Gearing Feedback

[Lady_Myajha]

Honestly I've said this before in non-sticky posts, but I'll say it here.

 

They need to release 7.0 without the gearing and flashpoint changes. It's not ready, and all it's going to do is drive away players.

 

If combat skills, load outs, and the character creation were bug free, I may feel differently under the circumstances. but the devs don't have that much time left, and they need to concentrate on stuff that the community wants.

 

Gearing and flashpoint changes aren't on that list, especially these really bad, unbalanced, and buggy gearing and drop changes.

 

What's even scarier is the Bioware didn't learn anything from the 6.0 launch when they launched a gearing change that was universally panned and disliked, and then the community had to suffer for about 6 months until Bioware made enough changes to the gearing system that it was at least livable.

 

Then they decided to do it all over again in 7.0 and not learn anything.

 

Just forget about the gearing and drop changes for now. Launch 7.0 with the story, the new character creation, the load outs, and the skill changes. Concentrate on making them better and bug free first. By putting on hold these gear changes it would free up manpower and manhours to the parts of 7.0 that the players actually want bug free (of free-er) and balanced.

 

Then take the added time to sit down and figure out a balanced and proper gearing system that allows all your players, and all play styles to enjoy the game again. Right now as it stands, the solo players will hate the system, the group players will see the costs of gear prohibitive. Anyone with multiple alts will hate it.

 

Shift manpower around, delay the launch of the new gearing system until it's actually ready and balanced, instead of doing it the typical Bioware way, of launching a system that no player likes, then scrambling to fix it 6 months later to try and retain you player base.

Edited December 29, 2021 by Lady_Myajha

[AdsAillard]

Honestly I've said this before in non-sticky posts, but I'll say it here.

 

They need to release 7.0 without the gearing and flashpoint changes. It's not ready, and all it's going to do is drive away players.

 

If combat skills, load outs, and the character creation were bug free, I may feel differently under the circumstances. but the devs don't have that much time left, and they need to concentrate on stuff that the community wants.

 

Gearing and flashpoint changes aren't on that list, especially these really bad, unbalanced, and buggy gearing and drop changes.

 

What's even scarier is the Bioware didn't learn anything from the 6.0 launch when they launched a gearing change that was universally panned and disliked, and then the community had to suffer for about 6 months until Bioware made enough changes to the gearing system that it was at least livable.

 

Then they decided to do it all over again in 7.0 and not learn anything.

 

Just forget about the gearing and drop changes for now. Launch 7.0 with the story, the new character creation, the load outs, and the skill changes. Concentrate on making them better and bug free first. By putting on hold these gear changes it would free up manpower and manhours to the parts of 7.0 that the players actually want bug free (of free-er) and balanced.

 

Then take the added time to sit down and figure out a balanced and proper gearing system that allows all your players, and all play styles to enjoy the game again. Right now as it stands, the solo players will hate the system, the group players will see the costs of gear prohibitive. Anyone with multiple alts will hate it.

 

Shift manpower around, delay the launch of the new gearing system until it's actually ready and balanced, instead of doing it the typical Bioware way, of launching a system that no player likes, then scrambling to fix it 6 months later to try and retain you player base.

 

Honestly, this is the most sensible thing I've seen in a while.

 

Even because... Not even the math on this gear seems to add up. My 322 gear STILL can't get near the levels of crit/alac my 306 had. I'm still clearing content better with my old 306 set (even without bonus set working) than with new gear. Not A LITTLE better - A LOT better.

 

Not to mention, adding this much need for extra tokens gained from content while severely limiting the access to the content that drops is DOESN'T really make much sense. It's 5.0 sh*t-fest in gearing all over again - and how many of us never even made it to 5.1? (Longest that I dropped the game was between 5.0 and 5.6... When it was playable but still bad).

 

Nobody wants that. So, yeah, maybe listen to Lady and adjust!

[Toraak]

Honestly, this is the most sensible thing I've seen in a while.

 

Even because... Not even the math on this gear seems to add up. My 322 gear STILL can't get near the levels of crit/alac my 306 had. I'm still clearing content better with my old 306 set (even without bonus set working) than with new gear. Not A LITTLE better - A LOT better.

 

Not to mention, adding this much need for extra tokens gained from content while severely limiting the access to the content that drops is DOESN'T really make much sense. It's 5.0 sh*t-fest in gearing all over again - and how many of us never even made it to 5.1? (Longest that I dropped the game was between 5.0 and 5.6... When it was playable but still bad).

 

Nobody wants that. So, yeah, maybe listen to Lady and adjust!

