Everything wrong with a Marauder in ONE thread!

[AcaciaDragon]

Cloak of Pain has 1 min CD and up to 30 sec duration. It's always on when you need, if well timed. Obfuscate can also reduce for a brief moment the damage you receive.

 

 

About the fury its hard to tell. The affects are good IMO, but the duration of Beserk is too low. For Juyo its 6 sure crits and with Ataru you can spam massacre. Don't forget about Frenzy.

 

Cloak of pain is only up if your getting hit, go 5 sec of not getting hit and you lose it. which is easy the way some mobs act and its useless in pvp unless your getting hit from more than 1 person, which typically means your not long for this world as we are so squishy.

 

Berserk is fine. Spammed Massacres are amazing.

[DufterKlopps]

i bet the only thread BW notices is "Whers our Hoods". And they will fix it with Marauder = light armor

[Axcys]

Everything thats wrong with the marauder class in 1 post:

 

 

NOTHING

 

That's cool though if you guys wanna cry till they buff us. Thats gonna be the greatest week of the game for me until they nerf us the following week.

[spne]

Everything wrong with Marauders in ONE WORD:

 

Players.

 

Seriously.

It's you and not the class.

[ShwagATK]

using the first 2 ticks of ravage is the most illogical thing people tend to argue about. why the **** am i gonna just SETTLE for the first 2 ticks instead of getting the entire ability out? you do realize that the third strike on ravage is the hardest hitting skill we have? let alone, what class out there do you know that has a channel that they are fored to use only the first 2 ticks?

 

and if you say full auto or w/e that stupid move is....theyre ranged. L2Position as a ranged.

 

the fact that any aware and decent player will a) run away from a non snare ravage b) interrupt ravage. and the first two ticks from ravage are anything but impressive.

 

just take the channel off, let us front load some burst. if not that, it needs to stun the target or grant CC immunity during the duration. but still the channel should just be taken off.

[Avigatorx]

Add this:

 

- We take far more damage and require far more healing than ranged DPS in hard modes and raids. Therefore we consume more raid healing, which should be directed toward the tanks.

 

- As melee, it is more difficult for us to maintain DPS on a moving target (or mobs with close range AE that requires us to move out of combat), which in effect lowers our overall DPS, where ranged DPS can pew-pew from anywhere on the map requiring little movement and maximizing their DPS.

Edited January 17, 2012 by Avigatorx

[EasymodeX]

check deaths on every single warfront u are..i bet my unborn daughter that u will ALWAYS or mostly find marauders/sentinels there topping the death chart...ofcourse some shine now and then but on the average this class is BROKEN for a easymode game where the map tells u even where to pee!

 

Tbh I like to sort by damage because I like to see my name at the top. Then I mouseover kills as I stroke myself.

 

 

using the first 2 ticks of ravage is the most illogical thing people tend to argue about. why the **** am i gonna just SETTLE for the first 2 ticks instead of getting the entire ability out? you do realize that the third strike on ravage is the hardest hitting skill we have?

 

Pretty sure Rage's omega Smash or a simple Annihilate will take that title. Not counting Pommel/Kick in PvE. Nice try though.

 

 

let alone, what class out there do you know that has a channel that they are fored to use only the first 2 ticks?

 

Pretty much every Sorc that I glare threateningly at.

 

 

the first two ticks from ravage are anything but impressive.

 

Actually, the first two ticks are the same damage as the third. L2count.

[ShwagATK]

 

Pretty sure Rage's omega Smash or a simple Annihilate will take that title. Not counting Pommel/Kick in PvE. Nice try though.

 

 

.

 

 

None of this takes away from what i said. as a carnage pvper, the 1100 and 1200 does not = the 3600 ive seen from my 3rd strikes. so no...try again. in most cases where my 3rd strike of ravage hits above 3k the first two tend to hit around 1200-1500, with the first being the weakest hit.

 

and even....if what you said is true where the first 2 strikes = the 3rd strike why would i not want the third one to hit? stop trying to be counter productive to the class. if all 3 strikes were just tuned into ONE front load burst strike then problem fixed.

