Cyphen Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) Making players drop Merc/Champ tokens would make the kill trading problem even worse, not better. The simple solution is to lock access to a planet until you've unlocked it via your class story. That would shut down the trading immediately. Not if you can make it so that if you kill the same players over and over, they will no longer reward you with the commendations. Example. I kill player A and he drops 5 gold. Player A respawns but I kill him again, he drops 2 gold.Same thing but this time he drops 0 gold, he now enters a state where he wont reward you with any gold for 15minutes. Also, players 10 levels below you, would NOT drop anything, maybe reward you with small amounts of Valor, but no commendations/money. Locking planets until class story completion would make it even more linear. Some people may skip ahead of the story etc... etc... This is not a solution, rather then sweeping an issue under a rug. If this kind of behaviour continues after a month or two when more 50s appear, then they should do something about it. As of now, I don't see a problem considering there is faction imbalance on most servers. When we see groups of 4+ we attack them, but when I see lone republic guy and I need the daily I get the mission done before jumping him. Edited January 2, 2012 by Cyphen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miotoss Posted January 2, 2012 Author Share Posted January 2, 2012 I can live with a lot of things cheating and exploiting isnt one of them. I rolled to play the game the same people using the easy way to do things are the same ones that will whine and complain they have nothing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashane Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Not if you can make it so that if you kill the same players over and over, they will no longer reward you with the commendations. Example. I kill player A and he drops 5 gold. Player A respawns but I kill him again, he drops 2 gold.Same thing but this time he drops 0 gold, he now enters a state where he wont reward you with any gold for 15minutes. Also, players 10 levels below you, would NOT drop anything, maybe reward you with small amounts of Valor, but no commendations/money. Locking planets until class story completion would make it even more linear. Some people may skip ahead of the story etc... etc... This is not a solution, rather then sweeping an issue under a rug. You really dont think that someone who rolled up alts to trade objectives (and both sides do it), woudnt simply take the next step trade kills with other 50's? Really??? The smart ones are already making friends on the other side and trading objectives that way, its a very small step to trade kills to maximize your gear score gain. As to locking players in, it is a solution and I'm pretty sure you'll see it come rather soon. The main issue right now is the creation of alts and using those to cap objectives. The easiest solution from a coding perspective is obvious. I would wager to guess that few of the majority of the player base skips ahead of the story. Primarily because its the main selling point of the game. You have to remember your a minority, I'm a minority, etc. The majority dont even post here and probably never will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyphen Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) I can live with a lot of things cheating and exploiting isnt one of them. I rolled to play the game the same people using the easy way to do things are the same ones that will whine and complain they have nothing to do. It depends if Bioware defines it. What players are suppose to go without completing the weekly/daily for the whole week? Id understand if its 2 - 3 months down the line, but the game has only been out for half a month. I did it, but I also kill Republic when I see them. You really dont think that someone who rolled up alts to trade objectives (and both sides do it), woudnt simply take the next step trade kills with other 50's? Really??? The smart ones are already making friends on the other side and trading objectives that way, its a very small step to trade kills to maximize your gear score gain. As to locking players in, it is a solution and I'm pretty sure you'll see it come rather soon. The main issue right now is the creation of alts and using those to cap objectives. The easiest solution from a coding perspective is obvious. I would wager to guess that few of the majority of the player base skips ahead of the story. Primarily because its the main selling point of the game. You have to remember your a minority, I'm a minority, etc. The majority dont even post here and probably never will. They would roll alts and log them so that the other player would kill them? As Iv said, the suggestion I posted could be account wide. Not rewarding players for wPvP is stupid. Maybe create quests which are repeatable and require you to kill X amount of players for Valor and Commendations. I can bet you there won't be any planetary locking before X levels. Think about twinks, sure minority but people aren't un-subscribing because they can enter higher areas before they should. They would surely un-subscribe if they could not enter higher areas before completing their class story, probably minority but still. Minority, well define minority. Below 10%, 20%, 30%? Edited January 2, 2012 by Cyphen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-sith_hunter- Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 awwww... great.... now I'm gonna have to raise an army to wage war on cheaters on Ilum. Think 30-50 players could stop it if they tried to have people there all the time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashane Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) I can bet you there won't be any planetary locking before X levels. Think about twinks, sure minority but people aren't un-subscribing because they can enter higher areas before they should. They would surely un-subscribe if they could not enter higher areas before completing their class story, probably minority but still. Minority, well define minority. Below 10%, 20%, 30%? Your second sentence is off. While they may not be "technically" unsubbing, they are getting banned, therefor having their sub forceably canceled. You should see a post on it by Stephen (or another yellow) today or tomorrow that I think will clear up exactly what's going to happen to those flipping these zones like that (Per reddit) /Edit/ An there it is... http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=1060894#edit1060894 "Some adjustments will be made to Ilum in the near future to discourage future exploits. However, the planet is still open to anyone who wishes to travel there." Edited January 2, 2012 by Ashane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xanxari Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Getting harrassed over chat because we chose to play the game right and actually take pride in killing the other faction. Pride is enough to kill the other faction. and you miss the point, the game is flawed, a complete fail when it comes to world pvp, no need to kill anyone just stand there and get you daily and move away and do arena, i like huttball, but i wont keep me playing for 2 month, and i cant PvE for every single flashpoint or operation is broken... so GG on the endgame. i knew they would fail endgame content, but i did love the lvling. so i wont QQ over it il just wait and hope they will get there act together so i can enjoy some endgame in a okey starwars game...