Stop comparing a game that just launched to a game thats been out for 7 years

[Riotus]

They had about 6 years of developing, so yeah we actually can compare it.

 

And you can see the fruits of their 6 years of development by logging into the game and playing.

 

Its about prioritys. The main priority was to get the game playable and have enough content to keep people entertained. Everything they needed to have a successfull launch is in the game now. All the stuff were asking for (with the exception of tradeskills that are not worthless) Is stuff that they correctly prioritized as stuff that could be handled post launch.

 

Would you have prefered to wait another year so it could come out with all that stuff? i know i couldnt.

[Gazzzenn]

Dude... cmon. WoW is 7 years old and TOR lacks its features..

 

Its like if a car designer took some features from a 7 year old car, then left out others. You'd be asking "what the hell, this 7 year old car has more features than this brand new one"

 

software can be updated....cars have to be remade...thats a freaking massive difference.

 

take a lexus is200 built in 2000, to this day there are still cars being made that don't even features some of what it had as standard never mind as optional extras, and that my friend using your logic means the car industry has failed miserably as they have not taken what has been done and implemented it into new cars.

 

i've just taken your comparsion of the car industry and ripped it asunder all because of 1 car.

 

now take cars like the bmw 3 series e36 first released in 1993, it had the most balanced chassis of any car in existance only ever beaten by the honda nsx for sheer balance, now both are out of production and what has the car industry learned from this? nothing they still make cars that don't even come close to being as well balanced as either of those.

 

bioware can and will update this game, they don't have to release a new game to do those updates. when they come you will be happy no doubt but give them time, and we don't want all of wow's features, they worked in wow but may not work in this game...perhaps the same reason they don't add every car feature that worked to every new car? just think about it.

[wrmrstacrdwower]

Well, in my own opinion. Fun. The character control is very clunky, and not fluid. To me i can only log in for maybe an hour at a time, then I have to play something else. Maybe this game just is not for me.

 

A very large, exspansive world, shared by everyone. The sharding idea imo was the worst design to happen to an online game ever. I have told friends in the past how I think a large mmo would be a neat idea, maybe it hasn't happened because the idea is held back by hardware. I'm currently level 38 in game. I bet you I have seen maybe 4-5 people on each planet, at any given time a day, MAYBE 4-5 people. I play on the crucible pits, it is a full server pretty much any time of day, with anywhere from a 10-30 minute wait time to log in. So... Where is everyone?

 

I have noticed this also. The Ui will say Tatooine 76 players or Alderaan 60 players and the occurrence of when I see another player is very limited.

 

And my conclusion was that in order to see a lot of players all clustered into certain areas the world would have to be much smaller then it was. It's not that the players aren't there its just no different then being in a WoW zone. The size of the zone enables players to have space to do things until you hit Org or SW.

[ShaggyShow]

I bet you I have seen maybe 4-5 people on each planet, at any given time a day, MAYBE 4-5 people. I play on the crucible pits, it is a full server pretty much any time of day, with anywhere from a 10-30 minute wait time to log in. So... Where is everyone?

 

Open your map, in the right bottom u see a small picture of the world map, right above that u can swap instance. Swap to "zone 1" and enjoy the waiting for respawns or killing stuff that is already tagged

[Gunryu]

And SWTOR is an MMO.

 

Can I group with other characters to complete missions in Mass Effect or Dragon Age?

 

Can I take my Commander Shepard in ME or Hawke/Grey Warden in Dragon Age and fight against other players?

 

Can I team up with 15 other players in Mass Effect or Dragon Age to complete a level?

 

?????

 

 

Ok let me put this bluntly, this is a single player game with some online capabilities

 

- There is NO NEED to group up to kill that elite monster because you have your companion to help you

 

- The world is linear it has no room to explore it's like 1 giant hallway!