 

 

and to say that sorcs ( ANY ranged class with a channel ) are forced to use their channel for the first few ticks...1) theyre guaranteed to channel again right after they cancel it. ravage = 30 sec CD. not sure what the cd is on lightning but im preeeettttyyy sure ive seen them step cast it several times. There is no balance for you, you constantly shoot ideas down and are counter productive to this discussion.

Edited January 17, 2012 by ShwagATK

[EasymodeX]

as a carnage pvper, the 1100 and 1200 does not = the 3600 ive seen from my 3rd strikes. so no...try again. in most cases where my 3rd strike of ravage hits above 3k the first two tend to hit around 1200-1500, with the first being the weakest hit.

 

1. You're most likely mis-remembering the high hits on the third strike because they are so few.

 

2. Your autocrit Scream should be hitting equally as hard.

 

3. Vicious Throw.

 

 

why would i not want the third one to hit? stop trying to be counter productive to the class.

 

It's not a matter of 'wanting' the third one to hit; it's a matter of adapting to the situation.

 

 

if all 3 strikes were just tuned into ONE front load burst strike then problem fixed.

 

New problem introduced: Marauders do too much burst on an anytime ability with no stealth required. Nerf. I would be able to break 10k damage with Ravage if it functioned how you describe. That's really quite unnecessary.

 

 

and to say that sorcs ( ANY ranged class with a channel ) are forced to use their channel for the first few ticks...1) theyre guaranteed to channel again right after they cancel it. ravage = 30 sec CD. not sure what the cd is on lightning but im preeeettttyyy sure ive seen them step cast it several times.

 

You could throw in a Bounty Hunter full auto for comparison if you would like.

 

Or you could consider how over half of a Sniper's DPS requires a cast time, whereas 99% of a Marauder's DPS is instant.

 

Or how a TRACERLOL can be shut down by interrupts, whereas a Marauder is virtually immune to interrupts.

 

 

There is no balance for you, you constantly shoot ideas down and are counter productive to this discussion.

 

I'm shooting down complaints that are generally irrelevant to Marauder class balance. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but 99% of crying about Ravage's channel are put forth by bad players. Bad players like to hang on Ravage because:

 

1. It doesn't cost rage and they're bad at managing rage.

2a. It has a 'BIG HIT' at the end, and the player is weak at actually executing DPS. Thus, they look to a 30s cooldown ability to make a 'BIG HIT'.

2b. Some of these players are spec'd Carnage. Oh hi.

 

Ravage is not a "bread and butter" ability. It is a situational ability used in specific moments for added burst -- "added". In other words, specific burst beyond the normal DPS and burst provided by the Marauder class.

 

If you think any amount of whining about (or fixing of) Ravage's core mechanics (UI/animation bugs aside) will make the Marauder perform any differently, you're a fool.

[SmokeyMcBlunts]

Only thing I agree with is fix ability/animation delay. Other than that marauder is a solid class.

[Friqenstein]

Marauder Class:

It's broken. Plain and simple. Well, some of it is broken. Not all of it.

Yes, I can get top kills in a pvp WZ.. so what? I know how to pick my targets carefully is all. And besides that, top kills != WZ victory, so you cannot use this as an argument as to why the Marauder class is perfect as is. I've gotten top damage and top kills on my lowbie Merc too so how does that factor in?

 

First off, putting Emp's against Emp's is just silly and against the whole 'faction' idea behind pvp to start with and simply dumb... along the lines of Pre-mades going up against PUG'd groups with lowbies. A major oversight in this game as in ALL MMOs to date. Why it was done this way to begin with is beyond most people's comprehension except those in pre-mades who like to faceroll ugly PUGs... but that isn't really Class related. I just had to toss that in there.

Simple fix, if you are grouped, then you automatically enter a 'grouped' queue. Easy enough. There are enough 50's now that this can happen easily and pre-made vs. pre-made is better for pre-mades right?

 

Let's break a few things down...

