made me realise why i get so sick and tired of mmos. devs can chop and change things to how they see fit .. we, the paying customer, just have to suck it all up and take it up the rear quarters. its the way it is and the way it will always be. however, past experience shows that if you QQ in extreme amounts sometimes they change their mind, not often but on ocassion.

i loathed hutball at first, utterly detested it in everyway, endless dying no defense and weak dps. never able to carry the ball more than 5 steps without being splattered over the arena .. then i rerolled BH and it became strangely awesome! my GS now sleeps in a wooden box outside a wine store. in summary yes, pvp is much about class, skill takes a back seat although skilled players do consistanly rise to the top ofc!

not read the entire thread, but my bet is mainly a population issue. should 1.2 bring back the early rage quitters and solve a lot of issues, it may be delayed. have to wait sometimes upwards of 20 mins for a wz most days which isnt fun. i dont care who im killing frankly

given there is no offical date for patch 1.2 id say this could be mid april or even pushed back to may. whilst i appreciate this is an extensive update, therefore much to test, it would be great if they released the customizable ui a bit earlier if there is to be a delay. proper proper fed up with fixed bars and have been since launch day.

just about the least played class and least amount of effort has gone into its look to. special mentions also to that upside down tortoise shell from hoth or the various gimp masks we get .. thanks bw. that new helm tho is fugly! just as well we have hide hem function sorry, im being quite anti smug today, maybe i should leave this board

i suspect every class will have players that dedicate themselves to their role and play it very well, maybe even exceptionally and above the 'norm'. imho, smugs in pvp are one of the very worst classes when compared to others. perhaps i just dont gel with the playstyle or whatever, but despite my very best efforts, at times, it just doesnt hit hard or survive well at all. in contrast, my poorly geared empire BH was out dpsing my smug and its 35 levels lower! from the forum threads i read, more people have trouble with smugs in pvp than just about any other class, some wont as posts here reflect, but a majority do. my above point rests my case tbh.

my thoughts as a sab/slinger in pvp .. just dont, walk away from the pc, have a think about which class you would like to re-roll (hint - not a commando). maybe even consider empire because a well geared smug in pvp is utter utter utter ****. noob l2p lol etc etc blah .. rubbish! i have a level 13 bounty hunter (merc) and its obliterates the stats i got in pvp up to 50 and even beats what i get as a smug at 50!! there is some serious balance issues in this game and it becomes more obvious the more toons you roll. our defense is completely weak and some crucial abilities are required in cover which in pretty much any wz is useless as you are outranged, stunned, pushed, pulled and generally battered within pico seconds. now i must admit, with a healing ally topping you up you can score some nice figures but i still havnt hit past 3.5k single crit, whereas my lowly empire toon gets that regularly .. in crappy green coloured armour! ffs. have tinkered with other specs and found sab does the kind of damge i want consistantly, dont enjoy df particularly either. you can agree to disagree if you wish but this is how i call it at present. smugs are good support in pve however, no question of that.

dps isnt too shabby, no effin clue how ppl are hitting 4k+ crits either but still, am sure my gear could be improved. reason i feel, especially in wz, the dps is low is because we do spend a good 50% of the time dead on the floor. defensive shield is utter utter cack, for every time i use it im toast more frequently than if i run and gun. all imho ofc

every class has its own 'irritant' and i suppose gs have their fair share. am only at 48 at present and have good and bad days with ma toon. survivablity can vary wildy in a pve environment from being minionless and dying in a blink to being almost industructable, whereas pvp requires good positioning and a friendly healer watching your back helps to. have topped a few WZ but have done poor dmg at other times. i guess they're inconsistant. best rep storyline for sure but i do kinda object in being forced to use 10+ spells in a rotation to knock sommit down. really dont know if i can be bothered to play the game in its current state tho. the lag and ability delay are hindering the overall enjoyment at present but that will change over the next few months.

played just about every major mmo launch in the past 3 years and swtor is no different to any other. its been released early, lacks content in one aspect or another along with a host of aggrivating bugs. this is standard for mmo launches and those 'brave' few that crawled out from the wow rock may not realise this, so doing my duty to inform you of this fact. it will be a good 12 months before this game plays acceptably well, we are just paying to beta test this game. one thing i cant forgive at present, above all the lame issues that plauges the game, is the lack of a configurable UI.

i personally find WoW a pile of utter garbage these days. will be actually pleased if all the wow crew do actually log back into blizzzard's crapfest where you can all be malcontent whiners all to yourselves.

a new gfx card will help a lot, will be able to play the game at a good frame rate and high settings in all but well populated areas. afaik BW used a game engine that lags in high pop areas, tho i have no sauce to verify this.