 

- Sure the voice acting is good, but say you are on vent, you have to tell everyone to shush while you listen to the story (and frankly people will get bored with the voice acting rather quickly)

 

- Instanced servers make it so you hardly even see anyone and it is bothersome to get a group for a heroic or flashpoint and have to wait a half hour just to go back with your other friends who might wish to do something with you.

 

- This game does not PROMOTE grouping (other than social points which is lame), everything can be done alone other than Flashpoints and Heroics and even certain heroics can be done with just you and your companion.

Edited December 30, 2011 by Gunryu

[Majestic_Jazz]

There are lists or were until the Devs removed those threads... Censorship anyone???

 

But then again many of the lists are subjective.

 

UI - may not bother you

Character Creation - No sliders

Character Creation - No racial differences in gameplay (Just Skins)

Companions - Can't click through.

Drops - Not varied enough.

LFG - may nt be necessary as this is more of a single player experience.

Lightsaber - Why does my class determine my lightsaber.

Ranged - Why does my class determine my gun.

Day/Night - Not available

Weather - Not available

Space - exploration

Space - economics impact

 

List that would have set themselves apart

Ability to switch faction

VO - completed

PVP space

Greater factions

Ability of guilds to provide/create mission content (bounties, raids)

 

And thats just off the top of my head, im sure theres more out there...

 

Your list is mainly made up of cosmetic things, not actual TRUE traditional MMO features that SWTOR is lacking.

 

Day/Night cycles is not an MMO feature, it is a game mechanic that is more cosmetic than an actual gameplay feature. Same with your lightsaber being determined by class, more of a cosmetic thing.

 

As for the UI, you are correct, it doesn't bother me, but Bioware DID say that the UI is being worked on and that they are looking into making the UI customizable in a later patch, so why people continues to complain about this after Bioware said that they are working on it is beyond me.

 

I asked for major MMO features that SWTOR lacks and you didn't list one.

 

So again I ask, make a list of major MMO features that SWTOR does not have that all other MMOs do have.

[Lankybrit]

software can be updated....cars have to be remade...thats a freaking massive difference.

 

take a lexus is200 built in 2000, to this day there are still cars being made that don't even features some of what it had as standard never mind as optional extras, and that my friend using your logic means the car industry has failed miserably as they have not taken what has been done and implemented it into new cars.

 

i've just taken your comparsion of the car industry and ripped it asunder all because of 1 car.

 

now take cars like the bmw 3 series e36 first released in 1993, it had the most balanced chassis of any car in existance only ever beaten by the honda nsx for sheer balance, now both are out of production and what has the car industry learned from this? nothing they still make cars that don't even come close to being as well balanced as either of those.

 

bioware can and will update this game, they don't have to release a new game to do those updates. when they come you will be happy no doubt but give them time, and we don't want all of wow's features, they worked in wow but may not work in this game...perhaps the same reason they don't add every car feature that worked to every new car? just think about it.

 

Well then. Compare it to other software then. Mac OS and Linux of today are so much better than Windows 7 years ago. That's a stupid comparison, but one that some people are advocating in this thread.

 

It just doesn't work. SWTOR has to be compared with what's currently in the market, just like ever other freakin' product in the World!

 

Cheers.

[mbernert]

Open your map, in the right bottom u see a small picture of the world map, right above that u can swap instance. Swap to "zone 1" and enjoy the waiting for respawns or killing stuff that is already tagged

 

I know of these feature. I was trying to point out just why I think this is a horrible feature.

[Riotus]

Well then. Compare it to other software then. Mac OS and Linux of today are so much better than Windows 7 years ago. That's a stupid comparison, but one that some people are advocating in this thread.

 

It just doesn't work. SWTOR has to be compared with what's currently in the market, just like ever other freakin' product in the World!

 

Cheers.

 

Well thats just like your opinion man, mac and linux OS still suck compared to windows 95......

[Majestic_Jazz]

Ok let me put this bluntly, this is a single player game with some online capabilities

 

- There is NO NEED to group up to kill that elite monster because you have your companion to help you

 

- The world is linear it has no room to explore it's like 1 giant hallway!

