trotsky_tor Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) And so does Overload, by the way. and yet it works. The difference being that Overload knocks back everyone, and only knocks *down* standard/weak enemies. Orbital Strike has no knockback component, only the knockdown on weak/standard. Overload Orbital Strike Note the descriptions. Edited January 13, 2012 by trotsky_tor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salmissra Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) And grapple has no knock-anything, yet it works. That still doesn't mean Orbital Strike isn't a viable possibility for working, I find it more likely that people ************ in the thread haven't even tried it. oh and Strike most definitely knocks things back, regardless of what the tooltip you link says. Edited January 13, 2012 by Salmissra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trotsky_tor Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) And grapple has no knock-anything, yet it works. That still doesn't mean Orbital Strike isn't a viable possibility for working, I find it more likely that people ************ in the thread haven't even tried it. ...Grapple has a pull component. It GRAPPLES them to you. Of course it works. Also, yes, I have tried Orbital, because I was in a group where the 2 people doing knockbacks didn't time it properly so I said "Well, since we have 20 secs to wait for your CDs, I'll just throw Orbital to see what happens." Of course, you will assume I'm being untruthful, but that's your prerogative. Edited January 13, 2012 by trotsky_tor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salmissra Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I will assume that you didn't wait long enough in the fight to reach the 1 knockdown requirement time, nor did you use strike along with someone else's knockdown before that, which is why YOU are assuming it didn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rathoz Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I will assume that you didn't wait long enough in the fight to reach the 1 knockdown requirement time, nor did you use strike along with someone else's knockdown before that, which is why YOU are assuming it didn't work. I've tried both Orbital and Frag Grenade, neither worked. They only work against Weak/Standard, ignored by the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trotsky_tor Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I will assume that you didn't wait long enough in the fight to reach the 1 knockdown requirement time, nor did you use strike along with someone else's knockdown before that, which is why YOU are assuming it didn't work. I did it after 2 of my party members had already failed to knock him off, so yes, it was in the part of the fight where he's invincible and channelling lightning, etc. As far as not doing it with someone else's knockdown before that, if OS was meant to work, it would've knocked him down for SOMEONE ELSE to knock off. It didn't. End of story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keii Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I did it after 2 of my party members had already failed to knock him off, so yes, it was in the part of the fight where he's invincible and channelling lightning, etc. As far as not doing it with someone else's knockdown before that, if OS was meant to work, it would've knocked him down for SOMEONE ELSE to knock off. It didn't. End of story. I'm pretty sure in that group you timed it right with Calcifer's orbital strike so you had two go off at roughly the same time and I still had to force pull him to the ledge and spike him off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keii Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Tankassins have 3 ways to knock him off. Force pull counts as one of the two needed, even though it goes off on the first, so you can appropriately position on the ledge to pull him off. If you barely miss though, you can spike him off the ledge right after a force pull. Spike has a tiny knockback so he has to be right up on the ledge. If both of those fail you can overload.It's entirely possible for Tank assassins to knock off False Emp by themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coolfusis Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Tanks with known working knockbacks: Assassins/shadows: Spike, overload, pull.Juggernauts/guardians: Force pushPowertechs/vanguards: Grapple (ensure no one loots before they res) Healers with known working knockbacks: Sorcerers/sages: OverloadMercenaries/commandos: Jet boost DPS with known working knockbacks: Sorcerers/sages: OverloadAssassins/shadows: Spike, overloadSnipers/gunslingers: cover pulseMercenaries/commandos: Jet boost Plan ahead, bring at least two from that list when seeking a group. I've had no issues ever getting a group together for HM FE, and I really don't mind needing to slightly plan ahead so the final boss can be beaten. Not everything should be cleared with whatever random hodgepodge of players you happen to scrounge up. Hell, half the reason I got by in WoW BC as a moonkin was because several fights needed off-heals (or even ranged off-tanks, like gruul's), and the crit boost to mages/extra battle res/innervate made up for the lower DPS. I like that the game has made it possible for casuals to get things done, but I don't want everything to become a loot pinata. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NasherUK Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 (edited) Unlike a certain other MMO, you need to actually plan ahead in a few of TOR's boss fights and you can't just roll your face across the keyboard to win. I have managed to kill him before he even started channeling lightning, so it is possible to kill him without knockbacks. Edited January 13, 2012 by NasherUK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xilap Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Just wondering has anyone tried jumping off and using grapple and then having the sorc try to use extricate to save you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mavery Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 What are these abilities you speak of? They are... Force Pull and Force Wave. Not really sure what was so confusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xothos Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 LOL i could be way off here... but knockback is not how he was intended to be beaten... I think they will (and should) remove that option soon. I have not done that encounter yet but it sounds like some condition is not being met, perhaps he is reaching an immunity timer because the dps is too soft? Maybe it is like some raid bosses where he becomes immune for a long period of time where the group has to just buff up and heal through it until a later time where you can resume fighting him *shrug* something is being missed... he doesn't sound like he is "broken" just some clever mechanic at work here. You are way off. Nota broken fight. Takes 2 knockbacks like everyone else was saying. Enough classes have them, so just bring 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AesirUesugi Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 I used Rocket Punch to get him over the edge as a Merc (an ability which Powertechs also possess) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trotsky_tor Posted January 13, 2012 Share Posted January 13, 2012 Well, it seems like this will be a non-issue in 1.1 on Tuesday. "Players can now acquire special