I think patch 1.1 is going to force me out :(

[solistus]

A nonsensical argument. All a PvP server does is enable no-consent PvP in certain zones. It doesn't mean its players don't want to PvP, nor does it hold exclusive the sort of structured PvP that actually contains something resembling depth.

 

The whole idea of a PvP server is actually pretty pointless, but that's a rant for somewhere else.

 

The point isn't that he's trying to do something that is only *possible* on a PvP server. It's just that the overwhelming majority of players who focus heavily on PvP play on PvP servers. A lot of people roll on PvP servers even though they don't care about non-consensual world PvP (or even view it as a downside), because they know that's where the structured PvP community will be as well.

 

There are certainly exceptions on both extremes - structured PvP fans who hate world PvP and roll on a PvE server to avoid it, and people who don't care about WZs but like the idea of fighting enemy faction players they encounter while doing their PvE content so they roll on PvP. My perspective is probably biased as a more 'hardcore' competitive player, but at least in the hardcore/enthusiast community, PvP is the norm and you'll get made fun of for rolling on PvE, no matter what kind of content you spend most of your time playing. PvE servers are generally seen as an 'easymode' or 'carebear' server for bad players who only do solo PvE content and don't like to be challenged. That's obviously an unfair generalization, but it's one a lot of hardcore MMO players make.

 

OP is interested mostly in structured PvP, and the things he's worried/unhappy about are that his PvE server doesn't have a strong structured PvP community and that being at level cap will make the situation worse once 50s are in their own PvP bracket. Rolling an alt on a PvP server and PvPing in the 10-49 range seems like a perfectly reasonable suggestion. It's the quickest way to get him playing the content he says he wants to be playing. The potential problems he's concerned about are all ultimately about the pool of players that will be available for WZ queueing. The only things he can do on his end that will change that are to play on a character that is in a different level range (i.e., a non-50 instead of a 50) and/or on a different server with a bigger WZ-playing community.

 

Tl;DR: the actual game mechanic difference between PvP and PvE servers is fairly minor and doesn't affect how WZs work, but at the end of the day, players who like PvP almost always roll on a PvP server.

[RamataKahn]

I love how people take 1/5 of a quote and turn it into something it isn't to call it a fail...

 

Rolling a new character on a PvP server 'in the interim' is a very realistic short term solution for a player who is one of the few 50's on a PvE server and is having issues finding PvP matches.

 

There is absolutely nothing 'fail' about that answer.

 

Not being able to play your 50 due to bad game design and lack of options is actually fail.

 

Yes it sure is.

[Dabrixmgp]

For a person that mainly PvPs you probably shouldn't have rolled on a PvE server.

 

I dont see a problem with that. In Rift and WoW I mainly PvPed but rolled on a PvE server because communities are terrible on those games' PvP servers. They are full of nothing but trolls who think they are better than everyone else and require unrealistic requirements for premades. But I had no problems at all queuing, enjoying, and winning PvP matches on a PvE server. Also its nice to not be on a server where everyone tries to be an elitist.

 

Telling someone to roll an alt on another server or saying "You leveled too fast" is just dumb. Who are you to dictate how someone else plays the game? BioWare should have known people would powergame to max level yet they did nothing to prepare for it. Also what if you rolled on a PvE server because thats where your RL friends went but they dont enjoy PvP? Are you supposed to abandon your real friends just so you can pvp? Other games that have BGs/WZs whatever cluster them so why cant this game do the same. BioWare had dozens of other MMOs to look to for ideas and years of production yet they ignored all of them.

Edited January 12, 2012 by Dabrixmgp

[cozzE]

Please Stephen Reid, I beg of you: Do NOT bring Cross-Realm pvp into the game. It helps undermine server community in a HUGE way !

[RamataKahn]

Please Stephen Reid, I beg of you: Do NOT bring Cross-Realm pvp into the game. It helps undermine server community in a HUGE way !

 

No it doesn't.

[oredith]

No it doesn't.

 

thank you for the well articulated and evidence laden argument.. here's an equally articulate response to your position:

 

poop

[Mfpluna]

Congrats on the 50.

