Bioware's unshaken confidence is troubling

[DevonDs]

For me their confidence helps ease my fears that they will move away from the vision that has created a game I really love to play.

 

I hope they continue to follow their vision and can deal with the unsubscribe of the sandboxers the pvp only players and the elite hardcore raid folks. Finally here is a game for a fourth group that focuses onnarritive and story.

 

Sandbox games, pvp games, games for the elite hardcore raiders are not bad.....this game is perfect for me and I hope it stays that way and that the others can find their grinding or crafting or world exploring or pvp, or add on and macro fed raiding game that works as eell for them as this game does for me.

[SwigMcJigger]

There are issues, but they're not "glaring".

 

They ARE working on fixes, however. Just give it some time.

 

 

I'm just wondering how they are going to fix things that don't even exist.

 

Things like addons, macroes, custom UI and dual spec?

 

 

 

I just read where someone compared it to the movie Titanic.

 

I haven't seen Titanic but I imagine it has a fantastic story, great acting, sets, music etc

 

So would Titanic be considered a great movie if even one of those elements was severely lacking or even missing? Like they didn't CGI the ship but just used a cardboard box with the word "Titanic" written on the side with a crayon?

 

 

Brilliant.

[Blue-Reckloose]

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=1275271#edit1275271

 

One instance of humility and listening to the community in addressing the #1 most requested issue among many found on:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/devtracker.php

 

Biased OP is biased. Next?

 

Ah, fanbois, so not helpful.

 

There are a multitude of instances where players have legitimate gripes, and Bioware sticks their nose in the air and declares themselves smarter than anyone.

 

For instance, PC models of certain species have MASSIVE clipping issues. There are miraluka who's masks clip through hoods, dissappearing/reappearing lekku, and little floaty hair things that do odd things in gameplay and cutscenes. And Bioware's response to this? "Nobody really wants to change their character, thats for games that have been out for awhile and only top level might want to". Really? Like nobody might want to alter their appearance to deal with clipping issues?

 

Or the high res textures. Bioware said it's a bug. Then they said it's a feature. Then instead of fixing it, they gave some PR spin about how they know more about our computers than we do. That's really arrogant and condescending.

 

Or how about the lack of a bug report feature? Ever tried to bug something? I tried to bug that the triggers for quests are wonky (if you travel in someone else's ship to the next planet, your quest will not trigger, and you have to go somewhere else in your ship and come back). Bioware's response? "Try resetting your graphics options and reinstall your game!" What the Force kinda response is that? I tell you the server side triggers are gorked, you tell me to reinstall? Are they even keeping these tickets?

 

Oh, and they pulled out the Derek Smart response to several questions, they oh so infamous "works as intended".

 

It seems as though they're making the appearance of listening, but only for things like exploits. Whenever there are major gripes, they just pretend everything is dandy, and they pretend that they know everything, and the players know nothing.

 

I'm not saying they aren't fixing some things, but the devs, community managers and tech support clearly need a major attitude adjustment.

[tindin]

Here's the deal: I want SWTOR to survive and flourish. I really like the game overall. However, there are GLARING issues with this game (I'm not going to rehash them here...no point in repeating it) and yet Bioware seems to be blissfully (blindly?) boastful of their game. I get how PR works, blah, blah (so don't attempt to give me a lesson), but I have seen ZERO humility on Bioware's part that indicates that they have heard their customers. Look at Trion. Whether you like Rift or not (I found it to be rather bland myself) that is a company working its a*s off for your $15 a month. They have approached the community with humility and open ears, and it has paid off. Meanwhile, Bioware is too busy spinning the hype machine and patting itself on the back to approach the community's concerns humbly and comprehensively.

 

Please know that I am writing this post as a fan of the game (and Bioware) and I really want the game to succeed. In my life, I have never seen an individual or entity succeed in the long term by avoiding self-reflection and constructive criticism.....ever.

 

huh?? so all the ppl complaining about all the patch down time....or all the things they have fixed are what?

 

you need to remember that something take time and work to fix. and unless you are one of the ppl working on it you have no clue if they are or are not busy at it. and coming here trying to be all fancy about saying there not doing anything doesn't make your point any better.

[Asuka]

Nope, no glaring issues that I can see either. So how many posts are you going to write today saying exactly the same thing? I'm curious.

