Hadanta Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I have a lvl 50 Jug tank with my pri dmg is only at 680. I have a lvl 27 merc my pri dmg is at 2815. You cant tell me that i'm at par with my jug tank. I would think I would do as much dmg as a dps class. But when a lvl 50 can do 10 times more dmg then me. Then I would think I could take 10 times more dmg then they can. I have just over 16k hit points or health. DPS class has around 12 to 14k hit points. . Trying to keep argo on me with just hitting targets for 680 dmg is a joke. Bust dmg or not, I can'1 even do 1/8 of the dmg a dps can. You need a big fix for this crap. It's crap that when I run a daily at lvl 50, it can take me few minutes to kill a mob if it has a healer init. But a dps can run in and kill it in seconds. Not take to much dmg and may only have to heal up. But Im still fighting the same mob. Please up my dps before you just give me more def. I like to kill things little faster. Its lke I can pull 3 mobs and tank and spank them in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krelan Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Most people in this thread are *********** clueless so let me fill you in. Let's take the current ONLY impossible fight in the game: Soa, the Infernal One, on nightmare mode. This thread details why is it impossible: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=147413 Note where you have to meet utterly IMPOSSIBLE DPS requirements over a set period of time to even come close to killing the boss. This is why universal combat logs are necessary. If I'm playing and achieving 2.2k DPS over 20 seconds (it's actually impossible at the moment, but I digress) and everyone else it apart from 1 person who is doing 1.1k DPS I have a bloody right to know who that complete *********** moron is so I can either tell him to DPS properly, or get the **** out of my progression - aiming for World Firsts - guild. Let's take a completely doable fight, Commander Jorland in Boarding Party: The engineer has no aggro table and 90,000 hp~ The medic has an aggro table and 90,000 hp~ Commander Jorland has 120,000 hp~ The enrage is 150 seconds: 400,000 / 2666.66 2666.66 / 3 (2 dps + 1 tank) = 888.88 Now this is a tightly tuned enrage, which also requires interrupts on the Medic (else he gets healed) and exceptional healing. If you wipe to the enrage there are multiple reasons why: 1) Interrupts on medic weren't occuring, meaning he was taking longer to kill 2) DPS wasn't high enough 3) Healing didn't allow DPS to properly rotate their max DPS rotation 4) People weren't focusing properly 5) Someone died - out of their own stupidity/healing issue That's 5 reasons why a boss didn't die due to a strict enrage. A global combat log, thus something designed like Skada (Skada) would help identify the reason. Skada has these different modes: - Damage done, - DPS, Threat, - Enemy damage done, - Enemy damage taken, - Healing, Overhealing, - Total healing, - Absorbs estimated, - Damage taken, Dispels, - Mana regen, - Debuff uptimes, - Activity There is only 1 reason why people wouldn't want something like Skada in this game: they don't want their DPS to be recognised. If someone said to me "your DPS will be too low" I'd say to them, as a good player, "take me and let me wipe the floor with you." I know I'm good, I know a combat log would show I'm good, thus I'm not afraid of a combat log being added into the game. People like you need to get the hell out of SWTOR. It's your kind of arrogant, elitist min-maxing attitude that ruins MMO communities. Go back to whatever MMO you crawled out of, or adjust your attitude accordingly. I think there's a lot of former WoW players here who saw what damage meters, gearscore, etc. did to WoW who do not wish that to repeat itself. I know I sure as heck don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scritchy Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) Please stop wanting this game to be EQ. It failed. End of story. Just by what kind of idiotic definition did EQ fail? It has been turning a profit for 13 years in March and it with UO are credited with spawning an entire genre of games (nobody even remembers Meridian 59). Edited January 13, 2012 by Scritchy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiaa Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 It's a start. I remember horrible low budget MMOs that had full combat logs. Whoever is making decisions for SWTOR, let's face it, is making most of the poor ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hy_C Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 People like you need to get the hell out of SWTOR. It's your kind of arrogant, elitist min-maxing attitude that ruins MMO communities. Go back to whatever MMO you crawled out of, or adjust your attitude accordingly. I think there's a lot of former WoW players here who saw what damage meters, gearscore, etc. did to WoW who do not wish that to repeat itself. I know I sure as heck don't. I'm glad you took your time to read the first sentence and nothing past it. It's your kind of stupidity that ruins MMO communities. Go back to whatever school you crawled out of, or adjust your ability to read