 

I think that is intentional we can't hit the same Critical and Alacrity thresholds. I may be wrong of course, but I think they are at least at the beginning of the expansion pushing us away from the High alac builds we've grown to enjoy, and over time as the gear level increases we will slowly see Higher alac and critical numbers so we'll eventually get close to what we're used to.

 

Most, if not all expansions they rework the Stat Formulas like this, so I'm not surprised.

[Pricia]

Honestly, this is the most sensible thing I've seen in a while.

 

Even because... Not even the math on this gear seems to add up. My 322 gear STILL can't get near the levels of crit/alac my 306 had. I'm still clearing content better with my old 306 set (even without bonus set working) than with new gear. Not A LITTLE better - A LOT better.

 

Not to mention, adding this much need for extra tokens gained from content while severely limiting the access to the content that drops is DOESN'T really make much sense. It's 5.0 sh*t-fest in gearing all over again - and how many of us never even made it to 5.1? (Longest that I dropped the game was between 5.0 and 5.6... When it was playable but still bad).

 

Nobody wants that. So, yeah, maybe listen to Lady and adjust!

 

Yes it's really bad. But I can't imagine that it would be possible to launch the game without at least SOME gear drops, considering that we are getting 5 more levels and I'm assuming the 318 gear is given during the story.

 

But what they CAN do is

 

- Fix the upgrade parts drops so that the appropriate currency drops for each activity

- Increase drops/reduce part requirements

- Adjust stats so that 318 gear is at least equivalent to 306 gear with no augments - which is REALLY not the case right now

- Ideally, remove the absurdity of the three different paths and make ONE common currency

 

I'm no programmer but I can't imagine that would take too much work. It would still suck but it would at least be somewhat tolerable until they fix their mess and give us more options/let us pick our stats.

 

But yeah, the more I test stuff, the more frustrated I get.

 

Also, frankly, it was extremely disappointing not to get any drops anymore. You know the crazy ironic thing? They don't like RNG, yet we depend on RNG to get parts now. I did a heroic that, on live, drops at least four blues/greens, and half the bosses didn't drop anything.

 

It's just sad.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Pricia

[Floplag]

The greatest mistake they are making in this is having PvE/PvP gear basically not being compatible or the same.

Everyone wanted the return of PvP gear, well many anyway i never did as this was inevitable that this would happen, but they didnt think it thru.

Its really rather simple, no matter how you gear up whether thru PvE or PvP it should be compatible, as it is now... why they are doing this in a way that separates them is mind bogglingly poor decision.

In the end the ilvl should be the same for the same level of content and you should be able to interchange the currency required for either one. Rewards must be on par for time spent on activity.

To do literally anything else is to invite anger and frustration unnecessarily.

[AdsAillard]

I think that is intentional we can't hit the same Critical and Alacrity thresholds. I may be wrong of course, but I think they are at least at the beginning of the expansion pushing us away from the High alac builds we've grown to enjoy, and over time as the gear level increases we will slowly see Higher alac and critical numbers so we'll eventually get close to what we're used to.

 

Most, if not all expansions they rework the Stat Formulas like this, so I'm not surprised.

 

I mean, sure, my 230 gear wasn't anywhere near as good as my 224 gear (which was enough to let my prgo group back then clear KP/EV HM on 5.0 launch day). However, by 242 (whatever was 3rd number) gear, you could see improvement... I can't see improvement at 322 level.

 

And, sure, the numbers are reworked, but it seems to have been a GREAT rescaling in terms of bosses health's with not the same increase in our gear which is a recipe for disaster.

 

Thing is so bad that the game system itself makes a point of telling you your 306 gear is better, which is nuts. If I'm getting worse stats, why gear at all? (Apart from implants)

 

Also still on the topic of shadow/sin, WHO ON EARTH decided that it made any sense adding the set bonus that is a PvP drop currently to accuracy implants?! Literally, accuracy for PvP preferred gear? And why are Death Knell bonus on implants nerfed but not others? (Is it intended? Accident?) Finally, the accuracy/alacrity legendary implants for sin/shadow have their colours flipped, another recipe for chaos. That, at least, is an easy fix.

[AlkarMBar]

Green and Blue gear with the same stats: No. I mean, no. That's completely wrong and it should be changed before going live, because it's confusing. Put at least +1 to mastery to the blue piece

 

3 branchs to get gear: I think it should be just 2 branches: PVP and PVE. You should merge Flashpoints and Conquest branchs. Getting gear is grindy now, and getting pieces that you already have from another branch with the same rating is frustrating.

 

The rate of obtaining gear is fine... if you only have one character. If you have several alts it takes too long to equip them. The fact that the gear is bound to legacy helps, but ... nobody is going to be swapping gear everytime they swap characters. I would increase a little the gearing rate.

