SWTOR 7.0 is the worst expansion to date ?

[Pricia]

It is weird what gets called an expansion now... Like, think how long of a slog KOTFE was. And KOTET only slightly less so, they were HUGE in terms of story addition. Even though I hated the stories, they were undeniably long and deep.

 

Then look at Onslaught.. You can literally have the whole thing done in an hour and a half. Forged Alliances takes longer! The LEADUP to SoR... And Onslaught's meant to be a main expansion? It's barely bigger than Jedi Under Siege. Which was only an update right..

 

At least Onslaught added uprisings. Not that many people do them, but at least that's content lol.

[OlBuzzard]

Ya know folks ... IMO there is still something going on in the background that we're not seeing.

 

** Massive exodus of employees ( could be ... not sure. Let's face it here in the US we've seen this repeatedly in virtually EVERY part of business... retail, fast food (even major restaurant chains) Grocery stores and Pharmacy (CVS especially here where I live . Other aspects of the entertainment industry. ) Some how I don't see BW as being immune from some of the fallout that has transpired since the entire COVID impact. And YES we are still seeing those affects where I live on a daily basis !!

 

** Expansion ... IMO 7.0 is not an expansion. An update ?? More like a change in the overall game strategy. IMO this is the part I'm really struggling with.

 

** Who's side am I on ?? Who said I have to be on someone's side. (anyone's side for that matter).

 

** So much potential. So much we were looking forward to. OK someone zigged when they should have zagged!! I get that !!

 

To the team: I really don't care how we got to this point. IMO the real question is how to we make amends. That goes for us a players as much as it does to those who decided to take so much of what we once loved away.

 

Olive branch: Peace out dude !! If I had the ability to patch things up and make some good stuff happen for most of us ( see note at bottom) ... I'd do it in a hear beat !!

 

(Note at bottom: most of us ?? YUP !! There's no way you'll please everyone !!! )

Edited December 27, 2021 by OlBuzzard

[uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu]

At least Onslaught added uprisings. Not that many people do them, but at least that's content lol.

 

Didn't KOTET add those? I've never done them, as you guessed haha, so I dunno, but I'm aware of them, and based of Lana's comments about "uprisings sparking across the galaxy" right at the end of KOTET, I had assumed that's where they were introduced?

 

Are they worth doing as a story player? Doable solo?

[TziganeNZ]

Didn't KOTET add those? I've never done them, as you guessed haha, so I dunno, but I'm aware of them, and based of Lana's comments about "uprisings sparking across the galaxy" right at the end of KOTET, I had assumed that's where they were introduced?

 

Are they worth doing as a story player? Doable solo?

I've never figured out how to start them - would also be interested to know if they are soloable.

[mike_carton]

There are 10 of them, each with the usual three difficulty modes. They were added as two separate sets of five each in 5.0 and 5.1 updates. Story and and Veteran Modes can be done though the Group Finder. For all three modes, you can form a custom group of players, pick up the mission on the fleet (Combat Training section,) and use the mission transport to start the Uprising. MM Uprisings certainly need a tank and a Healer and PUGs tend to struggle.

 

Highly effective players might be able to solo some Uprisings in Story Mode with good gear, but this is generally very demanding content now in terms of DPS and healing needed. It used to be a bit easier when the Uprisings were scaled to level 70 but the player characters were not (meaning they retained level 75 stats.) It was possible to solo MM Inferno, for instance. That changed some time during the last one year.

Edited December 28, 2021 by mike_carton

[Cedia]

There are 10 of them, each with the usual three difficulty modes. They were added as two separate sets of five each in 5.0 and 5.1 updates. Story and and Veteran Modes can be done though the Group Finder. For all three modes, you can form a custom group of players, pick up the mission on the fleet (Combat Training section,) and use the mission transport to start the Uprising. MM Uprisings certainly need a tank and a Healer and PUGs tend to struggle.

 

Highly effective players might be able to solo some Uprisings in Story Mode with good gear, but this is generally very demanding content now in terms of DPS and healing needed. It used to be a bit easier when the Uprisings were scaled to level 70 but the player characters were not (meaning they retained level 75 stats.) It was possible to solo MM Inferno, for instance. That changed some time during the last one year.