1) Every Jugg I come across can drop a Force Choke on me and still run around me and attack me while I'm suspended there in air and cannot do anything.. yet my force choke works a minimal % of the time at best and when it does actually work I MUST stand still or else it ends right away. I've seen this happen to my character and others in WZs time and time again.Broken or exploit?

 

2) Ravage a lot of times gets me into some stupid infinite animation loop yet the player is walking away and taking no damage whatsoever. There was no Dodge or Miss text coming off of him when I executed the move so that isn't the answer. Broken or exploit?

 

3) Stun immunity as a Whole: why is it that a Sorc can somehow NOT be slowed by my feated ability to slow him, nor be stopped by my Force Choke when it actually does land (oh ya cuz FC is f'ing broken), nor does he get rooted when I use my feated sabre throw to root him? Broken or exploit?

 

I'm not saying I want a whole bunch of things added to the class. I'm only saying I want what I have to actually work as they should instead of just pissing me off and allowing enemies to simply walk away.

To have a light armored person shrug off damage as though it is nothing is simply ridiculous. I've seen a Sorc getting pummeled by 3 or 4 guys at times and just keeps walking through the fires.

If you have 3 or 4 guys on you, it shouldn't matter what class you have or what sort of buff you are running, that **** should burn you down. Period.

 

4) Stun/root: immunity will eventually make it into this game you can pretty much count on it. It is just simply too ridiculous at present not to warrant it. Which means ALL classes get a stun/root immunity via diminishing returns or whatever system they derive, but it must be implemented.

Turning any pvp oriented content, in any game, into a 'spam your CCs all the time as a group' button isn't pvp nor is it fun. It damn sure doesn't fall into the category of 'skill' either.

 

5) How about our little 4s 'oh ****' cloak skill? If I'm attacking a stealthie person, he blinks out of sight and all of my already in motion attacks simply stop and do no damage to him/her, but when I drop into my qimped stealth form, I'm still taking Merc rapid fire or rockets or force lightning damage. Why? Broken or exploit?

 

There are just way too many issues with the Marauder/Sentinel at this time and you cannot chalk all of it up to L2P or elitist remarks.

No one can deny that Marauder got neglected in more ways than one in this game. Gear for one... Dark Side vendors... or how about how PvP gear allows a Jugg to choose between DPS gear or Tank gear... why? You chose to be a Jugg which is a tank so you should be forced to only use the designated tank gear. You shouldn't get a choice... period.

That totally defeats the whole purpose of having 2 different classes. Why make a person choose between the two and restrict one of them? Yes you can have your DPS talent spec, but you shouldn't get gear to back it up.

Unless I've seriously overlooked some vendors items, which I don't believe I have, this tells me and many of the other community members that there are obvious rethinks needed.

Edited January 21, 2012 by Paralassa
content

[Idiots]

i like how sometimes i hit an ability(even out of combat while standing around) and it takes 2-6 presses to come out.

in combat i hit an ability and my gcd goes off but no ability comes out.

[Axcys]

 

 

 

Ravage is not a "bread and butter" ability. It is a situational ability used in specific moments for added burst -- "added". In other words, specific burst beyond the normal DPS and burst provided by the Marauder class.

 

If you think any amount of whining about (or fixing of) Ravage's core mechanics (UI/animation bugs aside) will make the Marauder perform any differently, you're a fool.

 

This... over and over.

[Friqenstein]

This... over and over.

 

No, many seem to disagree. You can claim all you want, if we specifically Feat into it for the stun ability on it and it doesn't even touch the other player to begin with, they your argument is null & void and you know it.

[DarthBoga]

Marauder Class:

It's broken. Plain and simple. Well, some of it is broken. Not all of it.

Yes, I can get top kills in a pvp WZ.. so what? I know how to pick my targets carefully is all. And besides that, top kills != WZ victory, so you cannot use this as an argument as to why the Marauder class is perfect as is. I've gotten top damage and top kills on my lowbie Merc too so how does that factor in?

 

First off, putting Emp's against Emp's is just silly and against the whole 'faction' idea behind pvp to start with and simply dumb... along the lines of Pre-mades going up against PUG'd groups with lowbies. A major oversight in this game as in ALL MMOs to date. Why it was done this way to begin with is beyond most people's comprehension except those in pre-mades who like to faceroll ugly PUGs... but that isn't really Class related. I just had to toss that in there.

