Chessrook Posted January 21, 2012 Author Share Posted January 21, 2012 (edited) I'll bite: * Give XP boost option to less numerous faction. i.e. 5-10% boost * Add new race to less numerous faction * Increased valor gain for less numerous faction * Stat boost in warzones/pvp areas for less numerous faction. i.e. +x% HP There's four things right there. The first idea, well, I don't like it. Then again this is me, and the way I play I don't like XP boosts in general. The second COULD work, but that'll likely not happen until the first expansion or SUPERMAJOR patch, so as an instinctual response to the complainers, it doesn't fit. The third and fourth, however, while I wouldn't put them in Warzones, I WOULD put into Ilum and similar world-PVP areas, the stat boost before the valor gain. That I admit, good idea. Edited January 21, 2012 by Chessrook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDozen Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 What? I'm not sure that word is the right word. On phone, spell checker. I tried. Do you not know it was supposed to be aesthetics? Guess not, I'll edit my post then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandmthethird Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 i believe in time most will have alts from both faction. coz they will play the storys. leveling is so quick in this game that, it is really not that much hassle to play a new character. so in time ppl will have options to play either empire or republic. so taking a suggestion some1 else already said, with the release of new warzones make them only open to a balanced amount of players. i.e. you try to queue for empire and you get a message saying "150 empire to 140 republic. please choose a republic character or try back later" at this point your get the option to go straight to your character select screen (with not server queue if here is any) or you can wait for an empire spot to become free. i don't know if this would work, if its a really bad idea dismiss it , but i do know for it to work it would take time for ppl to get alts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FaToxic Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 IMO, faction imbalance ist most crucial on pvp servers. It's a no go to prevent people to play the fraction they want, but maybe BW could implement something that would make rerolling more attractive: 1. Same fraction pvp only in full groups. Doesn't prevent people of the same fraction playing against each other, but you'll have longer waiting times on random matches. 2. Strenghten the weaker side in world pvp. Let's say you'll have a ration over 3:1 in a world, a player from the weaker fraction can turn pvp off for 30min after dying a bunch of times. 3. Reward player that want to reroll. Changing the fraction of their already 50 is a bad thing, since TOR is a story driven MMO. But allow them to transfer their valour and equip to a newly created republic char, that would be a big motivation, especially since levelling doens't take that long. 4. Titles. Give player who used the offer above a special titel. 'Traitor' or such would be a cool thing, only avaliable to these who rerolled. My 5ct to this issue. If it finds consens, I might post it in the suggestion box. P.S.: Please excuse my bad english Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chessrook Posted January 21, 2012 Author Share Posted January 21, 2012 Yanno thinking about it, I imagine there might be a way to connect the Legacy system to this. Somehow. I can't think of the exact ways, but I'm sure there's something that, by using the legacy system, would make rerolling Republic more attractive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnoggyMack Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 In a PvE game, this developed and this focused on story arc progression, making "forced" decisions for a PvP community isn't a very viable option. That's what PvP players have yet to concede. Which is odd since so many of them are quick to point out 200 million dollars were spent on voice acting. Taking that into account, and understanding the impact of that, those same posters have to realize that this game is not going to suddenly place PvP priorities above PvE gameplay functionality. So population imbalance is not going to trump PvE accessibility and playability. In short, they're not going to prevent players from being able to make characters on either side. To play on servers with their friends. They're also not really keen on artificially tinkering with balance based on incentives that amount to simple bribery. None of the solutions offered take the reality of the game's development priorities into account. And why do I not offer a solution? Because I don't think one is needed. PvP is an ancillary aspect of the game. That the development team even has it on the list anywhere is good enough for me. But I just don't see the population imbalance as significant. Or a problem for the game. What most PvPers don't take into account is this ... the populations are really close enough in terms of raw data. So Bioware isn't going to see it as much of a problem. The reason this doesn't hold up to the anecdotal evidence PvPers experience is ... the PvP population isn't the same as the overall population. PvP population is most likely very much imbalanced. But it's still a minority demographic in the overall population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gannonmoss Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Unfortunately, most people will take the "Evil" side because it's "Dark" and "Cool" and all that stuff. It's hard to counter back against that, considering how Star Wars has very clear-cut definitions on what is Good and Evil. I'm not so sure that is always the reason. I rolled Sith because I assumed (and after playing a Republic char up to 11, confirmed) the Jedi/Republic story would be very 'vanilla'. There is no real controversy, things seem very cut and dry and it follows typical Jedi storyline: pay your dues, be tempted, overcome temptation blah blah blah. Star Wars fans have seen this story time and again; it feels old and overused. The Sith however are a somewhat enigmatic entity, in that we rarely see stories follow Darths and Sith Lords from the ground up. Not Anakin, who was a Jedi and turned (again way overdone) no these are people who were born into this or forced into this and it is all they know. My character never feels conflicted. He feels resolute and strong. Jedi often come off as indecisive, whiny and restricted by their moral code. Sith have the luxury of doing whatever they want, when they want and have no problem taking out everything in their way. Not only that, but if I decide to be good, I seem like a hero, not an automated force bot who does the right thing only if it means that he doesn't get emotional. I am not restricted by emotional constraints, my character has full reign to get upset at