anything that is ornage can be modded up

Will their ever be something like this for 2v2, 3v3, 4v4?

Thanks for the reply did not realize it wss elemental. Ive been using a 2/28/11 build for pvp and was wondering guesd ill just keep my obliterate.

Its somewhat scattered you take points to boost smash on immortal but dont takr the free smash talent in veng. when you spec your damage output isnt going to be huge so getting the talents for having your moves apply a dot vrs extra utility seems counter productive. http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#101RrudzzMZfMrorhzzM.2 This is my preferred immortal/veng hybrid for pvp and pve. I like sonic barrier with 9 second force screams, but if you want more effective damage the two points to increase crit chance of force scream or vicious throw after impale is fine too.

reading the tooltip it jusy seems so mopey a 500 dmg hit with a 500 dot ovet x seconds, impale says it hits harder. So is this mainly just a pve talent, or is it just bad. What am I missing.

Thanks for all the help you have given me for my jugg

You arent very bright are you? Say sonic barrier absorbs 2k pre set bonus that means the bonus applies an extra 400 damage mitigation. So in a 5 minute fight you get 25 barriers or 25 times 400 to equal 10k damage mitgated which as I stated is the same as 2% mitigation, I apologize if I didnt spell everything out for you. Hence the absorption of sonic barriet is important because it dwtermines the extra mitigation you get. Also I am assuming one is not specced for 9 sec force screams aka 31 into immortality. I reread your post sorry for my harshness I read goodun as goon lol. But yes I could have spelled the marh out more but sotinf on my phone is already hard enoufh ill tet to update when I get home

It all depends on how much sonic barrier absorbs. And from there its a simplr algerbra equation. Without a true mathematic equation 2% reduction will yield better mitigation. I.e. if you take a 5 minute fight and take 500k damage sonic barrier needs to absorb 2k damage pre talent to equal the mitigation of just 2%. Now if you double the damage but keep the same time 2% is clearly the winner unless sonic barrier absorbs now 4k pre set bonus. So if you have a rough idea on how much your barrier absorbs you can run acenarios to which is better, as longer fights may yield better results to sonic barrier

When you can get force crush, as the spec does much better with it

I leveled strictly as immortal used vette until i could get quin and never switched. had no problems questing doing H2+ or tanking instances. the key to managaing quinn is turning off all his dps moves and keeping him strictly as a healer, also i used oranage mod gear and world coms to keep gear up to date

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#101RrGbzzMZfMrorhzzM.2 my phone makes spelling hard

Honestly and forgive my bluntness, your post makes no sense to me. You linked a 27/12/2 build which is no way like 17/24. The big difference is in that spec tou get no rage cost on smash versus your build you dont so yes it makes sense to skip it in your build, but thats not what im talking about. Alsi you talked about spending points to improve damahe of other abilities rhen armor reduction, when all our damage is increased through armor reduction. An d secondly you linked a build that just spends more points in immortal for extra shield chance and an inferior damage mitigation talent then the one ve ngance. So again to restate my question, why is having an extra 2 dwfense after uaing retaliate better then applying a 20%armor reduction to multiplw targets in one gcd for no cost?

Looking at alot of the immortal/vemg hybrid builds (17/24, 1/23 ect.) It seems all skip crushing fist, makes all affected by.your smash have 2/4 applications of armor reduction applied. Isn't that what you want ad a supporting dpec a single move that gives a big damage boost to your group? Doesnt seem to be any talents you give up for it, so why is its skipped

what spec? And level 50?

he says he gets crits for 1500 and 3600 not normal for 1500