Overview of why Lethality is less DPS then POST-NERF Concealment (courtesy of sithwarrior.com) It's also important to note this tree suits Snipers a lot better, because it forces the Scoundrel into melee range for TA. For Gunslingers who stand at a distance, it's fine. However, the entire tree for is clunky, impractical, and slow damage for Scoundrels. It needs a rework, but then again, so does the entire class. The only raid fight where Lethality > Concealment is the EV Council, since Concealment cannot use stuns/backstab.

The Lethality build is a gunslinger build, completely broken for Operatives. There is absolutely no reason to take an Operative over a Sniper in PvE.

Cross server = no more pvp for me.

I say my Commando is needed on NM EV, because my Scoundrel does nowhere close to the damage of the Commando and makes the NM runs an actual added risk. You want numbers, I can see these numbers appear all over my screen during raids, and the Commando gets more numbers, and they are much higher. It's simple enough for me. I don't need a combat log to see what is good and what is bad.

You are claiming to be better at PVE because you deal less damage now? Have you ever heard of aggro reduction skills, or aggro management? Ugh, the stupidity, it hurts..

same thing, unexplainable aggro loss for the tank resulting in wipe. 2 missing platforms on the next, and 1 missing platform on the one after that, but thats unrelated, of course

this.

# dev posts/replies to inquisitor/counselor boards = 78 # dev posts/replies to warrior/knight boards = 43 # dev posts/replies to bh/trooper boards = 52 # dev posts/replies to agent/smuggler boards = 3

keeping this on page 1

I was the only 50 Scoundrel online on the fleet on 6 pm on my server today, then I switched back to my alt.

Of course I can beat him up, that is NOT the point of the video. I saw all these forum posts flying around 'of Scoundrels still doing 7k + crits post 1.1.1!!' and I got tired of that. Fact is; The opener of a Scoundrel, that requires being behind a moving target, while stealthed, with use of a relic and flechette round, does marginally more damage then a 1,5 second cast time, spammable attack from ranged? That is simply unbalanced. Whether I can beat my friend 1 v 1 is not the issue.

So who SHOULD scoundrels be able to take down then, oh wise one?

Oh I'm sorry, which class should then be allowed to kill a heavy armor class then? A healer? Or another heavy armor class? Plenty of those to choose from...

Pre-50's should always refrain from commenting on lvl 50 pvp, and I mean this in a polite way.

No, thats not critluck. The 2 set piece rakata bonus gives a 15% increased critchance on grav round/tracer missile, that makes it 50% unbuffed. I literally facepalmed. Literally. As stated in the video, we both wear champion + 2 pieces of rakata gear. I geared us the same intentionally. If you REALLY want proof, I can upload the gear check. I deleted it from the video because it stretched the vid out 40 seconds.

I thought this was kind of obvious

Scoundrel VS Trooper Post 1.1.1 I thought it would be fun to show some numbers for once. Its very funny Scoundrels were the one to get a nerf to their sustained DPS. And yes, I'm aware grav round can be interrupted. Just imagine a trooper up on a ledge, or at a distance, whatever. Had to record it half size so put it on HQ full screen to see anything, hf

This is not the case, because they could have just as easily lowered the armor penetration for PvP only, and left the PvE version untouched.

As much as I appreciate the discussion, this thread is about our PVE-damage, and Bioware's lack of response. Let's keep it that way. Thank you!