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniacal Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Report them immediately. People ARE getting banned for it, an entire guild got disbanded on my server so I'd imagine it's happening elsewhere. It may not be a glitch, but it is the very definition of an exploit, and they are punishing for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eroiqua Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 The smart ones are already making friends on the other side and trading objectives that way, its a very small step to trade kills to maximize your gear score gain. As to locking players in, it is a solution and I'm pretty sure you'll see it come rather soon. The main issue right now is the creation of alts and using those to cap objectives. The easiest solution from a coding perspective is obvious. Maybe the alt thing is an issue on your server...I have yet to see a sub-50 in Ilum on mine. It's not even about making friends on the other side. Whatever random Imperial I come across is in the trading mindset. I killed a guy the first day I was in Ilum; he didn't fight back. He came back, didn't fight the second time, either, so I stopped attacking when he was at half and we traded. The 50's don't fight. There is no point. One more thing that I don't think was mentioned yet...even when you're not at the same objective standing next to a member, you can still easily trade due to the stupid design decision where any objective is able to be capped, at any time, no matter the state of the others that come before it. For one daily I actually scored all five caps without even seeing a red. Someone was around capping them back, but I never saw that player. Is it also an exploit that I chose to travel down the east side of the zone and the other player chose to travel up the west? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saitek Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Report them immediately. People ARE getting banned for it, an entire guild got disbanded on my server so I'd imagine it's happening elsewhere. It may not be a glitch, but it is the very definition of an exploit, and they are punishing for it. I doubt that. Anyways, this will be a Non issue when more republic get 50. The only reason ppl have to do it now is because there is usualy a grand total of 1-2 republic ever on Ilum at a time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vant Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Where can I send screenshots of people win trading on Illum? I have about 20 or so people who include people below 50 win trading. Actually it IS a banning offense. It exploits game mechanics (anything that goes against or beyond a particular game feature's intended use is exploiting). The problem is that it is hard to prove. Show screenshots of people talking about it and report. Have the devs investigate it. I think it's incredibly asinine and lazy personally. What's the point in going to a PvP battle and not PvPing? Stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roycerson Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Is it also an exploit that I chose to travel down the east side of the zone and the other player chose to travel up the west? No it is not. Not a fair question either considering the video that was posted. No one is talking about playing the game as it was intended and just not running into anyone, hasn't been mentioned before so why are you inventing it as a straw man? IT IS clearly exploiting when Jabotookiller is specifically asked NOT to kill the other side because he is capping for them. It is clearly completely out of control when the guy who chooses not to take part in the cheating as he was specifically requested to do by the other player is then openly chastised in general chat... for NOT cheating with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eroiqua Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 (edited) No it is not. Not a fair question either considering the video that was posted. No one is talking about playing the game as it was intended and just not running into anyone, hasn't been mentioned before so why are you inventing it as a straw man? IT IS clearly exploiting when Jabotookiller is specifically asked NOT to kill the other side because he is capping for them. It is clearly completely out of control when the guy who chooses not to take part in the cheating as he was specifically requested to do by the other player is then openly chastised in general chat... for NOT cheating with them. What video? I see no video in this thread. I also see no post by Jabotookiller in this thread. No straw man. I'm addressing the claim by posters in *this* thread that any form of objective trading--any time one player chooses not to kill an enemy player in Ilum and instead caps a point then moves on while the enemy recaps behind--is exploiting. Edited January 2, 2012 by Eroiqua Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eloco Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 People grassing others up like 6 year old girls. Ilum isnt a warzone, its a ghost town, most of my time ingame is spent in Ilum, sat there crafting until a Republic shows up, then I take the nodes. If 'win trading' gave any kind of benefit then you may have a point, but it doesnt, so just shut up, stop wasting peoples time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deresdod Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 This should not be a bannable offense. On a pvp server we're stuck 50:1 empire to republic...its horribly poor design and theres nothing wrong with what these people are doing. Theres NO benefit to pvping in a the biggest PVP zone in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelKage Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 No it is not. Not a fair question either considering the video that was posted. No one is talking about playing the game as it was intended and just not running into anyone, hasn't been mentioned before so why are you inventing it as a straw man? IT IS clearly exploiting when Jabotookiller is specifically