Marauder... Dont make one

[Drathmar]

I see this said so often. Yeah...no other class requires thought to play effectively. Nope, not a bit. You can just roll anything else and be an easymode failboat loser with an 'I Win' button, or you can be a -real- Thingerjigger and be all 'it requires thought to play!' about a a class...that devs have acknowledged isn't performing to their expectations in terms of survival.

 

H'okay! Try to create a context in which you denote yourself as, apparently, more willing/able to think than others...for playing a class that is demonstrably under par.

 

Guess what; it doesn't make you smarter or more thoughtful to irrationally affix any sense of your own ego to the state of a class in an MMO.

 

Every class in this game benefits tremendously if you think and examine and test and practice with all its tools. Every. Single. One.

 

Good day.

 

Good thing bioware has officially said Marauder is the hardest class to play with the most complex rotations.

[Torkepl]

To the outposter. You scared sh^^ out of me

Im afraid i will now be useless on 50...

[DarkenWulf]

I see this said so often. Yeah...no other class requires thought to play effectively. Nope, not a bit. You can just roll anything else and be an easymode failboat loser with an 'I Win' button, or you can be a -real- Thingerjigger and be all 'it requires thought to play!' about a a class...that devs have acknowledged isn't performing to their expectations in terms of survival.

 

I'd take my trolling hat off to you, but apparantly you're serious., oh well, here goes nothing....

 

H'okay! Try to create a context in which you denote yourself as, apparently, more willing/able to think than others...for playing a class that is demonstrably under par.

 

Will comparing it to my level 50 tankasin help?

 

Guess what; it doesn't make you smarter or more thoughtful to irrationally affix any sense of your own ego to the state of a class in an MMO.

 

Which is basically what you're doing just from the opposite angle. Congrats

 

Every class in this game benefits tremendously if you think and examine and test and practice with all its tools. Every. Single. One.

 

You can suck and do the same three things over and over again and clear a fair amount of solo content on a fair few of them, sure. Others, not so much; that's not my point of contention, nor, I think, the point of contention many have.

 

I'm not even sure anybody knows what your point of contention short of just being contentious, I mean you're a BH complainging about marauders, we get that

 

To explain the problem to you, o'great thinker, is that in order to get a Marauder to perform merely -adequately- in a comparatively limited scope of circumstances when contrasted against every other DPS class, it is both harder to get it to do that and you can't do nearly as much with one.

 

I think you forgot to carry the one on your maths. You seem to be under the impression that theres an issue with Marauder because it consistently fails to deliver on dps. In which case you're almost certainly "doing it wrong". Heres the why:

 

Continuing on with comparison to my assassin, the DPS has been consistently higher, playing anni spec it's also more consistent over a long period of time. I'll be the first to admit I don't enjoy the mechanics of Sin quite so much, but it's got a good solid set of hits and some excellent escape/cc moves. It also requires less skill to play effectively. Fact.

 

Why? Because stealth provides you with a no brainer fight or flight mechanic., you can pick and choose your fights at will. It also excels in "SURPRISE! SITH!"

 

Does this make Mara gimped as a comparison. Of course it doesn't You can still pick and choose, but your fight and flight are more severely limited. Hence the whole host of "oh crap" buttons. Does Mara need a buff? I'd like to see a slight one. but I'm firmly of the opinion that it's general overall tweaks needed, and thats to everything.

 

Also theres no need to be deliberately insulting but if you want to bring it down to that level I'm more than willing to party. But seeing as you can't even carry a normal conversation I'd be fighting an unarmed opponent

 

No utility worth mentioning; no CC; can't heal anybody. Think about this very carefully before you respond since you're statedly a thinker.

 

O.k, I've thought long and hard about this.

 

Yes there is minimal stuns. but theres a ton of Snare, which btw aren;t affected by the resolve. Rupture can be talented to slow, Ravage can be talented to immobilize, choke can stun, deadly throw can slow, we can slow with a saber strike and we can leap.

 

Maybe you're just arguing for us to be overpowered. too far over the other end.

 

Gods help us all if you were a developer.