 

Your server isn't 'dead' by any means, but it's a lower population server than some others. The good news is, the population is growing daily as more people buy the game and get online (we can see the growth). However, you're right in that the number of level 50 players is going to be small and won't increase dramatically in a short period of time.

 

Cross-server queuing for PvP is something that the development team wants to happen, but it's not going to be available in the near future. In the interim, you might want to try re-rolling a new character, either on your own server or another server (perhaps a PvP server?). On your own server, you'll be able to PvP all the way from L10 to L49 without any issue, and by the time you get close to the cap you can see how the L50 Warzone 'scene' is. On another server - especially a PvP server - you may find a more PvP-centric community.

 

 

 

NO CROSS REALM PVP! NO CROSS REALM PVP! NO CROSS REALM ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

IT WILL KILL SERVER COMMUNITY!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I like knowing people on the server by their reputation. Its already happening. Our guild is getting know the good players from other guilds, who to watch out for. who are the good and terrible pvpers. Some people have already built names for themselves and I and other people love that stuff, its very nostalgic old school mmo where you start to know everyone.

 

CROSS SERVER WILL KILL THIS GAME AND I WILL CANCEL SUBSCRIPTION THE SECOND YOU IMPLEMENT THIS. I SWEAR.

[oredith]

CROSS SERVER WILL KILL THIS GAME AND I WILL CANCEL SUBSCRIPTION THE SECOND YOU IMPLEMENT THIS. I SWEAR.

you don't have to swear..

 

i don't think bioware doubts your threat, but i think their decision makers are also bean counters. i have a feeling their bean counters are seeing a few pennies more per person with the cross-realm pvp, than to keep to their original promise.

 

accountants, the destroyer of dreams..

[Dabrixmgp]

I dont see how cross server anything kills your community. In WoW no one forces you to use /LFD or /LFR to get a group. Also you can still form premades even with cross server PvP so it wont stop you from grouping with friends. But I have to agree they are needed. People who decide to play on a low population PvE server that like some casual PvP shouldnt be punished by ridiculous queue times.

 

Also I like to log in on late hours because sometimes I cant sleep at like 3-5 am. Even though Im on a heavy server during primetime its pretty dead at those hours and its impossible to get a pvp queue to pop. In WoW I can log on at any hour of the day and get into a BG.

 

Playing with strangers is FAR BETTER than sitting in fleet praying your queue will pop.

[RamataKahn]

Communities aren't built in WZs.

[RamataKahn]

I WILL CANCEL SUBSCRIPTION THE SECOND YOU IMPLEMENT THIS. I SWEAR.

 

No one cares.

[Jessabeans]

I was really hoping the patch would have things like a fix for the Darth Jadus fight, the missing Jedi Sage and other companions. The missing companion customizations, a fix for 5 inch tall NPCs in cut scenes, a fix for eyelids and teeth sticking through faces in cut scenes. Return of Anisotropic filtering or a better way of lighting/improved textures.

 

But no... time to start rolling out max level raid content because no one really wants to play the other 49 levels right?

 

If MMOs are only going to roll out content exclusive to max level players then why bother having leveling at all?

Edited January 13, 2012 by Jessabeans

[oredith]

Communities aren't built in WZs.

 

you have obviously never played pre-cross-server AV then.

 

or wsg, or.. well, anything.

 

you build a name and legend in the WZ.

[Sandtrooper]

In another bit of irony, everyone tells the OP to re-roll or roll an alt, and he acts like its such a chore to level another character cause "he is so busy". Yet people are complaining about how easy it is to level and the OP hit 50 before most people on his server.

 

So either dude commited a good portion of time to beating everyone to 50 and found out its lonely at the top and now is sad about it. Or he's a casual player like he claims and then it should be easy for him to hit 50 rather quickly on a more populous server since it only took him alittle while to hit max level he really doesn't have all them much invested in his character.

 

But it only took him 42 hours. So if he is that awesome, he could have another maxed tune in 48 hours (the extra 6 hours could be used to take time to poop instead of needing to wear a diaper for almost 4 days ).

 

Seriously, 42 hours and doing all the side quests, watching all the cut scenes and doing all the dialogue? And having a normal life?

