khsolo Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 We are jedi, all jedi have force push Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalaar Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The developers hate the sentinels. During beta they took everything from saber throw and force push and gave it all the guardians. The guardisn are the typical jedi knight and I trully believe that the sentinel class was not supposed to be added into the game when the jedi knights can out dps us in viglance and have heavy armor. While there will be people coming in here to post how great the sentinel class is, the truth is we are not. We are easily kitable in pvp and have no surivability in pve or pvp. I have been in PVP matches where sentinels are at 40+ swearing they can own anyone and get taken out quickly by bounty hunters and sorcerors and agents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaerion Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 The developers hate the sentinels. During beta they took everything from saber throw and force push and gave it all the guardians. The guardisn are the typical jedi knight and I trully believe that the sentinel class was not supposed to be added into the game when the jedi knights can out dps us in viglance and have heavy armor. While there will be people coming in here to post how great the sentinel class is, the truth is we are not. We are easily kitable in pvp and have no surivability in pve or pvp. lolwut. Back on-topic: we are, in truth, a pretty flexible class with a LOT going for us. The tradeoff from losing Force Push (and yes, Saber Throw) during beta was the inclusion of the Centering mechanic, which I find to be AMAZING when used properly. Additionally, there are a number of skills between the three trees to encourage liberal usage of Force Leap, which acts as one of our many interrupts. Force Push would have added yet another, so removing it helps to reign in our ability to absolutely control any enemies with a cast timer. If it makes you feel any better, we also don't get Force Pull. Only one AC does, and that's only in one of its skill trees. Off-topic: Sentinel is an amazing class with a wonderful variety of playstyles. Its flexibility is remarkable, for a pure dps AC, and I personally am glad to lose Force Push if it means I get to keep the options I get from Centering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pangwl Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 TBH, I quite agree to the thread... I don't why is force push is removed completely out of Sentinel. Can't the Dev team be alil more creative? Instead of just removing it completely? There can only be 1 reasoning why force push is completely removed -- I'd reckon during their theory-crafting phase, JS must have good decent amount of damage burst? Hence, the removal of force push from JS in order to 'balance' gameplay. But instead of a complete removal, why not, Maybe do these? 1) Make force push commits from centering stacks, (like 15 or 10) to use, instead of a instant pop. 2) Make force push only usuable when Zen is activated or in combat trance (and in respective skill-tree) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaerion Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 TBH, I quite agree to the thread... I don't why is force push is removed completely out of Sentinel. Can't the Dev team be alil more creative? Instead of just removing it completely? There can only be 1 reasoning why force push is completely removed -- I'd reckon during their theory-crafting phase, JS must have good decent amount of damage burst? Hence, the removal of force push from JS in order to 'balance' gameplay. But instead of a complete removal, why not, Maybe do these? 1) Make force push commits from centering stacks, (like 15 or 10) to use, instead of a instant pop. 2) Make force push only usuable when Zen is activated or in combat trance (and in respective skill-tree) But then you have an ability that works two different ways for the same base class. It's simpler in its current incarnation, as unfortunate as its loss is for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fascion Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Don't we need like... a free hand... to Force Push? I thought we were already holding a saber in that hand. Maybe we can Force throw our saber at a guy... then, while it is flying at him, gain access to a Force Push ability? Wait, no, sabers aren't actually boomerangs. If we did that, our flung saber would drop to the ground, leaving us without an offhand. We don't need Force Push, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaerion Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 We don't need Force Push, IMO. This, mostly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandmasterub Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Your offhand is busy wielding an extra saber. You don't have the focus to be directing force blasts on top of your swordplay. Sheathe your extra saber if you want to force push... Owait they call that the guardian. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khsolo Posted January 10, 2012 Author Share Posted January 10, 2012 The developers hate the sentinels. During beta they took everything from saber throw and force push and gave it all the guardians. The guardisn are the typical jedi knight and I trully believe that the sentinel class was not supposed to be added into the game when the jedi knights can out dps us in viglance and have heavy armor. While there will be people coming in here to post how great the sentinel class is, the truth is we are not. We are easily kitable in pvp and have no surivability in pve or pvp. I have been in PVP matches where sentinels are at 40+ swearing they can own anyone and get taken out quickly by bounty hunters and sorcerors and agents. Jedi knights with vigilance can out dps you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NovaGame Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Your offhand is busy wielding an extra saber. You don't have the focus to be directing force blasts on top of your swordplay. Sheathe your extra saber if you want to force push... Owait they call that the guardian. lol Then i guess we should do double damage than something that holds 1 saber since we strike with two Seriously tho ,i don't think we need Force Push ,i agree it is a nice utility but Guardians should keep some unique tricks,we got our own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenDisarray Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Honestly, why do we need Force Push? We are a melee class. I can see all Consulars having this, but really only Sages should. I would like to it this ability, cause why not, it's fun. But I only see us having it if it didn't work on players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaerion Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Honestly, why do we need Force Push? We are a melee class. I can see all Consulars having this, but really only Sages should. I would like to it this ability, cause why not, it's fun. But I only see us having it if it didn't work on players. Eh, one possible upside would be for the people who don't have reduced Force Leap range...could give them a chance to use it again for free focus. Also, for lols. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionflash Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 End Game Spoiler Question... I heard that in the flashpoint where you fight Darth Malgus, he becomes immune to damage once he is at something like 5% HP and the only way to kill him is with a knockback ability, kocking him off the platform. How does a sentinel kill Darth Malgus with no knockback abilities... Not that you'd run a FP with only Sentinels, but I can see a 4 man group reduced to only 1 or 2 players... Sentinels. A bit awkward, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBirkhofer Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 End Game Spoiler Question... I heard that in the flashpoint where you fight Darth Malgus, he becomes immune to damage once he is at something like 5% HP and the only way to kill him is with a knockback ability, kocking him off the platform. How does a sentinel kill Darth Malgus with no knockback abilities... Not that you'd run a FP with only Sentinels, but I can see a 4 man group reduced to only 1 or 2 players... Sentinels. A bit awkward, no? failed to beat that guy the other day for just that reason. Was kindof in infuriating. Tank+healer should both have KB though. So while I and the other sent could do nothing, they should have been able to. Our tank was a bit ... special however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AstralProjection Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 This, mostly. Yeah, as melee DPS the idea of Force Push is counterproductive at times. The only time I'd like to have it is for Huttball/Voidstar/World PVP where I would like to push people to their doom because it is just so enjoyable. I guess snaring them on a fire trap will have to do for now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daxr Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Your offhand is busy wielding an extra saber. You don't have the focus to be directing force blasts on top of your swordplay. Sheathe your extra saber if you want to force push... Owait they call that the guardian. lol Starkiller could do it, among other things. in Jedi Academy the main character could do it if he was dual wielding. It's apparently not impossible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinasa Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 +1 I'm now at 50 and the final battle of my story made it clear that Sentinel is not survivable in this game. Of course all Jedi who reach Master should have Force Push. It's very Un-Star Wars not to have this. And given how weak this class seems to be from all I see and read, we certainly need it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionflash Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Starkiller could do it, among other things. in Jedi Academy the main character could do it if he was dual wielding. It's apparently not impossible. Blade Storm Is the perfect example of a Jedi with his hands full trying to use force abilities. Although it isn't a proper 'Force Push' it does cause enemies killed by the attack to suffer a 'Pushed' death animation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hizoka Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 We are jedi, all jedi have force push cause smart melee players know that opening a gap for someone who can hit you at range is dumb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hezakia Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 cause smart melee players know that opening a gap for someone who can hit you at range is dumb +1 Why would you want to push someone out of melee range, when you are melee? so they can range you while you try and close the gap you just created? We have more then enough Defensive cooldowns to blow to keep us alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBirkhofer Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) cause smart melee players know that opening a gap for someone who can hit you at range is dumb smart melee players can think of a million situations where you do in fact want to do just that. Protect allies. such as, pushing an op away from someone they just knocked down. Push someone channeling a melee hit away. Such as, ravage/master strike with root attached. Or a focus sent/jugg about to force sweep. Interrupt any channel/cast. Push someone into a wall/corner to prevent escape. Push someone off a platform/ledge. Push sniper/gunslinger out of cover, if hunker down is not up. Push someone that is using line of sight to avoid damage from your team, into line of sight. Push someone that is running towards a pvp buff, heal,speed, etc, away from buff. Push someone away from you, so you can 1v1 someone else, instead of having 2 people beat on you. Push someone INTO aoe. Push someone into the range of a rooted ally. Leap onto sorc. walk behind. push sorc INTO your allies. Set up a push+leap combo. Edited January 11, 2012 by MBirkhofer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hizoka Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 +1 I'm now at 50 and the final battle of my story made it clear that Sentinel is not survivable in this game. Of course all Jedi who reach Master should have Force Push. It's very Un-Star Wars not to have this. And given how weak this class seems to be from all I see and read, we certainly need it. i lose barely over 1/3 my HP on that fight... guess you just did it wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenDisarray Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 smart melee players can think of a million situations where you do in fact want to do just that. Protect allies. such as, pushing an op away from someone they just knocked down. Push someone channeling a melee hit away. Such as, ravage/master strike with root attached. Or a focus sent/jugg about to force sweep. Interrupt any channel/cast. Push someone into a wall/corner to prevent escape. Push someone off a platform/ledge. Push sniper/gunslinger out of cover, if hunker down is not up. Push someone that is using line of sight to avoid damage from your team, into line of sight. Push someone that is running towards a pvp buff, heal,speed, etc, away from buff. Push someone away from you, so you can 1v1 someone else, instead of having 2 people beat on you. Push someone INTO aoe. Push someone into the range of a rooted ally. Leap onto sorc. walk behind. push sorc INTO your allies. Set up a push+leap combo. A lot of those scenarios are for utility, how much of a utility class is a Sentinel? And a couple others are for interrupt. We already have what, two or three interrupts? We aren't going to get another one, and we shouldn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zekid Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 I am one to vote that the sentinel is not broken. However having a move that moved some1 in pvp would be nice since we cant stun or move people. Every other class can do one of these. We can do neither. (I dont count force statis because we cant exactly prawn someone while they are held now can we?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pangwl Posted January 11, 2012 Share Posted January 11, 2012 Set up a push+leap combo. +1 You're on the same page with me. Also, if the JS have force push we can do push + leap combo = Generates more focus.... oh yeah, how about that smart melee people, hello? I don't see how is that not useful and better for us to DPS higher. A lot of those scenarios are for utility, how much of a utility class is a Sentinel? More utilities = better 'opportunity' to create higher + better + more consistent DPS. And a couple others are for interrupt. We already have what, two or three interrupts? We aren't going to get another one, and we shouldn't. I can only think of, 1) force kick, 2) Stasis, 3) Sweep -- which doesn't work only works on normal mobs and have no effect on PvP, strong, elite, champion mobs. 4) AWE - which get cancels right away when u start hitting; unless you AWE + Camouflage, it's not as useful as force push can be. I'd like if they (BW Combat Team) imbue Blade storm with a shorter version of force push for Jedi Sentinel... E.g. Blade storm (dmg) + 6 Meter KnockBack... and since it's an individual skill, it's not OverPowering, much more balance since it's not a true CC. This would instantaneously encourages us to use our Dispatch + Crippling throw, because it's within the short push distance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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