 

Thanks for the information. *yawn* Just more content for me to ignore.

[TziganeNZ]

There are 10 of them, each with the usual three difficulty modes. They were added as two separate sets of five each in 5.0 and 5.1 updates. Story and and Veteran Modes can be done though the Group Finder. For all three modes, you can form a custom group of players, pick up the mission on the fleet (Combat Training section,) and use the mission transport to start the Uprising. MM Uprisings certainly need a tank and a Healer and PUGs tend to struggle.

 

Highly effective players might be able to solo some Uprisings in Story Mode with good gear, but this is generally very demanding content now in terms of DPS and healing needed. It used to be a bit easier when the Uprisings were scaled to level 70 but the player characters were not (meaning they retained level 75 stats.) It was possible to solo MM Inferno, for instance. That changed some time during the last one year.

Thanks for your reply - appreciate the clarification and information.

 

Since I've never used group finder, no wonder I couldn't find them. And as they are mostly group only, I will never play them.

[DavidAtkinson]

It is weird what gets called an expansion now... Like, think how long of a slog KOTFE was. And KOTET only slightly less so, they were HUGE in terms of story addition. Even though I hated the stories, they were undeniably long and deep.

 

Then look at Onslaught.. You can literally have the whole thing done in an hour and a half. Forged Alliances takes longer! The LEADUP to SoR... And Onslaught's meant to be a main expansion? It's barely bigger than Jedi Under Siege. Which was only an update right..

 

You know that might be the reason why were are stuck with long and complicated gear grinds. We get a story that we can finish in one hour without space barring the dialogues and what then ? Ah yes, we still need to have a " reason " that keeps usbusy" in game. And if actual content won't be able to do so, gearing surely will ...

 

It's sad to see that they made a lot of good things in terms of gearing in 6.0 , and now they seem to scrap it all . The only positive thing about it is the fact that it's still legacy bound(thank god).

 

You all made some good points . It's very unusual to browse threads about 7.0 and find out that a lot of changes are disliked.

[Kendaric]

Thanks for the information. *yawn* Just more content for me to ignore.

 

Yeah, it's the same for me. There's absolutely no way I'll ever do an uprising. I play SWTOR for the story and nothing else.

 

Once 7.0 hits I'll probably play through the story on multiple alts (depending on how good it actually is), but beyond that I see very little reason for me to log on regularly. I most definitely won't waste time with content I don't enjoy.

[Pietrastor]

The worst? Well, jury's out on that till it realases obviously.

 

But definitely 100% the tiniest, shortest, smallest AND following the least amount of pre-expansion content ever released. And all that for the Grand 10th Anniversary. Hard to believe they can write, with a straight face, pompous letters about an amazing future SWTOR is suppoused to have with this kind of an output.

Edited December 28, 2021 by Pietrastor

[ShieldProtection]

"SWTOR 7.0 is the worst expansion to date ?"

 

Expansion isn't even released yet,

 

Right,

[Sarfux]

if they seriously go ahead with having the second combat style behind a play wall where you MUST FINISH chapter 3 to unlock it and switch? that will piss a lot of people off and that's that. there's a lot more stuff they need to NOT do, but that's one of the issues with 7.0. the other stupid decision is taking away xp from conquest objectives, which is a VERY viable leveling alternative for MANY people.

[Sarfux]

"SWTOR 7.0 is the worst expansion to date ?"

 

Expansion isn't even released yet,

 

Right,

 

based what's on the PTS compared to what has been tested with other expansions?...................

 

this is utterly terrible for this game . and I say that as a person who's been here with the game since it was alpha, and the old squadron forums lol! they are changing things for the sake of change now...totally not needed

[JattaGin]

SWTOR 7.0 is the worst expansion to date ?

 

Yes!

 

/thread

 

 

I've played (and tested) all expansions. What I witness on the PTS is by far the worst update I've seen in this game. In one of the threads on the PTS forum I ask BW "Who is your target group for 7.0?" Old players will have it worse. New players will have it worse. The only group who maybe seems to have it better (but I'm not sure about that) are professional raiders. The 0,1% of the game's population. Including Mr. Kanneg.

 

 

So I ask again. No one seems to like anything about 7.0 . So what now ? What was the point of all the feedback ?

