Darth_Philar Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I'm missing the point? I don't think they're going to remove PVP so... it's an gear based RPG game with PVP. Everything you just said also applies to PVE, but gear is ok there? I'm still waiting for someone to explain away gear upgrades in Call of Duty and Modern Warfare. PvE is all about advancing your character. This includes gear. PvP is all about using your skill to overcome the skill of other players. Gear should have no impact. The game unfortunately allows gear to have an impact which causes PvP players to be upset. In a failed attempt to make the PvP players happy, the developers add another PvE element and call it a PvP stat. The PvP stat now makes the gear imbalance even worse. The solution to PvP is not to add more PvE to it. The solution to PvP is to remove PvE from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee-Jay Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Sadly, instead of making a fun and/or meaningful PvP system to keep people playing, they opt for a gear treadmill just like everyone else Well SWTOR was feature-locked back in 2008. What do you expect? Back then it was the thing to do... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrekorSilverfang Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 PvE is all about advancing your character. This includes gear. PvP is all about using your skill to overcome the skill of other players. Gear should have no impact. The game unfortunately allows gear to have an impact which causes PvP players to be upset. In a failed attempt to make the PvP players happy, the developers add another PvE element and call it a PvP stat. The PvP stat now makes the gear imbalance even worse. The solution to PvP is not to add more PvE to it. The solution to PvP is to remove PvE from it. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sicknss Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 PvE is all about advancing your character. This includes gear. PvP is all about using your skill to overcome the skill of other players. Gear should have no impact. The game unfortunately allows gear to have an impact which causes PvP players to be upset. In a failed attempt to make the PvP players happy, the developers add another PvE element and call it a PvP stat. The PvP stat now makes the gear imbalance even worse. The solution to PvP is not to add more PvE to it. The solution to PvP is to remove PvE from it. I'm still waiting for someone to explain away gear upgrades in Call of Duty and Modern Warfare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sicknss Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 This. is not Quake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtydurst Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Without PvP gear the game becomes all about who can PvE the most to get the best gear. Therefore, if you want to compete in PvP you are FORCED to PvE and do raids. Bioware has implemented PvP gear with a PvP stat so that PvPers can't walk into PvE and expect to have optimal gear, and vise versa. This actually makes a lot of sense as it doesn't feel right to push PvPers into the raid scene just so they can compete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirtydurst Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 PvE is all about advancing your character. This includes gear. PvP is all about using your skill to overcome the skill of other players. Gear should have no impact. The game unfortunately allows gear to have an impact which causes PvP players to be upset. In a failed attempt to make the PvP players happy, the developers add another PvE element and call it a PvP stat. The PvP stat now makes the gear imbalance even worse. The solution to PvP is not to add more PvE to it. The solution to PvP is to remove PvE from it. Name a successful MMO where gear or items had no effect, in any fashion, on the PvP content of said game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRiddick Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Seriously... I am so sick of the argument "but without giving pvp gear a lolipop stat, pve'rs will come in and win... make all the stupid gear have the same stats OR even better, allow better stats for pve and have a solid set stat for PvP, that way the bolster would ACTUALLY work, and you poor excuses for pvp'ers wont have to worry about gear, Gear > skill = fail GET IT THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULLS... /sigh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRiddick Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Name a successful MMO where gear or items had no effect, in any fashion, on the PvP content of said game. Guild Wars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sicknss Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Guild Wars. What was the monthly fee for Guild Wars? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tierce Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I'd ask the same question for PvE content as well. I don't understand why there needs to be an advancement gear treadmill for PvE or PvP. The most fun I've ever had in PvP or PvE was when I was playing to win, whether that was against players or just to beat boss encounters when I could care less about the loot. I think anybody who does PvP or PvE needs to seriously ask themselves if they would be doing it absent of the item reward. If you can answer yes to that question, then you are probably actually having FUN. If you can't answer yes to that question, then you probably aren't having fun and the design of that content is probably unfun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRiddick Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 What was the monthly fee for Guild Wars? free... it started free, even with GW 2 it will be free at