snoopy Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 The hardcore give the casuals someone to look up to. Casuals look at the hardcore gamer and their gear and accomplishments and want to be like them. This in turns gets casuals to play more and push to be more hardcore themselves. Without the hardcore crowd casuals will never see what they could possibly become and without any cool goals to look forward to casuals lose interest. Actually, we really don't look up to you. Sorry to tell you that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cormey Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Who is going to test your game on the test realms? Without hardcores your game would be a buggy pile of **** that doesn't function. Considering the bugs that come out in MMOG updates I'd have to say those 'hardcores' aren't doing a very good job at testing anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GalacticKegger Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Here's a quick question for all you casuals out there that hate hardcores. Without the hardcores, who will play on PTR and test all the content? It's clearly not going to be the casuals.If the hardcores you describe are the same hardcores OP describes then most won't have time for it cuz they'll be too busy loot farming or preening. Participants in the PTS environment will be the true hardcores in the sense that they not only play and support the game on all levels but are willing to devote hands-on time to improving it. Edited January 17, 2012 by GalacticKegger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RocNessMonster Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Considering the bugs that come out in MMOG updates I'd have to say those 'hardcores' aren't doing a very good job at testing anyway. It's the developers job to make fixes, bug testers can only report those errors. If the devs decide to ignore them, then that is not the players fault. Personally I consider myself somewhere in the middle and think all this mudslinging by both sides is dumb. Edited January 17, 2012 by RocNessMonster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bladedakoda Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Considering the bugs that come out in MMOG updates I'd have to say those 'hardcores' aren't doing a very good job at testing anyway. Thats because they don't test the content, they just rush to get to endgame, that way when it goes live they can clear content fast. Oh yeah, and think people are looking up to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jett-Rinn Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) This has been true since the days of UO/EQ1. The hardcore drive the game. They are the most involved in every aspect of the game and are the ones who create communities. The hardcore give the casuals someone to look up to. Casuals look at the hardcore gamer and their gear and accomplishments and want to be like them. This in turns gets casuals to play more and push to be more hardcore themselves. Without the hardcore crowd casuals will never see what they could possibly become and without any cool goals to look forward to casuals lose interest. If SWTOR is to succeed it needs to focus a good chunk of its dev time on endgame content which is difficult and gives out rare rewards that few will get but everyone will dream of obtaining. This dynamic has been proven true time and time again. It is no longer hypothesis. It is no longer even a theory. It is fact. Bwahahahahaha oh thanks for the laugh I needed it. Edited January 17, 2012 by Jett-Rinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osster Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Hardcore players are the minority, they aren't the ones that sustain the game, they just like to pretend they are to make themselves feel important I guess. Threads like these, insinuating that he majority of players even know or care about what they do, really make me believe a large amount of these players have serious self-worth issues. Edited January 17, 2012 by Osster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kabjat Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 This has been true since the days of UO/EQ1. The hardcore drive the game. They are the most involved in every aspect of the game and are the ones who create communities. The hardcore give the casuals someone to look up to. Casuals look at the hardcore gamer and their gear and accomplishments and want to be like them. This in turns gets casuals to play more and push to be more hardcore themselves. Without the hardcore crowd casuals will never see what they could possibly become and without any cool goals to look forward to casuals lose interest. If SWTOR is to succeed it needs to focus a good chunk of its dev time on endgame content which is difficult and gives out rare rewards that few will get but everyone will dream of obtaining. This dynamic has been proven true time and time again. It is no longer hypothesis. It is no longer even a theory. It is fact. I disagree vehemently with your assertion. In fact, with all due respect for your opinion and the polite and concise manner in which it was presented, I am going to go ahead and say you are dead wrong. You seem to believe that, since you yourself find endgame and shiny gear important, that all others must as well. I care less than a little about the hamster wheel of endgame grinding, or min/maxing, or being a slave to a progression raiding guild. I've been there, done it....I'm bored with it. This game has PLENTY for myself and my husband to keep us entertained without ONCE casting "the few and the proud" a second glance. Also, where is the official data you have compiled that proves your claim? I am genuinely interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cormey Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 It's the developers job to make fixes, bug testers can only report those errors. If the devs decide to ignore them, then that is not the players fault. Personally I consider myself somewhere in the middle and think all this mudslinging by both sides is dumb. Ahh so you want all the praise but none of the blame, you coulda just said that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jett-Rinn Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Hardcore players are the minority, they aren't the ones that sustain the game, they just like to pretend they are to make themselves feel important I guess. Threads like these, insinuating that he majority of players even know or care about what they do, make me seriously believe a large amount of these players have serious self-worth issues. You should attend a Blizzcon sometime my friend....it is a wondrous and sad thing to behold. Anyway I think that the OP has been set straight sufficiently. and I honestly hope the devs read this so the fully understand just how many of use detest that whole elitist mentality...there really is no place for it in this community. Edited January 17, 2012 by Jett-Rinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PibbyPib Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 The problem I have with self-described "harcore players" is that they usually make up a small minority of the population, like 8-10% or so... but they make so much noise that development almost always tends to cater to their demands as the game progresses. Eventually, you're left with this top-heavy mess that's designed for this tiny faction, and people start drifting away from it. Then the "hardcore players" get annoyed that the place is a ghost town and set out for the Hot New Thing, and start making their same old stupid demands all over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brickabrack Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Hardcore drive MMO's? So how come Star