 

Then, implants and earpieces: Right now, the system is very unforgiven. If you buy an alacrity implant and you find you need a critical one afterwards, you need to farm for another one. Every vendor should include an option to buy an implant of a certain rating paying another implant of the same rating (i.e. buying a 322 critical implant paying a 322 alacrity implant). Same thing with earpieces.

[BenEddy]

Form what I can see so far. Gearing up will take a good amount of time. I'm okay with that as you will only need to make 3 sets of gear, dps, tank, and healer. I don't like that the gear has fixed stats. An idea to address this would be to add a modification Vendor for Conquest, PVP , Flashpoints, and OPS that get unlock like the Implant vendor.

 

Ideas for quest

 

Conquest Vendor quest -complete 200 points worth of stuff. Unlocks 326 purple modification

 

Flashpoints Vendor quest- complete 25 flashpoints in groupfinder . Unlocks 328 gold modification

 

PvP Vendor quest- complete 30 Warzones ( wins count as 2) Unlocks 328 gold modification

 

Ops Vendor, quest 1 - complete 10 storymode Ops weekly .Unlocks 330 gold modification

, quest 2- complete 10 Veteran mode ops weekly. Unlocks 332 gold modification

 

But please go back to having just the 3 types of mods (A,B, and unlettered) and 3 types of each enhancement.

Their cost would be a mix of the coms, credits, and mats for that vendor.

[Pricia]

Form what I can see so far. Gearing up will take a good amount of time. I'm okay with that as you will only need to make 3 sets of gear, dps, tank, and healer. I don't like that the gear has fixed stats. An idea to address this would be to add a modification Vendor for Conquest, PVP , Flashpoints, and OPS that get unlock like the Implant vendor.

 

Ideas for quest

 

Conquest Vendor quest -complete 200 points worth of stuff. Unlocks 326 purple modification

 

Flashpoints Vendor quest- complete 25 flashpoints in groupfinder . Unlocks 328 gold modification

 

PvP Vendor quest- complete 30 Warzones ( wins count as 2) Unlocks 328 gold modification

 

Ops Vendor, quest 1 - complete 10 storymode Ops weekly .Unlocks 330 gold modification

, quest 2- complete 10 Veteran mode ops weekly. Unlocks 332 gold modification

 

But please go back to having just the 3 types of mods (A,B, and unlettered) and 3 types of each enhancement.

Their cost would be a mix of the coms, credits, and mats for that vendor.

 

We don't need a quest. We just need the vendors. That legendary quest is a major PITA that once again penalizes solo players.

 

Also conquest gear will have the same IR as flashpoint and pvp I believe (or at least it should).

Edited January 1, 2022 by Pricia

[Jedi_Max]

Gearing overall seems like too complicated and uncomfortable to progress:

1) Too many currencies, it will be a nightmare for new players at least.

2) When you get your gear one way (FPs, for example), you can't upgrade it using other ways or at least disassemble it and get currency that can be used in any other gearing path. So it makes gearing grind too boring - you simply can't play content you want today instead having to grind the same type of content day over day.

3) Even while following the gearing path you choose (again FPs for example) you have to grind Heroics cause without currency from Heroics (lots of it) you can't upgrade anything.

4) This whole grind overall is not enjoyable at all, most likely distracting from game more and more.

Edited January 1, 2022 by Jedi_Max

[arunav]

Shouldn't GSF have the same or a similar gear path available as ground PVP?

 

The matches take longer, it is one of if not the most difficult learning curve to get good at in the game (and certainly more difficult than non-ranked ground PVP), and it's most certainly PVP.

[Pricia]

Shouldn't GSF have the same or a similar gear path available as ground PVP?

 

The matches take longer, it is one of if not the most difficult learning curve to get good at in the game (and certainly more difficult than non-ranked ground PVP), and it's most certainly PVP.

 

And the weekly grants no upgrade part.

[Damask_Rose]

I don't know if this should be here or on a thread about interfaces, but I find the raw stats on the character screen are useless without the %. And I shouldn't have to click through to see them.

[poekipelzball]

How does the flow of acquiring gear feel?

 

It felt quite confusing to me at first and I feel like I messed up by jumping right into an OPs and then some flashpoints instead of finishing my conquest and bumping up my gear to 320, giving me a weird mix of gear that was all over the place. I did eventually reach 322, though in order to get all pieces at that level I need to organise which pieces come from where and see if I can target those since the currency acquisition feels quite slow.