 

Think also about the distinction between us saying 'You suck because you play marauder' and 'Marauder sucks because it's twice as hard to get it to do the same thing as many others, and it can't do what many others can at all"

 

Because it seems to me that you've failed to make that terribly important distinction wherein which the latter is, in fact, the gist of it, and many responses seem to be assuming the former.

 

Well there is no distinction, not for you anyway, personally I think you're the former. But being objective I treat everyone as the latter. Sadly I just don't think it's the class for you. You appear better suited to maybe something club waving that sits under bridges and molests passing goats.

 

The fact of the matter is theres a clear disparity between those who say "Mara sucks and those who say "It's fyne l2p". THen there are very very helpful people like Kiba who for some unknown reason waste their time trying to show you where you're going wrong. To which they get snarky posts like yours like you're some kind of MMO expert because all your posts are truth and we're merely neknighted incorrect fools.

 

You should do a course on making friends and influencing people.

 

Good day.

 

Au Revoir

 

PS: Please give me something better to work with next time. I have no further time to stooping to your level if you can't even back this stuff up.

 

ALl I need to do is point to the sticky at the top.

Edited January 12, 2012 by Paralassa
insults

[Shadinaxx]

LMAO! well said

[Torkepl]

DarkenWulf interesting post!

[Tycoon]

Do you really think marauder's best ability is ravage? You must be carnage spec or a lowbe. Try some of the other specs. If you go annihilation spec, ravage should only be used when annihilate, rupture, and battering assault are on cool down. Also, dont try to get that third hit out of ravage. If you go for the third hit, your target will quickly get out of range, then you will have to spend time catching up. Edited January 11, 2012 by Tycoon

[Shadinaxx]

Even in carnage, ravage is not the most important ability, gore is, then it's a tie between ravage and scream, in pvp, I lean more towards scream. I think it's safe to assume that everyone agrees that when it comes down to balancing a class, pvp is the great equalizer

[Tycoon]

Even in carnage, ravage is not the most important ability, gore is, then it's a tie between ravage and scream, in pvp, I lean more towards scream. I think it's safe to assume that everyone agrees that when it comes down to balancing a class, pvp is the great equalizer

 

Yah i started to lean more to scream when i first started out with carnage. Unless he was a noob assassin, who doesnt know ravage can be interrupted and wasted all his stuns away.

[BarcodeX]

I <3 my geared marauder, but if I had learned about the 30m Saber Throw and Intercede for Juggy as well as the pro, overpowered stun lock by the Operative, I would have rolled them before buying the game.

 

Btw I love just trolling in Huttball with my level 12 Operative by stunning people in the acid bath or the fire pit thing lolz.

Edited January 11, 2012 by BarcodeX

[Shadinaxx]

I <3 my geared marauder, but if I had learned about the 30m Saber Throw and Intercede for Juggy as well as the pro, overpowered stun lock by the Operative, I would have rolled them before buying the game.

 

Btw I love just trolling in Huttball with my level 12 Operative by stunning people in the acid bath or the fire pit thing lolz.

 

I actually got trolled by a fellow mara, he charged me at the edge of the fire, and then ravaged me to pin me there, by the time I realized I got ninja charged, I was dead, lol... I felt like raging, but I couldnt help but laugh.

 

I usually force choke people in the fire, makes me giggle, like when you toss a pinecone into a fire an listen to it's screams, lol

[HBninjaX]

Good thing bioware has officially said Marauder is the hardest class to play with the most complex rotations.

 

It does get pretty complex, I actually find myself breaking lots of rules like staring at the hotkeys and even *gasp* mouse clicking the odd ability here and there. The gameplay is pretty gratifying for me though --it's immersive. I would say playing a healer/dps on a mercenary offers a similar level of satisfaction for me in terms of juggling abilities

[Xacuter]

Oh great! Another thread about a person who clearly doesnt know how to play his class.

 

Get good. Marauders are fine the way they are.

 

 

Level 50 Marauder who destroys in PVP and has absolutly no problem in PVE at all.

[Maxxacre]

I played a bunch of different classes between beta and live, and although Marauder isn't my highest class at all... I actually enjoy it more than anything else so far. It's certainly got its limitations now that I'm a lower level due to rerolling, and am now facing geared out level 50s... but the actual gameplay mechanics and style are just flat out better than any of the other classes I've played:

 

Sorcerer: everyone thinks they are OP... they're really good, really well balanced IMO, but relatively boring to play. Stand back, nail people with cast time abilities at range... bubble, CC, and force speed out of there when you start to get really pressured. Meh....

