Lordadamar Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) Havent seen this topic mentioned recently SO here goes... Every 40+ works to gain stats and good equipment modified to there play style so that we are more effective in pvp and pve... But the bolster in PvP is so biased it borderlines on making good gear and spec's useless... A lvl 20 should not be able to eternally stun a lvl 40, Nor should there Hit points be bolstered as high as people in there 40's... Higher level toons should be able to resist more attacks from a lower level... PvP is not about being equal its about a Power Advantage. In the current system low level toons with a 3rd of the skills with a 1/4 of the damage are gaining the same advantages as people who spent hours and hours building gear... This was tested it is not a mistake. Level 15 toons get nearly the same Hit points and same damage as a level 49 toon... If fact past level 39 you receive less and less bolster till, this is not an issue it understandable it makes sense. When a level 20's attack skill is bolstered to hit for 2.5k thats a bit ridiculous. And there hit points are bolstered to 10k+ what advantages does being higher bring in PvP? Its also irritating to to watch a level 20 Healer Out heal my 2.5k to 5k shots *** is this about... And all of you that will argue this is not fair, think about it this way at level 20 your not gonna fly to Belsavis and expect to drop a level 45 easy mob.... Why whould it be so in PvP... The thing to remember is its PvP, not love your neighbor and be fair... Let the Flaming begin P.S. The people that post you just suck or Crap like that are just missing the point. I am almost always top 5 in DPS. Edited January 19, 2012 by Lordadamar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lordadamar Posted January 19, 2012 Author Share Posted January 19, 2012 /// Bump /// Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democratus Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Two approaches to PvP are to either 1) Group battles by level - only allowing characters of similar power to fight each other. 2) Create a mechanic that gives all players a fair chance in battle. SWOTOR chose to go with #2. This has the advantage of shortening the wait time for PvP battles. I can see where they are coming from. In the future, if the population of characters grows it may behoove them to move to option #1. But for now they would rather players get into PvP matches quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VinnieDaMac Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I agree, level 15s should have no more than 2500 hp and be able to one-shotted by my level 49. My level 49 should not have engage a level 15 and worry about the possibility of losing to one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycao Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 well i yeah this ummmmmm..... if you cant beat a lvl 20 when you are 40+ you just really suck at this game and maybe a nice roleplaying server is where you belong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barbdwyer Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 You do know that no one would PvP till 50 if that was the case...as in that would suck horribly. Also, as it stands now, 40s and especially 50s, are still way more powerful than lower levels. At the most, on my 23 Operative, I can hit for maybe 2k on someone. I saw a BM Operative hit me for 3800, three shotted me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imcrazyhigh Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 wow really guys so why would any low lvl person ever play pvp........... they would not getting ***** by a lvl 49 would not be fun srry your points are invalid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FubarJeb Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Since we only have two PvP groups (level 50 only, and everyone else) it makes sense to balence it out. I'm at level 40, and I like the bolster stat. I think it's more fun to PvP on an even battlefield. If we had more level brackets then we wouldn't need the bolster stat. I like the current system now that the 50s have their own group. My two cents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lordadamar Posted January 19, 2012 Author Share Posted January 19, 2012 I agree, level 15s should have no more than 2500 hp and be able to one-shotted by my level 49. My level 49 should not have engage a level 15 and worry about the possibility of losing to one. Yah ATM the bolster is insane, Everyone im not saying Dont Bolster. Im saying Don't bolster equally.. <20 a percentage 21-25 a percentage 26-30 a percentage 31-35 a percentage 36-40 a percentage... After 40 your pretty much on your own I didnt any bolster between 45 - 49. And increase the Resists for as you gain levels. I shouldnt have to worry about a 20 level difference... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlyNameNotTaken Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) I get where OP is coming from. I had a Powertech tank spec with 23,000 HP and a level 16 Smuggler crit'd me for 9K and then again for 6K and then again for 8K. Combat survivability for the toughest, highest HP toon in the warzone? 