 

After doing it once all over the place it started to make a bit more sense, although I'm still unsure what to do with some of my currencies from the PvP weekly and the remaining OPs pieces. I also couldn't upgrade tionese gear at the operation gear vendor, only elite decurion, why is that?

 

Overall it didn't feel very satisfying to do content that didn't give me the upgrades I needed. I like being able to get gear from different sources, but the different currencies feel very restrictive. I have 72 thyrsian production accelerant after finishing my weekly, which is enough for one piece of gear (40), but I don't see myself really using the leftovers for anything anytime soon.

 

What are your thoughts on the pace to acquire gear?

 

For a single character it didn't feel too terrible, at least once I'd worked out what I was supposed to do. I don't imagine running alts will be too fun, however. I'd like it if there were more drops from bosses to get the standard 320 set a little faster, then upgrade it over time, rather than having to spend a lot of commendations to buy the gear to upgrade first.

 

Feel free to leave general feedback as well

 

I don't think introducing five new currencies to juggle is the way to go. I liked the previous system where all content made it possible to acquire the gear I needed, via legacy wide drops or currencies, so I could keep alts up to date by playing my main. That is sort of still the case, but with getting a set being so slow it doesn't feel as easy to do--although I did end up sending away all my old and offspec (non accuracy) gear, since I was getting upgrades for those pieces instead of the ones I was wearing. :/

[DarthVadorius]

Ok, so I think this has been asked and answered, so if it has, flog me openly, if not then, question. Why are we still requiring people to do pve content to get pvp gear? I don't want to play any pve content whatsoever, nor do I have the time to play pve content. I dont even really care about bringing expertise back or such because I know that will kill the occasional pvp player, but at least bring back pvp coms, or just give us the same coms for completing pvp matches in dailies and weeklies. Oh and bring back the complete any pvp match, not just if you win (increase the count if needed). If the gearing system will stay the way it is designed, it will take me forever to get max gear if I ever do, because I don't have time to commit to pve content even if I wanted to do it, which I don't. I know I'm probably in the minority here, but this new gearing system will kill the avid pvper such as myself.

[klizilii]

Not sure where to put this, but vanguard shield-specialist tank gear stats shield and absorb are broken in the PTS. The best I can tell we are not getting any benefit from these stats. The tooltip says as much Edited January 5, 2022 by klizilii

[mike_carton]

I also couldn't upgrade tionese gear at the operation gear vendor, only elite decurion, why is that?

 

Probably because Tionese is Green SM Ops gear and maxes out at 322 for now where as Elite Decurion is Green VM FP gear that maxes out at 324.

[Elssha]

Not sure if any of these have been said before, but...

 

• The set bonus in implants that don't give a stat choice, mixed with the inability to mod gear make getting 110% a PitA - Might want to either add multiple types with the various bonuses or lower how much acc gets us to 110%
  
• The implants with bonuses for tanks are backwards; Shield should be light blue, Abs dark blue
  
• The fact that all the sets look the same is going to make keeping track of gear more annoying than it is currently for people doing multiple roles
  
• Equipping the implant removes the sell-back timer, which IMHO is a mistake for something that pricy AND something people will likely want to test
  

[supercometl]

Form what I can see so far. Gearing up will take a good amount of time. I'm okay with that as you will only need to make 3 sets of gear, dps, tank, and healer.

 

Just going to correct you there. Tanks will most likely still have to have multiple sets between classes as the buffs each tank spec gets boosts different aspects of them. For example PTs tend to have higher shield rating than absorbtion because they get a 35% boost to it with roughly a 50%-60% uptime, along with passive boost to it. So even with static gear we will be augmenting each spec differently.

 

So if you either have one set for tank and keep swapping augments manually, or you just get a second set.

 

This does also apply to other specs due to alacrity, but I would argue less so.

Edited January 4, 2022 by supercometl

[poekipelzball]

Probably because Tionese is Green SM Ops gear and maxes out at 322 for now where as Elite Decurion is Green VM FP gear that maxes out at 324.

 

The gear that dropped was 320, though (legs twice, boo!), so that should have had an upgrade on the vendor I think? Seemed odd to me anyway!

[CuDearg]

FEEDBACK - Acquiring Gear - General Comment: Biggest question is why are you implementing all these different tiers of gear?? I understand rewarding people for doing harder content but then making it so you have to stick with different activities (questing, FPs, raids, etc.) in order to upgrade it seems too restrictive. Implementing gear for PvP, raiding, and then general game play seems more straightforward and would allow people to upgrade gear easier and actually play the content they come to play.

