Nerf Sorcs/Sages

[hilexplosiv]

Of course they are always top damage against bads who let them stand there and do their full dps unhindered and don't switch to them when they are attacking you because you are too busy tunneling someone.

[Erevan_Kindelar]

I don't believe the part about marauders/sentinels. but mercs/commandos are definitely next in line for nerf for warzones.

 

Ahh, so you ARE a Marauder/Sentinel, and if a class can beat you in 1on1, get higher on the DPS chart than you, or be on the other team and beat yours, then it must be overpowered.

 

In short, usblues will one-by-one go through each of the other classes in the game apart from his own, whining for them to be hit with the nerf bat, never actually realising that the reason they are doing better than he is, is because those players are in-game practicing their PvP tactics, working on their skills, and getting better at taking advantage of their opponents.

[Orangerascal]

Ahh, so you ARE a Marauder/Sentinel, and if a class can beat you in 1on1, get higher on the DPS chart than you, or be on the other team and beat yours, then it must be overpowered.

 

In short, usblues will one-by-one go through each of the other classes in the game apart from his own, whining for them to be hit with the nerf bat, never actually realising that the reason they are doing better than he is, is because those players are in-game practicing their PvP tactics, working on their skills, and getting better at taking advantage of their opponents.

 

I don't know if I should tell him how good sentinels are and that the sentinels in my guild: 'warchild' and 'meles' (look them up and talk to them) are afraid they will be next on the nerf cutting block.

 

Then again they've pvped in 6 other games and know what they are talking about

Edited January 26, 2012 by Orangerascal

[Vodrin]

You will hear the same thing from me too... yes I play as both Sage and Sorc. I also play as an Operative, Sniper and Merc and I am getting there with my Powertech. So far, the Sage and Sorcerer seem pretty good, but when I come across one in a Huttball match or WZ, he is dead pretty quickly.

I guess you are playing a Jugg or Sentinel, or some other class where you get your as handed to you and you look ridiculous unless you have a good idea of how to play your class and exploit the weaknesses of your opponents?

 

If you are playing a sentinel or marauder and cannot kill an equally geared sorc 1v1, you need to learn to play better. All the tools to kill them are there.

[BoDiE]

I don't know if I should tell him how good sentinals are and that the sentinels in my guild: 'warchild' and 'meles' (look them up and talk to them) are afraid they will be next on the nerf cutting block.

 

Then again they've pvped in 6 other games and know what they are talking about

 

Lol, exactly dude.

[Maskis]

you'll be crying when the much deserved nerf comes your way.

 

I'm sure you'll roll a merc within minutes.

 

I have a merc and a sorc that I pvp with and do quite well with both. I understand how both classes work and how to take advantage of their weaknesses and I have no issues going up against them. I don't always win ofc but its usually close.

 

I know it's a novel concept that you might actually take the time to learn how to exploit your enemies weaknesses for your gains and how to exploit your strengths, but that is the true path to power.

 

You won't be so full of rage and anger if you get good, it actually becomes fun. You are not doing yourself, or anyone else, favors by crying for nerfs. Take the time and learn the classes. Roll one and see what its all about then you might understand.

[Ewgal]

Of course they are always top damage against bads who let them stand there and do their full dps unhindered and don't switch to them when they are attacking you because you are too busy tunneling someone.

 

The problem is they can do high damage, CC, and heal in a lightning spec. Add into the mix that you can often have 4-6 in a war zone then it really is hard to avoid them without just afking the game.

[BlazingShadow]

Nerf either the bubble or the Force Run (make it assassin/shadow only) and then youll have balance.

[Orangerascal]

Nerf either the bubble or the Force Run (make it assassin/shadow only) and then youll have balance.

 

Sure, we'll trade it for heavy armor (30% mitigation) over our light armour (10% mitigation).

 

You can also call us merc 2.

Edited January 26, 2012 by Orangerascal

[supergarri]

It is so funny how this reminds me of about a third of wow pvp forum posts :

 

QQ frost mage is op QQ too much burst QQ spam ice lance QQ And so on...

 

I personally own a vig guardian and do not feel that i need to blow all cooldowns (bubble god mode anyone ?) to kill a sage/sorc. Granted, im a lowly lvl 39 on a french server.

 

Stop whining, think about which abilities of yours can counter. You do have a kick and a CC breaker, dont you ?

 

I apologize in advance to the grammar nazis for my poor english.

[Iridor]

I'm rank 55 sorc with 450 expertise and over 16k hp with BH buff. Operative can take me down to 20% within his initial rotation. After that there comes grenades, stun and I'm done. That's OP for you.

 

Sorcs/Sages are pretty strong yes. They have good damage mobility and CC. Sage/Sorc healers take some time to kill, but that applies to all healing class in this game. My advise L2interrupt.

 

So we have dps, mobility and CC. On the other hand we are squishy class without any meaningful burst. CC may look good on paper, but try go trigger happy with it and you have opponent with full resolve bar closing on you fast.

 

Bottom line. Play the class before ******** on it.

Bad troll is just bad.

