And guilds are... wait for it... made up of individual players! All getting conquest points! Wow! So what I've said still applies. Now they've probably won the damn planet with NINETEEN MILLION CONQUEST POINTS. Here let me break down the math for you: 19 Flashpoint achievements @ 2k conquest points each (because all the planets have the double bonus) = 38,000 Conquest Points 38000 Conquest Points x 500 players = 19 Million Conquest Points So what's your freaking point? A pure pvp guild would have to do thirty eight thousand matches to make those same numbers that week. You do understand how math works, don't you? (I actually expect you to ignore the math completely as you did in my last post, since it's terribly inconvenient for you and your claims of being put upon.) This is, of course, assuming that those are each unique accounts since it's your example and I'm guessing that's what you mean by a 500 man guild since you weren't clear. But even with the alts you're probably going to get and the legacy lockouts, the numbers still scale and the amount of PVP you'd have to do that week in comparison to making the same numbers as just pure flashpoints is pretty staggering. Then after they get their 19 MILLION CONQUEST POINTS they'll have to do a few pvp matches if they want more. OH THE HUMANITY!!!! Why is this a problem again when the pure PVP players are lightyears behind during this week? I mean, dude, you do realize that just because someone can do a repeatable that doesn't equal infinite points, right? That people are limited by the time they have to play, the length of the conquest week and the number of points given. So? Guilds that are broad based will have an advantage over ones that just PVP or PVE. That's the nature of the entire conquest system, and not something that's even remotely unfair, especially since each area of interest is getting their weeks to shine.

Of which there will be nineteen unique flashpoint achievements for a total of 38000 Conquest Points with the bonuses (which are on all three planets). That week, PVP players will have to do seventy six PVP matches to make the same amount of points. So... yeah. Why exactly are you crying again?

My concern is that if there's a win requirement, you'll have guilds queuing two ranked teams at 4 am /stucking as they trade wins. Making conquest points for only wins is going to practically guarantee shenanigans. This is why I really think ranked needs to be entirely separate from the conquest system with cross server queuing with its own unique and cool rewards to get people to play. Unlike regs, the ranked system is much easier to abuse. Plus, I really think that tying points to wins would be a huge mistake. Encouraging people to do more pvp is healthy for PVP as a whole. While I have seen a lot of inexperienced derps doing hilarious boneheaded stuff, I haven't seen any afkers or people troll dancing in the hundreds of warzones I've done during conquests. The vast majority of people seem to be trying to play, and given time and experience, some of them will actually get better. Noobs shouldn't be penalized because they got rolled by a more experienced premade. Maybe tying it to medals is the way to go. It's really not hard to get eight medals, but it does require at least a minimum of participation, if that's what people are worried about. But I really think that tying it to wins would be a huge mistake. As far as PVE goes, there seem to be a ton of ways to get points this week between the crafting and heroics and world bosses and killing mobs and such. In a few weeks, flashpoints take center stage in their own event, so I'm not sure why people's knickers are still in a twist about this.

Okay. Half of your post doesn't even make sense to me (you quit back with War Hero when there was no bolster, but now you are an expert on how much bolster sucks? I don't get it.). And this, above? Actually made me laugh my *** off and blink at my screen in disbelief. You must be the only person in the entire game that actually think the Recruit/War Hero gap was small, LMAO. There's just no point in talking to you because reality about what goes on in PVP and you don't co-exist on the same planet. LOL Whatever. Have fun raging against perceived slights to PVE. Hopefully Bioware doesn't listen to you.

I don't know when the last time you did PVP was, but yes, it takes maybe a week or two of doing the dailies to get the basic set of PVP gear. And no you don't have to trade ranked into regular coms to do it. I would know, because I have three fully geared toons at 55 atm. Furthermore, if you didn't even want to do that, you can buy cheap blue mods, armorings and enhancements off of the GTN and be almost on par with the basic set because of the way bolster works. Hell you could even probably use the basic set you get off of Makeb and do okay for the first week or two. Again, the augments are the pain in the *** to get, because they're expensive. It really does sound like you stopped PVPing a year and a half ago, back when the gap between Recruit and War Hero was like the Grand Canyon. With bolster, the gear gap is not that big anymore and gear itself is easy and accessible to get unless you're super lazy or trading all of your reg comms up because you're just in there for the relics. Who cares about the contributions of sub 50 players? Why would conquests be balanced around them at all? Conquest is something for the people who have already hit the level cap and are bored to do to keep them playing the game and paying a sub. Almost no game creates content like this centered around lowbie toons. No, the solution to that is to take conquest points away from ranked warzones entirely. Let ranked be it's own thing, give it actual decent rewards outside of the conquest stuff, and give it cross server queuing. Otherwise you're going to have teams queueing against each other at five am /stucking out to make the fights go faster. Unlike regs, it's just way too easy to abuse otherwise. And frankly most ranked pvpers are going to want the carebears on their teams anyway.

