nevetss Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 An MMO without bugs is like a government without corruption. It's a fool's dream. That being said, Rift was probably the best example of a clean launch that I've seen. This game, coming right out of the box, had green laser shows that kill immersion (I was talking to an alien and VOOSH there's a green wall in front of him). They finally got rid of this, but now my screen is flickering in those spots the green laser show was... hmm.. Ability delay, which is STILL driving me batty, that update will probably come next month, but good grief it's annoying me. Character's mouths not moving: Ok, slightly minor, but it's an immersion breaker, which in a story setting immersion is needed. But these things are not game breaking I can see the ability delay as a problem but I havent had very many problems with it as many other people are making this huge deal about it first it was no UI customization then they tell everyone they are going to allow it they say its a "pathetic bribe" thats what I see as problem with this nonconstructive community (not saying you arent) they complain and just say they quit the game because of one bug... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamuraBob_Fl Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 No, crafting wasn't useless, but it required raiding to get the latest greatest recipes to keep the gear you made on par with the progression of the game. As a casual who didn't raid much, it was just pointless for me. Dual gathering just meant I could have the gold to buy the latest and be viable for raiding after the recipes were farmed up by someone else. Zero variation in leveling? Now I know you are making stuff up. TOR= Kill variations of droids and humans in packs of three with different human to droid ratios of human to droid. Then go kill this larger droid or human with a bigger health pool. For real excitement you get to click on light blue panel for effect. That's it, that's all there is 1-50 unless you really stretch it and call killing bugs in groups of three variation. TOR actually has less questing variation than Rift and that's saying something. WoW actually has several quests that are carrots on a stick. The ones you do that are different and innovative and keep people chugging along in the leveling process. Throwing bears out of tree, pogo-sticking around knocking people off birds, vehicle based quests...there's a lot more but that is what popped into my head. They are silly and stupid quests, but they are different. I really think you are trying to compare TOR of today with WOW of four years ago and that simply doesn't work. No one is playing WOW of four years ago right now. You might be right about BC...I haven't played that game in a long time. Also, last time I played BC content I could get through it in a single sitting. They didn't add in raid drop crafting recipes until Wrath, and those recipes were still raid drops, and they weren't any better than raid drop gear. I never said TOR had variation in terms of leveling, but it's also silly to claim that WoW does. Where TOR is clearly superior, though, is that it actually adds risk of dying to leveling, which makes the fights more engaging. In WoW you couldn't die to normal quest mobs if you were awake and had more than 3 brain cells and a functioning keyboard. Your auto-attack was enough to kill normal mobs. In TOR packs with silvers or golds actually require you to think and use your abilities intelligently (well, maybe unless you're a Bounty Hunter ). It makes the questing game much more interesting. I can't speak to Rift. I never played it. And no, I'm comparing TOR to WoW from WOTLK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamuraBob_Fl Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 You're using that reasoning that this game has to compete with 2004 WoW, please explain why you're doing this. I have yet to figure out the point in it. And skipping points in a line in a linear questing game is still choice. Still have to do Correlia at the end of the day. (Which I do like, Correlia is a really awesome planet, very well designed and good story. ) Umm... I don't want to say lol wut again, but... seriously? Even today, you don't start WoW at max level. You're still going to be leveling through the same limited number of zones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batuhann Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 i think senatarian is getting paid for defending wow.if not, then its just. just . just sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barathos Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 But these things are not game breaking I can see the ability delay as a problem but I havent had very many problems with it as many other people are making this huge deal about it first it was no UI customization then they tell everyone they are going to allow it they say its a "pathetic bribe" thats what I see as problem with this nonconstructive community (not saying you arent) they complain and just say they quit the game because of one bug... I'd rather take the servers coming down for a couple days over this ability delay. So, to me, it's game breaking. And what are the qualifacations for game breaking? Just curious... The lack of hot bars and their weird positions (hot bars on the FAR sides of your screen, that's a good idea. >_>) is annoying, but nothing that makes me go "OMG FIX NOW!" moving the stuff around would be a +. And agreed, some of the reasons people are quitting are outlandish, some are validated, but others... yeesh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barathos Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Umm... I don't want to say lol wut again, but... seriously? Even today, you don't start WoW at max level. You're still going to be leveling through the same limited number of zones. I think I understand what you're saying... Lemme get my english translator... Ok yes, the square root of 4 is, indeed, 2. Anyways... You're saying it like this game doesn't have a limited number of zones. In fact, EVERY MMO has a limited number of zones. Which MMO doesn't have a limited number of zones? What does that even mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamuraBob_Fl Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I think I understand what you're saying... Lemme get my english translator... Ok yes, the square root of 4 is, indeed, 2. Anyways... You're saying it like this game doesn't have a limited number of zones. In fact, EVERY MMO has a limited number of zones. Which