Why Sorcs need a nerf

[Pwnzie]

Your problem is Bioware's crap coding - or - their crap thought processes. Your armor is not mitigating anything a Sorc or Sage sends your way.

 

And I mean anything.

 

lolwut

[Krayzietwo]

There are two ACs in SWTOR that in my opinion are blatantly OP; Operatives in terms of burst, and Sorcs in terms of utility combined with damage. More so the latter one. Sorcs got way too much utility, especially when they produce numbers similar/exceeding the other classes.

 

To sum it up:

- Ranged

- Sprint

- Knockback

- Instant cast long duration CC

- Great AoE damage

- Snare

- Mostly instant cast dmg abilities, if specced "right"

- A shield working post-mitigation, with a short CD

- Great burst

- Rescue

- Heals

 

This class needs to be toned down. My suggestions for how to do this is either increase the CD timer on several of their abilities (Static Barrier and Sprint especially), or reduce their overall damage output. A single class should not ever excel at every single aspect of a game.

 

Am I on crack, or am I actually on to something here?

 

Sorcs dont need a nerf, you need to stop failing.

[SurgeonFish]

All of this wouldn't be that bad if it wasn't for huttball. In huttball they dont need to deal damage, they can just cc, bubble, sprint, and win. Its kinda a pain in the ***, in voidstar and civil war they arnt nearly as bad.

[Bullsith]

that is something you wish, and its good that its not developed like this.

 

and if you read further on, i corrected myself, that i meant i am normally able to heal out the damage of 2.

 

and this does make sense, 2 enemies on one of us and me healing means 2 ppl on both side busy.

 

the rest has been said alot by many people, but i dont expect everyone to understand it.

 

Oh good, so you agree that force speed is not neccesary.

[Sinuouss]

Oh good, so you agree that force speed is not neccesary.

 

It is necessary. As a healer, it is one of my main defensive tools. i have the right to be able to flee people who force leap on me using a cooldown. I shouldn't just have to sit there and take it once someone gets on me every single time. Maybe it needs a longer cd, but sorcs would be garbage without it.

 

If other classes can leap, stealth, or pull people toward them. Juggernaut can leap to both friendlies and enemies. They are the most op class in huttball.

 

Furthermore classes have annoying abilities. Yes I'm sure i have frustrated many people sprinting out of los and healing myself to full, but I've been frustrated by being pulled into a fire, or knocked away from the goal, or aoe stunned for what seems like 15 seconds.

 

Warzones are a team effort. Sorcs are not OP. I feel pvp is pretty balanced actually.

 

And sorc isn't even the most powerful pvp class. They are definitely the best huttball healer, but operatives are better for voidstar.

[Qlimitus]

Originally Posted by Lastboss

There are two ACs in SWTOR that in my opinion are blatantly OP; Operatives in terms of burst, and Sorcs in terms of utility combined with damage. More so the latter one. Sorcs got way too much utility, especially when they produce numbers similar/exceeding the other classes.

 

To sum it up:

- Ranged

- Sprint

- Knockback

- Instant cast long duration CC

- Great AoE damage

- Snare

- Mostly instant cast dmg abilities, if specced "right"

- A shield working post-mitigation, with a short CD

- Great burst

- Rescue

- Heals

 

This class needs to be toned down. My suggestions for how to do this is either increase the CD timer on several of their abilities (Static Barrier and Sprint especially), or reduce their overall damage output. A single class should not ever excel at every single aspect of a game.

 

Am I on crack, or am I actually on to something here?

 

 

You really have no clue on how a sorc works.L2P against them ? This thread is a whine because you haven't figured out how to take one down,and have started to cry about it.

[Vealage]

It's still 20 seconds. And it draining Force armor is not really a valid argument, in the sense that you probably will not spam it on allies, but you can still apply it to YOURSELF every 20 sec. And if you need to apply it to a teammate to win the fight, you got the choice to do so. Utility.

 

I didn't say it drained Force armor I said Force Armor drained Force. Until someone displays to me the exact amount of damage Force Armor (and the spec that increases its absorb by 20%) anything you say is meaningless and anything I say is meaningless. And yea, I can apply it to myself every 20 sec. If you can't kill me in 20 sec, then you're really bad. Especially if you are on a team. Personally, I apply it to my teammates all the time, especially if the enemies aren't looking at me.

 

Yes you can. I'm a Sniper, and my guildmate who I duel every now and then is specced for instant casts. It's a DPS-race on eachother, and we win and lose 50/50 of the times. So you must be doing something wrong if you can not produce DPS in similar fashion. Oh yeah.. And as a Sniper, I do not have heals, pulls, shields or sprint. Do you think they should buff Snipers with tons of damage then, to make up for the loss of utility?