 

This^

[Aisar]

time spent doesn't = pro

 

have played many different mmos. muds, FPS and other games. Swtor launch is perfectly fine.

 

yes there are some issues. class balance. graphics glitches, UI fail and under-developed ideas (ie legacy)

 

but if you're such a pro. and vetran of mmos. you should have the intelligence to know that the game is less than a month old.

 

the saying. never play the month after patch day was coined in games with monthly updates where the game was borked nearly all month.

 

every mmo launches with bugs, glitches. imbalances. and a wild ride of exploits, glaring imbalance and gimmicky builds.

 

that's why first 6 mo is paid beta.

 

not everyone is a fanboi. and no one speaks for everyone.

 

only sith deal in absolutes.

 

 

 

people honestly just need to **** and chill out for awhile. if you think the devs don't know something...submit a ticket. if you think they're not working on things. you're a fool. if you say they don't respond. you're a liar and a fool.

 

if you say... they're level of X isn't up to my standards ...i don't like that. sure fine... that's an opinion. perfectly fine.

 

but people sling slop like it's passed down from on high. it's really getting pathetic on these boards.

 

The only purpose of my post was to shed some light. I respect your opinion and I am glad you shared it.

[PjPablo]

I don't know if it's confidence that bothers me, but they have mishandled a few things and do have some big issues to solve. Texture problem, Ability Delay, and FPS issues to name three. I am bothered by the way they have handled the textures issue. It's not so hard to come out and say 'We screwed up. We should have been more forthright in beta that high res textures would not be available at launch due to performance issues.' That would have deflected a large part of the outcry you now see on this board and other gaming sites regarding the texture issue. Also, when you have someone come out and say '95% of players have no performance issues' and follow it up a second later with 'I don't know the exact percentage' it's disingenuous.

 

Both those examples impact trust in the developer and that lack of trust can have a big issue in a genre when you have to constantly say "We are working on it."

Edited January 13, 2012 by PjPablo

[Keeheen]

Don't let the fanboys get to you OP, some people just can't tolerate any criticism.

[gtmach]

I don't mind criticism to the game but I get irritated with the presumption that BW or EA is crap because the issues haven't been fixed in 2 sec. That along with the automatic assumption that the companies hate their playerbase....makes no sense.

 

Plus when they act like this is the 1 company or set of companies in the world that will give these issues. All other MMO devs are angelic all of a sudden.

[Muzan-E]

I think we can all agree, though, that PR will have to work a lot harder if they want to reach the pinnacles of, say, SWG's customer service.

[Azzras]

Here's the deal: I want SWTOR to survive and flourish. I really like the game overall. However, there are GLARING issues with this game (I'm not going to rehash them here...no point in repeating it) and yet Bioware seems to be blissfully (blindly?) boastful of their game. I get how PR works, blah, blah (so don't attempt to give me a lesson), but I have seen ZERO humility on Bioware's part that indicates that they have heard their customers. Look at Trion. Whether you like Rift or not (I found it to be rather bland myself) that is a company working its a*s off for your $15 a month. They have approached the community with humility and open ears, and it has paid off. Meanwhile, Bioware is too busy spinning the hype machine and patting itself on the back to approach the community's concerns humbly and comprehensively.

 

Please know that I am writing this post as a fan of the game (and Bioware) and I really want the game to succeed. In my life, I have never seen an individual or entity succeed in the long term by avoiding self-reflection and constructive criticism.....ever.

 

Check the upcoming patch notes.

 

They are listening and fixing a ton of issues.

[Calimwulf]

I've seen more issues in this game than in most and I've been mmo gaming for almost 10 years now. So white knight, how many hours are you gonna roam the forums today looking to troll anyone that says anything at all that is even somewhat negative about this game? I'm just curious.

Slow day at work, that being said, I have absolutely no problem with someone that expresses a negative opinion.

 

What I personally have a problem with is someone that makes a post such as yours that 'generically' says glaring issues. Since I do not have 'glaring' issues. then I am going to respond. You also took the time to single my post out.

 

If Bioware were messing up by the numbers, I'd unsub and go away. Since I don't believe they are, then I will respond and say that.