accordingly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanscholo Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Good start, only a matter of time now... No its not... Dont mind the data locally...not interested, but dont mind it. Certainly dont want to have monitors on a game...this is not a sport like WoW. This is RP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazgra Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Someone please tell me how a guild leader is supposed to distinguish between two DPS recruits competing for one raiding position who both appear to be doing their job without World of Logs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korialstrazs Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Someone please tell me how a guild leader is supposed to distinguish between two DPS recruits competing for one raiding position who both appear to be doing their job without World of Logs? You're supposed to use your social skills to determine who is better by talking to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lethality Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 No its not... Dont mind the data locally...not interested, but dont mind it. Certainly dont want to have monitors on a game...this is not a sport like WoW. This is RP. I'm not a role-player, but... how can a game that defines your characters looks, voice personality and story more than any other be "RP"? I never understood. Some people seem to mix up role-playing with story-telling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hy_C Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 You're supposed to use your social skills to determine who is better by talking to them. I laughed only because I know you're being sarcastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keihryon Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I have a lvl 50 Jug tank with my pri dmg is only at 680. I have a lvl 27 merc my pri dmg is at 2815. Its a display stat bug. move the decimal to the left by 1. Your merc's primary dmg is 281.5 Hope that clears up your confusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guided_by_voices Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Someone please tell me how a guild leader is supposed to distinguish between two DPS recruits competing for one raiding position who both appear to be doing their job without World of Logs? i would hope and serious guild judge more by what number they put up on the meter or all all raids tank and spank encounters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonAgeOrgins Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 People like you need to get the hell out of SWTOR. It's your kind of arrogant, elitist min-maxing attitude that ruins MMO communities. Go back to whatever MMO you crawled out of, or adjust your attitude accordingly. I think there's a lot of former WoW players here who saw what damage meters, gearscore, etc. did to WoW who do not wish that to repeat itself. I know I sure as heck don't. I SUPPORT THIS comment and this poster just became my new best friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EternalFinality Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 This fulfills a purpose of seeing how much damage I do. Cool. But there's another very big reason I want a combat log - I want to see what enemy players are doing, particularly in PvP. I want to know what they did to me. I want to know when they trigger buffs and shields and stealth. I want to know who is healing who and when. I want to know what someone is spamming. I don't care about gauging everyone's dps in a raid, and if that's the reason you're not giving us a combat log then Bioware for god's sake get a clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baaddare Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 It was sort of tucked at the end of one of Georg's posts, and while I noticed it, I haven't seen any threads on the matter. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=1435443#edit1435443 That's how I interpret the quote, anyway. (EDIT: Emphasis not mine. In the original quote, the word "your" is italicized) And it's all right by me. The people who want logs say they need meters to let them gauge their own performance as a point of personal pride. Few have been willing to admit they want them for any other reason. This should satisfy pretty much everyone -- both the people who want logs to help them better themselves, and the people who don't want the culture of elitism and exclusion that meters foster. lol it has already started by the way there was a thread yesterday with them screaming that the info will only be of your performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazgra Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Most people in this thread are *********** clueless so let me fill you in. Let's take the current ONLY impossible fight in the game: Soa, the Infernal One, on nightmare mode. This thread details why is it impossible: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=147413 Note where you have to meet utterly IMPOSSIBLE DPS requirements over a set period of time to even come close to killing the boss. This is why universal combat logs are necessary. If I'm playing and achieving 2.2k DPS over 20 seconds (it's actually impossible