Force lightening needs a look

[Astarica]

I can understand your annoyance during a situation like that. But for things like Huttball, you shouldn't just be standing there eating it. If you're a melee class who doesn't either have a closer move(not sure who does and who doesn't for sure) or has yours on CD, don't try and just last it. You need to LoS that caster and draw him out, get him down on your level where you can smash his Ionized clothie self.

 

I'm not trying to teach anyone how to PvP because I, myself, am decades away from being a "Supa PvPeh Masta", but you can see how Force Lightning can be mistaken by people as super overpowered when it was just a situational mishap.

 

As playing both a Sorc and non-Sorc in PvP just about everyday. I don't think Force Lightning needs changed. I personally think Snares should have an impact on the Resolve bar.

 

Of course it's not hard to deal with. Usually you just turn around and hit the nearest guy instead of trying to find a way to get up there, but it's really annoying to see this guy shooting lightning somewhere up there that you just can't reach easily. This is also why ranged classes put up crazy numbers and very few deaths in Huttball since melee ends up deathmatch each other in the middle as it's not worthwihile to take a long detour to hunt down the ranged DPS. This is probably why people feel ranged DPS are overpowered in general since maps like Huttball allow them to put up extremely lopsided numbers.

 

When I use Recklessness (make FL range 30m for Assassins) I can pretty much hit targets with impunity and no risk to myself. And that's what Sorcercers get to do all day long. No it's not overpowered in the sense that it wins you games because your ranged can do exactly the same thing, but it sure is frustrating for the melee.

[Gaucho]

If we duel, I can cast FL and you can have a look.

 

happy?

[Arkerenos]

Of course it's not hard to deal with. Usually you just turn around and hit the nearest guy instead of trying to find a way to get up there, but it's really annoying to see this guy shooting lightning somewhere up there that you just can't reach easily. This is also why ranged classes put up crazy numbers and very few deaths in Huttball since melee ends up deathmatch each other in the middle as it's not worthwihile to take a long detour to hunt down the ranged DPS. This is probably why people feel ranged DPS are overpowered in general since maps like Huttball allow them to put up extremely lopsided numbers.

 

When I use Recklessness (make FL range 30m for Assassins) I can pretty much hit targets with impunity and no risk to myself. And that's what Sorcercers get to do all day long. No it's not overpowered in the sense that it wins you games because your ranged can do exactly the same thing, but it sure is frustrating for the melee.

 

I agree, it is very frustrating to get blasted on by ranged during Huttball. But on a one level map, or in the middle zone on Civil War, you can usually make it to them in a decent amount of time. Force Lightning doesn't hit for an ungoldy amount by itself. It just doesn't help that my sorc has multiple slows that I can use without penalty. Resolve... Bar... changes!

Edited January 11, 2012 by Arkerenos

[Leiloni]

It's not hard to LoS the ranged in Huttball if they're on a ledge and you're on the floor. It happens to me all the time and it's a pain in the butt. Either I have to switch targets and ignore you, or I chase you and then give you the advantage. Edited January 11, 2012 by Leiloni

[Astarica]

I agree, it is very frustrating to get blasted on by ranged during Huttball. But on a one level map, or in the middle zone on Civil War, you can usually make it to them in a decent amount of time. Force Lightning doesn't hit for an ungoldy amount by itself. It just doesn't help that my sorc has multiple slows that I can use without penalty. Resolve... Bar... changes!

 

Most of these posts really should say 'XYZ is overpowered in Huttball'. There is nothing wrong with FL in open terrain, but when someone is shooting from a spot that takes you 30 seconds to physically reach, it sure is pretty powerful. It's even worse when you've a ranged parked in like a tiny area with some crates above you, so that even if you walk up there, you usually have LoS issues and you're pretty much guaranteed to get thrown off if they use KB (which they will). Here even charge abilities aren't very useful since you'll get tossed off immediately, so if you can't grab them down, you might as well just look for someone else to kill instead.

[Arkerenos]

It's not hard to LoS the ranged in Huttball if they're on a ledge and you're on the floor. It happens to me all the time and it's a pain in the butt. Either I have to switch targets and ignore you, or I chase you and then give you the advantage.

