ergonomic Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I'm abit amazed that I haven't seen that much whine about this issue in the forums, maybe because not that many play as Darkness Assassins/Kinetic Combat Shadows in PvP, but here I go. I am a Sith Assassin on the European Server Niman. My name is Thergon'omic. I hadn't noticed what they had done to my Wither until two days ago and I concluded right away that they had buffed it abit too much. Guess what it now does? To 5 enemies it deals ~1000 Kinetic Damage, it reduces all damage done by them by 5% and now it also slows them by 30%. Guess for how long does this slow and damage reduction last, for 15 seconds. Guess how long is Wither/Slow Time's cooldown, it's 8 seconds. I'm the guy here who plays the class and I'm the one complaining. It is true Wither was almost useless in PvP before, but now it's just plain OP. Am I the only one who thinks this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haree Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I've tried it, with full damage PvP gear and the damage didn't even slightly compare to Clairvoyant Strike spec. If you have others around you doing all the damage then great, it's definitely really nice for PvP. Perhaps when they fix the Particle Acceleration bug it will be even more worth considering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ergonomic Posted January 22, 2012 Author Share Posted January 22, 2012 I'm sorry if I didn't make myself clear. I meant that the 30% Slow to 5 targets for 15 seconds (with an ability that has an 8 second cooldown) that's the part that I have beef with, not the damage part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitru Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I'm sorry if I didn't make myself clear. I meant that the 30% Slow to 5 targets for 15 seconds (with an ability that has an 8 second cooldown) that's the part that I have beef with, not the damage part. The only problem that I can see is that it applies the debuff to all targets, which can be problematic (re: overpowered) in WZs where multiple targets stand to be tightly clustered. Other than that, the slow effect is honestly pretty much required to be an effective deep KC Shadow in PvP since, without it, we have no appreciable ability to engage: Force Speed only gives 2 seconds of quick movement and is easily countered by knockbacks, stuns, and a massive number of other control effects and we only have a 10m range with our ranged attacks (which isn't appreciably more than outright "melee" range). The slowing effect gives us some ability to force combat; the fact that it has a greater than 100% uptime is simply there to make it very difficult to counteract. While I don't really care for PvP, it's pretty obvious that the only problem that could possibly exist is in the multi-target debuff aspect of it, rather than the debuff itself or the duration, and the multi-target aspect of it isn't really an appreciable concern in PvP since player tactics are fully capable of assuaging cluster situations that would allow you to take advantage of it. In essence, if you don't want to be slowed and there is a Darkness/Kinetic on the other side, don't group up tightly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrandaa Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 In essence, if you don't want to be slowed and there is a Darkness/Kinetic on the other side, don't group up tightly. This is why I don't see the AoE on Slow Time as that big of a deal in PvP. You should never clump up. If you clump up, you'll get destroyed by Sages/Sorc's or Commandos/Mercenaries. The AoE slow by Slow Time even makes it more important to not clump up. Snare + massive AoE = a lot of dead fools who clumped up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desecratr Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I'm sorry if I didn't make myself clear. I meant that the 30% Slow to 5 targets for 15 seconds (with an ability that has an 8 second cooldown) that's the part that I have beef with, not the damage part. Jedi guardians have 2-point talent in the 2nd tier of their tank tree that reduces the cost of their no cooldown aoe ALL 50% slow. It reduces the cost 100%. What is the problem with a 31 point talent giving a up to 5 targets 30% slow on a 8 sec cooldown that cost 1/3 of our force? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kylegore Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 i think the new force slow is really good idk why u dont like it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redderic Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 i think the new force slow is really good idk why u dont like it hes not saying he doesnt like it simply that he feels op with it. while i do believe it would be TREMENDOUSLY helpful, i still cant bring myself to use it on my pvp spec. FiB is essentially far too valuable imo to tradeoff for it. the ability to pick off runners at a distance and stop bomb planters/people capping the nodes in alderaan is fantastic for a class that generally cant do much outside of 10m. not to mention it is fantastic in Ilum for knocking a group off of their mounts destroying their chances of excape and earning your group easy kills. the area slow would be fantastic for increasing survivability imo slowing a group and bursting away with force cloak. makes for a lot of distance between them and you. not to mention with the upward damage scale its not quite as useless as it was before but still wont fit in my playstyle. having a 15 sec cd slow for 6 seconds seems to work fine for me for forcing fights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kckkryptonite Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I don't think it's that great. Most people will sport at least 40% reduction. And the slow is useful, but it's nowhere near OP since most times when 5 people cluster together they're usually fighting, not running somewhere. Maybe in hutball, but a lot of things are OP in hutball. You really have to give it more time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powerr Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 no because they countered the spell for guardians/juggs... force push resets the cd on leap.. so dirty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GFWarper Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I have Slow Time in my talents and using it I don't feel like change is barely noticable. It does pretty decent damage, has 10 foot range and affordable cost, but it only hits for 750-1000 per target and if you manage to hit 3 at once you should know your team is not going to disengage from this mess anyway, so not use for slow. Most of the time clusters of enemies consist of sorcerers and other shooter classes. They don't give a heck about slow, they simply shoot everything in their range. Anything less than hard freeze is nearly useless against experienced foes as they all have "remove slow effects" and every speed-up effect is not affected by your slow. As shadow tank I don't have problems with any slow even on Huttball. Repeated roots are a pain though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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