KeisukeTakahashi Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 I see a lot of complaints about ability delay and the HeroEngine. I completely agree that this is the worst problem in the game right now. However, why is it that people think that a game engine is some sort of unchangeable piece of software? If the problem is in the animations, they can change the way they work. If the problem is in the netcode they can change the way it works. There is nothing permanently broken and they said they are looking at addressing the issue. Those type of game engine changes are not simple though. I'm sure that it will take a while to figure out how to fix the problem and any such fix would need to be tested thoroughly. The important thing is that BioWare makes it high priority and fixes the problem. There are still many bugs and parts of the game that needs to be fixed and new content that needs to be developed. I just hope that BioWare doesn't underestimate how important it is to fix the ability delay issue. Basically, for those of you who say the HeroEngine is broken and the game will never be fixed. You are wrong. There is no reason that an game engine cannot be improved. BioWare would not need to completely throw away their game and start over just because it isn't working as well as it should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGSThomas Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 because people are parrots. They like to repeat everything they heard without knowing anything about the particular subject they are talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solar Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 because people are parrots. They like to repeat everything they heard without knowing anything about the particular subject they are talking about. /thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kubernetic Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Simple: They have no idea how programming and software development works, or how software engines function and can be modified. What's more, they missed the simple historical fact that when BioWare licensed the Hero Engine, it had to be modified for their purposes in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oflow Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 They shoulda modified it to actually work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solar Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Simple: They have no idea how programming and software development works, or how software engines function and can be modified. What's more, they missed the simple historical fact that when BioWare licensed the Hero Engine, it had to be modified for their purposes in the first place. Interesting comment from someone with four toons their sig; just sayin'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
titanmike Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 They shoulda modified it to actually work. They should have spent some of that money to build a engine, or pick a better engine to go with. Just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MXIII Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 They shoulda modified it to actually work. It does work, the problem is in order to have that "Fast paced cinematic quality" combat, response times have to be sacrificed. This is why its taking so long to resolve the issue, they are trying to have their cake and eat it too. Unfortunately the only "Fix" is A. Make all abilities channel and root you to the ground. B. Get rid of cinematic combat altogether Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikkeos Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 BW just had to get the barely beta engine with barely any documentation, loads of half-finished features, no preparation for more than basic DX9 support. They complained later that it applies low pressure in huge quantities. Sure you can fix and swap out all those parts that cause problems. But why would you do that when you're in the market for a game engine anyway? Just get something that actually is more than half finished, nicely documented and fits your basic needs from the start. Less fiddling, less hours to spend on it, way less hassle, lower costs too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreymaneAlpha Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Because they apparently made the decision to give precedence to animations over actions. And unless they give up on making animations so important, ability delay will continue to exist, and continue to ruin the game for competitive players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infestedhobo Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Interesting comment from someone with four toons their sig; just sayin'. I'm pretty sure he's agreeing with OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MXIII Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 BW just had to get the barely beta engine with barely any documentation, loads of half-finished features, no preparation for more than basic DX9 support. They complained later that it applies low pressure in huge quantities. Sure you can fix and swap out all those parts that cause problems. But why would you do that when you're in the market for a game engine anyway? Just get something that actually is more than half finished, nicely documented and fits your basic needs from the start. Less fiddling, less hours to spend on it, way less hassle, lower costs too. ignorant post is ignorant. They didnt want the hero engine, they wanted the basic architecture and features. The Engine that Bioware uses is not even close to what you see on the hero engine's sales pitch website. Getting an already established engine with the features you want IS less hassle, and DOES lower costs, and requires LESS fiddling, since they dont have to do all the R & D themselves, and basically create a whole new engine from scratch. The engine has nothing to do with response time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparklehorse Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 It's just plain awesome that so many developers play this game. The forums are filled to the rim with them. Bioware should totally fire all their devs. and hire all the devs. that post here on the forums. It's obvious they know so much more about how game engines and coding than the people who...you know...actually make the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jebazel Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Hero engine has a history of this problem from it's early days, quite a while ago now... Will take some deep core fixes