 

Exactly, but not a lot of people are willing to stop their forward progression and wait around that 10 seconds to draw me or you out. If I see their health below half, damn right I'm gonna chase them down... Right where they want me. Pop a few cooldowns, bypass my Shield, and I'm back in the respawn zone.

 

The problem is, so many people just keep running around trying to find the quickest way up to the ranged person, die from the 30 seconds of bombing, and get angry and start throwing "ZOMG NERF" around..

[Felene]

Exactly, but not a lot of people are willing to stop their forward progression and wait around that 10 seconds to draw me or you out. If I see their health below half, damn right I'm gonna chase them down... Right where they want me. Pop a few cooldowns, bypass my Shield, and I'm back in the respawn zone.

 

The problem is, so many people just keep running around trying to find the quickest way up to the ranged person, die from the 30 seconds of bombing, and get angry and start throwing "ZOMG NERF" around..

 

It wasn't easy to make concessions in order to gain advantages, at least for some people.

 

Force Lightning is fine, one's inability to interrupt one and think it needs to be nerf is not.

[Zarovich]

The real problem with Force Lightning is that it is not mitigated by armor at all. So basically it hits someone with Heavy Armor as hard as it hits someone with Light Armor. This is why Op/Scondrels can take down a tank as fast as a squishy. Most of Op/Scondrels attacks are not effected by armor just like Sorc/Sage.

[Kalakbar]

The real problem with Force Lightning is that it is not mitigated by armor at all. So basically it hits someone with Heavy Armor as hard as it hits someone with Light Armor. This is why Op/Scondrels can take down a tank as fast as a squishy. Most of Op/Scondrels attacks are not effected by armor just like Sorc/Sage.

 

I don't think this is true, since I tend to channel Force Lightning for like 650 a tick, but against a Vanguard with no cooldowns it's like 350 a tick. I've seen it as low as 200 with CDs.

[Leiloni]

The real problem with Force Lightning is that it is not mitigated by armor at all. So basically it hits someone with Heavy Armor as hard as it hits someone with Light Armor. This is why Op/Scondrels can take down a tank as fast as a squishy. Most of Op/Scondrels attacks are not effected by armor just like Sorc/Sage.

 

Simply not true whatsoever. Force Lightning/Telekinetic Throw is an energy attack that is mitigated by armor like any other attack. The only attacks that bypass armor are internal attacks, which for a Sorc/Sage I think is only a few attacks and since three are in talent trees a Sorc/Sage will only have 2 or 3 of these and all but one has a CD:

 

Weaken Mind - the instant cast no CD DoT

Force in Balance - 11 talent points in Balance tree. AoE.

Turbulence - 31 Point skill in Telekinetics tree. Casted DD

Sever Force - 31 points in Balance tree. DoT.

 

It's almost identical for a Scoundrel/Operative. Most of their basic attacks are kinetic/energy attacks, except for a few mostly talented special abilties that bypass armor.

Edited January 11, 2012 by Leiloni

[Zarovich]

I don't think this is true, since I tend to channel Force Lightning for like 650 a tick, but against a Vanguard with no cooldowns it's like 350 a tick. I've seen it as low as 200 with CDs.

 

There are numerous topics going around discussing this right now. People are finding out through testing that only a few damage times are mitigated by armor at all and that shields protects from even less then armor does. Right now the best defense ability seems to be the bubble that Sorc/Sages get since it protects from everything until the threshold is met plus it is not on a 2 min cd like most of the other defense ones.

[Karast]

Not really. Force Leap is not only a small stun but it moves you forward. Force Lightning must be channeled. So no, not exactly the same.

 

A better example might be root on gunslinger then. If I could use it every GCD I could achieve roughly the same effect.

 

I just do not like CC without GCDs in any game for any class.

 

I would be fine if the slow was removed and the damage increased, or the damage increase and a cool down added.

 

But being able to continually reapply a slow as I see many sorcs doing is a bit over the top.

 

It really negates the existence of CC breaks and interrupt.

 

As people have said in other posts. Yeah I can use my CC break, and yeah I can interrupt your cast. But you can simply start channeling again. My interrupt and CC break have fairly long cool downs so its pointless to use them for nothing if your just going to channel it on me again.