 

This is a good, standard response from a sorc/sage to this kind of thread. Let's take a look at the details.

 

"One class can take me very low in his full cc/burst combo because he catches me off guard/without bubble/not paying attention/being bad. And that class is eating a giant nerf next patch. Oh, and when I get back up with a full resolve bar, I can run away and heal myself." Uh... huh.

 

"Yeah, we're pretty good because we have good... everything. And we're hard to kill, but all healers are like that. Just interrupt... it will work against bad players who only have one heal on their bar. Ignore the fact that we have more insta/short-cast heals than any other class." Uh... huh.

 

"So we have everything that anyone could want in PvP except a oneshot button. But we don't have "meaningful" burst, where meaningful means equivalent to the class that has to have huge burst because that's all it can do. And oh, by the way, all that amazing PvP goodness we have doesn't mean anything, because if you play like a baddie it's worthless." Uh... huh.

 

"Bottom line: because I struggle to abuse an OP class due to the fact that I am bad, everyone who claims that it is OP is clearly bad and should be ignored." Yep. Uh huh. Right.

 

Seriously though? I love how when these types of threads come up, the assumption is that the people complaining are bad, not that the people defending it are bad.

 

Also I love that people are arguing that sorc/sage isn't OP. Every single sorc/sage in my guild, currently several hundred members strong, agrees that they're amazingly good in PvP - even the people who are actually bad at PvP can see this. Yes, the class being good doesn't make it autowin... it's still all about the player at the keyboard. But they're definitely the top of the power scale. And there has been much vocalized rubbing of hands and evil chuckling in Vent in anticipation of the patch when the only class that could decently counter them will be eating the giant nerfbat.

[Cynan_Ski]

I don't know how you guys are angry other than a merc or commando fighting a sage/sorc how can you fail? 1:1 which btw rarely happens unless iam heavily out classed ya in levels in the 1-49 bracket with talent point over ya or my gear is alot better not seeing how your having so much trouble. I hate the L2Play idea but sometimes really maybe you need to dust off some of those lesser used skills instead of mashing 4 of the same ones

 

 

as in getting gang banged by a ******** of lightning like the sky is falling on ya well everyone would feel that way. If the whole WZ was mercs / commando / ops / people would be calling for nerfs on that too

Edited January 26, 2012 by Cynan_Ski

[Excedrin]

Sorcs/Sages are fine, you're not doing it right if you can't kill them.

[ArchAUstin]

Sorcs/Sages are fine, you're not doing it right if you can't kill them.

 

I play a sage and i can say we are absolutely overpowered to the tenth degree.

 

Not only do I have every Utility tool in the game, ON TOP OF THAT i also have absurd damage and survivability.

 

Knockback+root?, 2 stuns 30m ranged? instant cast polymorph 30m range? Sprint? Interupt that locks out for 6 seconds at 30m range? you cant even BEGIN to compare the utility of this class to other classes.

 

EDIT: they need to place the utility talents higher up in the balance and Telekinetics trees so that you cant get BOTH the utility from Telekinetics and from balance....

Edited January 26, 2012 by ArchAUstin

[Cynan_Ski]

I play a Vanguard and Powetech and i say nerf them iam too awesome at it.....

 

 

See i can make up **** too

[Excedrin]

I play a sage and i can say we are absolutely overpowered to the tenth degree.

 

Not only do I have every Utility tool in the game, ON TOP OF THAT i also have absurd damage and survivability.

 

Knockback+root?, 2 stuns 30m ranged? instant cast polymorph 30m range? Sprint? Interupt that locks out for 6 seconds at 30m range? you cant even BEGIN to compare the utility of this class to other classes.

 

EDIT: they need to place the utility talents higher up in the balance and Telekinetics trees so that you cant get BOTH the utility from Telekinetics and from balance....

 

I will repeat my statement, and offer the suggestion that you take a look at other classes. You'll find that everyone is afforded PLENTY of utility and control, you just have a large majority of players that don't use it and then wonder why they're failing when they sit and spam their DPS abilities rather than cleverly interrupting/blinding/stunning/what have you.

 

As a healer sorc I have neither more nor less utility than a merc or op. If you think sorcs have anything that even TOUCHES stealth utility-wise then you're just absolutely delusional or not very creative when it comes to the use of stealth.

[Remulan]

Yea, I have a battlemaster of every class but sorc and every time I go up against one they kill me in 5 seconds no matter which of my 9 other battlemaster toons I am playing. I am obviously good because I have so many battlemasters and everything I say is true because you are reading it.

[ArchAUstin]

I will repeat my statement, and offer the suggestion that you take a look at other classes. You'll find that everyone is afforded PLENTY of utility and control, you just have a large majority of players that don't use it and then wonder why they're failing when they sit and spam their DPS abilities rather than cleverly interrupting/blinding/stunning/what have you.

 

As a healer sorc I have neither more nor less utility than a merc or op. If you think sorcs have anything that even TOUCHES stealth utility-wise then you're just absolutely delusional or not very creative when it comes to the use of stealth.