 

Seriously?

 

The OP should challenge someone to start with a brand new toon and race to level 50.

 

 

Sand

 

P.S. Seriously? 42 hours? 42/50=0.84, 60*0.84=50.4 minutes per level.

Edited January 13, 2012 by Sandtrooper

[Svelus]

i just hit 50 because i enjoyed the lving

[ZyloWolfBane]

All I got to say about this to the OP is that you picked a PvE server and are expecting people to want to PvP, this doesnt really sound like a Bioware problem.

 

This sounds like a you problem, derp less and reroll, the devs had the right answer for you in this situation.

[jedijuicer]

Two things for the OP:

 

(1) Roll a toon on a populated server

(2) Play the real game. PvP is and will always be a sideshow to the real game of PvE

[Jeedaix]

If, when it comes available, pay to transfer to a PvP server

[Nucairion]

im sorry but thats not the case, usually pve servers has NO pvp action

 

that is not true im on a pve server eu and i have leveled up mostly oding pvp, meeting some nice people on my server. pve servers have ppl pvping alot. i sometimes find 10-15 warzones between 1am through to 5am so pvp is not an issue on pve servers. the only problem is for pve servers while there maybe loads wanting to pvp many low lvls get put off doig it because of the constant face roll they get with oppsing teams have many lvl 50s with expertise gear

[Maxipad]

Um blame that on the fact that you STEAMROLL everyone else with your max rank abilities and 10 CCs every second. You deserve it.

 

You are a tool.

[Nucairion]

I personally think a 50s bracket is NEEDED, however it is to early for it.

 

I think Q times are really going to suffer

 

i unfortunatly have to disagree big time, it is not to early. the pve server im on pvp is facerolled with lvl 50s with pull champion/battlemaster and wzarzones become pointless when u get put against a full team of them. sooner 50s get there own warzones the better really. but that being said i have made some nice friends that are lvl 50 via pvping and it would be a shame not to pvp with them again until my char gets lvl 50.

 

the only way u could avoid this problem is either add proper pvp armour every 10 lvls for lower people so they have at least chance to win. the stat is wots making the pvp unfair not the lvl.

 

that said i do feel sorry for people on lower populated servers but thats the way it is. sometimes ur unfortunate to be on a low pop server but to single out u guys just so u can pvp will ruin it for the vast majority of others.

 

i also wonder if theres a hint of wanting warzones to stay way there are by the op coz he actually wants to facerole lowbies and gear up slightly quicker. all the lvl 50 pvpers i talk to want there own bracket, they dont find it much fun getting facerolls by oppsing team coz the enemy has more geared 50s. but also would rather the challange of an even fight

[RealAeiouy]

If they put it in cross server queuing, i'm quitting. It takes a bare minimum of effort to let 50's play with sub 50's, as I posted here (http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=162505) explaining how. Cross server queuing is just a destructive, and really, lazy developers way of avoiding dealing with the real issues that unbalance PVP at 50.

 

That thing ruined WoW and was in fact one of the final nails in the coffin of people actually speaking with each other on my server. I play MMO's for the community. Not to faceroll with a bunch of faceless goons. Thanks to people actually learning to socialize in TOR again, i've met more people who I group with here, then I have in the last year of WoW's "semi AFK" queue spamming system.

 

If I wanted to play with a bunch of faceless avatars, i'd go play Battlefield 3 or Counterstrike. Why would I ever want to sit through the destruction of another community thanks to cross server queues again?

 

 

 

 

Edit: And just to head off the trolls who think they know better. There's no issue of conceited players on here thinking I don't want to go "up against pros" or something. In fact, I typically roll with a premade against other premades given how borked the current system is, and I win far more matches then I ever lose.

 

I just don't want the system to go back to being a pointless grind that only exists for the inevitable carrot on the stick, like it's become in WOW. You had might as well go play a single player game with well designed bots, with a cross server queuing system up. It encourages a lack of communication, lack of good play, and lack of community on your server. It's crap.

 

Realize having world shards is just a lazy way of supporting a player base without just creating one massive world.