suprised if this thread remains unlocked, not because what you say isnt correct but its about community than pvp ^^ anyway, i left wow because of the community, i forget the server but they were the most repulsive humans to walk the planet. i kinda find it half and half here, some mature gamers but not many. for a mostly sensible and mature audient i find EQ2 one of the best if this gets to you

id vote yes actually. any extra content on top of the mess supplied thus far would be an improvement. not gonna happen tho, will take BW a good year to sort out whats on the plate currently.

bit of a mess innit really

yer it seems imps all pl to 50 geared up and learnt the game on rogue moon. its a horrible server to pvp on, waste of complete time in all honesty and if i never see a game of hutball again it will be too soon. i dont particuarly play mmos to pvp, more of side thing when im taking a break from pve but its lame *** on this server. all it does is inspire nerd rage at its finest which actually achieves nothing. best thing to do is not pvp and give imps nothing to do and reroll eleswhere haha .. fat chance.

not decided at 42 if i like gs yet. didnt want a faceroll but didnt want sommit that ticks you off either. its just very very slow going, constant regen after each fight, mid range dps, which for a dps class is a joke. my mate has a troop 40 and often out dps me as a fuppin healer ffs! keep all my gear current as well as companion, tried numerous specs and dont really enjoy it as much as id hoped. cc and stun classes, i have now discovered, are definately not my thing whatsoever. wish id tried it out in beta prior to rolling this toon but there ya go. kinda stuck with it, maybe they will improve. its not terrible, some people will enjoy it am sure and can see why, just think i rolled incorrectly. decent storyline tho, nice touches of humour.

yea, me and a mate both experience good ole 5 fps on decent spec pcs. its great to see characters flicking round your screen and pwning you within 2 seconds .. highly enjoyable. id forgive many issues in this game but the actual development time and costs do not bear out in the quality of this game. massive massive amounts of annoying game bugs compounded by 2 bolt-on after thoughts in space combat and pvp. that said am sure BW are listening but these things take time to fix. ofc we are paying to beta test this game and will do for a few months yet. although not quite the right thread for it, the pvp rewards are insanely good. not a bad thing you say but considering i can fully gear up in 2 hours of laggy crappy pvp comparing to a weeks worth of pve grind for lame rewards says a lot. trying to sweeten this bitter pill mr EA/BW huh?

if you could arrange to sort out the insane rubber banding issues that cause zero enjoyment from pvp it would be a start.

i see a fair few threads grumbling about the hat styles in this game ... and i agree, theyre bloody terrible!

bah i was so disappointed to discover that gay/lesbian relationships will not appear until a future expac. rolled a female toon and didnt fancy the idea of seducing blokes. serves me right

add me to the list of malcontented souls here! mate is a trooper and kills everything before i even get into position, utter pish =(

i did this at level 27 with a trooper mate, piece of piddle. i know that not terribly contructive but sometimes it helps to bring along extra firepower, its an mmo afterall that said, tatooine quests do seem r rock hard later on and the heroics are an insane joke, dooable but not a walk in the park even if your several levels above them.

i must admit, the OP did smack of flame me for comparing swtor with wow way too much, you even reference gold as the currency in this game! tbh you should go back to wow, that is a highly matured mmo with a bag of content and has many of the features you request! however, i do understand where he is coming from but for almost none of the points you have listed. i dont care about the credits system, the economy on my server seems well balanced and reasonable at present. day and night? nah dont care. better character customization you do have a valid point about, very limited and would have been nice to create your own droid at least instead of that camp thing that annoys tha heck outta you within the hour. gfx being outdated? nah, looks nice to me even tho it lags often. do agree the lack of water to swim in is odd, perhaps later implemented but not a priority. no, what really got me whilst palying this game were GAME BUGS! yes every game has them but this even blows the amount that EQ2 has out into orbit. last night me and a friend were questing on tatooine. on the first 2 quest areas alone we must have hit some 15-20 bugs, a large portion being almost game breaking. id list them all but frankly i want to go off and enjoy the game again at some point today, so for a flavour: bad ui. yep, unclickable ui and general unresponsiveness. the unclickable ui required a log out which takes a while! entering a heroic zone, having friend dc and on return both of us are dumped outside and unable to enter again without dumping the quest and re-picking this up. quest updates not being acknowledged. myself and minions falling on our backs and being dragged around like rag dolls (hillarious for 2 seconds then annoying). repops in some heroic zones are incredibly fast! kill one pack and move forward only for them to repop! let alone being 2-3 levels above them and taking a ******** to kill, skill based ya might say but a little ott for me. the list could go on but you see my point, the above was all in the space of an hour or 2. in a nutshell i feel this was rushed out in the end, lots of polish required to warrant a subscription long term. i do enjoy it, despite lots of work required to iron out the falws in general gameplay, plenty of game improvements and ideas id like to see in future but overall its an oldstyle mmo with a new lick of paint and storyline. most mmos survive on community and developers listening to their community. if the community in this game is mature and lively then this game will succeed in the end.