Oh please. I've played on both PVP and PVE servers and the skill gap between the pugs is pretty negligible. It's not like it's PVP Narnia over there.

Okay so I totally disagree with what you're saying here, but the imagery cracked me the hell up. I LOLed IRL.

I don't get the complaints either. Pops are faster, the fresh blood makes game more interesting and random, and I don't have to go up against the same godly premades five times in a row because there's just more people queuing in. Everyone who *****es about premades on this forum should be over the moon about conquests equalizing the queue out. I think right now we're just dealing with growing pains. Are their lots of derps? Sure. But there are so many of them that they seem pretty evenly distributed on both factions. And hey, some noobs aren't actually half bad. Almost all of the players I've queued in with are at least trying to play (even if they fail in hilarious ways sometimes), and I haven't seen anyone afk dance in a warzone yet. The ones with potential who actually realize they like to warzone will stick around. The ones just there for the conquest points will eventually realize that doing dailies, crafting and other PVE stuff is a much faster way to get conquest points. Btw, I think making wins a criteria for conquest points/decorations is a terrible idea unless you really love the thought of carebears queuing team ranked @ 4 am trading wins.

I'm not denying that there isn't an advantage when all things are equal. If two equally skilled players go against each other, sure gear gives the advantage. But that almost never happens because reg warzones are such a mashup of who happens to queue in, what gear they have, and how experienced they are. The vast majority of the times games are lost because of stupid playing, or one team using actual teamwork and the other just derping around. Losses where one team simply outgears the other are pretty rare from what I've seen. And dude, seriously? Hyperbole much? It takes maybe a week or two of consistent playing, even if you're getting your *** kicked halfway across the map, to get 2018 gear. The biggest stat bump comes from the augments, which are annoying to get because they're expensive - but not something that's unique to PVP. Anyway, I don't believe that you roll newbs in your 2018 gear, because if you did someone who takes the easysauce way out like you, would still be queuing up. I mean, you're the person who thinks it takes the same amount of skill to pvp as it does to spacebar a 55 through a level ten flashpoint. It's pretty obvious to everyone that you don't know what the hell you're talking about and that the wins you do get are probably because of other people carrying you. It is a lot when it takes so little time to actually do it (like what? 5-8 min to run through, tops?). That's why every time I did a /who of the guild on the top of our leader board last week there were constantly 5-8 55's from running Black Talon and people constantly in the Battle of Ilum cheesing their points until Bioware shut that **** down.

I hate to break it to you, but the reason you get shredded over and over isn't because of expertise. It's because you're bad at PVP. If you don't believe me, do the dailies for a week, get a basic set of 2018 gear, queue in again, and I guarantee you that you're still going to get destroyed because you don't know how to play. The better you get, the more competitive and closer the matches will become. But the problem is you, not the gear. And is lowbie pvp unbalanced? OH HELL YES IT IS. Which is fine. Because little league pvp is for learning how to play your class, basic strategies, trying out new advanced classes/specs, leveling etc... Those should be your goal, not winning, because It's not exactly serious business. You know, I see this claim a lot. And it's true that that you can be a jerk, sit at west, and go AFK while you update your facebook page and screw the rest of your team. But I have to say that I've done almost exclusively pvp during both events (on a RP Server no less) and I rarely see this happening. Are there a bunch of new bad players queuing in? Sure. Are they undergeared. Oh hell yes. But the vast majority of them are actually trying to play - and some of them, once they get more experience, will be pretty decent players. As for the few AFKers? That's something that could be fixed by giving us a better warzone kicking mechanism. The answer here isn't to reward 55's mindless spacebaring through level 10 content. It's to reward the people actually trying out new content, even if they're sometimes failing at it because there's a steep learning curve.

No, you're not the only one facepalming. From what I've seen people generally don't fall into one or the other camp. Sure they might have a main focus of play that's either PVP or PVE, but they don't just only do one thing. In my guild I mostly PVP, but get drug along on OPS and FP sometimes (usually after a few glasses of wine). Our GSFers do flashpoints. Our carebears queue in for the occasional warzone. We all shoot stuff in the face. Sometimes we do event stuff. Every single one of us LOVES owpvp (even the carebears, lol). I don't think that makes our guild the exception - I think we're probably pretty typical, actually, not the few loud whiners that cry all over the forums.

I love this attitude. It assumes that every single player in this game does only PVP or PVE because that's what the poster does and NEVER THE TWAIN SHALL MEET. I hate to break it to you, my friend, but there are a lot of legitimate reasons why someone who loves to PVP would roll on a PVE or even *gasp* a RP server. If this is a problem for you, I suggest you go find an MMO where there is no PVP whatsoever. We're not going away, just cause overly entitled players like you throw a toddler tantrum. As far as PVP player complaining more on these boards than PVE players - I am absolutely astounded and amused by the amount of selective memory going on here. The level of delusion on these boards is seriously hilarious.