 

The same as always: The false feeling of being valued as a tester and paying customer. I have zero expectations that they consider my feedback. They never did. That said, some people think that they delayed 7.0 because of our feedback and they hope that they will still change the game.

 

NO!

 

They delayed 7.0, because THEIR version of 7.0 wasn't ready in time. THEIR version of 7.0 is now ready for testing on the PTS. What we witness now on the PTS is exactly what we will get. The only thing they will do in January/February is fixing the worst bugs they are able to fix. For example that the inventory won't close when you hit "i". Or that some of the new achievements get granted too early. Yes, that they will fix.

 

Please, all you players hoping that they change the things we beg them to change: Lower your expectations!

 

Revert the decision to not reset dailies and weeklies? Not gonna happen.

 

Change the gearing system? Not gonna happen.

 

Revert the decision to rotate missions? Not gonna happen.

 

Add something for the crafters? Not gonna happen.

 

Revert the nerfed classes? Not gonna happen.

 

Change the way how Galactic Seasons work now? Not gonna happen.

 

Fix the broken economy? Not gonna happen.

 

Something something whatever you're unhapp with? Not gonna happen.

 

I'm just sad that they decided to make 7.0 the way they make it. All they needed to do was add NEW PLAYABLE CONTENT! But no, instead they change the whole game. For the worse.

 

You mean downgrade, right?

 

Lol.

 

At least Onslaught added uprisings. Not that many people do them, but at least that's content lol.

 

No, they came with KotET.

 

Edit:

 

Our negative feedback to changes had very little to do with the delay.

 

If you jump on the PTS you can categorically see they didn’t have half the stuff even close to being finished. There are still so many bugs and systems that don’t sync up that if they’d released it they would have lost many new and old players because of how broken it would have been. I wouldn’t even consider some parts to be beta worthy yet.

 

I would temper your expectations with this delay. I don’t think BioWare are doing any major changes based on our negative feedback to unwanted changes. All BioWare are doing is trying to get the stuff currently on the PTS to work better than it does. Nothing more.

 

Suggesting they are making any course corrections based on our feedback is false hope and you’re just setting yourself and others up to being disappointed.

 

Well, could have saved my energy. Trixxie said it already.

Edited December 29, 2021 by JattaGin

[Toraak]

based what's on the PTS compared to what has been tested with other expansions?...................

 

this is utterly terrible for this game . and I say that as a person who's been here with the game since it was alpha, and the old squadron forums lol! they are changing things for the sake of change now...totally not needed

 

Since we don't know how long the story is, that's is premature to say it's the shortest. Story is NEVER put on the PTS because BW doesn't want to spoil the story on us. Do we expect it to be the size of onslaught? probably, but we don't know that for a fact.

 

As for being the worst expansion, most of the hyperbole on the forums I see are overrated about it. Some things are good, others I don't like. People will adapt and continue playing.

Edited December 29, 2021 by Toraak

[TrixxieTriss]

People will adapt and continue playing.

 

And many more will leave than come and play. It’s certainly a winning formula that BioWare has continually used over the years 🙄. That’s why we’ve only got 2 semi full servers, 1 half full server and 2 dead language servers.

 

In any other industry or even game, this business model would be seen as a major failure. Driving away your loyal customers because you constantly ignore them is hubris and arrogant.

 

I’ve said this many times now, if this wasn’t a Star Wars based game it would have already failed years ago and been shut down. And the people at BioWare would have lost their jobs.

 

You only need to see what EA did to Anthem to realise I’m correct.

Edited December 29, 2021 by TrixxieTriss

[MystyqeofXev]

And many more will leave than come and play. It’s certainly a winning formula that BioWare has continually used over the years 🙄. That’s why we’ve only got 2 semi full servers, 1 half full server and 2 dead language servers.

 

In any other industry or even game, this business model would be seen as a major failure. Driving away your loyal customers because you constantly ignore them is hubris and arrogant.

 

I’ve said this many times now, if this wasn’t a Star Wars based game it would have already failed years ago and been shut down. And the people at BioWare would have lost their jobs.

 

You only need to see what EA did to Anthem to realise I’m correct.

 

Hey now, pride and hubris worked out really well for Blizz, er Activision.