MMO doesn't have a limited number of zones? What does that even mean? I'm saying that in terms of how linear leveling is, there's very little difference, if any, between TOR and WoW. The best you can say about WoW is that you can skip some zones, and it's probably easier because their leveling game didn't matter, but then again you could do the same thing in TOR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nevetss Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) I'd rather take the servers coming down for a couple days over this ability delay. So, to me, it's game breaking. And what are the qualifacations for game breaking? Just curious... The lack of hot bars and their weird positions (hot bars on the FAR sides of your screen, that's a good idea. >_>) is annoying, but nothing that makes me go "OMG FIX NOW!" moving the stuff around would be a +. And agreed, some of the reasons people are quitting are outlandish, some are validated, but others... yeesh... I consider game breaking as something makes certain class's completely unplayable and from reading the forums and not playing the game you would think that is the case where it is not. Some people will bash the game for bugs then bash it more for having server maintenance to fix these bugs..just saying some people really are ignorant. Reporting a bug and discussing way it effects the game and what would be a good change to it is how I would view a good constructive community on a forum but it is mostly people just straight out " I found a bug this game is trash what?!? they brought the servers down for maintenance how dare they?!? They don't listen to their community!" I could be a bio ware fanboy but constructiveness is all I want out of these people instead of comparing it to Wow, this game has a pretty good chance at becoming more successful but not with this community not helping it. Edited January 22, 2012 by nevetss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scopian Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) They didn't add in raid drop crafting recipes until Wrath, and those recipes were still raid drops, and they weren't any better than raid drop gear. I never said TOR had variation in terms of leveling, but it's also silly to claim that WoW does. Where TOR is clearly superior, though, is that it actually adds risk of dying to leveling, which makes the fights more engaging. In WoW you couldn't die to normal quest mobs if you were awake and had more than 3 brain cells and a functioning keyboard. Your auto-attack was enough to kill normal mobs. In TOR packs with silvers or golds actually require you to think and use your abilities intelligently (well, maybe unless you're a Bounty Hunter ). It makes the questing game much more interesting. I can't speak to Rift. I never played it. And no, I'm comparing TOR to WoW from WOTLK. Right, they didn't add raid level crafting drops till Wrath, now the game is an entire expansion past that. TOR competes with Cata WoW...not Wrath, BC, or Vanilla WOW. They will soon be competing with MoP WOW (which has pokeman and lolpandas but also has a lot of draw for people who played the game to this point so far), and soon it will compete with TERA (no idea about the game) and GW2. Saying TOR is better than GW1 isn't a good reason for anyone to be complacent with the game. TOR has two starting zones and one path per faction. WoW has multiple starting zones (6 or 8 now total, I don't know for sure), and has multiple zones for each level for most of the leveling process. I don't think there is a way to argue WOW has less variation in the leveling process as the two games stand now. I do agree with you on them making it nearly impossible to die in WoW. It sucks and its stupid. But their reasoning for doing this is because many, many people who tried the game and left/quit before reaching level cap sited their number one reason was dying easy. This is when WoW was really trying to push their product to the masses. Edited January 22, 2012 by Scopian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Path-x Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I am completely satisfied with the game. Personally I hate MMOs (WoW in particular) but SWTOR really positively surprised me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taurusaud Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) They are getting what they deserve, but it certainly isn't praise. However, if you look at Bioware's website it's filled with self-praise so it all balances out! Edited January 22, 2012 by Taurusaud Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poogination Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 You mean it's not perfect? No surprise there. At least it shouldn't be a surprise for anyone who can figure out how to think. You do realize the game is less than 2 months old right? Other mmorpgs stayed in development longer and were terrible during launch. You realize this budget was 200 million dollars... right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamuraBob_Fl Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Right, they didn't add raid level crafting drops till Wrath, now the game is an entire expansion past that. TOR competes with Cata WoW...not Wrath, BC, or Vanilla WOW. TOR has two starting zones and one path per faction. WoW has multiple starting zones (6 or 8 now total, I don't know for sure), and has multiple zones for each level for most of the leveling process. I do agree with you on them making it nearly impossible to die in WoW. It sucks and its stupid. But their reasoning for doing this is because many, many people who tried the game and left/quit before reaching level cap sited their number one reason was dying easy. This is when WoW was really trying to push their product to the masses. WoW does have multiple starting zones, sure. The thing to me is that I leveled 3 80's, and the way the game ends up playing I never really felt like I had any decision to make about where I leveled. At most I could stick around one zone until I outleveled another. Of course, you can do the same thing in TOR. There's nothing that really forces you to do any particular zone once you get your advanced class. You could level from 10 to 50 just doing FP's and WZ's if you wanted to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariacan Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I like this game, but all in all it's a sub-par wow with story elements slapped on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setanian Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 WoW does have