Simple fix, if you are grouped, then you automatically enter a 'grouped' queue. Easy enough. There are enough 50's now that this can happen easily and pre-made vs. pre-made is better for pre-mades right?

no. just because you don't like something doesn't mean it's wrong or bad. empire vs empire is done to make sure you at least can pvp when there's not enough republics. i think we all agree we'd rather play than not play.

 

Let's break a few things down...

1) Every Jugg I come across can drop a Force Choke on me and still run around me and attack me while I'm suspended there in air and cannot do anything.. yet my force choke works a minimal % of the time at best and when it does actually work I MUST stand still or else it ends right away. I've seen this happen to my character and others in WZs time and time again.Broken or exploit?

it's a talent.

and having to stand still is called a channeled skill.

2) Ravage a lot of times gets me into some stupid infinite animation loop yet the player is walking away and taking no damage whatsoever. There was no Dodge or Miss text coming off of him when I executed the move so that isn't the answer. Broken or exploit?

what do you mean, exploit? it's basically a channeled skill that hits right in front of you. obviously you're not hitting someone if they walk away. the animation being bugged is true, or it might just be working as intended.

3) Stun immunity as a Whole: why is it that a Sorc can somehow NOT be slowed by my feated ability to slow him, nor be stopped by my Force Choke when it actually does land (oh ya cuz FC is f'ing broken), nor does he get rooted when I use my feated sabre throw to root him? Broken or exploit?

this is just lies. people have ONE cc break. if you charge and he breaks, you can throw the saber and it WILL root, every time, without fail. never had any problems with this.

I'm not saying I want a whole bunch of things added to the class. I'm only saying I want what I have to actually work as they should instead of just pissing me off and allowing enemies to simply walk away.

To have a light armored person shrug off damage as though it is nothing is simply ridiculous. I've seen a Sorc getting pummeled by 3 or 4 guys at times and just keeps walking through the fires.

If you have 3 or 4 guys on you, it shouldn't matter what class you have or what sort of buff you are running, that **** should burn you down. Period.

surprisingly, with this i wholeheartedly agree. if you are getting focused down, you should be dead. this is probably an issue of 1 lvl 50 vs 4 newbies.

4) Stun/root: immunity will eventually make it into this game you can pretty much count on it. It is just simply too ridiculous at present not to warrant it. Which means ALL classes get a stun/root immunity via diminishing returns or whatever system they derive, but it must be implemented.

Turning any pvp oriented content, in any game, into a 'spam your CCs all the time as a group' button isn't pvp nor is it fun. It damn sure doesn't fall into the category of 'skill' either.

i don't actually see a point you're trying to make here. do you want a game without cc or something?

 

5) How about our little 4s 'oh ****' cloak skill? If I'm attacking a stealthie person, he blinks out of sight and all of my already in motion attacks simply stop and do no damage to him/her, but when I drop into my qimped stealth form, I'm still taking Merc rapid fire or rockets or force lightning damage. Why? Broken or exploit?

this is pretty logical. those people just walk away from you as soon as they combat stealth, and you won't be able to hit them with instants anymore. if a channeled skill is on you, it's entirely possible it will continue doing damage.

 

There are just way too many issues with the Marauder/Sentinel at this time and you cannot chalk all of it up to L2P or elitist remarks.

No one can deny that Marauder got neglected in more ways than one in this game. Gear for one... Dark Side vendors... or how about how PvP gear allows a Jugg to choose between DPS gear or Tank gear... why? You chose to be a Jugg which is a tank so you should be forced to only use the designated tank gear. You shouldn't get a choice... period.

That totally defeats the whole purpose of having 2 different classes. Why make a person choose between the two and restrict one of them? Yes you can have your DPS talent spec, but you shouldn't get gear to back it up.