 

Oh, wait.

[SeCKSEgai]

Since we don't know how long the story is, that's is premature to say it's the shortest. Story is NEVER put on the PTS because BW doesn't want to spoil the story on us. Do we expect it to be the size of onslaught? probably, but we don't know that for a fact.

 

As for being the worst expansion, most of the hyperbole on the forums I see are overrated about it. Some things are good, others I don't like. People will adapt and continue playing.

 

Let's start with something basic.

 

You need 2716 accuracy to hit 110.06% accuracy

Two pieces come with accuracy gloves and boots at 475 for 320 gear.

306 accuracy enhancements are 431 (std initiative 80) but at 75 you're having to hit a target of 1590.

 

Where are you going to get the rest of it? And what does it end up costing you?

 

Ear is a given so that's another 475+, but once you dip into legendaries there go the implant slots (mine legendaries are both crit). In my case, what was normally augmented for crit with 306 had to be replaced with accuracy, and what I slotted for alacrity in 306 was the only area where I could add extra crit. I only have one alacrity augment because that's really all I could fit while still hitting just 33.9% crit, when in 306 it would be 42% with a working death knell bonus.

 

In other words, not only do we lose abilities, utilities, and set bonuses, but we also are having to meet higher thresholds but not given the stats to compensate.

 

You have to put in a lot of time just for incremental growth all the while becoming weaker at 80 than you were at 75.

 

Because you have no option to mod, you need a constant supply of aug kits to move your augments as you replace pieces.

 

The proposed gearing system requires a ton of work to progress but only offers minimal gains. On top of that its gated by currency limits.

 

The system as it stands now on PTS is designed to force players to take forever and a day to upgrade their gear but with absolutely no consideration given as to their willingness and motivation. It just assumes that players will pursue the gear no matter the process.

 

I get why they want to move away from spammer station syndrome, but it seems they failed to grasp the nuances on why it became popular.

 

I'm content with running "more difficult" content - the problem is finding enough capable and like-minded individuals on a whim. The other day I joined a dvl boss raid that took a long while to form. When it finally started we lost more than 5 people in the first 10 seconds. After group wiped maybe a minute later a random dps complained it was the healers fault, completely oblivious to the limits of how healing actually works.

 

No one on my server really bothers to pug dxun or gods even in sm because the risk of failure is too high given the player base. There are plenty of people more than capable, but there are a lot more that aren't.

[Pricia]

Since we don't know how long the story is, that's is premature to say it's the shortest. Story is NEVER put on the PTS because BW doesn't want to spoil the story on us. Do we expect it to be the size of onslaught? probably, but we don't know that for a fact.

 

As for being the worst expansion, most of the hyperbole on the forums I see are overrated about it. Some things are good, others I don't like. People will adapt and continue playing.

 

Well, it's ONE planet and ONE flashpoint, so I don't see how it's premature to say that it's the shortest story for an expansion. The worst of it is that, from what they said in an interview/blog post somewhere, it's probably not even going to finish the storyline...

 

Will we adapt and continue playing though? I'm a solo player who loves the story, playing alts and gearing them up, and doing weekly conquest (and galactic seasons). Every single thing I like is being nerfed (although they don't seem to have touched my tacticals... yet).

 

So, let's take it one by one, shall we?

 

Story - as said above, very short. Will probably be done in 1 or 2 hours. I have a lot of characters though so it will keep me busy for a while. Also, no more gear upgrades through story in general as renown is gone (except what we'll get from playing 7.0 the first time).

 

Playing alts... Once I'm done with the story... what's the point really? I mean, I'll play 4, probably rotate them, but once I've done conquest on 4 the rewards for the 5th is a TOTAL JOKE (100 fragments and 25k credits). The only thing that will somehow save it is the guild reward... providing my guild reaches the cap (some haven't). And as long as I need tech fragments (oh yeah, the game pretty much forces you to join a guild considering how hard it will be to get tech fragments now).

 

Gearing up my alts? Yeah... not even going to bother. I'm looking at at least one month per character, I have 34... Do the math. I also have no desire to waste 5 minutes switching gear back and forth between two Conquests. Sheesh, BW doesn't like interruptive play? How is that for interruptive play? Solo players get NO DROPs from anything, so switching gear won't even help getting geared up faster.