start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fungihoujo Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Because pvp isn't about skill, it's about who has the most time to grind out gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComeAndSee Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I've been playing MMOs since I was 13 and Lineage 2 was the only MMO that offered NO REWARDS for PvP except having your stats logged. Vanilla WoW's PvP system was an immense grind. Basically you needed to earn x amount of honor to earn x rank, but at the same time you decayed 30% of your rank a week. Also, who was the highest rank was dependent on WHAT THE PLAYERS set it at on the server. They could decide 1million or 100,000 honor as what made you a High Warlord and everyone else on the server was expected not to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alwaysthirsty Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 A PvP system with no rewards would bore me to tears. Facerolling teams all day with my pre made with nothing to work towards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GameTwine Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 In PVE you go into a dungeon "Hoping" you get such and such item. After wasting 2 hours your item doesn't drop. How do they feel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitsummerisle Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Sounds like GWs, just saying... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) I played Dota for years. An MMO warzone style game with no out-of-match progression and an even playing field every match. It was far more fun than PvP in an actual MMO, that's for sure. I didn't need a gear grind to have fun. Edited January 17, 2012 by EternalFinality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRiddick Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 A PvP system with no rewards would bore me to tears. Facerolling teams all day with my pre made with nothing to work towards. that is whay a ranked system needs to be implemented, work towards higher rank, which gives you better cosmetic gear, lets face it, dont we all just want people to know we are better than them... if you are sporting top tier cosmetic gear people know you have put your time in, why should stats matter? isnt the whole purpose of PvP to be better than the other person/team, to win?, or is it to have better stats to make it an uneven fight where it really doesn't matter about ur skill? cummon guys are you that conceded? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sicknss Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 free... it started free, even with GW 2 it will be free at start. Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sicknss Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Because pvp isn't about skill, it's about who has the most time to grind out gear. How about a Ferrari for sitting on the couch all day? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRiddick Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 (edited) Exactly. expound... or I am assuming that you mean this is why GW is a step up from all the other mmo's of its generation, It provides a top quality gaming experience without the lame monthly that other MMO's charge for cut rate content cause that sir... is the truth... heh Edited January 17, 2012 by TheRiddick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alwaysthirsty Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 that is whay a ranked system needs to be implemented, work towards higher rank, which gives you better cosmetic gear, lets face it, dont we all just want people to know we are better than them... if you are sporting top tier cosmetic gear people know you have put your time in, why should stats matter? isnt the whole purpose of PvP to be better than the other person/team, to win?, or is it to have better stats to make it an uneven fight where it really doesn't matter about ur skill? cummon guys are you that conceded? Im all for it dude, dont get me wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axorman Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 PvE is all about advancing your character. This includes gear. PvP is all about using your skill to overcome the skill of other players. Gear should have no impact. The game unfortunately allows gear to have an impact which causes PvP players to be upset. In a failed attempt to make the PvP players happy, the developers add another PvE element and call it a PvP stat. The PvP stat now makes the gear imbalance even worse. The solution to PvP is not to add more PvE to it. The solution to PvP is to remove PvE from it. +1 I'm still waiting for someone to explain away gear upgrades in Call of Duty and Modern Warfare. That's apples to oranges. In any FPS the equalizer is the headshot. Give the new lvl 10 the ability to "headshot" their fully geared lvl 50 counterpart and you can have your silly gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrekorSilverfang Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 A PvP system with no rewards would bore me to tears. Facerolling teams all day with my pre made with nothing to work towards. This is because you treat PvP like PvE as do all the other wow kiddies. The point of pvp is competition. If you do this right you end up with e-sports like Starcraft, LoL, Quake, CS etc etc. If you do it wrong you end up like WoW; which was picked up as an e-sport due to it's popularity and quickly dropped because it didn't provide a truly competitive environment for skill to show through. You could make an argument that those aren't MMOs but then again EVE has a big annual tournament. GW has regularly run tournaments and as well as major tournaments that are done by the developers themselves instead of the 3rd party organizations like the others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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