4.5 seconds. That's not even enough time for me to close the gap and even hurt him. I can't charge him while he's in cover and my ranged attacks do 10% damage. Even if I used my highest-DPS ranged rotation while I closed the gap the MAXIMUM theoretical ranged damage I could do in that 4.5 seconds is about 1,000, assuming I crit on all three with my explosive dart, incendiary missile and rail shot. (((1K+2K+3K)*1.5*0.1)=~900). Sorry, but a level 50 tank in the absolutely best armor in the galaxy (full Battlemaster), with the best training in the Galaxy, who can stand toe-to-toe with the Infernal One and expect to win should not get three-shot by a wet-behind-the-ears gun-runner and barely even scratch him. Edited January 19, 2012 by OnlyNameNotTaken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackalTurner Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Wait wait wait... You are complaining that a level 15, who has worse gear than you and not even half of your abilities, is able to beat you? Im sorry, but either you suck, got double teamed, or are just extremely unlucky. Bolster only makes their stats equal to what they would be at a higher level. Gear is not factored in, and neither are abilities. So even with bolster YOU still have the advantage. I think you just want to run around the battlefield pretending you are a god while oneshotting everyone...until you hit 50 of course, then you are gonna be cursing PVP because everyone will be on equal footing and you dont have your advantages anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBonfire Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Couldn't disagree MORE with the OP. Firstly getting to level 40 and getting gear etc etc isn't some kind of divine skill. It's an MMO, it's designed so a brain dead monkey can level up. It just means you played for longer than that lvl 20 over there. Seondly, if you think a lvl 40 something and a lvl 20 something with bolster are equal you are completely wrong. The lvl 20 gets a boost to stats but doesn't get 20 levels of talents and 20 levels of abilities to use. A level 20 is still worse than the lvl 40, just not unplayably worse. Finally, and most importantly, if you make ppl in their teens, 20s and 30s just fodder for lvl 40s then why the hell will they queue at all? They'll just not bother til they are mid to high 40s and then disappear into the 50s bracket in no time. You'll kill under 50s pvp completely just cause you can't beat up a bolstered toon with naff all abilities and talents. Whole idea is dense, will never happen. ps..... look forwards to the 50s bracket where ppl with loads of expertise will trounce you repeatedly. Then you can see what having all that specialised gear making you better feels like on the receiving end . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lordadamar Posted January 19, 2012 Author Share Posted January 19, 2012 well i yeah this ummmmmm..... if you cant beat a lvl 20 when you are 40+ you just really suck at this game and maybe a nice roleplaying server is where you belong I throw down 100k to 200k dps everytime its not about sucking its about the friggen classes with stuns at lvl 20 like BH, smuggler, Gun Slinger, Trooper that when bolstered can stun you forever and because they are bolster so far you cant resist there 10 2k shots... You should be worried for your *** at level 20 going into PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpiritofSWTOR Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) Let the Flaming begin... OK. I believe you want to one-shot grays in WZ pvp. This is not the way BioWare has designed it, and I am quite glad they did not. Don't think of that level 15 as a low-level gray. Think of him as a player with far fewer skills than you have -- but approximately equal in hitpoints and damage. If you are consistently losing to these gray players one-on-one, then you begin to understand that you cannot simply "gear up and win." (Unless, of course, you are geared up with level 50 gear.) Instead, there should actually be some skill, tactics and strategy involved in PvP. Not just gearing up to win. Peace. Edited January 19, 2012 by SpiritofSWTOR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackalTurner Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I throw down 100k to 200k dps everytime its not about sucking its about the friggen classes with stuns at lvl 20 like BH, smuggler, Gun Slinger, Trooper that when bolstered can stun you forever and because they are bolster so far you cant resist there 10 2k shots... You should be worried for your *** at level 20 going into PvP. I play a bounty hunter mercenary. I have ONE stun move at level 32. ONE. And it lasts for about 4 seconds or less. I have a CC that lasts for 60 seconds too, but if you take any damage it turns off. Bolster doesnt effect the time of a stun or the amount of stuns at all. So yeah...keep believing in fairy tales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvanSnowWolf Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I know.. you are so right OP.. lowbies are not people like us. They exist only to be culled... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VinnieDaMac Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I get where OP is coming from. I had a Powertech tank spec with 23,000 HP and a level 16 Smuggler crit'd me for 9K and then again for 6K and then again for 8K. Combat survivability for the toughest, highest HP toon in the warzone? 4.5 seconds. Sorry, but a level 50 tank in full Battlemaster gear who can stand toe-to-toe with the Infernal One should not get three-shot by a wet-behind-the-ears gun-runner. That couldn't have not happened anymore than right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamescloutier Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) I'm starting to think the only way to make everyone happy is to make a bracket for each level and force everyone to naked. With the way bolstering works anyone from 10-49 has a fighting chance. The "issue" was that the hardcore PvPer that got to 50 quickly got a boat load of gear with expertise. Expertise gave those players an advantage. But here is the thing, most if not all of those people spend a lot of time PvPing and more than likely also had a skill advantage over other players. That's what happens when you play one class a lot. Over time more players will close the expertise gap but may not close the skill gap. So back on point, if you're