 

So yeah, alts are pretty much done.

 

Conquest - double goal, horrible rewards after the 4th character, and if I want to get any sort of upgrade parts I won't be able to do CQ my way, but I'll have to do what the devs want me to play that week to get some upgrade parts, which means fighting with people for spawns (tag sharing is great but that won't work on clickies or mobs that die too fast when 6 people are trying to tag it) and doing content I don't like. Yay?

 

Galactic Season 2 - too many goals I can't do solo. Even the vet chapters will probably be impossible solo with all the gear/ability nerfs. I'm not sure it's even doable to finish it all solo without spending credits. We'll see.

 

So am I bitter? You bet.

 

So... will I adapt? I play solo. Not grouping is a choice because 1) too many toxic players, 2) I need to be able to take a break at any time. So nope, I'm not suddenly going to be able to group.

 

What I can do though, as alts will be useless and solo gear will suck and I have everything I want so I don't care about the 1 million credit cap, is cancel my subscription once I'm done with GS2. Because there will be basically no reason whatsoever to keep subscribing.

Edited December 29, 2021 by Pricia

[TrixxieTriss]

Hey now, pride and hubris worked out really well for Blizz, er Activision.

 

Oh, wait.

 

There was zero pride, it was all arrogance. But you’re right of course, it’s worked out so well for Activision and Ubisoft.

[uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu]

Well, it's ONE planet and ONE flashpoint, so I don't see how it's premature to say that it's the shortest story for an expansion. The worst of it is that, from what they said in an interview/blog post somewhere, it's probably not even going to finish the storyline...

 

 

Wait, really? That it? The whole expansion is gonna be this one planet Elom or whatever? Which, from what I've gleaned, seems to just be another barren abandoned Nathema-esque world with no civilisation... Wow. I assumed it was just gonna start off there or something. That's beyond disappointing. It'll probably take half the time Onslaught did.. Seems every expansion is just giving us less and less story.

[Ranadiel_Marius]

Well, it's ONE planet and ONE flashpoint, so I don't see how it's premature to say that it's the shortest story for an expansion.

 

I mean if you are judging it based on the number of Planets and Flashpoints only with no regard for how long the story actually is, then Legacy of the Sith would be the second shortest since RotHC was just a single planet and ZERO flashpoints.

[Floplag]

At this point we dont know whats going to make it in... they listened, they delayed, right now its literally pure speculation.

Can we le it get closer and see the final product before making statements like this maybe?

[Kendaric]

Wait, really? That it? The whole expansion is gonna be this one planet Elom or whatever? Which, from what I've gleaned, seems to just be another barren abandoned Nathema-esque world with no civilisation... Wow. I assumed it was just gonna start off there or something. That's beyond disappointing. It'll probably take half the time Onslaught did.. Seems every expansion is just giving us less and less story.

 

Elom is just the flashpoint, the actual planet we'll get is imperial controlled Manaan. Apparently there's no daily area at the time of release, which is supposed some time later.

 

So, yeah... in regards to playable content it doesn't really look big.

[uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu]

I mean if you are judging it based on the number of Planets and Flashpoints only with no regard for how long the story actually is, then Legacy of the Sith would be the second shortest since RotHC was just a single planet and ZERO flashpoints.

 

Uh, RotHC also had ENTIRELY unique Rep/Impside stories though. This won't. I'll bet my bottom dollar on it. They'll keep doing what they have been doing. The exact same mirrored content, except your follower and mission giver will change from Gnost-Dural/Tau/Arn/Aryn to Rivix/Krovos/Whatever other Sith they decide to include on Impside. The actual missions will be identical, and the cutscenes will all concern the same issues. Count on it. And I don't really consider that miniscule level of change to be two separate stories. So all in all, completing both RotHC stories takes longer than even Onslaught does, and will likely be longer than the new content too imo. So either way, Onslaught is the shortest released so far.

 

Also, I don't do Ops and hadn't got my PC yet when RotHC released, so I dunno the details on this, but didn't RotHC also include Oricon and the post-story dread master stuff? Or was that a post launch update?

Edited December 29, 2021 by uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu