KhealThar Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 I think people need to go read up on what innovation actually is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaonnor Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 (edited) Answers in Blue. Oh and yeah, once your free 30 days is up, I expect to not see any post made by you. Please move along.... So basically... you're correcting me by saying there are in fact two stories. Congrats. Also, I am not arguing that there were no repeated lines. I am arguing that no matter the lines, on the same faction, the story is damn close to the same. If I say "Oh sure, I'll do the quest" or "Oh I guess you've coerced me into doing the quest" I still do the quest the same way... there is no change other than different ways of ending up in the same place. Also, this is highly irrelevant to talk about Doom being the best FPS or KOTOR being the best yada yada. The problem is that a game without innovation needs to at least be polished as much as its competitors... this game not only adds very little new, but it does everything it copies worse than the people who did it first. THAT is the real issue, not the innovation, but the simply bad gameplay. My 30 days were not free good sir, I paid for them as part of the $60 I paid for the game, same as you. I love these comments because they are like saying "Yea, well after we are done here in prison and you get out next week, I won't have to hear about you cause you'll be out there not wasting your time in prison and actually doing something fun with your money! Unlucky you!" Please move back to the game you all claim is so much fun and off the forums. Edited January 8, 2012 by Thaonnor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesleDarksyde Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 ------> Nope... Since we have stances in SWTOR as well. To try an diminish/minimize a clear cut innovation to a "stance", does not become you. Name me one other MMO that has a cover mechanic, where objects in the world are used for cover? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meltaman Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Nope it you who are the complainer here. This entire thread is a blatant example of your malcontent with the game. Yet you feel the need to make nonsensical threads looking for a reason to play the game because you cant bring yourself to go back to playing wow. Thats what all the complainers here are mad about, the fact that swtor isnt what they wanted but they cant go back to playing wow. Such a paradox, its almost comical. Shame we cannot summon the Foot of Gork to stomp him and the rest of his kind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeinasindorei Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Alright, so you apparently, mistakenly, think that the cover system is innovative. Granted, it is a bold step, but it is really nothing more than a glorified stealth mode/WoW stance hybrid. The cover-ability mechanics function the same way stealth and stance mechanics in WoW do. Add to that that it ACTUALLY DOESN'T WORK. There's tons of things broken with it momentarily, especially in PvP where it is next to useless. What use is cover against a force-charging Jedi Knight? The fact that you can't force charge someone who is on cover. Cover is not the same as stealth. Not even close. You're just being obtuse for the purpose of being a troll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vecke Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Folks have pointed out features that are - by definition - innovative. Being able to send your companion to craft while you continue playing the game is an innovation. Giving pets personalities and backstories is - by definition - an innovation. Using a cover system instead of stealth is an innovation. Making 100% of the quests cinematic with cutscenes is an innovation. They might be - in your opinion - really crappy innovations, but they are, by definition, innovations. You asked a question and it was answered successfully. You can disagree with the quality of the innovations, but I think it's disingenuous to deny they're innovations at all. So I ask again. What innovations would you like to have seen added that couldn't be denied in the same sideways manner you denied the innovations posted by others? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majestic_Jazz Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 My pets don't have stories nor contribute to conversations. Plus only two classes have them. Nor can I trust my pets in WoW to interrupt and taunt without manually telling them to. I tried telling my pet to go collect some rare materials for me while I ran flags in WSG. He just stared at me. I tried to learn to make blues by destroying my greens in WoW. Turns out that isn't possible. Face it, you're just a stubborn WoW fan who refuses or ignores any reasonable attempt to answer your previous question. All you're trying to do is rally support for your own stubborn opinion. I'm beginning to think you don't even know what innovative means. 100% on point, and it is funny how Xugos ignores any reply that has much sense behind it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mezlabor Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Good Goood let the Hate flow through you! In all honesty innovation hasnt really sold that well in mmos recently. The biggest success recently is Rift which is pretty much a direct copy of wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricOF Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 What are you talking about? Yes, they copied SOME things from previous MMO's. But 99% of the things in WoW are very original. And let's face it, without WoW, SWTOR would NEVER have existed. LOLOLOLOLOLOL. You couldn't have played many MMOs before WoW. All it did was take all forms of advancement and speed it up by an order of about 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majestic_Jazz Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Folks have pointed out features that are - by definition - innovative. Being able to send your companion to craft while you continue playing the game is an innovation. Giving pets personalities and backstories is - by definition - an innovation. Using a cover system instead of stealth is an innovation. Making 100% of the quests cinematic with cutscenes is an innovation. They might be - in your opinion - really crappy innovations, but they are, by definition, innovations. You asked a question and it was answered successfully. You can disagree with the quality of the innovations, but I think it's disingenuous to deny they're innovations at all. So I ask again. What innovations would you like to have seen added that couldn't be denied in the same sideways manner you denied the innovations posted by others? Well said! At this point, Xugos is just fighting a fight that he knows he cannot win. He asked a question, people answered, and now he is trying to challenge their answers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeinasindorei Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 I think people need to go read up on what innovation actually is. Creating a better or more efficient model of something that already exists. SWTOR has better or more efficient questing, crafting, and companions than any other MMO. Plus it has cover, which no other MMO has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesleDarksyde Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 (edited) I think people need to go read up on what innovation actually is. Also very true... I'll help here and give a real world example... In the old days we had cross ply tyres. The steel thread in the tyre ran from one bead (inside ring of the tyre) across the tread face at an angle, to