asked NOT to kill the other side because he is capping for them. It is clearly completely out of control when the guy who chooses not to take part in the cheating as he was specifically requested to do by the other player is then openly chastised in general chat... for NOT cheating with them. No one CAN force me to attack another player if i don't want to do it ... yeah Illum is dead right now and nobody in their right mind is attacking the other faction ... just witing for capping ... at least no imperial ever attacked me ( pretty imbalanced server about 1 rep for every 6 imps) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STD_Skindancer Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 People grassing others up like 6 year old girls. Ilum isnt a warzone, its a ghost town, most of my time ingame is spent in Ilum, sat there crafting until a Republic shows up, then I take the nodes. If 'win trading' gave any kind of benefit then you may have a point, but it doesnt, so just shut up, stop wasting peoples time. QFT if winning ilum made any sort of difference at all then people would be fighting for control of it. personally i think the daily/week was designed incorrectly and forces players to trade nodes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roycerson Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 What video? I see no video in this thread. I also see no post by Jabotookiller in this thread. No straw man. I'm addressing the claim by posters in *this* thread that any form of objective trading--any time one player chooses not to kill an enemy player in Ilum and instead caps a point then moves on while the enemy recaps behind--is exploiting. My bad. I looked for it a bit but didn't find it. It's one these other Illum threads. It's blatant. I agree the banhammer shouldn't be used lightly and people should be given the benefit of the doubt when there is one. But there's a video out there which clearly shows the other side. lvl 14s in Illum trading caps with a lvl 50 and asking the guy that sees it not to kill their lvl50 from the other side because he's capping for them. Getting angry at him when he does anyway as if killing the bad guys is a strange activity in a pvp zone. The non-cheating player then gets his lvl 14 toon out and owns them, and that is satisfying for all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allmightyprom Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I doubt that. Anyways, this will be a Non issue when more republic get 50. The only reason ppl have to do it now is because there is usualy a grand total of 1-2 republic ever on Ilum at a time... Agreed. highly doubt anyone gets banned for taking a point on ilum and then not defending it against another player that takes it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exaro Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Quick question, when it is going on in-game what do I do? As I see it I have a few options which are: Attack republic and get crushed by the other 10 trading and; not complete my Ilum daily. Sit at a different node where no-one is going to go due to trading happening and; not complete my Ilum daily. Report them all and; not complete my Ilum daily. Leave Ilum and; not complete my Ilum daily. Wait outside the node for the trading to be completed and once it is; not complete my daily because there is nothing but trading happening on my server and it's just going to keep happening no matter what I do. Honestly, as a player that doesn't want to do it, what do I do? You say it is bannable but honestly, how can it possibly be a bannable offence when I am literally FORCED to do it to experience content provided? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roycerson Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 No one CAN force me to attack another player if i don't want to do it ... yeah Illum is dead right now and nobody in their right mind is attacking the other faction ... just witing for capping ... at least no imperial ever attacked me ( pretty imbalanced server about 1 rep for every 6 imps) You need to read the basketball analogy. Kevin Durant can't be forced to block a pass, but if he chooses not to, having agreed with the other team that they, in return will not block his passes, then he'd be a cheater. He would not be engaging in the game of basketball but actually engaging in another activity all together. He would also be fired, ridiculed, fined and probably go to jail. It's not your fault if no one attacks you, it's not your fault if you choose not to attack because you know to do so is to die. IT IS your fault if you and another player from the other side (or an alt) agree not to kill each other and exchange caps. THAT is NOT inaction. THAT is an action. Agree = verb. Collude = also a verb. Cheat = verb. I could come up with verbs that describe this sort of action all day. It's star WARS. Agreeing with the other side to achieve mutual objectives is not part of playing the game, killing them is. Maybe you should make your own alternative universe and call it "Star lets all get together and click on things for xp" That would be fantastically boring but I bet you'll get some cool threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roycerson Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I would like to reiterate at this point that I don't care what you people do. Doesn't bother me at all. What pisses me off is liars. You know who you are. You know what you do. If you don't. I'm not talking about you. If you do, fine, I don't care, don't call me stupid though, I'm not stupid and your lies and thinly veiled rationalizations are an insult to me and every other non-moron on these forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OsirisZoran Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Just an FYI you do get valor from killing the opposing faction while in the pvp section of Ilum and maybe everywhere in game. it just doesnt tell you but it does give you credit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lemmywinks Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 pvp in mmo's is clearly dead & has been buried 6 feet under a long time ago. Shame on Bioware for not having enough insight to see this sort of fiasco coming but even more shame to the awful players who have the "anything to win" mentality, including cheating. I sincerely hope this bulls*** doesn't come to my server because I pvp for the sake of pvp'ing, the rewards are secondary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rancorzealot Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I don't win trade on ilum... an Imperials blows up a turret and i repair it! I don't have enough time to kill the imperial and repair, so I'll just keep repairing it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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