 

The instant casts are all DoTs. After the DoTs are applied, he must be channeling his Lightning skill, then when it procs he can insta cast his regular lightning strike. Or a DoT. DoTs are NOT BURST. They are two seperate things. You're even worse than I previously mentioned if I had to tell you that.

 

Why I want to kill you and not let you escape with 10%-20% HP? Because you usually have a healer around that can heal you up to full health in a matter of seconds, before you reenter the fight.

 

If my team's healer is spending time healing me, then they can't be healing someone else at the exact same time. 12k health is not easy to heal unless you take about 5 secs to focus, and even then it won't be completely healed. If you aren't targeting my team's healer then you are doing it wrong. If my team's healer runs after me to heal me, then he is doing it wrong too.

 

No, your CC isn't that bad, but that wasn't the point either. It's the fact that you also got a shield, and a sprint, and a pull.. Sigh..

 

Pull is for friendlies only. Shield needs 20s to recharge, so if you can't deal enough damage in 20s then I feel sorry for you. Sprint is 2s long, and you can always CC me while I am doing it, as long as the CC isn't a slow.

 

 

The fact that you sent me a PM just so you could get me to reply to this is stupid. You don't have a Sorc or a Sage. I do.

 

Are you mad that you are a Sniper and do less damage than I do? Is that what this whole thread is about??

 

If you're a sniper, then I understand why you think we are overpowered. You are underpowered. At least, on my 33 Sniper I have noticed that.

 

Thank you for the PM alerting me to come respond to you, but I really am not going to reply to this thread anymore. You have your thoughts, and I have mine. I have made my case, thank you for the debate.

[fungihoujo]

There are two ACs in SWTOR that in my opinion are blatantly OP; Operatives in terms of burst, and Sorcs in terms of utility combined with damage. More so the latter one. Sorcs got way too much utility, especially when they produce numbers similar/exceeding the other classes.

 

To sum it up:

- Ranged

- Sprint

- Knockback

- Instant cast long duration CC

- Great AoE damage

- Snare

- Mostly instant cast dmg abilities, if specced "right"

- A shield working post-mitigation, with a short CD

- Great burst

- Rescue

- Heals

 

This class needs to be toned down. My suggestions for how to do this is either increase the CD timer on several of their abilities (Static Barrier and Sprint especially), or reduce their overall damage output. A single class should not ever excel at every single aspect of a game.

 

Am I on crack, or am I actually on to something here?

 

According to this guy I am now specced in all three of my trees at once- goodness, no wonder sorcs are so OP!

 

Easy fix, let other classes spec in all their trees at once.

 

 

But fine, increase sprint CD to a minute- also, increase force leap for SW/JK to one minute and make that their only ability that gets them somewhere. While we're there, give SI heavy armour to make up for a poorer defensive ability, and make all defensive abilities for other classes be on higher CDs than they are.

 

You're on crack- a heal specced SI won't excel at damage- and a damage specced SI has a choice between a very weak 1.5 second heal or a stronger 3 second heal which you will never get off in pvp- should note, the stronger heal in WZ heals about a quarter of my health on a crit- in three seconds, most burst classes can do around 10k damage on expertise geared people.

 

Madness has pretty weak burst- relies entirely on dots and channeled abilities, the CC is instant WW, a snare with our final talent dot (short snare), force slow on a 12 second CD and the same stun and interrupt everyone seems to have. Then, a very short range aoe knockback and doesn't knockback very far- good for CC, but, remember, we're also the 'mage' class, we're very fragile so shields and CC are our survival mechanism.

 

Other classes have plenty to work with too- Ops can destroy out of stealth, Troopers have very high armour and can easily heal while taking a beating, they also have high damage even in tank spec and their tanking abilities can make allies unkillable. JK are amazing at staying on a target- have excellent mobility with their jumps, and unlike other classes ramp up rather than locking out in a long fight- Sorcs run OOF, troopers build up too much heat, and smugglers lose their energy after a while- JK though never stop building up focus for their attacks while in combat.

 

All in all, each class has some things they've very good at- which is how balance works. Nobody needs a nerf- and anything that might 'need' a nerf, should get a counter buff in an area that it's weaker at (ie- if you nerf scoundrel burst from stealth, buff their mobility or survivability while not stealthed in return to make up for their weakness- similar for SI, though I think anyone is out of their mind if they can't understand sorcs are the squishiest class in the game)

 

 

Finally, shields from sage/sorc can go on other players- don't complain because your sage friend is only shielding himself, that's someone playing bad, pure and simple.

[Mcskeet]

I love how all these idiots thinks CLOTH wearing DPS'ERS should have 12k health, no shield, no heals, and no sprint.