having issues in PvP, then PvP more, group up with another person, figure out what classes you struggle against and why, figure out got tactics for warzones and get your group on the same page at the start of a match. Basically spent some time and improve your skills, it cost less commendations than gear. Edited January 19, 2012 by jamescloutier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthCaydus Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 My only problem with bolster is that it makes for a lot of lowbie **** talkers. Some lvl 15 sniper on my civil war team today actually took the time and effort to whisp me after the match and gloat on how he had 'beaten' me, a lvl 49 in the post match stats... Never mind my 140k protection stat all this kid cared about was the fact that he had outmedalled a person who had invested a lot more time and effort into his toon than himself. Despite all the positives of bolster, and ill be the first to admit that I loved it when I was a lowbie, no mechanic shud give reason for lower levels to think they are superior to people who have invested alot more into their toons. /end rage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transcend Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I throw down 100k to 200k dps everytime its not about sucking its about the friggen classes with stuns at lvl 20 like BH, smuggler, Gun Slinger, Trooper that when bolstered can stun you forever and because they are bolster so far you cant resist there 10 2k shots... You should be worried for your *** at level 20 going into PvP. You do 100k dps? That's like 6 million damage in a minute... I think you're lying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrustyDog Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I dont think countries thast have been around less time than the United States should be allowed to use guns when they fight us. Thats just unfair. They should be forced to throw rocks at us. Then when we rickroll roflstomp them we can award all kinds of medals to our returning troops and tell them how uber they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avindra Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Bolster is fine, the lower levels have much less skill points spent in their trees to boost their ablities not to mention they have less abilities. If you cant beat a low level attacking you with 3 skills and you have 2 hotbars full of them then thats your problem for being bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aleiro Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Havent seen this topic mentioned recently SO here goes... Every 40+ works to gain stats and good equipment modified to there play style so that we are more effective in pvp and pve... But the bolster in PvP is so biased it borderlines on making good gear and spec's useless... A lvl 20 should not be able to eternally stun a lvl 40, Nor should there Hit points be bolstered as high as people in there 40's... Higher level toons should be able to resist more attacks from a lower level... PvP is not about being equal its about a Power Advantage. In the current system low level toons with a 3rd of the skills with a 1/4 of the damage are gaining the same advantages as people who spent hours and hours building gear... This was tested it is not a mistake. Level 15 toons get nearly the same Hit points and same damage as a level 49 toon... If fact past level 39 you receive less and less bolster till, this is not an issue it understandable it makes sense. When a level 20's attack skill is bolstered to hit for 2.5k thats a bit ridiculous. And there hit points are bolstered to 10k+ what advantages does being higher bring in PvP? Its also irritating to to watch a level 20 Healer Out heal my 2.5k to 5k shots *** is this about... And all of you that will argue this is not fair, think about it this way at level 20 your not gonna fly to Belsavis and expect to drop a level 45 easy mob.... Why whould it be so in PvP... The thing to remember is its PvP, not love your neighbor and be fair... Let the Flaming begin P.S. The people that post you just suck or Crap like that are just missing the point. I am almost always top 5 in DPS. Is this guy for real? Does he really want to own low-levels in a warzone that is dedicated to a 49 level span? lvl 20s have already a big disadvantage, they have less skills than a lvl 40. So now basically you just want to grief and gank in a warzone...? I can't tell if you're stupid or just s troll in search of food mate... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeth Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 This thread is hilarious. And proof that the bolster system works. They dont need more brackets, the bolster system is fine and results in quick popping PvP. TLDR: Bad player got killed by skilled lowbies. Classic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Philar Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) PvP is not about being equal its about a Power Advantage. In the current system low level toons with a 3rd of the skills with a 1/4 of the damage are gaining the same advantages as people who spent hours and hours building gear... This is completely wrong. What you have just described is PvE. Gear and level should be meaningless in balanced PvP because your character is supposed to be irrelevant (PvP stands for Player versus Player, not Character versus Character). I get it though, you are used to the WoW system of rewarding those who grind by making stats count far more than skill and you don't like the more skill-based CvC (it still isn't true PvP) of SWTOR. It will take some getting used to, but I think you will survive... For 4.5 seconds. Edited January 23, 2012 by Darth_Philar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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