B3-S1 Bessi at 5/11 and RNG of training modules

[Saeten]

How are you supposed to compete training of specific planet areas when the modules are RNG and you can’t get the ones you need???????

B3-S1 Bessi at 5/11 and RNG of training modules didn’t give me the areas for the 5 of each to complete. 

It is possible for me to never complete Bessi in months if not years for this issue.

The only ways to fix this level is for HK-24 to have specific areas of training modules to buy directly or change the RNG of modules to be limited to the ones you are focused on for your training level.

please review and fix!!!!

@KeithKanneg @EricMusco @JackieKo 

Edited June 11 by Saeten

[iakona]

Same problem here. B3-S1 progress is RNG-gated, which is a very player-hostile design choice. Get rid of the weekly currency caps or limit training module RNG to only give planets/combat roles that are still needed for the current level. I already have half a cargo bay of unusable Training Modules, Collected Research, and Data Fragments that can’t be opened or used due to the overly aggressive weekly caps, and it’s only going to get worse while I wait on RNG to give me the 11 more CZ/Black Hole/Iokath Training Modules I need to continue progressing.

B3-S1 progress should be entirely effort-based, not at all restricted by RNG.

Edited June 11 by iakona

[denajii]

The weekly caps definitely need to be increased because you can only make so much progress - and I know it's to pad it out, but.. they're still ridiculous

And rng when theres specific areas necessary for further progress is.... no, just no, that is horrible design

The missions being rng before lvl 5 are okay imo, potentially very annoying when it's a planet like Ruhnuk(ugh), but at least it's a type of variety

[Nothing_Shines]

Well the good news for people starting later is they can hoard the three required tier five missions during tiers 1-4, now. I know I burned through a bunch of CZ-198, Iokath and Black Hole missions on the way to five that I obviously wouldn’t have had I known tier five was going to be such a roadblock.

Since reaching 5, I haven’t gotten a single of the required mission locations, burned through what was left of my resources for new attempts from HK-24 and am now stuck wasting time with Bessi until her timer ends and I can activate her again to get the two missions from memory chips.

i also have an entire cargo hold page filled with unusable missions and resource packs.

[nimaus]

Thank god, just got to level 5 and thought I was being stupid lol

I mean really I'm ready to accept that weekly cap - it's annoyingly low but somewhat manageable like sure, I've the patience to grind it. But to put RNG into it? That's just a low blow.

I'm not sure if randomness changes according to specific stage of progress, but say if every time it's equally random, from the pool daily areas (Onderon, Iokath, Section X, Black Hole, Makeb, Yavin IV, Mek-Sha, Czerka, Ruhnuk, Ossus, Oricon, Manaan, Rishi - not sure if there's more, like Ziost for example, the bigger the pool, the smaller the %), that's just 7.7% of a chance for the module to be one you need to progress. At level 5, you need to complete 5 modules of 3 specific areas - and to think how many modules we will need to complete to finally fill those required 15 specific modules, and especially how long it would take if we got just 2 modules per memory chip/1 hr. session per mem. chip, and we have only very limited amount of those data currencies per week to gamble with the modules and we already need to reserve some of those data for upgrades too. And this is just level 5 out of 11?!?

Sorry for info dump, but since this is the first post about it, just wanna say that I know the devs said they want it to be grinding, but putting in RNG precisely devalues the labour of grinding. Like so I can grind harder but for someone to have fully upgraded Bessi before me purely because of chance + having my inventory and cargo bays full of useless modules/research data.

Agree with Iakona, we need an effort-based system where progress is reachable by direct tasks and labour.

[nimaus]

3 minutes ago, Nothing_Shines said:

I know I burned through a bunch of CZ-198, Iokath and Black Hole missions on the way to five

I haven't gotten CZ-198 modules at all until reaching lvl.5 lol and I got just 2 from level progress rewards - none from dozen of modules I brought from HK-24 and memory chip.