to fix I'm afraid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aisar Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 (edited) Maybe.. If they had made an announcement a week after release explaining exactly what was going on, why it was going on and what it would take to get it fixed, I would not need to speculate. See, when you don't tell people what is going on and reassure them when they freak out, things sometimes go badly. Even saying, yeah our stuff is kinda broked right now but it works 90% of the time..we are working nonstop every day during regular business hours with 2 teams. We can't say when, but it will be fixed. Sorry about that. Oh gee, that really sucks....let me play and see. Well..it happens now and then but it's not that bad. Good game though. OMG WHAT AN IDEA Edited January 20, 2012 by Aisar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreymaneAlpha Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 It does work, the problem is in order to have that "Fast paced cinematic quality" combat, response times have to be sacrificed. This is why its taking so long to resolve the issue, they are trying to have their cake and eat it too. Unfortunately the only "Fix" is A. Make all abilities channel and root you to the ground. B. Get rid of cinematic combat altogether Exactly this. "Cinematic combat" is an absolutely untenable, indefensible design decision. I cannot believe that anyone involved in the decision to prioritize animation over action had ever before played an MMO at a competitive level for either PvP or PvE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vitellius Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Simple: They have no idea how programming and software development works, or how software engines function and can be modified. What's more, they missed the simple historical fact that when BioWare licensed the Hero Engine, it had to be modified for their purposes in the first place. So, what would you call someone that paid to go on a roller coaster that they believed was built by engineers that have no idea how physics works? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earthchild Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 No it is not unfixable, however, I suspect it is very hard and time consuming since the problem has been around since beta and has not been adequately addressed. Not everybody is bothered by the ability delay, so if the fix takes a zallion dollars and will only retain a half zallion dollars worth of customers, it will not get top priority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boomxi Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 because people are parrots. They like to repeat everything they heard without knowing anything about the particular subject they are talking about. Because Bioware licensed hero engine and they work within the framework. But I don't think engine is to blame. It is their collective decision to make fights more cinematic. So game can be fixed just takes a bit of work as in mirror the classes properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obinae Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 They should have spent some of that money to build a engine, or pick a better engine to go with. Just my opinion. QFT I don't understand what Bioware was thinking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldsilver Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 because people are parrots. They like to repeat everything they heard without knowing anything about the particular subject they are talking about. crackers, i need em now please. but yeah i agree with this + op Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dumpiduke Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 No it is not unfixable, however, I suspect it is very hard and time consuming since the problem has been around since beta and has not been adequately addressed. Not everybody is bothered by the ability delay, so if the fix takes a zallion dollars and will only retain a half zallion dollars worth of customers, it will not get top priority. Well, in my humble opinion, the success of this game hinges on responsive gameplay just like it did every other failed MMO post-WoW. Bioware really dropped the ball on this one, and I fear that the issue isn’t going to be addressed in the near future (if at all). We just need a concrete statement from Bioware stating exactly how they intend on going about addressing this issue. We were told that there were going to be at least some fixes in January. From all of the patch notes for 1.1, there may have been one note relating to giant ability delay/animation thread: Corrected an issue where activating cover, using Explosive Probe, and then using Snipe could cause Snipe to be interrupted. That's it. Nothing else. My spirits are dwindling fast. I don't know how much longer I can hold on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jett_Skirata Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 QFT I don't understand what Bioware was thinking Since you apparently know so much about programming maybe you should write it for them, sell it for 1 mil or so… make a bunch of money. Oh wait… you don’t know jack do you… sorry my mistake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terko_Koslah Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 They should have bought WoW engine . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oflow Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 It does work, the problem is in order to have that "Fast paced cinematic quality" combat, response times have to be sacrificed. This is why its taking so long to resolve the issue, they are trying to have their cake and eat it too. Unfortunately the only "Fix" is A. Make all abilities channel and root you to the ground. B. Get rid of cinematic combat altogether No it doesnt work. You can use abilities and they reset the GCD and do nothing. Happens all the time if you use an instant after an ability thats off the GCD. 'Fast paced cinematic quality' combat has nothing to do with response time. BF3 has fast paced cinematic quality combat and it doesnt have ability delay or misfires. It probably has more to do with how the client & server talk to each other than the animations. Its not being addressed because they probably cant fix it so instead they try to cover it up. Thats why they left out the combat log because they knew it shows abilities dont work or misfire, and its also why they changed the GCD animation to try and say its the players' fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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