the other bead. And it would also run in the opposite direction at an opposing angle. So the steel threads made a criss-cross pattern on the tread face of the tyre. Later we made them radial. The steel thread ran straight from one bead to the other, perpendicular with the tread. This was hailed as one of the biggest innovations in tyre structure design. The are called radial tyres. And you'll battle to find a cross ply for cars these days. Buth designs are still just tyres, with a minor change to it's internal structure. That's innovation. Edited January 8, 2012 by DesleDarksyde Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricOF Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 No, not quite. Each class has a minor side-story chain that doesn't even grant them most of the experience required to level up. Most of your experience comes from generic, "hey, do me a favor and I'll give you some soup" quests. WoW had class quests as well, and dear I say, they were quite marvelous, unique, and compelling. Try again. They were gargabe. People don't even bother to read them. Blizzard couldn't tell a story worthing of entertaining a three year old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masaville Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 This game is utterly boring. Cool for the first while, then unbelievably dull. It makes me want to go and watch TV or read or book or do anything other than play. Clearly, it's not going to last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aghyarian Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 But 99% of the things in WoW are very original Hang on let me go play dungeons and dragons Oh my god this is EXACTLY like WoW! Stupid table-top game from the 70s copying WoW. No originality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majestic_Jazz Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Creating a better or more efficient model of something that already exists. SWTOR has better or more efficient questing, crafting, and companions than any other MMO. Plus it has cover, which no other MMO has. Add to the list: - Voice Overs - Cinematic Storytelling - Interactive Dialog Of course these aren't innovations to gaming as they have been in games like Mass Effect and Deus Ex, but for MMOs, they are innovative Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yodimaster Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 What are you talking about? Yes, they copied SOME things from previous MMO's. But 99% of the things in WoW are very original. And let's face it, without WoW, SWTOR would NEVER have existed. Name 1 thing WoW really innovated..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricOF Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 No....WoW had the same amount of content as SWTOR now in 2004 (which isn't much) but they didn't have to compete with other HUGE games. WoW was very original at the time. There were only a handful of previous MMO's out there, and they weren't even that popular. So the definition of original isn't to be original but to merely do something after a few others do it but don't get as much attention for doing it. That's some kind of "original." WoW copied everything ever seen in MMOs prior and just made them easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majestic_Jazz Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Oh also, one that everyone forgot to mention......group dialog! NO VIDEOGAME EVER has created a system where people online can engage in an interactive conversation. Again, this is more than an innovation to MMOs, but to gaming! Imagine single player games like Mass Effect or Deus Ex in the future having multiplayer co-op modes where their avatar is in the same conversation as another online avatar and having their choice being played out in real time. Never been done before.......and that is something that SWTOR innovates on. Now I am waiting for Xugos or any other troll to deny that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rohanshot Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 You caught me. There are two different stories in this game. Empire and Republic. Still not the 8 stories that they claim. ...So what your saying is that a Trooper, a battle hardened soldier, has the same story as a Jedi Knight, a force using warrior? Or that a Sith Inquisitor, a manipulative slave working his way into power, has the same story as an Imperial Agent, a behind-the-scenes special agent? Even the two jedi and sith classes have different stories. A Sith Inquisitor as I said, is a slave who is demeaned by his superiors and is showing he is the most dangerous one by continuously making himself powerful. On the other hand, a Sith Warrior is the pampered warrior, respected and revered by many, taking out dangerous threats to the empire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vydor_HC Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 In it's simplest terms, innovation just means change, but in general usage it's normally associated with making things better, and more efficient. I haven't seen anything in this game that goes down that road. However, that doesn't mean the game is bad. It's still pretty damn fun to play. Plus, with the IP and gigantic fan base the SW franchise provides, Bioware merely needed to deliver a game that is playable to reap huge rewards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesleDarksyde Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 And since Xugos is in Hindenburg mode... Just doing damage control, as the innovations are pointed out, and he refuses to adress those points, I'll simply restate mine.... Yep, I love sending my pets in Wow on missions to gather mats, craft stuff, or collect gold.I always have 3 pets out on missions (In Wow), while I keep one to fight with me. I also love the pet-story lines in WoW!They are really cool, don't you think? Oh and... Cover mechanic... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricOF Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Well said! At this point, Xugos is just fighting a fight that he knows he cannot win. He asked a question, people answered, and now he is trying to challenge their answers! SWTOR has gotten off to a good start. It might be a threat. WoWers have to kill the nascent threat! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaonnor Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Oh also, one that everyone forgot to mention......group dialog! NO VIDEOGAME EVER has created a system where people online can engage in an interactive conversation. Again, this is more than an innovation to MMOs, but to gaming! Imagine single player games like Mass Effect or Deus Ex in the future having multiplayer co-op modes where their avatar is in the same conversation as another online avatar and having their choice being played out in real time. Never been done before.......and that is something that SWTOR innovates on. Now I am waiting for Xugos or any other troll to deny that. I don't deny that this is innovation... I just think it is ****** innovation for an MMORPG where the majority of content is repeated. I find that even in the first play through, I tended to be pressured by group members to simply skip through, as no one wants to be waiting on the 1 member of the group who wants to read the dialogue that anyone who is repeating the flashpoint has seen 30 times already... So innovation yes... just not a very thoughtful innovation for the genre in which they are innovating in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scfs Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 Name 1 thing WoW really innovated..? Hmmm. I'll go with, having a cash shop in a p2p game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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