Do you support an in game version of Recount. Please give reasons for your answer.

[DragonAgeOrgins]

This thread won't DIE

 

Who seriously keep's bumping it EVERY DAY. It's making me have a massive head ache. All right again from the top. No to this tool, not because you think I suck. because I don't like a tool for you to use to yell at other's. Look at warcraft at what a nasty community. Secondly, why do we need to burn through content the second it comes out. And lasty, promotes cookie cutter clone build's.

 

So yea.

[Spynnal]

This thread won't DIE

 

Who seriously keep's bumping it EVERY DAY. It's making me have a massive head ache. All right again from the top. No to this tool, not because you think I suck. because I don't like a tool for you to use to yell at other's. Look at warcraft at what a nasty community. Secondly, why do we need to burn through content the second it comes out. And lasty, promotes cookie cutter clone build's.

 

So yea.

 

People keep posting, I see no bumps.

 

I'd like meters, but not for a single reason you listed. I enjoy them personally for self-improvement, nothing more.

 

To me, personally, it helps with talent and gear selection. Does my Sith Inquisitor get more bang for his buck speeding up casts? Should I focus instead on more willpower?

 

Meters let you try each, see how each affects your output, and helps me make informed opinions on things I'm otherwise a little lost on.

 

Has nothing to do with groups, instances, or gauging others, at least to me.

[Israel]

You guys should fill out this survey when you get the chance. Link

[Brool]

do not support.

[universeman]

I'd like meters, but not for a single reason you listed. I enjoy them personally for self-improvement, nothing more.

 

Unfortunately, if these "meters" are in game, they will be used for other reasons by other people. And it will change the community (for good or bad I don't know: probably both).

 

So, we need to look at the big picture when it comes to adding/changing anything. Will it do more harm than good? Possibly.

[Hakagan]

I would certain love to see a combat log introduced into the game that would possibly be able to be exported to create a site for SWTOR like World of Logs.

 

It would help immensely with theorycrafting side of things.

[Hairless]

Recount, damage meters, et...

I personally prefer to play a game, not play to a meter.

 

Hah. So you can't play a game if the scores are disclosed? It somehow becomes not a game anymore?

 

Funny how none of these people ever have a sensible reason.

[Dasamukha]

Yes.

 

1. It will help with the enjoyment of the game.

2. A Dps class's success or failure is defined by the amount of damage done. A method to track that information is valuable.

3. An in-game dps meter allows them (Bio) control the functionality of the meter.

 

I know that dps meters start down the road of elitism that ruins some of the experience for players. If Bio implements the meter, they can control functionality. I would suggest that dps meter be like a pvp score board, allow us the ability to measure our improvements as players, but don't allow it to control the game.

 

For the record, I am dead set against a wide spread mod system. I don't want a dbm clone especially. I think Bio will have a much easier time creating challenging encounters if they don't allow an add-on to tell the player what to do when.

 

But I am in favor of adding functionality in the user interface. I believe that the UI should be customizable to the player's desires so we control the "environment" in which we play. The UI is a part of my environment. The MMO player today is used to being able to change the scale and to move objects around on the screen to our liking. Building this functionality is not game breaking, but is going to be pretty important for the long term health of the game.

 

Edit: In response to the player above wanting a combat log. I certainly "hear" what you are saying. I have found myself dead a few times and wanted a combat log to look at and see. "How did that happen?" But the combat log is what starts the slide. Once you make the combat log available, you give the a mod builder the information to scan and and assemble. That's why BIO needs to implement the meter so they can keep the combat log separate.

Edited January 9, 2012 by Dasamukha

[Vindexus]

I think one of the things that often times get lost in this discussion is the Pandora's Box that gets opened once you reveal some of the black box info about how damage is dealt and healed. Once the lid comes off on what's best and what's we'll say, less than optimal, encounter tuning by the developers becomes much more difficult. I'm not necessarily saying that it's a bad thing, but it creates a greater divide between the haves and have-nots, when it comes to information.

Look at WoW. Players of that game have an exhaustive following who dissect every change and find out the optimal rotations. The problem there becomes all of a sudden, there is one and only one way to play. If you're a Maurader, you have to play a 31/7/3 Annihilation spec or whatever, because it does 5% more dps than the other specs. And so on, and so forth.

It creates a big problem on the developer end for them to create all specs to be equal and for all things to scale for a virtual limitless amount of factors. Why do you think WoW has rewritten its talent system 3 times in the last 3 expansions.

