but they get alot more armor from their gear without having to sacrifice their damage output like an assassin does by changing our charge.

stealth - check (stealth) backstab - check (maul) vanish - check (force cloak) cloak - check (force shroud) sprint - check (force sprint) poisons - check (charges) evasion - check (deflection) sap - check (mind trap) envenom - check (discharge) gouge - check (low slash) kick - check (jolt) FoK - check (lacerate) deadly throw - check (force slow) need i go on? you need to face the facts, assassin = rogue, only real differnce is that swtor tried to give rogues the evasion tank tree they always wanted.... and thats the only one that really works. so instead of posting about how were not like a rogue perhaps we can get back to fixing the fact that we were designed to be like one, but are now lacking.

just roll darkness and learn to use the strengths your given since your a jack of all trades and dont have any! and stop whining that 2/3 of our class isnt viable! too obvious? i think you missed something in the post you quoted. they were trying to tell people like you to STOP posting exactly what you posted.

how is his logic flawed? imagine if instead of having to actually sit at a computer and farm to get credits, spammers could farm credits from work, the movies, on the bus, during a road trip, at the zoo, ect....

would you stop quoting everyone with useless posts, we get it, its been address, you dont agree, can YOU move on? an entire page of nothing but you quoting people with 1 liners like "You didn't read either. Moving on." is a little rediculous.

so basically what your saying is that deception lacks survivability? perhaps BW should look at adding something ot the top tiers of the tree to help with this issue without making the rest of the class OP. btw incase you hadnt noticed, im ignoring the rest of the garbage you posted about pegs/holes and how i should just "adjust my tactics" instead of fixing the problem. aslo, why do you guys always seem to think you speak for "most" of the other people? if you did we woulnt have so many threads about it. your not the all-knowing god of the assassin class, so please dont act like it.

theres that rogue hatred of yours when my post had nothing to do with rogues at all, it had to do with deception and madness not being as viable as darkness in pvp. stop with the wow rogue hatred spam. your like a broken record for christs sake.

and your perception just took you from comparing two classes in swtor to a class in swtor and a class in wow. your hatred of the rogue class in wow has spilled into swtor. i havent seen any say "why doesnt the assassin play like a rogue!?!?" yet for some reason you always go back to that same point. we know its not a rogue, now you need to get over it.

Dont bother, cowflab is a darkness assassin who see the world from the point of a darkness assassin and doesnt seem to think there is anything wrong with the rest of the class besides user error. PRO TIP: not everyone wants to be forced to play a darkness assassin to not be gimped!

i dont even consider the class you pick at lvl 1 a true class, its more like story selection.

Lets not forget the talent trees shall we! Shroud of Darkness - At lvl 50 this equals roughly 1 extra hit worth of hp.... for 3 talent points! 1 hit =/= 3pts! -Needs to be doubled at the very least if its to stay at 3pts Harnessed Darkness - Like the idea, but it takes forever to get the stack high enough to heal, and even when you do get the extra heal the health gained is almost unnoticeable. - I say make it heal for 2% per stack, solves both the stacking and the healing problems. Saber Conduit - The extra force from this is equal to 1/3 of a point of force a sec per talent point and since most of our abilities cost roughly 25 your looking at roughly 1-2 extra abilities per minute. The only reasons I can see this being worth the sink is the fact that without it you cant get to Static Charges and outside of Dark Embrace its the only way deception assassins have to boost force regen. - I'd say reduce the CD timer to 5s and/or increase the amount of force gained each proc to make it worth the 3 points. Static Charges - Nice design feel to the talent but without an auto attack theres a good chance the the fight will be over before you ever reach 5 stacks. - Could be reduced to 3 stacks doing +10% damage per stack making it take less stacks but provide the same damage bonus. Deceptive Power - Total bloat talent, only costs 1 point but 10 extra force isnt even enough to do 1/2 of an ability and after that initial force is gone the only time your ever really gonna see it again is if you get chain CC'd (in which case your probably dead) or the fight is over. - Either get rid of it or bump it up to say 25 force so that it actually allows us to cast a full extra ability at the opening of the fight! Oppressing Force/Haunting Dreams - I guess my only problem with these is I feel their in the wrong tree. Why are we buffing our CC that breaks on damage in the spec that centers alot around AoE, aka Death Field, because its costs/is buffed by 6 talents or 1/3th of the tree! - Swap these over to deception since thats more of the CC/Single target spec. Not sure what to switch em with though.... Thats just my 2 creds worth of insight. because all SI's are Assassins amirite?

No worse then all the crybaby QQers.

Would you rather he go on a tirade like everyone else on these forums?

2k credits in over an hour while using your skill wrong is more then enough, stop crying.

so what the OP is saying is he still makes a profit from the mission side of the gathering skill and that this is somehow supposed to support the fact that slicing is useless?

blackout?

I've been having this issue as well and it seems to start around the 40s. I've been following several threads about it and it seems they all have a common denominator, deception. It got to the point where I couldnt even do regular quests my lvl if it involved killing an elite or a large group of weak mobs + 1 strong. I switched to darkness and this became alot easier. I think the problem lies in the fact that deception is more of a 1v1 class that relys alot on that initial burst, but with alot of quests where you kill elites or large groups you generally dont get to stealth before they attack due to cutscenes and/or having to use some item or other. Meanwhile darkness has much more survivability and madness allows for more aoe damage with little self healing.

No, were just not gonna rage quit because BW didn't snap is fingers and have the problem with their coding pinpointed, fixed, tested to ensure it didn't create more issues and then released immediately, like the OP wants.

The only problem I have with this statement is the "absurdly large" toolkit part since this can actually work against us as well. With so many abilities you have to be able to bind them all to easy to reach locations and remember where those locations are at the very moment you need them. With so many abilities this becomes challenging. This could be made easier if BW would impliment a stealth bar and/or a macro system, but until then we just have to play with our "absurdly large" keybindings.

only problem i have with this is that point in deceptive powers, the extra 10 force is only good for the opening, after that if you reach full force again before the fight is over your doing it wrong. I'd put it somewhere else like Avoidance, Static Cling, or Electric Execution.

but your dismissing it as collateral damage and nothing more with all the garbage you keep puking out....

judging by what you seem to be looking for i believe a damage meter would be the better solution then gearscore, then you could simply ask people what their dps/hps is and go by that. a damage meter i can get behind since more of a measure of skill then gearscore will ever or could ever be.

sounds like getting booted from a group full of idiots, could have been the best thing that happened to you.

once again your comparing gear to skill, this is not the case. the player in greens could be really good, but GS tells you hes bad. while the player in epics could be a facerolling nerf herder, but GS tells you hes good. how is this addon useful again?

^^^ this. and although im against an LFG tool that hands you a group on a silver platter that might have the most skilled players or could stick you with the guy that requires a helmet to play, i do believe that the current mechanic is lacking. something similar to the LFR tool in wow would be a fine option, doesnt spoon feed you a group but makes it easier to tell who wants to do what without requiring you to be at the fleet spamming general. doesnt hurt the community either since you still have to ask around to find the players you wanna play with, but allows you to see who wants to join you and still allows you to avoid lord of the facerolling ninja looters.