last role.

 

 

 

Im with you OP, DF is useful though it can be the lazy mans dungeon tool still it does save time if little else.

[Gerrard_Ennui]

Just chiming in quickly here.

 

I definitely support any type of robust, expanded LFG tool, cross-server or otherwise. The game could definitely benefit from a queue-up PvE grouping system. If its available for PvP, it should be available for PvE.

[MalignX]

Welcome to the discussion! Nice to see more and more people.

[VooDooAddict]

If its available for PvP, it should be available for PvE.

 

This.

 

Now go ahead and argue over what the level/gear filters, role settings, acceptance timers, and cross server details all you want. Currently the only option for queuing is PvP.

 

It's clear that SWTOR is meant to be convenient and appeal to the mass market player. This isn't a strict and brutal game world like EQ1 and EVE. I still have EVE for that type of ... "it's so damn hard it's rewarding" gameplay. That is not why I bought SWTOR. I bought SWTOR to play with friends that like simple and intuitive casual gaming in a setting that was recognizable and fun.

[SushaBrancaleone]

id like to add a couple..

even if i doubt some1 will read up to page 52..

 

to put in context what some have said on the first page.

1) id like to add that, the utility of a crosserver lfg (rahter than just a server lfg) is to mitigate the population distribution through servers. without having to talk about # accounts, subscriptions and so on, we can agree that the player base has stabilized. While some are unnafected (on the populated servers) many already inhabit ghost realms. Players from these servers quit everyday, if free merges between such servers are not provided swiftly, the only hope to save these servers and their population/comunities, is a crosserver lfg system.

 

2) it seems to me from bioware's answer that the only real reason by which they do not want to implement a lfg crosserver system is for badbehavious and ninja looting. (we could mention poor FP experience, but we can counterbalance that with the casual player who can play 8-10 hours a week and would rather have a bad experience than none at all). Before I even evaluate on their points, i'd like to say it just sounds fishy, and that its just an excuse to not say "crosserver for some unkown reason requires for huge technical changes and is a massive amount of work and we'd really like to avoid doing it cos we almost forgot what our children look like and would like to spend a weekend at home with em..."

but if one were to consider their points then.

 

a> the looting issue can be solved with a more intelligent loot system... 8 years after wow seems like a pretty good time to innovate the AI behind it? maybe? yes ofc more work.. whatdya say...

 

b> bad behaviour. well for 1 there is the ignore function, which should be crosservers. secondly, take what other have done. Windows provides players with "social ranking" as you can tag an account as "good to play with" or .. bad etc etc...

without having to use staff to regulate the comunity itself can help. if a player get 10 or 20 or more complains he can, for example, be penalized by losing priority in the LFG system to the first 10 (or whatever) players who join the list after him. Basically, if being an *** and bothering others is/ or can be punished by the comunity with temporary penalties, which reduce your chances of going to fp etc.. then any paying customer would adjust his behaviour. Misuse or abuse of such function is easily bipased by using a # cap of complaints which must be from different servers. so if for example. a player gets 5 complains from a minimum of 3 servers then he is punished with lets say a 1 week buff that makes him lose priority to other players in the lfg system..

 

seriously, steam and windows have used one username per client for all their products. so if lets say you've been a total pain in the neck while playing game X and all the comunity knows u and hates you and recognises you. so you drop the game and buy a new game, game Y, all the comments that players have posted on you for game X will be visible to players of game Y.

The issue of of bad behaviour encouraged by random grouping is easily solved by providing players with an identity which can be graded by other players. without having to use real names, fb accoutns and the sort, it is sufficient to provide a crosserver system with crosserver reputations.

 

This ofc requires for Bioware to develop programs that can do this. so no you guys cant go home for the weekend, infact go buy a hammok and put it in the office and buy canned food to last you for a month or 2....

[Dunklezhan]

Just chiming in quickly here.

 

I definitely support any type of robust, expanded LFG tool, cross-server or otherwise. The game could definitely benefit from a queue-up PvE grouping system. If its available for PvP, it should be available for PvE.

 

I agree to a point but also see what happened to wow once this aspect was introduced. LVL 80 players that had no idea how to get to instances via the actual game world. Players who never set foot out of a capital city until they maxed lvl. This is horrible that means they made all that content just to toss it in the trash.

 

While I think it should be there to alllow folks to participate in groups when times are slow ikt needs to have some sort of limitation to keep folks out in the real world. Though tbh most of these missions are hit via fleet so meh. Can't really hurt.

 

Should also allow free server moves like Rift. Allows servers to gain pop when things start to die off.

[MalignX]

I agree to a point but also see what happened to wow once this aspect was introduced. LVL 80 players that had no idea how to get to instances via the actual game world. Players who never set foot out of a capital city until they maxed lvl. This is horrible that means they made all that content just to toss it in the trash.

People can experience content in anyway they see fit, it is a video game.

 

While I think it should be there to alllow folks to participate in groups when times are slow ikt needs to have some sort of limitation to keep folks out in the real world. Though tbh most of these missions are hit via fleet so meh. Can't really hurt.

 

Again, how you choose to play is fine, but others would like more options. Not that I disrespect your opinion, just disagree. (I feel I have to continue making this disclaimer).

 

Should also allow free server moves like Rift. Allows servers to gain pop when things start to die off.

 

Hey, something we agree on.

 

Welcome! (Edit: The AC Respec thread is almost as entertaining as this one.)

Edited February 2, 2012 by MalignX

[Gerrard_Ennui]

I agree to a point but also see what happened to wow once this aspect was introduced. LVL 80 players that had no idea how to get to instances via the actual game world. Players who never set foot out of a capital city until they maxed lvl. This is horrible that means they made all that content just to toss it in the trash.

Those occurrences were the exception rather than the norm. In general, the LFG tool enriched more players' gaming experiences than it harmed.

 

I would also suggest that it doesnt matter if players dont know their way from stormwind to elwynn forest, or if they've never stepped outside of the capital city because those players are enjoying themselves, playing the way they want. That is the most important thing, and that's the reason why connecting players for group content - with a dungeon finder or some other tool - should be an MMOs top priority.

[Dunklezhan]

Those occurrences were the exception rather than the norm. In general, the LFG tool enriched more players' gaming experiences than it harmed.

 

I would also suggest that it doesnt matter if players dont know their way from stormwind to elwynn forest, or if they've never stepped outside of the capital city because those players are enjoying themselves, playing the way they want. That is the most important thing, and that's the reason why connecting players for group content - with a dungeon finder or some other tool - should be an MMOs top priority.

 

Top priority removed the social and pvp aspect from WoW. I have mixed emotions as I do like ezmode especially when it comes to low pop servers but then again the reward seems much less when your handed everything on a platter. There has to be risk involved to truly appreciate any reward. Yes we play games for fun but why exactly did you come to an mmo...

 

So in the spirit of compromise...ADD the LFG tool but limit XP gain via said tool so folks who actually play the game as intended have an edge. After all the reasoning behind LFG tools is to gain access to content during slow guild or server times right.... This way you get your content and some gear but you actually have to take yer lazy arse out into the game that took so much time to develop and play it like the rest of us.