 

Ok fine, let us have all their dps skills, but put them in heavy armor with 20k hp, and let us jump at people.

 

 

Seems like your going to cry again, so lets re-nerf the sorc.

 

 

Put them in light armor, take away force speed, but reduce the cooldown on the shield ( Which having tested thoroughly, shields 4k damage at level 50, 5k with the 20% bonus talent, and 10k if you have the talent AND a juggernaut guarding you. ) .

 

 

Ok so that was a more subtle tweak instead of a nerf, but it just changed the game. Without force speed, we no longer have the advantage of getting to the huttball first ( which isn't really an advantage, because we have 12k health and light armor. )

 

Let's face it, any class up against the Sorc is going to kill it, unless they just have no clue as to how to play their class. LOS / Heal / Shield / LOS / Kite tactic is useless. If you are dps spec, and have adequate gear, go after the sorc... if not. DON'T. Run the hell away and stop picking fights with geared sorcs. If you can't manage to dps down 15k health before they have a chance to run away and heal and re-shield, you shouldn't be fighting them.

 

This would be the same if I ( as a sorc ) got ganked by an operative, and cried because I couldnt kill him. DUH PEOPLE, operatives are meant to kill us. My strategy, CC and run away. If your standing toe to toe against a sorc and your outmatched, that is it... simply. Get better gear, and then go toe to toe with them, and after you learn to play, I promise you will beat them 9/10 times 1v1. if it's 2v1, well then you can't even complain about the class.

Edited January 21, 2012 by Paralassa
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[Sathid]

Bubble,Absorb,Absorb,heal,stun,Lightning,lightning,heal,stun,,,did i miss anything?

 

All hail the immortal Sorc's.

[Venilator]

It always gets me when someone speaks it - why the hell shield needs to be toned down? Its only 3k damage if talented and its team ability.

 

People complain "killing sorc with a shield", they dont complain about "when both teams have shields on all people".

 

 

 

The reason they don't is due to them all doing nothing but PuG PvP. Puggers always complain about anything that they have difficulty killing

 

The greatest example of a nerfed due to Pugs was LoL's Mordekaiser. He was awesome in Pugs but organized and tourney play never saw him used because well... he wasn't that great. Thing was in a PuG he could reach godmode (all champions in that game can reach godmode if allowed to farm) because his specialty was slaughtering minions, dominating/pushing lanes, and being insanely good in 1v1s. . When you have a character like that on the opposing team your team is supposed to shut him down. Kill him a few times and he is affectively useless.

 

Well Puggers since they are unorganized and do not understand any form of tactics then "I should get to kill whatever I hit" started to cry nerf because Mordekaiser dominates Pugs with ease. So you have myriad of puggers crying nerf and then you have the organized RANKED Teams saying that that the player base has no idea what they are talking about and that there is a reason Mordekaiser is the least players character in Ranked matches. Its because he is so easy to counter via kiting (he has no CC), via lane denial, and just ganking him early in the game will shut him down mid and late game...

 

LoL listened to the Puggers and nerfed him and he went from the least played Character in Ranked and moderately played in Pugs to no one even plays him anymore.

 

 

Basically what i am saying is Pug players have no idea what they are complaining about. They whine because they think their characters are supposed to 1 man entire teams and get upset with their vision of their Heroic Character gets stomped or denied by someone elses character.

 

The only Valid complaints right now is burst damage is WAY to high compared to player HP since certain classes can crit between 20 to 45% of a characters HP.

Edited January 21, 2012 by Paralassa
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[aranha]

Bubble,Absorb,Absorb,heal,stun,Lightning,lightning,heal,stun,,,did i miss anything?

 

All hail the immortal Sorc's.

 

^ True story!

[Aidank]

Wait what? Since when do sorcerers have burst?

[Jabbb]

Poor gear Sorcs are squishy as hell, but when you start seeing Valor rank 50+ Sorcs with Champion/Battlemaster gear you begin to see a massive improvement in there survivability.

 

This, sorc are OP, in max gear. OP compared to other max gear classes. Why? *********** bubble. Bubble is after mitigation and on a 20 second cooldown as you get more gear fights last longer and damage goes down relative to health pools. 3 bubbles in a fight is a ton of extra life to grind through.

[Sathid]

This, sorc are OP, in max gear. OP compared to other max gear classes. Why? *********** bubble. Bubble is after mitigation and on a 20 second cooldown as you get more gear fights last longer and damage goes down relative to health pools. 3 bubbles in a fight is a ton of extra life to grind through.

 

Thats why i call them the Immortal Sorc's,,I cant wait til the lvl 50 only bracket comes because it will be so obviuos that no one can deny what they see.