You really think these two things take an equivalent amount of skill? Are you for real? Wow. You must be terrible at PVP. I mean, like mind-blowlingly terrible. Either that, or you're one of those fools who camps our node and cries in ops chat the whole game because the rest of the team can't carry them. LMAO.

You know, I've gotten almost 95% of my conquest points in the last two weeks doing warzones, and I haven't once seen anyone deliberatly throw matches in regs or even go afk. Are there a lot of bads in PVP right now? Sure. But as far as I can tell (on my roleplay server, no less), is that the derps are at least trying to play. I think the handwringing over this is extremely overrated. Where there have been reports of /stucking out for quicker matches is in team ranked. And if bioware ties the conquest medals to wins, you're just going to give people the incentive to queue two ranked teams at 4 am and trade wins. Making the conquest points more dependant on wins is a freaking terrible idea. I really hope they don't do it.

It's is kind of strange that they decided to fix it in the middle of the event. The damage has been done, especially to my guild who chose Corellia which ONLY has the GSF bonus, has between 12-16 flyers at prime time, and has comepltely gotten the shaft by a carebear guild who is now 1.5 mil points ahead because of this stupid exploiting of the Battle of Ilum & Black Talon. At least they fixed it for next time around, so that's something, I guess. So thanks for that, Bioware. Glad that you saw how lame this was and put an end to it.

They did it with five to six, I believe. Although it didn't start that way. They only had two at first, I think, and then logged over to alts/recruited people to help once they realized the Pubs were trying to cheese the system.

Yes. I've done it multiple times. All of which generally revolve around PVP. Once because my guild thought it would be hilarious to make a guild of body size 4 male troopers, give them a funny guild name, and then group for little league pvp (when we're not dancing shirtless on the bar in the cantina). I've done it a couple other times to try out different advanced classes, talent trees, or just to have a toon in a particular PVP bracket to group with friends. I've also done it for PvE reasons just because I'm playing with someone else who is leveling up a toon.

Then do what one PVP guild did on our server and heal your own commander until they get frustrated and attack one of the flagged players. BTW, I don't know how people are missing the OWPVP. It's popping up all over the place on the Ebon Hawk, and we're a roleplay server. I spent several hours defending the Republic base on Alderaan this weekend and bouncing imps off of the bridge. Figure out where/when one of the named commanders spawn. It won't be long before someone tries to come and get them because they want the frameworks.

Some thoughts: 1. You don't get to tell other players what to say or think on the forums. 2. You have zero crediblity about dealing with it internally since sixteen of your members were already cheesing the system (as opposed to say one or two, who did it without leadership knowing). 3. I think it's hilarious that even after all that lame whoring for points and with your guild name in the mud now, you still got second place. Congrats to Aisthesis. I totally believe that they didn't cheese the system becuase I saw their teams all over regs all week long. They were fun to play with and against, and I tip my hat to them.

You know, just cause you can do something, doesn't mean that you should. Come on. This is kindergarten ****, you guys. And no, not all guilds did it. My guild didn't do it (<Saberwing>) and we were neck and neck for third place on Alderaan. If I'm wrong and someone did, let me know and give me some names and screenshots, because I promise you they'd be in for one seriously epic ***-chewing.

Damn. I knew someone was going to abuse the ranked system for the super quick conquest points. It's disappointing to see it happen during the very first week though. *facepalm*

I think they're planning on mitigating this is by switching up what things give out points depending on the conquest goal. If you look on Dulfy, there's two whole events that seem dedicated for crafting where I don't think you can even PVP for rewards. There's a week that just focuses mainly on flashpoints, or GSF or PVP too. So I'm guessing guilds and players will sort of fall into their own natural rhythm, where they only compete in weekly events for the type of content they really care about. Will be interesting to see how it shakes out though.

What gives bonuses or even be available for points at all is going to change weekly. Sometimes people will be able to pvp for them, sometimes pvp is completely off the table and the flashpoint runners/raiders will be front and center. For kind of a taste of what some of the weekly events are going to be, check out Dulfy.

Bastrus described PVP here pretty well. The only thing I'd add is that faction dominance in PVP swings back and forth between Rep and Imp unlike over on Pot5. One side might get the upper hand for weeks or even a months, but then something seems to happen and then it evens out. There are a lot of new PVPers in the 55 queue at the moment because of the Conquest stuff (which I personally think is good even if some of them don't have much expierence and don't have the gear) but I figure that's probably happening on most servers at the moment. The Pot5 refugees I've met seem to be pretty happy here, fwiw.

<Saberwing> had a great time yesterday at the Republic base on Alderaan with both <The Wolf Pack> and <The Eclipse>. Fighting on that bridge is just really entertaining, and I hope everyone had as much crazy fun as I did. The only thing I wish we had now was some kind of alert system so we could know when and where people are attacking bases and commanders so people know where they can get in on the OWPVP action. I was thinking about maybe starting a new channel for it, but don't we already have like a handful of PVP chat channels that don't really get used already? Could we possibly use /enemies for something like that?