multiple starting zones, sure. The thing to me is that I leveled 3 80's, and the way the game ends up playing I never really felt like I had any decision to make about where I leveled. At most I could stick around one zone until I outleveled another. Of course, you can do the same thing in TOR. There's nothing that really forces you to do any particular zone once you get your advanced class. You could level from 10 to 50 just doing FP's and WZ's if you wanted to. The different is; If you are to follow your class quest, you have to go from zone to zone in the order you are told. Additionally, on ToR, it's the exact same thing, zone after zone. The same 2/3/4 gang mobs just standing there waiting to be killed. As opposed tro WoW or a lot of other like games, there are wanderers and multiple zones to cater for your level. I don't want ToR to be another WoW by any means, but I would like to think they could have come up with something a lot less linear and boring. I have boxed multiple characters on many games. In ToR I cannot see me even wanting to level a 2nd toon. But like I said earlier, different strokes, different folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sevalaricgirl Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Hmm, I just started playing and I love the game. I think Bioware did a great job and the breaks will be fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feelinestars Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I don't really see how eliminating features is "innovation," but ok. A few years back Blizzard did what was best for their MMO, but at this point it's not really believable when people defend WoW as somehow being something that's really shining and polished. I understand people want to defend the game they invested years in, I played it for 5 years, but it's clearly not nearly as good as TOR at this point. You're going to say with a straight face that TOR is better than WoW right now? Both games in 2012? Even if you type it, I know you don't even believe it yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamuraBob_Fl Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 You're going to say with a straight face that TOR is better than WoW right now? Both games in 2012? Even if you type it, I know you don't even believe it yourself. Yes I am. Leveling isn't a grind, and I've never seen "additional instances cannot be launched at this time" in TOR. Also, I kind of like talent trees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nevetss Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Hmm, I just started playing and I love the game. I think Bioware did a great job and the breaks will be fixed. This, cept I have been playing the game. Give some more time seriously if you stop bombarding them with hate and more constructive post the game will go a lot farther. They will fix all the small and major things, but if all you do is "the game has a bug and I don't like it!" what do they get off of that to make it better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulvan Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 BW isn't getting the praise they deserve because they don't deserve it. This game was hyped up to be the next big mmo , and it fell short imo. There are certain expectations that gamers look for in a new product , especially from a well known company. Lol lol lol fell short it was expected by most people to be the wow killer i even thought it had a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink_Saber Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 You're going to say with a straight face that TOR is better than WoW right now? Both games in 2012? Even if you type it, I know you don't even believe it yourself. I'd say that with a straight face, too. If I didn't think it was, I'd be there instead of here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nevetss Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I'd say that with a straight face, too. If I didn't think it was, I'd be there instead of here. I would be another one to tell you that with a straight face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barathos Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I'd say that with a straight face, too. If I didn't think it was, I'd be there instead of here. This guy speaks sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feelinestars Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 It is competitive it had over 2 mil subs but the constant wow players bashing the game and people getting their opinion on buying the game from a forum is causing a problem no matter what game it is that comes out it will have bugs NO matter what game it is and just by reading forums you would thing you character was completely unplayable and cannot move and everywhere you did walk you fell through the map or something. The game is great and you seriously need to actually go look up what it takes to make a game and repair whats wrong with it, specifically when a game is as big as SWTOR if you don't think this game is competitive your wrong it has had the biggest subs ever on release and bioware is working hard on fixing and keeping people happy in the game it is the people who believe they are entitled to more than they really are reporting bugs on a forum and trying to have them noticed by the devs is good but bashing the game for a bug is another. Btw, want to keep comparing to wow? Here you go what was their subs 2 years ago? I believe somewhere around 15mil or so bragging on their box now they have dropped to somewhere in the low 9 millions...a game drops and once everything is fixed I will be proud to sit here and watch this game prosper and be part of it. SW:TOR sucks, dude. Get over it. WoW doesn't even acknowledge this AA MMO, because it's not even in the same league. TOR will have a very, very small niche in the MMO community, EA won't get a return on it's investment, and this game will be F2P within 6 months. Period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feelinestars Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 you're not very bright.. He's incredibly bright and dead-on the money. You cannot put out a 2012 MMO to compete with WoW in 2012 and have it lack in every single possible way, excluding (get this! lol) storytelling time. I mean, really guys. Quit being in denial. This is 2012. We expect certain features in an MMO. Certain features in an online game, forget MMO! Just ridiculous.. absolutely ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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