WoW vs. TOR: Comparing game launches

[Neeseek]

Hey guys lets compare a game that launched in 2004 to one launching in 2011.

 

Funny, WoW fanboys do it all the time but in terms of "quality"

 

 

Yes, they compare a game with 7 years of experience to one with 0.

[TheRealDestian]

Hey guys lets compare a game that launched in 2004 to one launching in 2011.

 

He's comparing nerd rage to nerd rage.

 

And he's exactly right.

Edited December 14, 2011 by TheRealDestian

[Sedayeen]

Actually you are dead wrong. Your post is the ENTIRE point of my original post. People will whine and cry just like with WoW (which was far worse than ANYTHING that will happen in this game) and they WILL keep on playing for years afterward. People like to be dramatic and use hyperbole but in the end you will all keep subbing and enjoying it. See you in game (for the next 5+ years!).

 

Stop being insulting, I never said I wasn't going to play the game so your last comment is just silly.

 

The above happened to WoW - that is very true, ppl whined, and complained, and STAYED, and subs grew and grew. I'm not disputing that.

 

But what about all those MMO's that came after WoW, the next "wow killer" if you will. People didn't stay, people went back to WoW.

 

I wish TOR luck, I really do, I'm not against the game or anything, but I think its a valid concern.

Edited December 14, 2011 by Sedayeen

[Sierra-Six]

yeah WoW's launch was a painful birth that grew into a great game, I bet TOR will be the same.

 

regardless of what all the nay-sayers claim.

[Acron]

Umm no. I have known over 100 people personally who have played since release (day one). Every single one of them recalls very clearly, as I am stating, the mass amounts of lag, crashes, server instability, loot-lag, whining, etc. It never stopped for months afterward. Queues to get into most decent servers were 1+ hours long (800 or so people usually, sometimes 2000+). And yet everyone kept playing it.

 

People like to whine about things they love. They will keep playing them like a complete crack addict though - unable to resist. Some of us show restraint when fussing that we didn't get to play here or there while others just endlessly cry like a baby. Also, this games launch has been smoother than any other by miles. And it will continue. See you in game!

 

You do know on the 18-30th ull get 2+hours queue on your server, or you havent been here on the stress testing? i had a 5h queue there (swtor beta)

 

or do you think people wont go to the servers where they friends are because they are "high"?

[Froodlemaster]

Hmmmm, I don't recall any of that and I was in beta and there at release but then again I was too busy actually playing the game and having fun. I do remember it being rough at first but unlike SWTOR, nobody at all, including Blizzard, could have foresaw just how freaking massive those first few days could have been. Nothing up to that point had seen anything near the hype that WoW got so it doesn't take a genius to realize there was no way they could have been ready for the freaking FLOOD of players waiting to get in.

 

So, to compare what could be argued as the very first MASSIVE mmo to go mainstream that was release 6+ years ago to SWTOR which has had YEARS to watch, study and learn from other mmo's and be ready for this is a complete joke.

 

But they are ready. They are staggering early access to STOP crashing, to stop bugs, to stop mistakes. They aren't just releasing it and hoping it goes well. They are prepared, it's just that people can't take "wait for it" as an answer. We are guaranteed 2 days of early access. Anything more is a bonus. Bioware is very ready, as you saw from the immaculate open beta previously, which was probably the best beta for an MMO I have been in.

Edited December 14, 2011 by Froodlemaster

[Maloreon]

The more realistic comparison would be to Rift. For me, that was the smoothest launch I can remember.

 

Rift was very smooth, I played it as well. This game has been just as smooth (so far). I'm sure they learned much from Rift. One part where your comparison breaks down though is this game has like 8x more people playing it worldwide (by actual release). Hence why they only let in a smaller amount today. Our EA release is actually equivalent to like 2-3x what Rift had. When Bioware posts the official numbers people will realize why they did it this way. Best MMO launch in history up until now is Rift, but for size and stability it is going to go to TOR in the coming weeks.

[Knoxpwns]

Funny, WoW fanboys do it all the time but in terms of "quality"

 

 

Yes, they compare a game with 7 years of experience to one with 0.

 

 

damn, WoW had 7 years of experience in 2004? thats like some time warp ****.

[bheta]

this should jog peoples memory of the wow launch

 

 

http://vnboards.ign.com/world_of_warcraft_general_board/b19789/79174207/p1/

[Maloreon]

You do know on the 18-30th ull get 2+hours queue on your server, or you havent been here on the stress testing? i had a 5h queue there (swtor beta)

 

or do you think people wont go to the servers where they friends are because they are "high"?

 

Once I'm in I don't intend to log out unless they force me to (server reset). I'm on vacation after all!

[Karbine]

Simple fact is, your perception of WoW launch is horrid.