Weird enough, many of the modules I got seem to be just coincidentally identical, like not only is it Mek-Sha, but multiple Combat Mek-Sha modules, or Support Makeb etc. and some certainly came up more, like I probably got mostly Section X, Black Hole, and Mek-Sha - which sucks because they have fewer quests.

[DeannaVoyager]

I haven't had problems with weekly caps yet, but that's only because I don't know what I'm supposed to do and I randomly click stuff when I want to try to progress it again. I've been forcing myself to do some of them, to progress at least a bit, but I hate it. I've done all the daily areas millions of times, but this is even worse because you never even get to finish the weekly. Now you guys are telling me they also added RNG to the missions... I am speechless. Good thing I'm not in a rush to finish it. Now I'm thinking it may not even be worth it. 

I can't believe they've added yet another layer of grinding old content, with low currency caps, with RNG, and with a very complicated and unintuitive system to re-grind everything with. Why not use all that developement time to create NEW CONTENT instead? I've never been so close to unsubbing and leaving the game for good as I am now. 

[HypSpec]

Trying to understand why all three of the gating factors were necessary to support the player experience goals of the devs - currency caps, 1hr limit on Bessi's time out, and RNG of missions types and locations granted. These on top of some gotchas can make for wearisome gaming for a lot of players. I think the "they'll enjoy the new companion so much more than others because of what they went through to get her" card may be getting overplayed here. 

• I can reasonably accept some sort of cap on the currencies so there is a minimum time investment required and that it can't be done by 24/7 grinding.
• I am still not sure why they have a time limit on having Bessi out unless it is to have another layer to work through and time management as an additional challenge to players.
• I cannot understand the RNG on missions granted whether it be type or location and with the only player experience output likely being frustration and inconsistent player to player.

I share the issue called out above on her time limit. We are used to doing the full 'weekly' set of dailies, but you can't with that time limit. I end up with a list of unfinished weeklies in the quest log that I am less enthusiastic about going to back to clear out after Bessi gets dismissed. It really does run counter to what we are used to with no benefit I can see.

So for the devs - why does there need to more time-gating factors than the caps? or please share more about your objectives in having the others too, especially the RNG.

Edited June 12 by HypSpec

[HobbesToo]

I don't see what the issue is. The developers equated an unlocked B3-S1 with a Wings of the Architect. It's going to take time, and if we have excess area training module then that means we can use them in later levels.  There is no need to fix a system that isn't broken.

[Ruchalus]

I agree, it makes things a PAIN. I have to write and update a guide for this topic but it'll be hard to update the guide in a timely manner if I'm at the mercy of RNG. The weekly caps could potentially use an increase, but your idea of the HK-24 Droid selling specific training modules for select areas would be great. I think it's ridiculous how our objective to "Upload CZ-198/Iokath/Black Hole Research to the Terminal" requires Systems Data. Those resources are spread so thin between those and the upgrades for B3-S1, it would make SO MUCH MORE SENSE if the uploading objective only required the Area-Specific Data we get from defeating enemies with B3-S1 out. 

I do not trust RNG, if I had a luck stat it would be abysmal. I would like some amount of control in how I can upgrade B3-S1.

Edited June 12 by Ruchalus

[Taurax]

I had seen the same thing, needing specific planetary missions at level 5 and beyond, reading a guide today.  I do agree with the aspect of RNG giving missions, and it is possible to NEVER get a mission on a planet for weeks or months.  I know we 'could' buy with resources more opportunities for missions, but then we need those resources later for leveling.  Given that Bessi is a subscriber only deal, this makes this a little unfair.

The weekly caps, I can get, but it makes the whole leveling of Bessi really target that it will take 11 (or more weeks) to complete.  

I sure hope Bessi is a way more powerful companion than any or the others for the effort and time to put into it.  

[Ruchalus]

1 minute ago, Taurax said:

I sure hope Bessi is a way more powerful companion than any or the others for the effort and time to put into it.  

I hope so too, HK-51 took a good amount of effort to get (but nowhere near this much), and he was DEFINITELY worth it before the companion rework since he could one-shot kill silver rings or lower.