 

- Sure the voice acting is good, but say you are on vent, you have to tell everyone to shush while you listen to the story (and frankly people will get bored with the voice acting rather quickly)

 

- This game does not PROMOTE grouping (other than social points which is lame), everything can be done alone other than Flashpoints and Heroics and even certain heroics can be done with just you and your companion.

 

From what I hear, World of Warcraft can be soloed from level 1-85 and yet people consider that a MMO. So why is everyone jumping on SWTOR's case?

 

FAIL!

 

Nice attempt though.

Edited December 30, 2011 by Majestic_Jazz

[Ambrogino]

software can be updated....cars have to be remade...thats a freaking massive difference.

 

take a lexus is200 built in 2000, to this day there are still cars being made that don't even features some of what it had as standard never mind as optional extras, and that my friend using your logic means the car industry has failed miserably as they have not taken what has been done and implemented it into new cars.

 

i've just taken your comparsion of the car industry and ripped it asunder all because of 1 car.

 

now take cars like the bmw 3 series e36 first released in 1993, it had the most balanced chassis of any car in existance only ever beaten by the honda nsx for sheer balance, now both are out of production and what has the car industry learned from this? nothing they still make cars that don't even come close to being as well balanced as either of those.

 

bioware can and will update this game, they don't have to release a new game to do those updates. when they come you will be happy no doubt but give them time, and we don't want all of wow's features, they worked in wow but may not work in this game...perhaps the same reason they don't add every car feature that worked to every new car? just think about it.

 

So your saying i should pay a higer price for a 2000 BMWthan a 2012 BMW?

[TheFluke]

Some people suck at logic.

 

The actual release date of a product has no relevance to a consumer who is focused purely on features versus price, which is the majority of consumers.

 

If you offer someone two games, and they like both the graphics and the features available of one more, at a cheaper price, why the hell would they care that the game was released seven years ago? They wouldn't.

 

Every time I see this argument I want to punch a kitten.

 

Use your head.

Edited December 30, 2011 by TheFluke

[mbernert]

1 - Talking about fun is very subjective because I am having a BLAST! with this game.

 

2 - I am level 39 going on 40 and the planets I play on are VERY full. Anywhere from 80-120 people on a planet at a given time. I play on The Shadowlands btw.

 

Fun is very subjective, that's why I listed "maybe this game just is not for me.

 

Character response however, could be listed as subjective, but it is also a huge topic on the general forums that the devs are "currently looking into".

 

2- Yeah, I see 50-150 people on each planet as well. the only problem is the game creates a new "instance" and phases them out from each other. The worst idea ever imo.

Edited December 30, 2011 by mbernert

[Applemask]

I played WoW at launch. I played vanilla WoW's beta, even.

 

People who say WoW at launch was nothing compared to this game are being absolutely silly. Warcraft was a much, much more polished game. It didn't have entire class progressions that could break with wrong quest options, it didn't have renderers that crap out nearly half of the time, it didn't have the very basics of its combat ridiculously bugged and flawed - character responsiveness issues, the delay in unit frame updating, etc.. I could honestly keep going, but I don't want to just bash this game. Warcraft, even during its original beta, felt leagues ahead of Star Wars in terms of polish. It's funny how much I bashed Warcraft until I played Star Wars, and now I really have to give Blizzard props for the things they did that we took and still continue to take for granted. Bioware has yet to even approach that level of launch day game polish.

 

The biggest problem is honestly a lack of addons. As broken as this game is in many regards, addons could fix a lot of it. While true, Star Wars has a lot of things Warcraft didn't at launch day - quest tracker, for example - remember, in that specific example, fan-made quest tracker addons were available on day 1. Addons wouldn't be able to fix a lot of the problems with this game because they seem to be in the core game code, but they'd definitely make them more bearable, and they'd fix the others.

[Bobbyrab]

Keep in mind that Bioware would probably be the last group around that wants the tag to their game being... "If you don't think we have the features that you want go back to WoW you whiners." Sometimes fans do more harm in defending something they like then people who are venting ever do.

 

Good point. Yes, some of the "requests" are nothing more than whining, but BW has to take them seriously. Stephen Reid even said in the reddit q & a that they follow feedback closely. Now, they may not respond as people want...

 

There's certainly knee-jerking on both sides. Some people, I'm convinced, want to see this game fail, for whatever reason. Others hear even the slightest dissatisfaction from a player and they strike (Admission: I have been guilty of this on occassion). Neither is helpful to TOR. The ardent defenders strike so incessantly because they like the game and fear any complaint will turn their like to dislike and they might regret their investment.

[Gunryu]

From what I hear, World of Warcraft can be soloed from level 1-85 and yet people consider that a MMO. So why is everyone jumping on SWTOR's case?

 

FAIL!

 

Nice attempt though.

 

Maybe because oh I don't know............

 

WE WANT BETTER THAN WOW!

[arnaudlublink]

Dunno what game your playing.... Theres wildlife all over, i know because im biochem.

 

lol? you mean those big beast you see everywhere, 1 specific mob with same look and thats all? It was great if they had more with different look and sizes. They just made 1 single 3D model which can be made in lower then 30 minutes with some cheap textures.

 

Even the tree's are all the same, even the rocks. How many years they spend on this game?

 

-.-'

 

 

And yes I can blame them, I pay this game + they ask money for each month! If I have regret I buy this game the answer will be YES in caps. I will continue playing this game because its a game and I bough already a gamecard, but hell no I will continue pay each month for this.

 

As a artist I never understand its hard to find a job in the game business when you see games where people spend millions to make it and still fail so hard in BASIC game development knowledge.

[Mudanie]

Your list is mainly made up of cosmetic things, not actual TRUE traditional MMO features that SWTOR is lacking.

 

Day/Night cycles is not an MMO feature, it is a game mechanic that is more cosmetic than an actual gameplay feature. Same with your lightsaber being determined by class, more of a cosmetic thing.

 

As for the UI, you are correct, it doesn't bother me, but Bioware DID say that the UI is being worked on and that they are looking into making the UI customizable in a later patch, so why people continues to complain about this after Bioware said that they are working on it is beyond me.

 

I asked for major MMO features that SWTOR lacks and you didn't list one.

 

So again I ask, make a list of major MMO features that SWTOR does not have that all other MMOs do have.

 

 

This game is designed to be leveled mostly solo. Sure there are flashpoints and heroics that you can group up with a whole 3 other people....but it's clearly and purposefully designed for the people who don't traditionally like MMOs. Sharding, in a MMO, especially on a PvP server is the dumbest thing I've ever heard of.

[ShaggyShow]

I know of these feature. I was trying to point out just why I think this is a horrible feature.

 

I also am not the biggest fan of it either. But i have already found myself swappin to the 2nd instance a few times so that i could quest in peace. I guess it has it positive and negative sides.

[Riotus]

lol? you mean those big beast you see everywhere, 1 specific mob with same look and thats all? It was great if they had more with different look and sizes. They just made 1 single 3D model which can be made in lower then 30 minutes with some cheap textures.

 

Even the tree's are all the same, even the rocks. How many years they spend on this game?

 

-.-'

 

 

And yes I can blame them, I pay this game + they ask money for each month! If I have regret I buy this game the answer will be YES in caps. I will continue playing this game because its a game and I bough already a gamecard, but hell no I will continue pay each month for this.

 

As a artist I never understand its hard to find a job in the game business when you see games where people spend millions to make it and still fail so hard in BASIC game development knowledge.

 

There is a valid reason there are not herds of animals. People with bioanalasis can kill the mobs and farm them for mats and skill gains. Herds of mobs would imbalance this... not to mention create unneeded additional information for the servers to process.