I'd rather have them spend development time in writing new compelling story arcs rather than open the door for them to follow along like every other MMO.

I think the biggest mistake that BioWare can make with the game is to do things like all the other MMOs, just because it has been done in the past.

[Hairless]

I will not let this die!

[GalacticKegger]

I will not let this die!

Apparently.

[Hairless]

Apparently.

 

Yea man. I got this thread bookmarked on my comp, laptop, and phone.

Bump 4 life.

[GalacticKegger]

Yea man. I got this thread bookmarked on my comp, laptop, and phone.

Bump 4 life.

hehe . . .

[Caraanam]

if they do allow it...for the love of god i hope they do not allow it be linked in chat of any kind...if its for personal use then so be it...otherwize..im so sick of lil boys linking their dmg reports all over the place...blah.!

 

i am for everyone doing their best and learning from their mistakes...and being ALL that they can BE!

[Thaed]

Noble goal. Anybody with half a brain realizes that it doesn't end up being used for this purpose. Anyone thinking it does, is quite delusional.

 

I managed to use it for those purposes for a few years.

 

I'm afraid that anyone who thinks not having dps meters will make for a better community is quite delusional. Idiots will be idiots regardless of the tools that they have to display their idiocy.

[Ritecud]

I think one of the things that often times get lost in this discussion is the Pandora's Box that gets opened once you reveal some of the black box info about how damage is dealt and healed. Once the lid comes off on what's best and what's we'll say, less than optimal, encounter tuning by the developers becomes much more difficult. I'm not necessarily saying that it's a bad thing, but it creates a greater divide between the haves and have-nots, when it comes to information.

Look at WoW. Players of that game have an exhaustive following who dissect every change and find out the optimal rotations. The problem there becomes all of a sudden, there is one and only one way to play. If you're a Maurader, you have to play a 31/7/3 Annihilation spec or whatever, because it does 5% more dps than the other specs. And so on, and so forth.

It creates a big problem on the developer end for them to create all specs to be equal and for all things to scale for a virtual limitless amount of factors. Why do you think WoW has rewritten its talent system 3 times in the last 3 expansions.

I'd rather have them spend development time in writing new compelling story arcs rather than open the door for them to follow along like every other MMO.

I think the biggest mistake that BioWare can make with the game is to do things like all the other MMOs, just because it has been done in the past.

 

Excellent post and I have to admit I tend to agree with you. Haven't seen it that way before.

[HalusW]

I think one of the things that often times get lost in this discussion is the Pandora's Box that gets opened once you reveal some of the black box info about how damage is dealt and healed. Once the lid comes off on what's best and what's we'll say, less than optimal, encounter tuning by the developers becomes much more difficult. I'm not necessarily saying that it's a bad thing, but it creates a greater divide between the haves and have-nots, when it comes to information.

Look at WoW. Players of that game have an exhaustive following who dissect every change and find out the optimal rotations. The problem there becomes all of a sudden, there is one and only one way to play. If you're a Maurader, you have to play a 31/7/3 Annihilation spec or whatever, because it does 5% more dps than the other specs. And so on, and so forth.

It creates a big problem on the developer end for them to create all specs to be equal and for all things to scale for a virtual limitless amount of factors. Why do you think WoW has rewritten its talent system 3 times in the last 3 expansions.

I'd rather have them spend development time in writing new compelling story arcs rather than open the door for them to follow along like every other MMO.

I think the biggest mistake that BioWare can make with the game is to do things like all the other MMOs, just because it has been done in the past.

 

Great post. Biiwate really does have enough on their plate without opening up Pandora's Box. I assume Blizzard is revamping the talent trees yet again for MOP?

[GalacticKegger]

DPS meters for me are a tool to see where I went wrong, and what we as a group can do better.

Would that not be a combat log? I would be in favor of a combat log as it's an excellent after the fact teaching tool. Edited January 10, 2012 by GalacticKegger

[Hairless]

I think one of the things that often times get lost in this discussion is the Pandora's Box that gets opened once you reveal some of the black box info about how damage is dealt and healed. Once the lid comes off on what's best and what's we'll say, less than optimal, encounter tuning by the developers becomes much more difficult. I'm not necessarily saying that it's a bad thing, but it creates a greater divide between the haves and have-nots, when it comes to information.

Look at WoW. Players of that game have an exhaustive following who dissect every change and find out the optimal rotations. The problem there becomes all of a sudden, there is one and only one way to play. If you're a Maurader, you have to play a 31/7/3 Annihilation spec or whatever, because it does 5% more dps than the other specs. And so on, and so forth.