[iakona]

4 hours ago, Taurax said:

I had seen the same thing, needing specific planetary missions at level 5 and beyond, reading a guide today.  I do agree with the aspect of RNG giving missions, and it is possible to NEVER get a mission on a planet for weeks or months.  I know we 'could' buy with resources more opportunities for missions, but then we need those resources later for leveling.  Given that Bessi is a subscriber only deal, this makes this a little unfair.

The weekly caps, I can get, but it makes the whole leveling of Bessi really target that it will take 11 (or more weeks) to complete.  

I sure hope Bessi is a way more powerful companion than any or the others for the effort and time to put into it.  

4 hours ago, Ruchalus said:

I hope so too, HK-51 took a good amount of effort to get (but nowhere near this much), and he was DEFINITELY worth it before the companion rework since he could one-shot kill silver rings or lower.

 

lol well you're both going to be disappointed. It's a purely cosmetic companion. All the ability stats on the finished version of B3-S1 are identical to Shae Vizla, just reskinned. Cruel joke by the devs to make it so hard to get this "reward" when you can get literally the same abilities from level 1 with zero effort using Shae.

[optotiger]

Completely agree.  I am glad to see them to try something different ad I can live with the lower caps as I understand that they want it to last over several weeks.  But to use RNG to get the modules is beyond stupid as getting modules you need may not happen.  So far have had certain planets I have not hardly gotten any missions for and other planets where I have gotten several.  Turns level 5 onwards into a huge grind which quite frankly doesn't make the comp worth doing.  Kind of annoying, as I enjoyed levels 1-4 once I figured out how the system worked. 

Considering how the last gearing change was designed to remove the annoying RNG elements of previous gearing systems in this game to bring RNG back into this type of format is really annoying. 

[denajii]

9 hours ago, Taurax said:

I sure hope Bessi is a way more powerful companion than any or the others for the effort and time to put into it.  

She's not

her functions are the exact same as every other companion but with unique animations

She's on par with Shae, apparently, as her aoe attack as a dps is the same as Shae's aerial annihilation, but that's it

Atlurr from galactic season 1 and Amity from season 4 were examples of what the Venture system should be: companions that have uniqueness to their ability kits that make them stand out from the other companions of the game.. unique animations are cool, yes, but like iakona said, this is a lot of grinding and effort for a companion that's the same as one that's already in the game, and has the same functions, especially when the only (debatable) benefit is that she doesn't talk while Shae admittedly never shuts up

Edited June 13 by denajii

[Strathkin]

I mean, the RNG like some say is kind of bad, I find it helps though if you summon her for different tasks on at least two character's.

Still this week I was a bit disappointed when I found out the previous 3 Tank, Support & Damage roles now increased to 4.  I mean many I've found they can spend most of the 1st or 2nd day just running around doing mission's for B3-S1.

• What's worse, is now you need to not complete a mission you were working on if her timer is going to run out...
• Previously you could resummon her, at least to finish the mission before she disappeared.
• Now you got to sit and wait for perhaps 5-10 minutes, unless your absolutely certain you can finish mission, and also turn it in or you loose progress.

Still I'm not a big fan of doing 4 Tank, 4 Support, and 4 Healer roles.  I mean (most) exclusively always have Companions in Support, because Tank &/or DPS is very situational.   

[hillerbees]

I've given up on Bessie already - from day one to be forced to run missions on Runik.  Looks like all work and no play.  I'll see how everyone else gets on with it and how long it is typically taking.

I do think its good to earn a companion rather than everyone just getting them but I'd have thought a shorter quest trail would be better- even if it was 2 or 3 times the amount of effort required to get the star fortress ones.  Months of work for one is not at all appealing.

Also I do think they should have stated at the very outset that there would be a long quest chain to complete when there was first mention of the Basilik companion instead of after a number of updates in.

[RainEbon]

Well, it has finally happened. I've reached that point where I'm thinking of dropping the game again which hasn't happened since my return to SWTOR with 6.0.