 

Powertech: really fun class, and really good in PvP... but limited by a resource that I really don't like (Heat). Great versatile class, but just relatively boring and limited by Heat.

 

Shadow: completely outperformed by the Operative/Scoundrel right now in terms of burst, but still a fairly versatile class and a lot of fun to play. Yet still... very much hit and run except in tank spec, which also limits your DPS, and you're still not as versatile as the other tank classes and you lack the versatility with the exception of 1 pull. Also, a resource that runs out extremely extremely fast which requires you to throttle... naturally.

 

Mercenary: most boring class I've ever played in PvP, but one of the best in PvE. A lot of AOE = a lot of dead trash mobs. Questing is easy... but except for healing spec, it's just really really boring and too simple to PvP. And without an interrupt... you feel like a derp.

 

and enter the Marauder. Using an action point system, you're never going to have to throttle your DPS in PvP and you're never going to have to worry about being "energy starved" or anything. All you need to do is be relatively intelligent about balancing the use of Rage builders and Rage spenders. Easy. But the class adds a lot of complexity beyond that with synergy of abilities and different spec options that the other classes simply lack. What that means is that you are playing a high skill threshold class. In other words, you're either going to faceroll people, or get facerolled for not playing it right.

 

Bioware has said now officially that it's pretty much the hardest class to play and the one with the most complex "rotation" out of all of them. THAT is the class I want to be playing, of course. When played right... it's purely awesome.

 

And to be honest, it feels so much more fast-paced and in-your-face than any of the other classes I've played. I feel like a bad mofo when I'm playing Marauder. Personally, I'm glad a lot of people think it's gimped (because it's not, so it's safe from a nerf at least) and also that a lot of people don't really play this class. Everyone is too busy rerolling the FOTM Operative/Scoundrel (seriously... check out the lowbies right now). Meanwhile, I'm rolling what is generally considered to be the most underpowered class in the game, which is in reality one of the best IMO. For PvP, that is.

[keltonz]

and to be honest, it feels so much more fast-paced and in-your-face than any of the other classes i've played. I feel like a bad mofo when i'm playing marauder.

 

^ qft

[Ardim]

Funny how it never seems to work that way in reality. Maybe everyone playing marauders just isn't skilled? That can't be the case; I'd have to assume everyone to be stupid to accept that as the reason for why I can -go around a WZ or huttball and systematically pick my killcount by preying on marauders-.

 

I'm not trying to brag about it; it's a -problem with the class- and I can only hope the promised patch to improve warrior and knight survivability delivers.

 

It's just lacking where it shouldn't be right now. Yeah, a skilled marauder doesn't immediately die while turning circles and doing retarded things like a derpy marauder, but it doesn't -matter-. Skilled just means I almost have to try to faceplant you; almost.

 

Its still systematic. You've got no surprises to pull. I can run around singing tra la la with energy shield up and just wait out your undying rage by healing through it.

 

Sorcs tend to get the best of me 'cause they've got spammable quick heals and a much deeper resource pool to spam things with. Assassins and operatives sometimes get the better of me, and I sometimes get the better of them, but they've got good toolboxes too.

 

Everyone can easily get the better of a marauder. Juggs take longer 'cause they have more CD's to power through, but whoop dee doo; I'm more intimidated by a sorc's shield bubble than your CD's that I can ignore most of with most of my attacks anyway.

 

My fire dots from combustible gas cylinder, fusion missle and incindiary missile instead of tracer when I'm rolling a pyro spec? Good gawd, there's nothing a marauder or jugg can do about that damage.

 

Nothing. Dot you and kite you and you're done. Against Arsenal builds, you at least have a chance that I might screw up, but how can keeping you dotted and LoSing you as a very nearly guaranteed win (barring interference from people that aren't you) as a guaranteed win be cool?

 

That ain't cool. I feel a bit dirty for doing it, but there it is, doable.

 

Just...bloody...acknowledge that warriors need some love.

 

And if that's not evidence that can easily prove itself, try getting your marauder into a serious ops team.

 

You won't be getting in because your class is great for anything, if you get in at all. You -will- be an unnecessary drain on the healers, and you will underperform compared to ranged DPS.

 

This stuff matters. A class that's a foot shorter on its own stick of what its supposed to be good at than anything else and better off being avoided for serious content raiding ain't good.

 

Not for you, not for me, not for the game.

 

I should not be able to do like I do on my BH. The day that marauders make me work like anything else does to kill them and I can't reduce it to a systematic faceroll will be a good day.

 

Marauder takes skill to use. It's not one of the easier classes to play but for me it's pretty rewarding. People can kite a Marauder...until we use Crippling Slash, Force Crush (If in Rage, like I am) or Predation.

 

Everyone can easily get the better of a Marauder...Yeah...Only if they're relatively inexperienced. Btw, we don't lack surprises. In fact, we have quite a few. Undying Rage certainly is one and so is Force Camouflage.

 

Personally, in my opinion, the only thing Marauder really needs is better outfits, somewhat less squishiness, and Pommel Strike/Savage Kick usable in PvP. Those skills could use some love.

Edited January 11, 2012 by Ardim

[JustinxDuff]

Pommel Strike/Savage Kick usable in PvP. Those skills could use some love.

 

Unnecessary, if you can't DPS in PvP without them then you are doing it wrong.

[Ardim]

Unnecessary, if you can't DPS in PvP without them then you are doing it wrong.

 

Oh I can most certainly DPS in PvP without them. I just don't like having utterly useless skills. Besides, Savage Kick's animation looks really cool imo.

Edited January 11, 2012 by Ardim

[saminaobx]

I think that my 50 merc facerolls marauders like they're made out of cheese sammiches and he's a fat kid with four arms and a love for cheese sammiches.

 

I think that my 50 merc, being arsenal, can burst you into the floor if I'm willing to deal with pop vent heat...or just kite you, 'cause I'll be holding my jetpack in reserve just for you if you force leap me.

 

G'head, fus roh dah me and I'll show you how ranged DPS is done. Fusion missle, couple of fire dots, pop my energy barrier when you wind up for ravage and set the heal to charging. When you're done, you'll have seen my HP bar move and then go right back, 'cause my crit/surge is enormous, and my self heals easily crit over 4k 38% of the time.

 

 

I do it all the time. All. the. Time. Your class is broken and you're giving bad advice to someone with a legitimate complaint; it should not be this easy for me to run around a WZ and just cherry pick warriors and guardians to just ...choose my own adventure in how high I want my killcount to be this session.

 

Assassins and consular, now there are some hard targets. They got toolboxes, and they're a wild ride when they're played by someone that knows how to use them.

 

Agents popping me for 6k with knockdown and another 2k+2k before I even get up? Beastly; good stuff. I gotta work to take them down.

 

Sorcs? They've got a functionally deeper pool of their resource to 'mana dump' with than I do, and their shield bubble is wicked, but ya know, there's nothing quite so gratifying as when a sorc knocks me back and gets it wrong...and then I jet burst -them- into the acid or fire and electro dart them.

 

It's like beating them at their own game.

 

But warriors..warriors got nothin'. You only 'dominate' against people that can't playe their class. Anything else played skillfully will eat you, sometimes in several different ways to the none you bring to the table.

 

It's not your fault. It's the designers' fault for apparently deciding that melee DPS and even melee tanking were just gonna be the class architectures they dropped the ball bad and hard on with release.

 

Dunno how it got through beta like that. I was in several phases of beta; it was a known thing. None of this is new.

 

I reckon they wanted more data before editing classes and waited to see how the first few months of live added to the picture, but that's just me rationalizing in the hope that they're acknowledging the problem at all.

 

Still, don't tell people that marauders can be awesome if they just do it right; everything sucks if you do it -wrong-. Do anything right, and anything is better than a marauder.

 

That's just the way it is. Have fun with it if you can, but be honest about the state of things. Or they don't get fixed.

 

Quoted for truth

[Ardim]

Quoted for truth

 

No. Just no.

[Teladis]

I've been saying this for the longest time. The class is such a joke...It's not even that hard to play. Unless needing to be over geared for content is being hard.