 

They started off with a third of the servers swtor is going in with, They didn't have world zones phased and filtered, and they did it in 2004, 7 freakin' years ago.

 

I would imagine technology has maybe, even in the slightest, gotten better since then in addition to the fact you could still play WoW, to some extent and everyone suffered equally.

 

They also started off with a third less people if not even less than SWTOR ... I was there the launch for WoW was bad ... the QQ was at an all time high and at times the game was unplayable....

 

SwtoR has more players let in today than WoW had that week total and it was not even an early access launch.

Edited December 14, 2011 by Karbine

[Trandel]

Actually I have a very close RL friend who was in since the first beta (I didn't bother with Beta since I did not expect as much as he did). The beta community was warning Blizzard about the problems they'd have at release well before the game came out and they released into a disaster anyway. Funny how it is the complete opposite of how this game's launch has gone - clear communication with the playerbase, bugs being fixed, more bugs popping up and being quickly fixed, a satisfactory launch, etc.

 

LOL? Wow really? Other than BW's massive epic fail with this "early access" the other main themes going around in this forum, that has been under BW's mods watch like this was Soviet Russia, is about the total LACK of communication and players exploiting a bug to power level, lol.

 

Where did you get you're glasses bro and do they have the words "BioWare Approved" on them?

[Morsexy]

WoW launch was very tough. They had no concept of the demand for the game, and didn't build accordingly. The servers I was on all had lag and downtime, in fact if you look at your billing history, I know traditionally my date of billing is the 14th. I'm a day one player. That means that they gave us 21 days of free play to compensate.

 

21 days.

 

Many facets of the game were straight up broken, I nearly quit the game for good at level 47 on my warrior because I couldn't kill a mob level 44 or above ( a bug they denied for months until they admitted it was there).

 

There are many, many other examples as I'm sure there will be to SW:TOR. It really doesn't pay to compare apples to oranges, or think that correlation = causation.

 

 

They will both have ups and downs, and the success of the game will be based on the experience and end game activities like dungeons and raids that keep people coming back to a compelling setting.

 

Not ultimately, anything other than a "OMG THE SERVERS EXPLODED OFFLINE FOR 10 DAYS" scenario that is clearly not happening.

[Maloreon]

They also started off with a third less people if not even less than SWTOR ... I was here the launch for WoW was bad ... the QQ was at an all time high and at times the game was unplayable....

 

SwtoR has more players let in today than WoW had that week total and it was not even an early access launch.

 

Exactly. And yet people are whining here, I don't get it. This game is dominating my face.

[Sierra-Six]

But they are ready. They are staggering early access to STOP crashing, to stop bugs, to stop mistakes. They aren't just releasing it and hoping it goes well. They are prepared, it's just that people can't take "wait for it" as an answer. We are guaranteed 2 days of early access. Anything more is a bonus. Bioware is very ready, as you saw from the immaculate open beta previously, which was probably the best beta for an MMO I have been in.

 

 

^THis

[Maniigoldo]

I still remember the endless posts whining, crying, and threatening to quit for MONTHS while Blizzard's servers failed miserably at and after launch of WoW. I recall thousands, nay millions of threads saying that this would "REALLY COST BLIZZARD BIGTIME" since people were so frustrated. I recall reading posts saying Blizzard's image was "SCARRED" permanently, etc. I remember people being SO righteously angry about how badly Blizzard was treating them - but yet they still sat in queue for 1-2 hours every night waiting to play. The QQ on those forums crushed any amount of QQ here...

 

And then WoW went on to break basically every known video game record and become a worldwide phenomenon. That is funny, because WoW's launch actually WAS terrible. It was a disaster, and the game went on to dominate for years.

 

Still, somehow, the crybabies on these forums are actually convincing themselves that today, tomorrow, the rest of EA, or any other slightly negative event in SW:TOR history will have any impact on their number of subscriptions in the coming years.

 

For those of you that are angry and about to type up a really nasty response to this post, you know it is true. You know that this is a fact - that they won't be hurt by this. That you WILL keep playing. Furthermore, you know this launch is actually going well - yet you still whine. But go ahead, keep making posts fussing about how this game will fail - and I will keep pointing you to a game with the worst MMO launch in history that went on to dominate just as this game will in this era.

 

Welcome to the SW:TOR era of MMO's.

 

Well said...

I really cant understand those ppl..they are never happy with anything all they do is find little excuses or minus negative details of swtor to start bashin it,and all that because the ywont play for a day or two

 

As for the queue IT WAS expected and ppl should realise that like any other mmo's launch

Edited December 14, 2011 by Maniigoldo

[Neeseek]

damn, WoW had 7 years of experience in 2004? thats like some time warp ****.

 

Reading isn't your strong point is it?

 

WoW fanboys TODAY.. Claim WoW is a better game than TOR, they have more features, more raids, ect.