 

I wouldn't stand idly by while someone hurls and screams insults at someone else in real life, whether I agree with that person or not. That is wrong. It is just as wrong to stand by and not post when someone, in my estimation is trying to troll, but coaching it in a 'polite' way. That is who I am and how I live my life.

[Yemmer]

Sadly, it wont matter for me, Bioware has gone leaps and bounds fixing things, Kudos to them, remember folks, every MMO has major bugs on release, WoW was far far worse then this for over a year, For me however it's not enough, Not that i am dissatisfied with bioware, but as soon as the 30 day free sub runs dry, i'll not be renewing, I refuse to support any game with the EA stamp on it, the scumsuckers have destroyed every game they have put their fingers in, or have gotten lazy and stop supporting them as soon as the mass-sales on release end, As awsome as this game is so far, i do not see 30 million worth in content, not even remotely close, and as EA has a hand in it, sorry to say, so far as i can see, it has no real future worth paying for so long as EA has any say in anything.

[Taurusaud]

WoW was far far worse then this for over a year

 

That's such a total lie.

 

 

WoW had a responsive UI working right out the door. It's 7 years later and SwTOR can't even get THAT right.

 

 

WoW had mobs that wandered around and even talked to eachother as opposed to mobs that just sit there lifelessly in this game. WoW had underwater areas you could swim to, critters walking about and attacking one another, day/night cycles, music, the ability to sit and lie down, a combat log, and live mounts, ALL ON RELEASE. Bioware has cited "technical difficulties" when asked about the potential for bringing live mounts into this game.

 

 

WoW had infinitely more detailed and imaginative landscapes compared to SwTOR where every planet's ecosystem looks EXACTLY LIKE EARTH. Seriously who plays a space MMO to see oak trees? Where are the liquid nitrogen forests and electric gas clouds? Where is the alien plantlife?? Alien planets are such an opportunity to be creative and oak trees is what they came up with!? WoW's space zones were actually imaginative.

 

 

Is a non-working UI to be expected? Because most gamers expect a working UI, in fact most MMOs since WoW have failed because of a broken UI. How is it with a $100+ million budget they can't accomplish in 2011 what Blizzard did 7 years ago with a lower budget.

[Katharis]

I'm not saying they aren't fixing some things, but the devs, community managers and tech support clearly need a major attitude adjustment.

 

Evacuate? In our moment of triumph?

Edited January 13, 2012 by Katharis

[Aisar]

Anyone who says WoW was like this at Launch never played WoW and is trying to spread false information to make this game look better. It's dishonest guys, and does not help anyone.

 

That launch was enchanting, and stayed that way. Done with this game before my first toon hit 50. Speaks for itself.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Aisar

[Yemmer]

That's such a total lie.

 

 

WoW had a responsive UI working right out the door. It's 7 years later and SwTOR can't even get THAT right.

 

 

WoW had mobs that wandered around and even talked to eachother as opposed to mobs that just sit there lifelessly in this game. WoW had underwater areas you could swim to, critters walking about and attacking one another, day/night cycles, music, the ability to sit and lie down, a combat log, and live mounts, ALL ON RELEASE. Bioware has cited "technical difficulties" when asked about the potential for bringing live mounts into this game.

 

 

WoW had infinitely more detailed and imaginative landscapes compared to SwTOR where every planet's ecosystem looks EXACTLY LIKE EARTH. Seriously who plays a space MMO to see oak trees? Where are the liquid nitrogen forests and electric gas clouds? Where is the alien plantlife?? Alien planets are such an opportunity to be creative and oak trees is what they came up with!? WoW's space zones were actually imaginative.

 

 

Is a non-working UI to be expected? Because most gamers expect a working UI, in fact most MMOs since WoW have failed because of a broken UI. How is it with a $100+ million budget they can't accomplish in 2011 what Blizzard did 7 years ago with a lower budget.

 

 

I said the first year of release.

[Taurusaud]

I said the first year of release.

 

Every single thing I posted was in the game at release. Try reading next time.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Taurusaud

[Yemmer]

Anyone who says WoW was like this at Launch never played WoW and is trying to spread false information to make this game look better. It's dishonest guys, and does not help anyone.

 

Obviously you did not play it on release. Unless of course you take the stance that exploits allowing you to make about 600 gold per hour at lvl 4 and being able to fall through the terrain into a never ending void - and be unable to get out unless the blizzgods pulled out out wern't bugs.