 

FEEDBACK - Acquiring Gear - PvP Specific: I was excited to see that the devs were going to implement a system where the PvP'ers could do the content they want without having to grind other general PvE content - BUT a deeper dive into upgrading PVP gear shows that is wrong. Again PvPers are forced to do FP and daily/weekly grinds in order to get gear to PvP. This is just wrong. Not to drag another MMO into the mix, but you can just PvP in WoW and get all the gear you need to be competitive in PvP - why can't that happen in SWTOR.

 

FEEDBACK - Pace - General Comment: The paces feels like its going to be slower than necessary. Gearing to BIS in 6.0 was too fast, but the number of different currencies required and the drop rates seem low for a player to progress at a rate that feels rewarding. Right now it feels like a chore.

 

FEEDBACK - General: Rewarding players for doing harder content is fine, but as it stands this system is more complicated that it really needs to be. Having general gear with a maximum item level that is less than that you would get from HM or NiM content but maybe similar to what you would get from a SM op isn't unfair. It still makes better gear available, the player just has to progress in the difficulty of content in order to earn it. And since PvP is going to have its item level capped, then this approach would allow PvPers to just focus on PvP and not worry about having to do other content to get better gear.

 

Looking forward to 7.0, but hoping that gearing won't take the fun out of playing the game!!!

[klizilii]

FEEDBACK - General: Rewarding players for doing harder content is fine...

I'm really starting to think this wasn't the intention. I find constant examples of hard content that doesn't reward better gear and lots of content that takes way more time while giving the same (or worse) rewards by a significant amount. I too am worried that this new gearing system is going to cause major burnout as it's horrible if your goal is to max your item rating.

[akdonkey]

The Gearing system is HUGE leap Backwards. Forcing people into PVP that is bugged and everyone using Lag cheats to win is terrible. The PVP here is horrible I have never liked it. Heroics I run but not on a daily thing I do them to power level alts sometimes. They are not fun anymore just required duty. Doing area Daily's I will NOT do them again. I did them often to get Companion gear only to have it all made useless. Operations are not fun. They take too long and I have NEVER had one Successful run in one. Never even completed one. So why take the gearing system backward?

Post some hard data one How many players run PVP daily. How many players run Operations. I bet those numbers are so low That is why you are trying to change the system.

If this new gearing system goes Live I will quit. It's a 10-year-old game and I'm somewhat bored with it. I have been here since launch. I will NOT be the only player who quits either. It's not a threat it's just simply I'm not going to be forced into an area of the game I hate to get great armors after you let me play how I wanted for so long then yank that out from under me.

[ReveredDead]

This new gearing system is a HUGE step back. 6.0 gearing wasn't perfect but it worked. All it needed was an upgrade and a few tweaks. A higher rating level and that's it. We got upgrades to gear through playing ALL content. And Tech frags was all we needed to upgrade. Now we need not two, not three but FIVE damn materials to upgrade any kind of gear. We weren't forced to play NiM ops for max gear at 330. We weren't forced to play MM Flashpoints for 328. We could simply play all of the content provided and have the opportunity to get gear upgrades. Everyone had fun because everyone could play the same content. Now how fair will it be when a person locked at story 326 gear won't get invited to play operations because he doesn't have the right gear (and he wouldn't survive anyways at 326). Now with upgrading gear? All we had to do was just use Spoils of War vendor for an upgrade with tech frags. Now? You guys have taken a simpler system and replaced it with a complex system...Wasn't Biowares whole reason for 7.0 meant to uncomplicate and simplify swtor and it's mechanics. Well if that was goal Jackie then you guys missed the mark by miles. If you guys saw what happened to World Of Warcraft after they went down this EXACT SAME PATH. You will see a huge drop in subscribers and players come summer of 2022 after people throw in the towel.

[BRKMSN]

While leveling a new character on the PTS, class missions were not enough to keep the character level caught up with the planet. So players (without legacy perks, guild perks, and XP boosting gear) need to do planetary missions, heroics, FPs, or WZs to supplement XP to the character. The loot drops seemed in line with the character level. The mission rewards as well. But there didn't seem to be any way to get any "better" gear along the way. No artifact gear dropped along the way. There wasn't really a source for "better than premium" mods, enhancements, armoring, hilts, barrels without crafters. So it looks like crafting will be the only way to ever really get a gear "boost" during leveling.

 

At max level, the gearing progressed early through FPs to get to 320, but RNG still played a factor. I probably had 35-40 gear drops before I finally had a 320 mainhand drop. I would prefer if the system based the drop on what upgrades a character was needing, rather than purely RNG. After getting to 320, the gearing gets slower as items over 320 rarely drop from vet mode FPs. So this could be frustrating for players that want to play alts or employ loadouts.

Edited January 10, 2022 by BRKMSN