 

Its not like your losing a while lot if I break that channel because of it not having a cool down and it having a really low resource cost is all I am saying.

 

Its actually in my opinion one of the most effective CC's in the game right now, especially when used on Operatives and scoundrels. Chain casting it on one of them that jumps someone close to you or your healer can completely shut them down and prevent them from finishing off a target.

[lokivoid]

Compared to most abilities in this game it just does too much.

 

Applies to mirror class

-low resource cost

-good damage

-applies a snare

-no CD

 

Keep in mind what i state is not taking into account advanced class talents (becuse lightning is shared by both assassin and sorc, they do not get the same talents that effect this ability)

 

-Go play a a inquisitor, I wouldnt say low resource cost, considering how force resource mechanics work.

 

-The damage is so so per tick without blowing additional cooldowns

 

-The snare is there becuse one its a channeled effect with a vary short range

 

-It does in fact have a six second CD

 

 

So prehaps you should focus your concerns on sorc talents not lightning it self.

[Chiricahua]

This. It seems high damage because smart players use their talents to pop in instant casts in between to sneak in more damage.

 

This will be fixed I'm sure.

[sangreal]

-The snare is there becuse one its a channeled effect with a vary short range

 

Sorcs get longer range, btw (passive skill, not a talent)

[jblazen]

Stop calling sorc's ranged nukers. We are not a burst dps class nor can we "nuke" anything.

 

We're a dot based class that can do some decent dmg with a long ramp up time.

 

Force lightning is fine. In fact it feels underpowered, it hits for 250 a tick for me at level 41 so that's 750 dmg over 3 sec, that is hardly OP and I can't move.

 

It is not our main spell, it's our filler spell when others are on CD. It's a copy cat from WOW's shadow priest mind flay spell. Since you have to channel it, it makes sense to make it slow. Stop calling it a snare.

 

PVP is about mobility and burst. Both of which you cannot do with force lightning. Stop crying.

 

The only decent dmg that comes out of force lighting is when it's used with recklessness which is a 90 sec CD.

[Orlex]

LIGHTNING SPAMMING IS GETTING STUPID!!!!!

 

It needs a cooldown.

[Darth-LeChuck]

force lightning (and sorc in general) only does high damage against players who have worse gear

 

 

people should be forced to play a class in a duel with the same gear

before being allowed to shout for a nerf

[rakah]

Compared to most abilities in this game it just does too much.

 

Applies to mirror class

-low resource cost

-good damage

-applies a snare

-no CD

 

Not asking to fix every point, just remove at least one of the above.

 

Something has to give here. There should be a give and take with any ability either in terms of its damage, resource cost, or its mechanics. Right now for all lightening does it is way too cheap to cast and saves a global with its snare. You see players spamming this and not even dipping below 85% energy (whatever you call it). It makes controlling their resources when dps-ing a joke.

 

One of these factors has to go. Sorcerers already have a snare ability so even removing that wouldn't totally gimp the ability to slow players.

 

*edit* This game already has enough CC, a good dmg low cost auto snare ability for a range nuking class is not needed and just makes the game even more imbalanced for melee, and this is coming from a Commando. If Grav Round auto snared, it would be stupidly overpowered.

 

If you grab psychic barrier (which you should) then you restore 1% total force each time your telekinetic throw does damage. The purpose of that is to offset the cost of the dots that you probably don't notice the damage from. TK itself does about 1k per tick on a crit up to 1.5k at most.

The lack of CD must be specced into and it is pretty manditory to ensure you keep your target at range with it's snare. if you let somone into melee range as a balance sage/madness sorc your doing it wrong(unless your using your knockback to interrupt a heal i suppose).

 

1. get the jump;

the sage/sorc relies on kiting to mitigate most of the damage (with a bit from the shield on top). you may also be able to chain CC enough to get em low before they can sheild. and if you put em on the defensive it makes it hard for them to counter.

2. interrupt tk/ lightning.

3. if your a sniper you might even be able to simply out damage, forcing them to LoS

Edited January 30, 2012 by rakah

[Jarexx]

I'll trade the snare on force lightning/telekinetic throw for being able to move while casting it any day.