someone who is trying to murder another without fear that the emotions will endanger his precious Jedi Code. The Sith Rule of Two adds a whole new dimension to things for the sith players and the Imperial Agent storyline is nothing short of epic. The Bounty Hunter story feels rehashed, but isn't all that bad. With the Sith storylines, your character is always on his guard, everyone seems ready to stab you in the back (including some of your companions) and often times stress inducing betrayals add a great sense of catharsis after large story blocks. The final point of this is the new dimension it adds for Star Wars fans in general. When I played Horde in WoW, even though I had long favored the Alliance in Warcraft, I found after playing Horde... I began to loathe them. I began to stereotype, target and grief Alliance and see them as the enemy. Following that formula, I am beginning to hate Jedi. (Story wise) They get in the way, mouth off like condescending jerks and hide behind the Republic Fleet, with full knowledge they are too weak to stand against the Sith. They have turned the (jedi) knight in shining armor into an annoying weakling who I loathe and detest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyrmius Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Faction Imbalance... if you are on a PvP or RP-PvP server I can see where this would be a huge problem. It's no fun for the underdog and eventually no fun for the big kid on the block. However, any change to this *hopefully* will not effect the PvE servers and maybe not the RP (unsure on whether good or bad for RP). First time I log into a PvE server and the game tells me "You MUST create an Empire character due to population imbalances" I will seriously consider unsubscribing. If SWTOR PvP is going to effect all Players and all Servers that much then I have no choice but to quit. Preferably BioWare *could" effect a change only for the PvP and RP-PvP servers and that would make good sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDozen Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 87 of the 215 severs are PVP severs. That's roughly 40%. Without even including those players on PVE servers that like to PVP that's very significant. To dismiss an issue because you think the PVP base is smaller and insignificant isn't too bright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnoggyMack Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 87 of the 215 severs are PVP severs. That's roughly 40%. Without even including those players on PVE servers that like to PVP that's very significant. To dismiss an issue because you think the PVP base is smaller and insignificant isn't too bright. Due to the way things were during EGA, a lot of PvE players ended up on PvP servers. PvP is not the big thing you think it is. And never has been in games like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDozen Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Due to the way things were during EGA, a lot of PvE players ended up on PvP servers. PvP is not the big thing you think it is. And never has been in games like this. So you're saying the majority of players on PVP servers are PVE players? Or even a large enough amount to to make my numbers invalid? You lost me right there. The PVP base is significant enough to warrant attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PjPablo Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Due to the way things were during EGA, a lot of PvE players ended up on PvP servers. PvP is not the big thing you think it is. And never has been in games like this. So you are saying people rolled and stayed on a pvp server with no intention of pvp'ing? I don't buy that. To the poster who used the 40% number, that seems pretty accurate as far as player base ratio. swtorprogress has some rough census numbers and they show 43% of players on pvp servers worldwide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnoggyMack Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 (edited) So you are saying people rolled and stayed on a pvp server with no intention of pvp'ing? I don't buy that. The amount of posts I've read from hardcore PvPers upset that they can go from planet to planet, zone to zone, with ZERO open world PvP opportunities, kind of assures us of the fact that even PvP servers are realatively grief free. Which means people who are wrapped up in levelling simply don't care about PvP. Levelling. PvE. You remember PvE? 200 million dollars worth of this game's investment? Hardcore PvP issues simply don't top their list of priorities. Never have. They're not going to FORCE players to one faction or the other. No matter how many times it is suggested. Because they have too much of this game's development invested in PvE. Edited January 21, 2012 by SnoggyMack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IasonEvan Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Make the PvP NOT involve what faction you are from. Let the game randomize teams. I just want to PvP. I don't care what faction I fight for. I just want to PvP. If we all want to PvP, but the system in the game doesn't work properly, change the system. Faction based PvP in MMO's always seems to end up like this with a few exceptions. Another thing that would fix it would be to have the PvP pool include all servers. That way you could ensure there were enough players on both sides. Ultimately, the best fix is to get rid of faction based PvP. If you can accept a Jedi or a Sith hitting you several times with a lightsaber and you don't die, you can accept a factionless PvP match. It's pretty simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDozen Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 The amount of posts I've read from hardcore PvPers upset that they can go from planet to planet, zone to zone, with ZERO open world PvP opportunities, kind of assures us of the fact that even PvP servers are realatively grief free. Which means people who are wrapped up in levelling simply don't care about PvP. Levelling. PvE. You remember PvE? 200 million dollars worth of this game's investment? Hardcore PvP issues simply don't top their list of priorities. Never have. Now you're basing assumptions by what you see complained about on the forums. Bad move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PjPablo Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 The amount of posts I've read from hardcore PvPers upset that they can go from planet to planet, zone to zone, with ZERO open world PvP opportunities, kind of assures us of the fact that even PvP servers are realatively grief free. Which means people who are wrapped up in levelling simply don't care about PvP. Levelling. PvE. You remember PvE? 200 million dollars worth of this game's investment? Hardcore PvP issues simply don't top their list of priorities. Never have. They're not going to FORCE players to one faction or the other. No matter how