Note: this is intended to be a PvE discussion. PvP'ers, please stay away. We are requesting feedback from developers about the PvE damage of the Scoundrel/Operative. There has been a LOT of rage from Operative/Scoundrels on the 1.1.1 nerf, mostly for Bioware completely ignoring the PvE consequenses. Our PvE damage has been nerfed badly in favour of PVP and we would like a developer to comment on this fact. However, pages and pages of threads about this subject have been closed down and ignored. I do not play PVP. I had to shelve my Scoundrel, due to not being able to keep up the DPS required in NM raids. Now, I'm full timing my Commando instead. Now, Judging by the threads posted below, these are the most important questions the Scoundrel/OPS community would like to see answered by a developer: 1. Why did you ignore the PvE consequenses of this PVP-focused nerf? Do you still consider the PvE-nerf justified? 2. Are you aware that the damage-trees are now less then viable in End Game Raiding and we are forced to spec into healing for raids? 3. Can we expect a small buff to our PvE damage in the future? Here are threads I picked up from the first 10 pages of the PTS forum/Operatives forum for some reference: Operative Nerf Concerns Devs Respond! (over 2500+ posts, CLOSED, now points to PVP forum) Operatives/Scoundrels still want developer feedback about their PVE Damage (CLOSED, now points to PVP thread) Bioware, you are hurting my PVE damage badly. Why? (22 pages, CLOSED) Patch 1.1.1 changes to Operatives (31 pages) Concealment in Eternity Vault What the Scoundrel/Ops nerf did to PvE (11 pages, CLOSED) Operative Nerf is too much (31 pages) A serious look at the Smug/Op nerf - a better solution for 1.11? [long read] (20 pages) Please dont publish 1.1.1 update until you are 100% sure about the nerfs (22 pages) An educated look at the Operative nerf. (13 pages) No one wants Operatives in group now. (8 pages) How to balance the nerf to the Operative burst damage. Thank you for ignoring us (CLOSED, points to now closed thread) So we can't PVE as Op now? (CLOSED, points to now closed thread) Devs respond to trivial issues and ignore 46 page thread regarding OPS Nerf (9 pages, CLOSED, points to now closed thread) BioWare Proceeding with Scoundrel/IA Nerfs: Ignoring the Community since 2011 (CLOSED) Can we get dev feedback for Ops/Scoundrels? (CLOSED) Devs not answering for the Operative nerf (7 pages) (CLOSED) Devs Please read .. re: Operative/Scoundrel Nerf (CLOSED, points to now closed thread) Has anyone actually tried Operative/Scoundrel @ 50 on test servre?? (CLOSED, points to now closed thread) operative nerf will destroy the class to the end (12 pages, CLOSED, points to now closed thread) 700+ expertise, 65+ VR pre 1.1 Op’s thoughts on proposed PTS nerf (11 pages) The problem with how BW is handling this adjustment Yet another Scrapper Scoundrel/Concealment Operative player asking for compensation (8 pages) Patch 1.1.1 for PvE DPS Scoudrel/operative, Please Dont do that (CLOSED, points to now closed thread) Acid Blades / Flachette Rounds nerf is roughly an 11% damage nerf on PvE bosses. (CLOSED, now points to closed thread) Knee-jerk over-nerf. Again. (8 pages, CLOSED, points to now closed thread) If 1.1.1 goes live without reconsideration....... (CLOSED, points to now closed thread) With the new changes to Ops/Scoundrels have you thought of PvE? (CLOSED, now points to closed thread) Setting an ugly precedent (CLOSED) Cave to the whiners, Lets Nerf it up. (CLOSED) Answer to "How much did the nerf hurt us" = ~12.5% less damage. Agents: Least played & not chart toppers, Nerfed first? (13 pages) Will Operatives be compenstated for the loss of damage? Operative/Scoundrel healing/shared spec issues. (CLOSED) Scoundrels/Ops (CLOSED) Jug w 9.1k aoe and we get the nerf dart? Operative nerf is crazy brutal So now our eyes are finally opened. The PvE consequenses for a Scrapper/Concealment. (CLOSED, points to now closed thread) PvP balancing should not affect PvE Operative/Scoundrel Nerf is too much... (CLOSED) R.I.P PvE operative DPS (CLOSED, points to now closed thread) Since Bioware wont give us the reason... Scoundrel after 1.1 - what went wrong? (Yes, again, but PvE) ANALYSIS: Scoundrel is the Worst Class in the Game at Everything (18 pages) Leveling as Scoundrel is much harder than before Tired of the "our damage is fine" crowd ... Reaction of a Battlemaster lvl 50 Operative (12 pages, CLOSED, points to now closed thread) Lets get some perspective on operatives here. (CLOSED) I had actually started this thread once before, but after 5 pages of pure 100% positive feedback, it got shut down. To add insult to injury, the moderator requested to 'please continue this discussion on the PVP forum' (!) If you are tired of being ignored, please keep this bumped. Edit 10/2 (Edit2 9/3), research: # dev posts/replies to inquisitor/counselor boards = 78 # dev posts/replies to warrior/knight boards = 43 # dev posts/replies to bh/trooper boards = 52 # dev posts/replies to agent/smuggler boards = 6 + 1 troll

ignore, see scoundrel/ops forum

Try playing as a Scoundrel. We have a 1,5 sec stun, 4 sec stun and a break on dmg stun. Thats it. Its pure hell.

I like the fact you blame players for being affected by the bugs.

Why are you making me watch a wow-pvp video on a swtor forum? I'm not showing people on a BF3 forum COD movies.