Wars: Clone Wars Online has 8 million users? Also, while I'm somewhat hardcore myself, even I know Casuals don't look up to Hardcore. If anything Casuals pity Hardcore. Edited January 17, 2012 by Brickabrack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthChagras Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 SWTOR is not aimed at the hardcore crowd, it's aimed at the Casual crowd. Thus dedicating the dev team to hardcore end game content just won't happen...honestly I could give a **** less about my gear or how hard it is to obtain an item, I'd rather it be easy so I can get it, and be done with it all. I have other things to do, and get only a few hours a day to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jett-Rinn Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Hardcore drive MMO's? So how come Star Wars: Clone Wars Online has 8 million users? Also, while I'm somewhat hardcore myself, but even I know Casuals don't look up to Hardcore. If anything Casuals pity Hardcore. That isn't even the most amazing part about that....my company did some consulting work for them last spring...the vast majority of those 8 million users spend over 25 bucks a month for station cash. SOE is frigging rolling in it right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_giordino Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I'm not a hardcore player but what he says is true. It has been proven in multiple MMOs. Hardcore players create the top guilds, communities etc and drive what's going on. Hardcore players showing off gives casuals something to strive for. Their presence is greater than someone who plays for a couple hours, a couple times a week. They build guilds and structure so casuals can be part of something when their on. Hardcores show casuals what to do n how. Etc You need hardcores plain n simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alrighto Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 somewhat agree with OP hardcores drive MMOs forward, they are the ones will test new content first, encounter and report bugs first, without hardcore players, the casuals will not get the amount of polished content when they eventually reach it to succeed MMOs need to cater for both, having multiple difficult modes is one of the great feature that allows both casuals and hardcores to experience the same encounter if an MMO is set strictly for a casual crowd, it will lose that edge that hardcore players help drive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeathCorp Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 This has been true since the days of UO/EQ1. The hardcore drive the game. They are the most involved in every aspect of the game and are the ones who create communities. The hardcore give the casuals someone to look up to. Casuals look at the hardcore gamer and their gear and accomplishments and want to be like them. This in turns gets casuals to play more and push to be more hardcore themselves. Without the hardcore crowd casuals will never see what they could possibly become and without any cool goals to look forward to casuals lose interest. If SWTOR is to succeed it needs to focus a good chunk of its dev time on endgame content which is difficult and gives out rare rewards that few will get but everyone will dream of obtaining. This dynamic has been proven true time and time again. It is no longer hypothesis. It is no longer even a theory. It is fact. I don't look up to hardcore players, I look down. I pity them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mannic Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 You should attend a Blizzcon sometime my friend....it is a wondrous and sad thing to behold. Star Wars conventions are the very definition of "cool," though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djsmileey Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 This has been true since the days of UO/EQ1. The hardcore drive the game. They are the most involved in every aspect of the game and are the ones who create communities. The hardcore give the casuals someone to look up to. Casuals look at the hardcore gamer and their gear and accomplishments and want to be like them. This in turns gets casuals to play more and push to be more hardcore themselves. Without the hardcore crowd casuals will never see what they could possibly become and without any cool goals to look forward to casuals lose interest. If SWTOR is to succeed it needs to focus a good chunk of its dev time on endgame content which is difficult and gives out rare rewards that few will get but everyone will dream of obtaining. This dynamic has been proven true time and time again. It is no longer hypothesis. It is no longer even a theory. It is fact. I am through and through a hardcore player and have been for the better part of 20 years. None of this is true in any sense of the imagination. Thank you for the laugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chronosxx Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 no need to lie! this must be your first mmo hardcore players have and will never make up the majority of the community. Its these things that are called lives that prevent it from happening Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandmthethird Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 OP lol. when the hardcore can pay for this game they will aim the content to the hardcore. till then they will aim the content at the masses. the paying public that will keep this game alive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korusus Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 This has been true since the days of UO/EQ1. The hardcore drive the game. They are the most involved in every aspect of the game and are the ones who create communities. First, I don't believe you played Ultima Online because if you had you would know that Origin did not cater to the hardcore crowd at all (hello Trammel). Secondly, it was when Blizzard stopped catering to the hardcore raiding crowd and introduced things like badges and heroic 5 mans that their numbers went through the roof. There's a reason why Naxxrammas was re-used, because the so-called "hardcore" crowd were the only ones who got to experience that content the first time around. That's called wasted time and effort. I guarantee the percentage of players that saw the Lich King dwarfed, absolutely dwarfed the number that saw AQ40's final boss. Now I consider myself to be a casual but also an MMO vet and I'm loving this game so far. I love how even the solo experience is challenging and rewarding. The solo boss fights are very well done and the companion system adds a surprising amount of flexibility to my playstyle (I can actually level as a healer or a tank and not just as a DPS spec). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mannic Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 I don't look up to hardcore players, I look down. I pity them. Might want to save your pity for someone who, you know... cares? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bladedakoda Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 I really hate bringing wow into posts, but fact is WOTLK had the most live subs in the history of the game. WE all know that Wrath was aimed at the casuals. Cataclysm hit and fire lands was hard for most of the wrath people. Yeah the numbers took a massive dive. Please don't tell me that hardcore players are the majority, not only is it arrogant to think it, it's also naive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iusedtoplaywow Posted January 18, 2012 Share Posted January 18, 2012 OP is dropping fact bombs and the Dev's at Blizzard will be the first to tell you this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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