many times it is suggested. Because they have too much of this game's development invested in PvE. Considering they have 40% pvp servers, a planet dedicated to pvp, warzones, pvp gear, AND pvp being one of the only time sinks at 50 I would say that BW considers pvp to be somewhat important. More important than pve? No. But important nonetheless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDozen Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 (edited) I'll bite: * Give XP boost option to less numerous faction. i.e. 5-10% boost * Add new race to less numerous faction * Increased valor gain for less numerous faction * Stat boost in warzones/pvp areas for less numerous faction. i.e. +x% HP There's four things right there. I think these ideas are at least worth considering. Edited January 21, 2012 by DirtyDozen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matte_Black Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 (edited) Mostly, it's a matter of the players not wanting to pick even teams more than the faction they want to play but, I would say the Imperial faction seems to be more successful stylistically, especially among the PvP crowd so, maybe Republic could use more of the upcoming art team effort. My suggestion would be for the dominant faction to win control of a planet where they can fight a factional civil war based on lightside/darkside. This would draw numbers from factional battle fronts of the dominant side and provide more balanced PvP across the board in a self-balancing manner. Edited January 21, 2012 by Matte_Black Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanWolfShadow Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Mostly, it's a matter of the players not wanting to pick even teams more than the faction they want to play but, I would say the Imperial faction seems to be more successful stylistically, especially among the PvP crowd so, maybe Republic could use more of the upcoming art team effort. My suggestion would be for the dominant faction to win control of a planet where they can fight a factional civil war based on lightside/darkside. This would draw numbers from factional battle fronts of the dominant side and provide more balanced PvP across the board in a self-balancing manner. Now that is one of the more interesting concepts that I have seen bounced around. That is a great idea. You should post that in the suggestion forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nema_K Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 (edited) I think forcing people into factions was a bad idea to begin with. I'm sure smugglers, troopers, bounty hunters, and agents existed on both sides. Let them start neutral and pick a faction. That way you won't have people complaining that BH has cooler graphics then a trooper. (Mirror classes would have to be changed around in order for this work) Jedi and Sith would have to start with their respective faction, but their LS/DS meter hits a certain level, they could have the option to defect to the other faction. Of course, its late to implement anything like this now. Edited January 22, 2012 by Paralassa content Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDozen Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 Mostly, it's a matter of the players not wanting to pick even teams more than the faction they want to play but, I would say the Imperial faction seems to be more successful stylistically, especially among the PvP crowd so, maybe Republic could use more of the upcoming art team effort. My suggestion would be for the dominant faction to win control of a planet where they can fight a factional civil war based on lightside/darkside. This would draw numbers from factional battle fronts of the dominant side and provide more balanced PvP across the board in a self-balancing manner. That does sound interesting. I agree you should put that in the suggestion box. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chessrook Posted January 21, 2012 Author Share Posted January 21, 2012 Mostly, it's a matter of the players not wanting to pick even teams more than the faction they want to play but, I would say the Imperial faction seems to be more successful stylistically, especially among the PvP crowd so, maybe Republic could use more of the upcoming art team effort. My suggestion would be for the dominant faction to win control of a planet where they can fight a factional civil war based on lightside/darkside. This would draw numbers from factional battle fronts of the dominant side and provide more balanced PvP across the board in a self-balancing manner. I agree, this is a VERY nice idea. And perhaps add in that Neutral players would be able to pick which side they could join, allowing it to even out a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashirae Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 For me, the Republic races are just boring. The blind guys and their headgear is pointless since it'll rarely match any armor. The Twi'lek colors are dull. The Zabrak tattoos look fake. The green guys just have nothing interesting going on. Compare that to: a race with glowing red eyes, the "Darth Maul" race, more decorated Twi'leks, a red-skinned race with spiny projections all over their bodies and faces, Sith class-specific scarification, crazy feral bald women who love pain. Unless someone is a hardcore fan of Jedi from the movies/books, I can't see why anyone would roll Republic. I think a lot of people who play the game and aren't big fans would see the more exotic Imperial races as much more attractive. So my suggestion is: give Republic an extra race, or multiple extra races. If "aliens having boring voice overs as a main character" is an issue, then just have the lore explain how they came from a human Republic adopted family. Or any other myriad of explanations to side-step alien character voice overs. My second suggestion: don't let whoever wrote the Jedi stories do it for the next expansion. The Jedi stories are terribly uninteresting (I consider myself neutral at heart, but play Imp because it's more interesting). We all know from the movies that Jedi are most certainly very interesting and entertaining, so why are their questlines so DULL? The only explanation is bad/uninspired writers. The people who wrote the Sith class quests and the Imperial Agent quests are great, please make them write everyone's new stories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnoggyMack Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 More important than pve? No. Wait, are you suggesting that PvE is more important than PvP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashivauto Posted January 21, 2012 Share Posted January 21, 2012 there is no imbalance on my server.... I hace both rep and imp high lvl toons .... Never a problem w/ warzones etc.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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