Unless I've seriously overlooked some vendors items, which I don't believe I have, this tells me and many of the other community members that there are obvious rethinks needed.

just because you choose a class that can only be one role, all the other classes should be restricted to one role? juggernaut has 2 DPS specs for your information. you actually think a healer merc and DPS merc should have the same gear? a tankasin and deception sin?

Edited January 21, 2012 by Paralassa
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[FeeFiFoFum]

Dont worry, many of our issues are fixed as of this patch, see how many times the Marauder was mentioned...?

[DarthBoga]

Dont worry, many of our issues are fixed as of this patch, see how many times the Marauder was mentioned...?

 

not once...

[EasymodeX]

No, many seem to disagree. You can claim all you want, if we specifically Feat into it for the stun ability on it and it doesn't even touch the other player to begin with, they your argument is null & void and you know it.

 

This is not an issue with the power of Ravage. This is a client-server synchronization issue that affects ALL abilities that have a range limit on them with a channel. Your client thinks they are in range and uses the ability. The server disagrees on the rangecheck and invalidates your ability ... but you do not regain the cooldown that you spent. (a) their netcode is slow. (b) it is illogical and erroneously sets abilities on cooldown.

 

So the bottom line: many are *********** idiots and don't even know why they're crying. They're like newborn babies and cry because that's the only way they know how to communicate.

 

This doesn't make Ravage underpowered. It doesn't mean that Ravage needs more damage. It doesn't mean that Ravage needs to be frontloaded, or usable on the move. None of those changes fix the actual problem: BioWare client-server synchronization sucks dick.

[excaliburhc]

bump - think this needs to stay on front page

[gibmachine]

Regarding Smash

 

It really has to deal damage on button press rather than when animation ends. Currently it's either you predict where your target will be running or you can forget seeing that awesome numbers.

[Precurso]

There's a workaround for all these issues.

 

- Get pocket healer

- Get pocket stunner (Op/sorc/sin etc)

- Spec to Rage

- Have your stunner stun

- jump in and smash

- Take screenshots

- ???

- Profit!!!

 

 

oh, and check out my leet streaming videos

[Spiderbubble]

So I re-specced into Carnage to give it another shot:

 

 

Frankly, the double snares from Vicious Throw and Ravage are very nice for PvP. In PvE, I like Carnage way more than Rage.

 

I still have trouble with Ravage EVEN THOUGH it should be a snare. Why does it only snare something once it's already beyond Ravage's original range? Why did it break in Hutt Ball when the opponent glitched past a ledge and fell (about 2 seconds into the Ravage, thus missing the third hit). I still see Ravage glitching out beyond belief, and for it being such a nice ability in all other aspects (at least for Carnage), I really wish it wasn't so bugged.

 

The same happens with Choke, under similar circumstances.

 

 

After reading a bit more, and getting more experience in PvP/PvE, I will admit: I was a bit harsh on this class. It's not entirely useless. But I stand by the fact that it still has issues. If nothing else, the bugs entirely wreck a Marauder's already fragile combos.

[Doroes]

Another problem I've found is that Force charge can sometimes dc you from a warzone by throwing you off the map. Smash is interrupted easily since you leap and then any range can do it's knockback. I've also found that Unleash now sometimes requires a Line of sight to the person you are targeting. Not helpful in huttball when you have the ball.

 

Note that force charge and the unleash issue aren't 100% of the time just things I've noticed.

[REiiGN]

I realized other classes can't do **** against us 1v1. We had a tournament of duels in our guild between level 50s and I did pretty well. As Rage even over carnage marauder. Other classes get extremely screwed over when they don't have the buffs of others. You're health while fighting will go down but keep ripping that damage and time your CDs right. While smash is our biggest asset, its great at destroying personal shields. You destroy that...others turn squishy. Plus, other classes are in the same boat as far as CDs. No stun in this game matters if you don't capitalize on it and when people fight us, they freak out due to their health going down real fast they forget their timers. Plus, fights are extremely fast for us unless you fight an operative which are super *******.

[Grader]

Focus on real bugs

 

Bleedout not working

 

Council event in EV locks you out if you use your berserk skill. It should just lock out the group heal portion imo.

 

Smash Stutter

 

etc etc