I honestly have no idea what's going on with this game and what the devs intentions for it are but the future doesn't seem bright to me. Every aspect of SWTOR has been turned into a mind numbing grind and that just isn't fun.

I find my self laughing as I write this post seeing how my intentions to list all the problems I have with this game, ranging from its mediocre story that goes nowhere, no endgame, galactic seasons, the APAC server to the developers horrible handling or should I say ignoring of PvP have changed. I just don't want to or care anymore.

To keep it on topic and the reason for my posting, the B3-S1 quest. Maybe the devs saw it as an opportunity to expand the players playtime but from my experience and those around me the outcome has been the opposite. No one wants to spend this much time on a single quest running around doing brain (and a word that for some reason is not allowed, it's not that bad :/ ) activities over and over again while at the same time being limited by a companions time limit, weekly materials/ingredients limit, RNG and on top of that the subscription only aspect of it that threatens to take away your progress if you decided to become preferred.

I really didn't want to doom post but in all honesty this quest has just added to the disappointment that SWTOR has become. I have my 20 sub days or so left but after that I'm not sure I'll be subscribing again or playing the game if something doesn't change. 

 

Edited June 13 by RainEbon

[Taurax]

Actually, for combat mode even at level 25, she seems to do quite well.  I know in the guides people have stated that the influence level resets, but I haven't found that to be the case.  I gave her gifts to level 10 the first week, and it stayed until this week when I moved her to level 25.  (I had extra comp gifts so I didn't waste any credits)  The heals are about average, but think tank mode she is struggling to hold agro (I'm a healer spec).  I'm starting (and wish I had kept all my first ones, not deleted them because I don't really want to goto Iokath and Manaan for their quests) to keep them in a bank tab for the further research.  However, the resources gated stopped me pretty much.  I'll just have to log in daily, select Bessi, get her daily 2 quests and hope they are useful.  

Except I have already 15 items which are resources rewards that I can't use as they will just get thrown away due to the caps.  Sigh, and from what looks like on the guide that I'll need to do more quests per week.  I'll just be working on trying to get blueprints for the galactic seasons for now.  

[HypSpec]

Looks like once you are grinding level 5 - 9, the 5 training modules per location with be a big gating factor for progress. It looks like 3 locations per level. With the RNG on training module locations, we'll want to keep the ones that will show in the later weeks (rather than doing just for currency) in inventory for the right week. Thinking this will reduce the RNG issue as we advance from level 5. Inevitably we'll have to buy some from HK-24 as I see (already had to buy a support one to finish level 5, but able to use add'l currency from Heroic bonus).

So at Lvl 5, only use modules for Iokath, Black Hole, and CZ. Then only the ones tied to each level going forward.

Our inventories are going to be packed with research modules we don't turn in due to cap, location training modules because not part of current level, and the data fragments by location as they drop in inventory.

[Bar-Da-Voya]

On 6/12/2024 at 11:02 AM, Nothing_Shines said:

Since reaching 5, I haven’t gotten a single of the required mission locations, burned through what was left of my resources for new attempts from HK-24 and am now stuck wasting time with Bessi until her timer ends and I can activate her again to get the two missions from memory chips.

 

You don't have to wait for Bessi's timer to run out to use more memory chips. You can either use a different character and use a memory chip for Bessi even if the alt hasn't complete any prior missions for Lane or you can dismiss Bessi as an active companion while in the lab and Bessi will reappear where you can talk to Bessi and turn in another memory chip to get 2 more missions.

Also for future planning it seems  you will need 5 of every area training mission except for Rishi and Mek-Sha as you progress through the levels.

Last tip that I found and I hope is not a bug is that when Bessi disappears after the 1 hour timer is up, if you have an active training mission you can resummon her from your companion menu as long as you are on the planet that you have the training mission for to allow you to complete that training mission even after the 1 hour timer is up.