[Majestic_Jazz]

Maybe because oh I don't know............

 

WE WANT BETTER THAN WOW!

 

"better than wow" is subjective.

 

I think SWTOR is better than WoW simply because SWTOR has done what WoW failed to do, bring me into MMOs.

 

So you may think that SWTOR isn't better than WoW but I do.

 

Again, opinion, not fact.

 

Also my point was about WoW being an MMO and SWTOR being a single player game, not which game is better. You say that SWTOR is a single player game because it can be soloed yet people consider WoW a MMO and yet that can be soloed from 1-85. Care to explain that?

 

Saying that you want better than WoW doesn't answer the question, it is actually avoiding the question.

 

It is my conclusion that if you do not like SWTOR or feel that it isn't an MMO, then why the hell are you here then? Why not goto another TRUE MMO forum and hang out there? What is your purpose here?

[Gunryu]

"better than wow" is subjective.

 

I think SWTOR is better than WoW simply because SWTOR has done what WoW failed to do, bring me into MMOs.

 

So you may think that SWTOR isn't better than WoW but I do.

 

Again, opinion, not fact.

 

Also my point was about WoW being an MMO and SWTOR being a single player game, not which game is better. You say that SWTOR is a single player game because it can be soloed yet people consider WoW a MMO and yet that can be soloed from 1-85. Care to explain that?

 

Saying that you want better than WoW doesn't answer the question, it is actually avoiding the question.

 

It is my conclusion that if you do not like SWTOR or feel that it isn't an MMO, then why the hell are you here then? Why not goto another TRUE MMO forum and hang out there? What is your purpose here?

 

 

You people that defend this game by saying "Compare it to WoW in vanilla" well I will do the same.............you used to always have groups forming for quests because you NEEDED help with that elite mob, you NEEDED help with quests, the reason WoW can pretty much be soloed now is because they dumbed it down for people that find this type of MMO acceptable! MMOs are NOT meant to be soloed they are meant to GROUP with people and do things TOGETHER!

 

So again I say............

 

WE WANT BETTER THAN WOW!

 

As for why I am here and still playing a bit? I want to get my 60 bucks worth, not feel like I got ripped off.

Edited December 30, 2011 by Gunryu

[arnaudlublink]

There is a valid reason there are not herds of animals. People with bioanalasis can kill the mobs and farm them for mats and skill gains. Herds of mobs would imbalance this... not to mention create unneeded additional information for the servers to process.

 

No idea what bioanalasis is.

 

But:

 

Ever heard about programming? You can turn off drops from a mob in a game as a programmer so people won't farm it.

I won't laugh at you because you have just to less knowledge about how to make games.

[Mudanie]

"better than wow" is subjective.

 

I think SWTOR is better than WoW simply because SWTOR has done what WoW failed to do, bring me into MMOs.

 

So you may think that SWTOR isn't better than WoW but I do.

 

Again, opinion, not fact.

 

Also my point was about WoW being an MMO and SWTOR being a single player game, not which game is better. You say that SWTOR is a single player game because it can be soloed yet people consider WoW a MMO and yet that can be soloed from 1-85. Care to explain that?

 

Saying that you want better than WoW doesn't answer the question, it is actually avoiding the question.

 

It is my conclusion that if you do not like SWTOR or feel that it isn't an MMO, then why the hell are you here then? Why not goto another TRUE MMO forum and hang out there? What is your purpose here?

 

 

The reason why people are here complaining (as pertaining to the lack of MMO feel) is because BW had the biggest budget of all time, with the Star Wars name, with 7 years of development time, and all they managed to pump out was a dumbed down version of WoW. It is a HUGE disappointment, Blizzard and BW are monster companies and can set trends, but all they are doing is turning MMOs into garbage instant gratification games.

[Shillen]

This isn't 2004. That's stupid to compare it to a 2004 game. Comparing it with 2011 WoW makes perfect sense because that's the option you have to play WoW or this or some other 2011 MMO.