Hey gabe, thank you for all the pvp stun!

[Nightsorrow]

The less CC a game has the better. CC is an effective, but also quite pathetic way to add "depth" to a PvP scenario. Losing control of your character is never fun, and should be kept to an absolute minimum. They are also hard to balance, since you always need to factor in how much damage or healing someone can recive during a stun.

 

And a game with these typs of CC's often devolve into being all about them, meaning, any class with no or little CC's become worthless, and a team of only heavy CC classes rips through anything.

[Kalaesk]

Some classes have multiple stuns and snares. Also, resolve doesn't kick in quickly enough to be of any benefit.

 

But I agree with the OP. I don't feel like I'm being stunned or snared enough in PvP, nor do I believe the Jedi Knight and Sith Warrior knockbacks send my flying nearly far enough to be enjoyable. Please improve these as well. Nothing is more fun than not being able to control my character or being moved as far as possible from my objective.

 

Force Push/Concussion Round that send you flying through the air with the greatest of ease.

[rufix]

Everyone has a stun

That's called balance

If you're getting stunned by a train of 2+ people, that's your team's fault. They would kill you regardless, because of numbers

 

lol u kidding right

[Spigotwelder]

if you would compare that stun to say the one that consular/inqs have then you would see that a sentinel/marauder doesnt have a real stun besides Awe wich also breaks on damage.

 

its a 3 second channeled stun wich means during that time we cant do a thing to them cause that damage itself isnt really that great.

 

good thing you have a team

 

actually i imagine it's hard to find groups when you can't see the benefit of having a stun you previously didn't even know you had

[Dakan]

yes lets just stand next to each other and mash our nuke keybinds until someone dies and then move off to another target. That would make pvp so much more enjoyable.

 

On a more serious note, l2p.

 

^^ +1,000,000,000,000,000,000

[Dravinian]

This. A million times.

 

 

but but but ....it would be balanced, we would all have nuke buttons!!!

 

Odd that you can understand it from him, but not when I made the same point to you, perhaps because you feel he is making that point in support of your argument where I made the same point to counter your argument?

 

Adding stuns doesn't take away from the mashing the "nuke" button, other than to stop the other player mashing theirs why you mash yours.

 

There is little in the way of counters in this game.

[Spigotwelder]

remove gear there's no counter to people with better gear than me

[Spigotwelder]

remove xp there's no counter to people with more xp than me

[Dravinian]

There is, it is called skill.

 

Of course with two players of equal skill the one with the better gear will probably win 9 times out of 10, they will have more HP, hit slightly harder, take slightly less damage.

 

I think people accept that in an MMORPG.

 

The complaint about the bolster system is putting people who are vastly different together, it is one thing to lose to someone who is level 50 when you are level 50, and the other guy has better equipment, because you had a chance, if you were better skilled you might have won.

 

It is a different thing to put a level 26 against a level 50 and expect any outcome that doesn't involve the level 26 losing 95% of the time. Even a better skilled player will struggle in that situation because the difference is so vast.

 

That has nothing to do with this thread though.

[BubblegumYeti]

Any form of CC should NOT be a part of any PvP game. One of the holy rules of game design is NOT to take away control from the player.

 

I understand they want cc in PvE, but they should just change it to damage reduction abilities in PvP (like the taunt for tanks). The only cc that might be allowed is a slowdown.

[CupieFoxtail]

but but but ....it would be balanced, we would all have nuke buttons!!!

 

Odd that you can understand it from him, but not when I made the same point to you, perhaps because you feel he is making that point in support of your argument where I made the same point to counter your argument?

 

Adding stuns doesn't take away from the mashing the "nuke" button, other than to stop the other player mashing theirs why you mash yours.

 

There is little in the way of counters in this game.

 

Another straw man argument, deja vu.

A nuke button would kill everyone.

A stun button will not kill you, because tah dah, you get out in 4 seconds

You won't die in four seconds, or else there are larger problems at play than a stun

If you get stunned twice, for 8 seconds, you should have a teammate nearby peeling, healing, guarding, stunning, or something to that affect, so that you will not die

If you get stunned by one guy for 4 seconds

You get out, and you get to stun him right back for four seconds, making that damage back

That's called "balance"

[CupieFoxtail]

Any form of CC should NOT be a part of any PvP game. One of the holy rules of game design is NOT to take away control from the player.

 

Disagree, go check out Rift PvP

It's 100% coordination free, effectively just spamming a PvE rotation on player targets

Massive DR's on all forms of stun, CC, knockback, snare, slow, anything.

Edited January 15, 2012 by CupieFoxtail

[Dravinian]

I don't think you understand what a strawman argument is.

 

Please detail where in my post I have created a strawman argument.

[Alpha-Crookers]

Scoundrels need knockbacks while you're at it.

 

Damn /signed !

[Nightsorrow]

Any form of CC should NOT be a part of any PvP game. One of the holy rules of game design is NOT to take away control from the player.