at the moment, but I digress) and everyone else it apart from 1 person who is doing 1.1k DPS I have a bloody right to know who that complete *********** moron is so I can either tell him to DPS properly, or get the **** out of my progression - aiming for World Firsts - guild. Let's take a completely doable fight, Commander Jorland in Boarding Party: The engineer has no aggro table and 90,000 hp~ The medic has an aggro table and 90,000 hp~ Commander Jorland has 120,000 hp~ The enrage is 150 seconds: 400,000 / 2666.66 2666.66 / 3 (2 dps + 1 tank) = 888.88 Now this is a tightly tuned enrage, which also requires interrupts on the Medic (else he gets healed) and exceptional healing. If you wipe to the enrage there are multiple reasons why: 1) Interrupts on medic weren't occuring, meaning he was taking longer to kill 2) DPS wasn't high enough 3) Healing didn't allow DPS to properly rotate their max DPS rotation 4) People weren't focusing properly 5) Someone died - out of their own stupidity/healing issue That's 5 reasons why a boss didn't die due to a strict enrage. A global combat log, thus something designed like Skada (Skada) would help identify the reason. Skada has these different modes: - Damage done, - DPS, Threat, - Enemy damage done, - Enemy damage taken, - Healing, Overhealing, - Total healing, - Absorbs estimated, - Damage taken, Dispels, - Mana regen, - Debuff uptimes, - Activity There is only 1 reason why people wouldn't want something like Skada in this game: they don't want their DPS to be recognised. If someone said to me "your DPS will be too low" I'd say to them, as a good player, "take me and let me wipe the floor with you." I know I'm good, I know a combat log would show I'm good, thus I'm not afraid of a combat log being added into the game. Quoting this because it needs to be read Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonAgeOrgins Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 People like you need to get the hell out of SWTOR. It's your kind of arrogant, elitist min-maxing attitude that ruins MMO communities. Go back to whatever MMO you crawled out of, or adjust your attitude accordingly. I think there's a lot of former WoW players here who saw what damage meters, gearscore, etc. did to WoW who do not wish that to repeat itself. I know I sure as heck don't. Quoting this because this needs to be read also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romiz Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Someone please tell me how a guild leader is supposed to distinguish between two DPS recruits competing for one raiding position who both appear to be doing their job without World of Logs? That is called be an elitist. And reason viewing others DPS should never be allowed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranberries Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 i would hope and serious guild judge more by what number they put up on the meter or all all raids tank and spank encounters? In good guilds you expect people to move out of fire. If not you get kicked, this moves people onto level 2 of trial: performance in terms of numbers. If you do bad numbers, improve or **** off. If you do good numbers, you make raider rank. It's not rocket science people. Here's a thought: I CAN DO GOOD DPS WHILE MOVING OUT OF FIRE BECAUSE MMOS ARE *********** EASY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hy_C Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 That is called be an elitist. And reason viewing others DPS should never be allowed. I guess all jobs must be elitest for wanting resumes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kunitsukami Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Just by what kind of idiotic definition did EQ fail? It has been turning a profit for 13 years in March and it with UO are credited with spawning an entire genre of games (nobody even remembers Meridian 59). UO started in 1997 EQ1 in 1999, and UO is still going in some iterations today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazgra Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 That is called be an elitist. And reason viewing others DPS should never be allowed. Ok, and if you're at the bleeding edge of raid progression where you're hitting enrage timers due to poor dps, what can you do about it without analysing logs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hy_C Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Ok, and if you're at the bleeding edge of raid progression where you're hitting enrage timers due to poor dps, what can you do about it without analysing logs? Use your social skills and work through it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VicSix Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Quoting this because this needs to be read also. Not really, well maybe the last part. I saw what it did for wow, sold a ton of copys. Customizable ui was a huge selling point for wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PjPablo Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Use your social skills and work through it. So talk to the boss and convince him to die faster? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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