Pulse Grenades outside of Darth Malgus’ throne room. These grenades aid groups lacking knockback abilities in defeating him." from the updated patch notes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pavarotti Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 (edited) I used Rocket Punch to get him over the edge as a Merc (an ability which Powertechs also possess) But if you'd actually taken the time to learn either of those Adv.Classes you would know that Mercenaries only knockback with Rocket Punch when they have the required talent, a talent that does not exist for the Powertech! Edited January 14, 2012 by pavarotti Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munx Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Not impossible to kill without knowback I actually killed him the other day without anyone knocking him of edge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexysolo Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 If your dps isnt horrid you'll kill him before this phase. He only enters this phase after using the force choke/chasing a party member mechanic on all four party members. Pretty much seems to me like a 1 last shot at downing him before he enrages and wipes you, if you can figure it out. It seems like your DPS is horrid because all of the groups I go with don't even get to the 4th party member. He becomes immune to damage after 3 of us have to solo him, not 4. Maybe if you cared less about your ****** DPS and posting on here, you would learn the mechanic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playingforfun Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Operatives have an ability they can use from stealth that while it doesn't knock him back it can be used for the first hit so a real knockback will work. Hidden Strike or something like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shammus Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Normal mode you don't need knockbacks, hard mode you do, that's the mechanic. At about 50k hp he starts channeling force lightning and he cannot be interrupted, losed, or stopped in any way and will wipe you if you don't react as follows: When he does that, he loses his boss immunity, and the first knockback will knock him down to the ground, the second one will send him flying, position yourself well so he falls in one of the pits and he dies. Time the knockbacks right or he'll get up again and you'll have to repeat the process, losing precious time. Edit Above poster: he is meant to die, and the loot is from a chest (hard mode, that is). He gives columi chest (exchangable token at the vendor) a mount (not every time but looks like crap anyway) a crafting recipe, a crafting mat. this mechanic actually sounds pretty awesome. kind of like a vader/emporer thing going on.. wouldn't you agree? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merraith Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 To be clear...he is killable without knockbacks. It doesn't matter how many of your group he has chosen to go one on one with as he gets close to ~10% when he starts doing his channel when you would normally need to knock him back, he just needs to have AT LEAST one person left to go one on one with. The timing is fairly tricky, but if he's right in the 10-12% range when his script for choosing someone begins, then if your dps is good enough both collectively (before he stuns 3 of your group) and individually (the one person who is active when the other 3 are stunned) you can dps his health down to 0 during the script and he will not go into the channel phase which would require the knockback. Obviously you would need enough dps to at least have him around 10% before the last person to go one on one occurs without actually pushing him over into his channel phase, and enough dps to push once the script begins to kill him before it's over...but it is possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysquine Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 1st knockback he goes to the ground, 2nd knockback (you have to be fast) you push him to his doom like you would a normal npc/player. Long story short, if you have less than 2 knockbacks, you can't do it. Spot on. Sorc + Jugg works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gvaz Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 At 8% health, the last boss of HM False Emperor (not going to spoil it with his name, for anyone who still hasn't done it) needs to be dragged over to a ledge and hit off the ledge with not one, but two knockbacks, since he becomes invulnerable and soon after enrages. This is a fun mechanic, except for the fact that not all advanced classes have knockbacks, and I can very easily think of many group compositions that would be perfectly fine except for the inability to knock back twice. On this particular boss, such a party would be unable to complete the encounter except with some really clever thinking (ex. a bounty hunter using grapple hook while jumping off the cliff). Please turn knocking the boss off the cliff into a scripted event, or add knockback to all the classes. I'm not sure if this is also the case with Normal mode False Emperor, since I've never done it. If you go to ilum it's in teh beginning of the damn instance for the quest, before you even step foot in it its said, it's darth malgus. Now, the boss BEFORE it is a spoiler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueRazor Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 You can kill the last boss without KBs as long as you can dps him down before the end of the 4th one on one fight. We accomplished this by having the healer (me) dps as much as humanly possible. If he isn't below 25% by the time he calls the third person's name, you're screwed. We beat him using the following group composition - Jug (tank) Sorc (healer) sniper and marauder for DPS. We are also decently geared, and as guildies, were using vent. The sniper ended up getting the kill-shot as soon as his one on one began. Most people aren't rocking great gear yet, and pugs are notoriously un-focused. It seems many people are used to running WoW heroics grossly overgeared, and expect to be able to do the same thing as soon as they hit 50 in this game. Spamming aoes with auto-follow on, while watching TV will not make for a successful run. When everyone has full t2+ gear, everyone will be able to roflstomp the content, but for now, most hard-modes require a little bit of thought. I try to only do hard-modes with guildies for now, as I've had a few groups with the tank in level 40 greens/blues, with 11k health fully buffed, wondering why they get two-shot in HM Battle for illium. That's right, I can't heal you if a boss hits you for 6K+ a shot (or a 10K crit). Many folks falsely believe they can skip the regular level 50 instances and go straight to the level 50 HMs with level 45 blues on. Eventually, people will have the gear that enables them to carry poorly equipped group members, but for now, one weak dps can mean the difference between total success, and total failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borscter Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 2manned false emperor boss today with marauder and operative. Just stand on opposite sides of the gap, he'll charge one and attempt to run back to the other. And he'll take the shortest route there, running into the void So, no stuns needed. Hell, you don't have to hit him at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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