 

I agree. It is one of the holy/golden rules. However, I would accept them to break/bend it a bit, but I feel that it is way to much in this game, to heavily reliant on it.

[Dravinian]

Disagree, go check out Rift PvP

It's 100% coordination free, effectively just spamming a PvE rotation on player targets

Massive DR's on all forms of stun, CC, knockback, snare, slow, anything.

 

I don't think this is true, there is DR on those abilities, but it is hardly just a PvE rotation on player targets.

 

In PvE CC is rarely used, it is easier to have an Off-Tank than it is to CC a target.

 

In PvP CC is used sparingly, when it is required and when you can get the most out of it.

 

Also stuns are quite rare, you have fears, you have squirrels (a kinda mez) and lots of snares, but not really many stuns.

 

You also, for many classes, have several ways to break those, even though there aren't that many. I think on one of my build I have 6 ways to break CC. I am pretty much un-CCable.

 

So less stuns, more ways to break it, and this equals to boredom for you?

 

It equates for me a more interesting PvP experience, I get to fight against people and not just get killed while CC'd.

[Nightsorrow]

I don't think this is true, there is DR on those abilities, but it is hardly just a PvE rotation on player targets.

 

In PvE CC is rarely used, it is easier to have an Off-Tank than it is to CC a target.

 

In PvP CC is used sparingly, when it is required and when you can get the most out of it.

 

Also stuns are quite rare, you have fears, you have squirrels (a kinda mez) and lots of snares, but not really many stuns.

 

You also, for many classes, have several ways to break those, even though there aren't that many. I think on one of my build I have 6 ways to break CC. I am pretty much un-CCable.

 

So less stuns, more ways to break it, and this equals to boredom for you?

 

It equates for me a more interesting PvP experience, I get to fight against people and not just get killed while CC'd.

 

I agree here. The less CC, the better. Some might be needed to add "depth" in a lazy way to a PvP scenario, but as it stands, and as it often stands in MMO's: More CC = Better Class. Or rather; More CC that allows damage without breaking = Better Class.

 

Keep CC to a minimum, if for no other reason then, "It's simply not fun to not be able to control your character, for any reason."

[Lashkor]

Sentinels do have a stun, called Force Stasis*. Learn how to play your own class. Holy God, no wonder there's so many bad players in this game that cry. They don't even know their own classes.

 

 

EDIT: Guess someone beat me to it.

 

4 Second channeled ability =/= Stun.

 

It equals a 4 second channeled disable.

 

L2PvP kthxbai.

[Seksi]

If you think balanced combat isn't the epitome of fun in PvP... please quit video games

 

So balance above all else makes pvp fun eh? I guess you are entitled to that opinion.....as illogical as it is. Personally I put being in control of my toon the majority of the time pretty high on that list.....and being chain stunned till death pretty far down at the bottom.

 

Like someone said, if we could all one shot each other or only did 1 point of damage per hit to each other that would be balanced too, doesn't mean it would be fun.

[Seksi]

I don't think this is true, there is DR on those abilities, but it is hardly just a PvE rotation on player targets.

 

In PvE CC is rarely used, it is easier to have an Off-Tank than it is to CC a target.

 

In PvP CC is used sparingly, when it is required and when you can get the most out of it.

 

Also stuns are quite rare, you have fears, you have squirrels (a kinda mez) and lots of snares, but not really many stuns.

 

You also, for many classes, have several ways to break those, even though there aren't that many. I think on one of my build I have 6 ways to break CC. I am pretty much un-CCable.

 

So less stuns, more ways to break it, and this equals to boredom for you?

 

It equates for me a more interesting PvP experience, I get to fight against people and not just get killed while CC'd.

 

I agree, I though Rift pvp was bad until I played this game. This is the absolute worst pvp in an MMO that I have seen in my life. I am going back to UO here....seriously.

[Seksi]

4 Second channeled ability =/= Stun.

 

It equals a 4 second channeled disable.

 

L2PvP kthxbai.

 

LOOK!!! It's l2p guy!!! I've seen you like.......a gazillion times, you must be famous! Or unoriginal........

[Repefe]

I agree. It is one of the holy/golden rules. However, I would accept them to break/bend it a bit, but I feel that it is way to much in this game, to heavily reliant on it.

 

First time I hear about it ... secret holy rule ?

[Razot]

Yes more stuns!

[Nightsorrow]

First time I hear about it ... secret holy rule ?

 

Not really secret. It's been mentioned countless times "dont take control away from the player". It's one of the reason why a game with a lot of choices should not really on cutscenes to tell the story, since a player has no control in them.

 

A player should be in control of his/hers characters actions as close to a 100% of the time you can get.

[Repefe]

Not really secret. It's been mentioned countless times "dont take control away from the player". It's one of the reason why a game with a lot of choices should not really on cutscenes to tell the story, since a player has no control in them.

 

A player should be in control of his/hers characters actions as close to a 100% of the time you can get.

 

And did any MMO actually follow that rule ? I don't remember any.