 

I have a 50 scoundrel, 44, sage, 40, sentinel, and i have read through all the troopers skills because i have thought about rolling one.

 

Every class has utility, but no class has as much utility or even close to as much as a sage.

 

Reason being you can get ALL the utility from both damage trees because they are too early in the trees.

[gryhmr]

Sorc/Sage are absolutely the best class in the game because they have absolutely no weaknesses and have all the capability in the world. They need to make bubble have a longer cooldown and make it so sorc/sage do not have force speed.

[Iamurfriend]

L2p bad kids!!

[Orangerascal]

I play a sage and i can say we are absolutely overpowered to the tenth degree.

 

Not only do I have every Utility tool in the game, ON TOP OF THAT i also have absurd damage and survivability.

 

Knockback+root?, 2 stuns 30m ranged? instant cast polymorph 30m range? Sprint? Interupt that locks out for 6 seconds at 30m range? you cant even BEGIN to compare the utility of this class to other classes.

 

EDIT: they need to place the utility talents higher up in the balance and Telekinetics trees so that you cant get BOTH the utility from Telekinetics and from balance....

 

I play a merc and I do 5m damage with nerf missile ....

 

Am I doing this right?

[OsirisZoran]

they don't need to listen to posts.

 

if they would actually watch the results of warzones they could tabulate that the sages and sorcs always are the top 5. followed by the mercs/commandos.

 

so you're mad that you don't know how to play your class to its full potential?

 

ive seen pvpers who know how to play sentinels/guardians/shadows and sith counterparts easily be in top 5 dmg.

[kaya]

My thoughts on sorc / sages,

1 v 1 they're pretty mediocre. They win some lose some, they're fine really. I dont think any range class does particularly well in a 1 v 1 situation (they actually do better than commando / mercenary and gunslinger / sniper which are rubbish 1 v 1).

A lot of their abilities become too good when put in a group situation though.

 

They need bubble for themselves. They do die extremely fast once its down. But being able to throw it up on their 7 teammates for no real cost is silly. They should put a max number of targets on it thats only removed by a high level talent in the healing tree. Say 3 or 2 even. Being able to bubble others is a good mechanic that raises the skill cap of the class and utility is never a bad thing in pvp - it seperates good players from mediocre ones. Any other bubble nerfs are unwarranted and would destroy the class.

 

The aoe knockback. This isn't really a problem with sorc / sages specifically as opposed to ranged in general. Theres too many aoe knockbacks, you get 3 ranged specs sat close together cycling their aoe knockbacks and they become effectively immune to melee. Personally I think this is the main reason ranged are so superior to melee in pvp currently.

They should change one of these moves to be single target and the sorc makes the most sense of the 3 ac's that have it. Its commando's only gap opener, they have less snares, roots and stuns and no sprint and are frankly rubbish against melee - they aren't the problem with range's dominance over melee.

Theres an argument for making gunslinger's single target but knights and warriors being able to charge to the commando or sage next to them then switch to the gunslinger is enough of a detterent for them to benefit a great deal from stacking like this.

 

Their resource is also far more suited to warzones than every other spec. It doesn't have the wind up of focus or the maintenance of ammo / energy. This ties into the bubble 'problem' and them being able to spam it on allies pretty much indefinitely. Sorc / Sages only resource currently is the GCD. Changes to this would require too much reworking of talents, skills and other things and im not sure its necessary. Its just worth noting its an extremely strong aspect of the class.

 

Sorc / Sages aren't massively overpowered but they are marginally stronger than most ac's in the game. Their skills just scale too well with groups.

I find it kind of absurd that when people complain about their utility no one ever lists their dispel and i've seen about 2 sorcerers actually use it (they were disgustingly difficult to kill and i hope people continue to be ignorant of this utility).

The simple fact is very few sorcerers are using all of the utility available to them and are still doing particularly well despite this.

Edited January 26, 2012 by kaya

[Noxulifer]

Are you kidding me...? I actually went to the forums right now to make a post about jedi consular. They ARE impossible to kill almost. I am a sorc, and I have never managed to kill a jedi consular. Yes I know, I suck and all that... But I am not alone thinking this as everyone I have talked to hate these jedi's, they are the most powerful class in my view.

[OsirisZoran]

I play a sage and i can say we are absolutely overpowered to the tenth degree.

 

Not only do I have every Utility tool in the game, ON TOP OF THAT i also have absurd damage and survivability.

 

Knockback+root?, 2 stuns 30m ranged? instant cast polymorph 30m range? Sprint? Interupt that locks out for 6 seconds at 30m range? you cant even BEGIN to compare the utility of this class to other classes.

 

EDIT: they need to place the utility talents higher up in the balance and Telekinetics trees so that you cant get BOTH the utility from Telekinetics and from balance....

 

You dont play a sorc/sage.

 

what 2 stuns are 30m and ranged???? electrocute is the only stun we have.

 

Instant cast whirlwind has to be SPECCED into. Interupt is FOUR second lockout. Knockback + root has to be SPECCED into. You cant have all this and be a GREAT HEALER.

 

Stop exagerating its sickening.