[Drankathar]

I've been saying this for the longest time. The class is such a joke...It's not even that hard to play. Unless needing to be over geared for content is being hard.

 

I thought you were leaving?

[Talarii]

So I have found out after reaching level 50 on my marauder that they are not an ideal class at all. First off in pvp, its not like they're 100% gimped but they are definitiely not very good. Half the time when you use ravage it cancels and stops doing damage but you're stunned in place and keep channeling it while the enemy either runs away or beats on you. Also we have virtually no CC, cant heal, and only wear medium armor. Then in pve we're worthless too. As of right now no raid wants a melee class like marauder. All we offer is the same amount of dps as other dps classes, no crowd control, and we take more damage than ranged. Therefore no raid really wants you. As a marauder you may get lucky and the raid wont care and will send you an invite. But a progression raid group wont want you because all you do is hinder them slightly. So just a warning to anyone considering rolling marauder....think twice.

 

So, I couldn't disagree more. I'm a 50 marauder and there are a few things to note in this.

 

PVP: If you are standing still in pvp your doing it wrong. I almost NEVER use ravage in pvp. First off, you don't usually need to because you kill people quickly without it. Secondly, do not stand still in pvp period. I charge people, Force Crush, Smash, Scream...and they are at 10% if not dead. Marauders crap on people so hard its funny. You have not 1, not 2, not 3, but 4...yes 4, defensive cooldowns to cycle through to survive. People comment all the time asking me how I smash for 5K+ (6400 top so far) and yet it takes most of their team 2 min to drop me.

 

On PvE a really well geared sniper can keep up with me, but thats about it. I get invited to hard mode raids because good Marauders are reliable dps that bring a group dps buff.

 

If healing in pvp is an issue for you then get the talent that heals you when you break cc. Go biochem and get the reusable OP potions.

 

If you are not rage spec you are missing out. If you are carnage your out of your mind completely cause carnage is USELESS. If you are annihilation then your doing 80% of the dmg I do in rage on 1 target while I do most of my damage aoe.

 

Play a rage Marauder and watch people fall before you with the greatest of ease.

[mylefthand]

 

If you are not rage spec you are missing out. If you are carnage your out of your mind completely cause carnage is USELESS. If you are annihilation then your doing 80% of the dmg I do in rage on 1 target while I do most of my damage aoe.

 

Play a rage Marauder and watch people fall before you with the greatest of ease.

 

I play carnage cause i like the mechanics of how it works more than i like rage. Is it ok if i complain because my tree is -in fact- useless?

 

nobody ever answered my question - why do I have to play rage to pvp, and is this good game design? Why is it that you can faceroll with the greatest of ease while tons of other people cant fight their way past their comatose grandmother? Am I to believe everyone but the 5% elite are too inept to play the class? Im keeping track of the scoreboards, 5% really is about the number of marauders who actually manage to perform better than 3/4 people in the warzone by any margin.

 

My sniper is always at the top of that list at 26 and I que with 50s against 50s, so Im clearly not too inept to play that class. What gives?

[Majinr]

I've been saying this for the longest time. The class is such a joke...It's not even that hard to play. Unless needing to be over geared for content is being hard.

 

still here?

[Vexous]

I play carnage cause i like the mechanics of how it works more than i like rage. Is it ok if i complain because my tree is -in fact- useless?

 

nobody ever answered my question - why do I have to play rage to pvp, and is this good game design? Why is it that you can faceroll with the greatest of ease while tons of other people cant fight their way past their comatose grandmother? Am I to believe everyone but the 5% elite are too inept to play the class? Im keeping track of the scoreboards, 5% really is about the number of marauders who actually manage to perform better than 3/4 people in the warzone by any margin.

 

My sniper is always at the top of that list at 26 and I que with 50s against 50s, so Im clearly not too inept to play that class. What gives?

 

You! You there!

 

*waves hand* There is nothing wrong with the marauder class, these aren't the uncomfortable questions that need to be answered. Move along, move along. *waves hand*

 

Marauders. Not up to par with every other class out there. Buff them now and stop listening to the marauder main dev who must obviously be screaming L2P at all the other devs. Please.