[Taurusaud]

Obviously you did not play it on release. Unless of course you take the stance that exploits allowing you to make about 600 gold per hour at lvl 4 and being able to fall through the terrain into a never ending void - and be unable to get out unless the blizzgods pulled out out wern't bugs.

 

If that was true nobody would have kept playing WoW. Guess what.

[Apax]

Here's the deal: I want SWTOR to survive and flourish. I really like the game overall. However, there are GLARING issues with this game (I'm not going to rehash them here...no point in repeating it) and yet Bioware seems to be blissfully (blindly?) boastful of their game. I get how PR works, blah, blah (so don't attempt to give me a lesson), but I have seen ZERO humility on Bioware's part that indicates that they have heard their customers. Look at Trion. Whether you like Rift or not (I found it to be rather bland myself) that is a company working its a*s off for your $15 a month. They have approached the community with humility and open ears, and it has paid off. Meanwhile, Bioware is too busy spinning the hype machine and patting itself on the back to approach the community's concerns humbly and comprehensively.

 

Please know that I am writing this post as a fan of the game (and Bioware) and I really want the game to succeed. In my life, I have never seen an individual or entity succeed in the long term by avoiding self-reflection and constructive criticism.....ever.

 

I agree with this post, especially the comment regarding Trion and Rift. I didn't really like Rift (and mainly because it was just more of "WoW" to me), but I continued subscribing to it for quite a while even when I stopped playing because I felt the developers were really working hard on every front, including communication and working with their customers. It's something I really appreciate from a developer that I feel needs to be rewarded. Too bad it's so rare.

[PjPablo]

Obviously you did not play it on release. Unless of course you take the stance that exploits allowing you to make about 600 gold per hour at lvl 4 and being able to fall through the terrain into a never ending void - and be unable to get out unless the blizzgods pulled out out wern't bugs.

 

The biggest issue for WOW at launch was they were completely unprepared for the number of subs they got. This led to queues and server instability. As far as bugs...sure there were there just like all launches but they were pretty minor.

 

Keep in mind if the game was as bad as some are painting it here they never would have had a sevenfold increase in subs in the first 90 days.

[Jederix]

You have an overly inflated sense of the relevance of your opinion, OP.

 

Welcome to the Internet. Just about everyone is a narcissist when it comes to their own opinion and posts.

[Jederix]

Ah, fanbois, so not helpful.

 

There are a multitude of instances where players have legitimate gripes, and Bioware sticks their nose in the air and declares themselves smarter than anyone.

 

For instance, PC models of certain species have MASSIVE clipping issues. There are miraluka who's masks clip through hoods, dissappearing/reappearing lekku, and little floaty hair things that do odd things in gameplay and cutscenes. And Bioware's response to this? "Nobody really wants to change their character, thats for games that have been out for awhile and only top level might want to". Really? Like nobody might want to alter their appearance to deal with clipping issues?

 

Or the high res textures. Bioware said it's a bug. Then they said it's a feature. Then instead of fixing it, they gave some PR spin about how they know more about our computers than we do. That's really arrogant and condescending.

 

Or how about the lack of a bug report feature? Ever tried to bug something? I tried to bug that the triggers for quests are wonky (if you travel in someone else's ship to the next planet, your quest will not trigger, and you have to go somewhere else in your ship and come back). Bioware's response? "Try resetting your graphics options and reinstall your game!" What the Force kinda response is that? I tell you the server side triggers are gorked, you tell me to reinstall? Are they even keeping these tickets?

 

Oh, and they pulled out the Derek Smart response to several questions, they oh so infamous "works as intended".

 

It seems as though they're making the appearance of listening, but only for things like exploits. Whenever there are major gripes, they just pretend everything is dandy, and they pretend that they know everything, and the players know nothing.

 

I'm not saying they aren't fixing some things, but the devs, community managers and tech support clearly need a major attitude adjustment.

 

The only people around here who need an attitude adjustment are a good portion of the posters in the general forums.

[Jederix]

Anyone who says WoW was like this at Launch never played WoW and is trying to spread false information to make this game look better. It's dishonest guys, and does not help anyone.

 

That launch was enchanting, and stayed that way. Done with this game before my first toon hit 50. Speaks for itself.

 

Spoken like someone who wasn't there.