It creates a big problem on the developer end for them to create all specs to be equal and for all things to scale for a virtual limitless amount of factors. Why do you think WoW has rewritten its talent system 3 times in the last 3 expansions.

I'd rather have them spend development time in writing new compelling story arcs rather than open the door for them to follow along like every other MMO.

I think the biggest mistake that BioWare can make with the game is to do things like all the other MMOs, just because it has been done in the past.

 

Well, what you are saying is already going to happen.

BW already confirmed we are getting combat logs. It is in the game, just not enabled.

I mean, of course it is in the game. How else would they do internal testing for balance and etc.

[Muckbeast]

no damage meters of any kind

[Fortrisgall]

No I don't support a version of Recount.

 

MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS!

 

Stop worrying about what other people are doing or wearing. Just focus on yourself.

[PjPablo]

No I don't support a version of Recount.

 

MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS!

 

Stop worrying about what other people are doing or wearing. Just focus on yourself.

 

It's an MMO. As soon as you join a group it ceases to be about you, the individual. It's now about the group.

 

Why is there so much fear on this thread? Are people really that afraid to be exposed for poor play? The first step in getting better is to realize where your opportunities lie and data helps with that. I never will understand the anti-data crowd.

[VaelMacoss]

I'll take a threat tracker first.

[Peccavi]

It's an MMO. As soon as you join a group it ceases to be about you, the individual. It's now about the group.

 

Why is there so much fear on this thread? Are people really that afraid to be exposed for poor play? The first step in getting better is to realize where your opportunities lie and data helps with that. I never will understand the anti-data crowd.

 

with groups of 4 and ops groups of 8 theres no room for error. with that in mind you can tell pretty quickly who fails and who doesn't. if the healer dies, then the tank fails if the tank dies the healer fails if the mobs dont die fast enough the dps sucks, you dont need a 3rd party parser to tell you that, you use your brain.

 

Unfortunately a lot of mmo players seem to be lacking one.

 

 

 

to add i played EQ 1 for a long time without any sort of add on, the only "add on" we had was to make the UI look a little cooler but that was it.

Edited January 10, 2012 by Peccavi

[Lightmgl]

I think one of the things that often times get lost in this discussion is the Pandora's Box that gets opened once you reveal some of the black box info about how damage is dealt and healed. Once the lid comes off on what's best and what's we'll say, less than optimal, encounter tuning by the developers becomes much more difficult. I'm not necessarily saying that it's a bad thing, but it creates a greater divide between the haves and have-nots, when it comes to information.

Look at WoW. Players of that game have an exhaustive following who dissect every change and find out the optimal rotations. The problem there becomes all of a sudden, there is one and only one way to play. If you're a Maurader, you have to play a 31/7/3 Annihilation spec or whatever, because it does 5% more dps than the other specs. And so on, and so forth.

It creates a big problem on the developer end for them to create all specs to be equal and for all things to scale for a virtual limitless amount of factors. Why do you think WoW has rewritten its talent system 3 times in the last 3 expansions.

I'd rather have them spend development time in writing new compelling story arcs rather than open the door for them to follow along like every other MMO.

I think the biggest mistake that BioWare can make with the game is to do things like all the other MMOs, just because it has been done in the past.

 

But having/not having a damage meter isn't the issue here. This same issue is going to arise any ways because of the DPS Hard Enrages that currently exist in all Hard Mode bosses in Flashpoints and all bosses in all difficulties of Operations. DPS is an issue because the encounter design has made it an issue.

 

Not being able to see whos doing what isn't gonna fix this. People are still gonna be encouraged to use specs that maximize DPS and play smart and build smart. The only problem now is that when you're hitting that enrage timer and wiping you have to guess as to why you missed it; Is it because the encounter is overtuned, is it because you are all bad, or is it because one of you is bad? Its even more amusing when fingers start getting pointed without the DPS meters to verify it. You end up with people getting very nasty and playing guessing games towards each other.

 

If you really don't want this style of play, then you need to shift the topic from whether or not there should be DPS meters to whether or not fights should have DPS checks....

 

Theres a reason that most PUGs are having a very hard time doing anything beyond Black Talon. Only a couple of fights are bugged, the rest are just so hard that your average person can't do enough DPS to burn them down properly at the moment before hitting the enrages....

Edited January 10, 2012 by Lightmgl