Final tips - don't worry about the currencies as you will always have more than you need each week as long as you don't open the currency box after you hit the weekly limits so spend all you currency to get missions if you need more missions and make sure you get the 10 memory chips per week (using alts) so that you will get 20 missions per week from that.

With all that I managed to get 5/5 on CZ-198 and Iokath and 4/5 on Black Hole this week (Level 5) and have a good amount of missions ready for Levels 6, 8 & 9.

Enjoy the grind.  

[HypSpec]

3 minutes ago, Bar-Da-Voya said:

Final tips - don't worry about the currencies as you will always have more than you need each week as long as you don't open the currency box after you hit the weekly limits so spend all you currency to get missions if you need more missions and make sure you get the 10 memory chips per week (using alts) so that you will get 20 missions per week from that.

Good thought here on using leftover currencies - I have 10 of each (combat, defense, support) and can buy a mission with each one. I am not at 5 for 5 on any yet, so along with the training module you get each time you use a memory chip, I can buy three others (and pray to the RNG gods to get the right locations).

[denavin]

Not going to bother with all the RNG or Grind to get this companion. It's Just NOT Worth it....

[Ranadiel_Marius]

So something to keep in mind for anyone starting to stockpile modules, you only need to pre-emptively stockpile 4 for each location. When you go up a level you get three modules as a reward for completing the previous repair level. These modules are guaranteed to be modules you need for the next level. On early levels these modules are combat/support/defense, but at higher levels they are "generic" modules that will always drop a module for a specific location that you need (e.g., the modules for completing level 4 will always drop 1 CZ-198, 1 Iokath, and 1 Black Hole).

6 hours ago, Taurax said:

Actually, for combat mode even at level 25, she seems to do quite well.  I know in the guides people have stated that the influence level resets, but I haven't found that to be the case.  I gave her gifts to level 10 the first week, and it stayed until this week when I moved her to level 25.  (I had extra comp gifts so I didn't waste any credits)  The heals are about average, but think tank mode she is struggling to hold agro (I'm a healer spec).  I'm starting (and wish I had kept all my first ones, not deleted them because I don't really want to goto Iokath and Manaan for their quests) to keep them in a bank tab for the further research.  However, the resources gated stopped me pretty much.  I'll just have to log in daily, select Bessi, get her daily 2 quests and hope they are useful.  

Except I have already 15 items which are resources rewards that I can't use as they will just get thrown away due to the caps.  Sigh, and from what looks like on the guide that I'll need to do more quests per week.  I'll just be working on trying to get blueprints for the galactic seasons for now.  

Regarding affection reset, I assume that happens whenever Bessi changes "model." The first model change happens when you complete repair level 1. At this point I am assuming that the second model change happens when you complete level 7, but will need another week or two to be sure. And the last model change happens when you take her home (at level 10?).

The reason the affection resets is that there are actually four Bessis in the code, one for each version of her appearance (unfinished, unfinished v2, unfinished v3, and finished).

[OutsiderJediSam]

So I just hit Level 5 and see what all the issues are too.

The RNG of this is just terrible.  It was nice that hitting the level did give me 1 of each place I need, and I was lucky enough to have 1 module in storage, but now I'm at the mercy of RNG for 5 modules in 3 specific places each as well as RNG for the drop of the 10 data fragments per place???  Are you kidding me?

Just as a reference for my experience....I did 2 CZs (1 given at Level 5 and the 1 I had in storage) so 4 total missions......and I got 1 data fragment drop.  So, at that rate, I'd have to actually do 20 modules??? I'm sure my RNG wouldn't be that bad but still...it's probably gonna take more runs than the module missions to complete the fragment missions and that's all in that 1 area?  Then repeat in 2 more diff areas????

Update: Just did 1 Black Hole module so 1/5...and 1/10 on fragments....so more Black Holes runs for the fragments than the 5 module runs as well???

And all this for Level 5.....with Level 6-11 to go too????

I mean, I really don't wanna criticize the devs too harshly, but when bad concept is this obvious.....what else is there to do???

Edited June 13 by OutsiderJediSam