 

The only reason server communities exist because mmog developers have yet to come up with a way to defeat it. Since servers are an artificial limitation and has nothing to do with creating community what is wrong with expanding the playerbase you interact with? You are all still part of a larger community.

 

Developers should continue to increase the ways more players can interact. They should not cater to isolationists who erroneously believe players on their servers are different.

[RealAeiouy]

If you as a player wants to ensure a high number of people will be in queue for PvP, then do not roll your toon on a PvE server. The admin is right, he should reroll. Cross server PvP is an absolutely horrible idea that will kill what little sense of community this game has considering this game currently lacks realm forums.

 

 

People in PvP ops now are actually tolerable and even trainable to be better players. With cross faction PvP, you get people who can't be held accountable for their play and, with anonymity, become complete @uckwads. At least with same server PvP, horrible players can be crafted over time into better players through the constant shaming and guidance of the vets. This kind of reputation can only be built upon a community of players who play each other on a daily basis.

 

If BioWare was so concerned with cross-realm play, why not just make all servers share the instances of a planet. I could just shuttle to Republic Fleet (345) to meet up with my friends to run a flashpoint. Why? Because I play MMO's for the community and not the carrot on a stick grind that rakes in the cash for you, EA.

 

I, and many others, don't want our community ruined because YOU don't know how to roll a PvP toon on a PvP server.

 

Please tell me how you hold people accountable on your server. There are idiots on every server they are not being held accountable. Cross server pvp just makes the community bigger. You can't do anything to someone who just pvps and is a jerk so stop acting like limiting it to small populations is better. Personally I want to play against a more diverse group of players and teammates. This creates more interesting gameplay. If you are on a server where on side is not good then both sides suffer because of it. That is not good gameplay.

 

You can still play against others in open pvp. From an immersion standpoint fighting the same enemy over and over does not make sense.

 

Cross server pvp creates consistently better Warzone experiences for most players. It ends up being more competitive and more challenging.

 

They can do a lot with queues that promote server first then cluster than global but to only have the same 100 people pvping day in and day out no that is not a better experience.

 

In a game with two million players I want to be able to pvp against more than just the same 50 people all the time.

[Nucairion]

Realize having world shards is just a lazy way of supporting a player base without just creating one massive world.

 

The only reason server communities exist because mmog developers have yet to come up with a way to defeat it. Since servers are an artificial limitation and has nothing to do with creating community what is wrong with expanding the playerbase you interact with? You are all still part of a larger community.

 

Developers should continue to increase the ways more players can interact. They should not cater to isolationists who erroneously believe players on their servers are different.

 

well its been my expeirance that cross server pvp results in getting loads of different players everytime never playing with a community as you constantly playing with random people from other servers, not to mention once the warzone is done youll hardly get to talk to them again with the server difference,

 

keeping same server only pvp allows you to make friends and talk wth them on a daily basis also allowing to to group up with the in a warzone or meeting them in random one.

 

you can get to know more people on your server not to mention alot of people in cross server pvp in wow would simple go afk during it. same server pvp sure u still get the minority of people doing this but when you get to know your fellow pvpers youll be able to work better as a eam to win rather than get a bunch of solo players jsut working for themself.

 

that is jsut my opinion and each opinion has its own benefits and flaws. a benefit for cross server pvp would perhaps be less queue time but cause other issues. but same server pvp for me creates a better community inside it as you will be albe to get to know more people and talk with them daily

[CrystalCastles]

Congrats on the 50.

 

Your server isn't 'dead' by any means, but it's a lower population server than some others. The good news is, the population is growing daily as more people buy the game and get online (we can see the growth). However, you're right in that the number of level 50 players is going to be small and won't increase dramatically in a short period of time.

 

Cross-server queuing for PvP is something that the development team wants to happen, but it's not going to be available in the near future. In the interim, you might want to try re-rolling a new character, either on your own server or another server (perhaps a PvP server?). On your own server, you'll be able to PvP all the way from L10 to L49 without any issue, and by the time you get close to the cap you can see how the L50 Warzone 'scene' is. On another server - especially a PvP server - you may find a more PvP-centric community.