 

 

Well no ****, they had 7 years to build this up.

 

 

Yes, I still read the WoW forums, why? I have no idea.

[Maloreon]

LOL? Wow really? Other than BW's massive epic fail with this "early access" the other main themes going around in this forum, that has been under BW's mods watch like this was Soviet Russia, is about the total LACK of communication and players exploiting a bug to power level, lol.

 

Where did you get you're glasses bro and do they have the words "BioWare Approved" on them?

 

If you actually believe that Bioware has had poor communication with us then you are beyond delusional and/or insane. They have communicated SO clearly since day one. They communicate through multiple channels (twitter, forums, website, etc.) and they communicate with updates DAILY. They made everything that is happening abundantly clear.

 

The only people who are disappointed are chronic whiners and people who felt ENTITLED to 5 days (we're not even there yet lol!) of play when it says MAY received UP TO 5 days. I'm sorry but if you actually believe what you are saying there is no point discussing much of anything with you. Facts are facts, they have communicated clearly.

 

P.S. - I'm sure the bug will be fixed within hours, if it is not already, and the players will have their accounts locked and or rolled back. Big deal, in every MMO that has ever come out there has been an XP exploit or something similar to get ahead and people always abuse it and then get banned. Bugs are inevitable in software - and players getting banned for abusing said bugs is also just as inevitable. Cry on.

[Maniigoldo]

Uh there wasn't that much of complaints when WoW was released nor' in beta.

 

Yes they was ALOT of them...

WoW launch was T.E.R.R.I.B.L.E

[HoneyBoy]

It is fair though, because an MMO is an MMO, despite what year it was launched in. I said before, yes, the year differences could make a bit of difference, but it's probably more difficult to launch a good MMO now, then it was when WoW was released. EQ was the only dominant MMO. Now a days, there are at least 100 MMO's available to players. And it gets harder to develop MMO's now then it was 7 years ago.

 

I disagree because like you said EQ was the dominant MMO, it maxed out at what 500,000 players for a short time? Nobody knew that WoW was going to hit 1 million in less than a year. Blizzard jumped into the genre blind whereas Bioware is going into a mature market having experience with the Mythic division that oversees Warhammer and EA who has launched MMO's in the past.

 

If it was truly "harder" to develop an MMO now then why have we seen so many more of them since WoW? Why do they all follow the WoW template in some way shape or form?

 

Here are some quotes from Ray Muzyka and Greg Zeschuk about SWTOR:

 

"Some of the guys from Austin came to us and said ‘Hey we want to do an MMO for you guys,’

 

“This was years ago, and we were wrapping up GDC. WoW had been out for a while and it had taken off, so yeah it was a great thing for us to look at.”

 

""It [World of Warcraft] is a touchstone. It has established standards, it's established how you play an MMO. Every MMO that comes out, I play and look at it. And if they break any of the WoW rules, in my book that's pretty dumb."

 

If anything WoW has made it easier since the template is so easy to follow and it created a market that otherwise didn't exist before.

 

If TOR greatly expands the MMO market right out the gate then by all means yeah I think it'll be fair to compare their launches, in any other circumstance Blizzard were clearly at more of a disadvantage at launch.

[darthbored]

yeah but back then WoW was about it. in this day and age people have a choice. so these new mmos have to be flawless from day 1. hence why every MMO since WoW has failed miserably. Edited December 14, 2011 by darthbored

[Skitziblink]

I want to play swtor just as much as the next guy but i would rather wait to get into the game than have servers crashing every hour and fight 150 other ppl to kill X mob you need for X quest, which from memory was the case with wow and all its expansions. Bioware is doing it right in my opinion. So i will patiently wait for my email knowing that when I do get to play its going to be smooth and enjoyable.

[IMPERVIOUSCLAN]

im going to be the sane voice here...

 

 

A. Odds are you didnt play vanilla wow, period. Almost no one did and they want to act like they are cool so they said they did.

 

B. Wows launch was very smoothy, nothing yo u can fault except for SOME ques depending on what server you wanted to jump on.

 

C. This is not a smooth launch, comparing it, especially to a game that came out IN 2004, A POINT IN TIME WERE PEOPLE WERE STILL WEARING CLOTHES FROM THE 90s.

 

Now ****.

[TheDeRagnus]

Just wanna say, that if WoWs launch went SOOOOOOOOOO smooth, why is BW letting people in saying that they don't want to have servers crash like WoWs?

[Trillistar]

The only WOW launch issues I remember is LK when the allowed a day early release of the oackage on the east coast and those players were in game playing the new content 3+ hours before west coast US coudl even stand in line to buy it. They learned and went digital for Cata. Seems swtor didnt' learn from the major mistakes of other major companies. Staggered content access was probably the biggest upset I ever saw.