Going forward, should SWTOR drop voice acted PlayerChars?

[TrixxieTriss]

That's pretty hilarious you think they all get paid a max of 10k per job. Nolan North wouldn't even answer a phone call for that pittance.

 

Of course they don’t. I never said they did.

 

I said “Even using 16 seperate VAs at the maximum work rate of $10,000 a job”. My language implied it was for arguments that I was using the maximum possible based on the available info that is also assumed to not be correct.

 

You don’t know how much Nolan gets paid per job any more than I do. It would be based on how many hours it takes and what his contracted rate is. Unless you somehow have access to his tax returns, you don’t know if he gets more or less than $10k.

 

It’s a pointless argument to have because none of it is based on facts. It’s all supposition.

Edited December 16, 2021 by TrixxieTriss

[Damask_Rose]

snip

 

Some tidbits I found that are germane to the discussion:

 

https://venturebeat.com/2012/01/20/ea-spent-only-200m-to-make-star-wars-the-old-republic/

 

https://www.gamedev.net/forums/topic/676955-1-hr-of-voice-acting-translates-into-how-much-hrs-of-voice-actor-work/?page=1

 

The link to the article quoted is broken, but this speaks directly to the issue:

 

No offense but have you been hiding under a rock or something, in the past few years or so? People have posted this time and time again but here it goes, for the 100th time...

 

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/03/29/gdc-2013-james-ohlen-on-how-f2p-saved-swtor/

 

"Some journalists and fans attributed much of the upfront cost of TOR to its scripting and voice acting. Ohlen explained that this belief is erroneous: "[Voice acting] was a known entity, and cost was quite low in comparison to the cost of the rest of the project." In other words, BioWare had been there and done that with voice acting already in its other games and budgeted accordingly.

 

However, BioWare did not have a tested platform to build an MMO. Much of the cost was funneled toward creating an engine that supported a team of over 300 people working on it at the same time and adding choice and consequence to the MMO story. "Don't be scared about adding voice over and cool cinematic content," he advised his audience, "but do be careful about adding lots of choice with consequence because that adds to QA cost and development cost and makes it hard to design everything."

 

I'm sure there are plenty of reasons for why class storylines were shelved for example but voice acting is surely NOT one of them, nor it is as expensive as some people are led to believe.

[OddballEasyEight]

They already tried and there was pretty massive backlash.

 

That's why there are a few missions in the expansions where you just pick your line and nothing is said.

 

But you get a big HELL NO! from me.

[TrixxieTriss]

Some tidbits I found that are germane to the discussion:

 

https://venturebeat.com/2012/01/20/ea-spent-only-200m-to-make-star-wars-the-old-republic/

 

https://www.gamedev.net/forums/topic/676955-1-hr-of-voice-acting-translates-into-how-much-hrs-of-voice-actor-work/?page=1

 

The link to the article quoted is broken, but this speaks directly to the issue:

 

That venture beat article can’t be correct. 1000 VAs during initial production? Surely that’s got to be wrong.

[DWho]

Man I just love countering all your made up claims.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Again I countered your claim earlier, you inserted "hollywood celebrities" and what they said in fact was "celebrities" which just means famous people per definition.

Those I listed are some celebrities that do the voice acting work for your player characters. Yes they are in fact making hundreds of thousands and sometimes millions.

You guys thinking they are doing this for less than a mcdonald's wage is pretty freaking hilarious and shows how hard you are trying

 

For starters, Net Worth is not current income. All of the people you listed are former actors and actresses that made their money in one way or another through Hollywood (or on screen/on stage pursuits), thus they would be celebrities in that sense as well.

 

Nolan North was previously a soap opera actor (which is a pretty good paying profession), voices Smokescreen in Transformers Prime, Superboy in Young Justice, Tony Stark in Marvel's Avengers, The Penguin in Batman:Arkam series. That would seem to explain where he got his net worth.

 

David Hayter is a screen writer in addition to voice acting and wrote screenplays for X-Men, X-Men 2, and Watchmen. There's where his net worth came from

 

Mark Bazeley: another former actor with credits in The Queen, Bourne Ultamatim, and The Damned United. On screen acting would seem to be his main source of net worth. Also, I see his net worth as of 2021 as 14 million from this link https://networthpost.org/net-worth/mark-bazeley-net-worth/

 

Kari Wahlgren: another former on-screen actress. She has also done voice work for quite as few full feature animated titles. That would seem to be where her net worth came from.

[SaerethDL]

Some tidbits I found that are germane to the discussion:

 

https://venturebeat.com/2012/01/20/ea-spent-only-200m-to-make-star-wars-the-old-republic/

 

The ongoing debate over the development cost seems moot because it still keeps climbing. EA has pointed out that the team is staying together to continue working on the game and just released the first major content patch titled “Rise of the Rakghouls”.

 

Emphasizing that subscribers will get their money worth’s of new stuff is most crucial. The Old Republic customers have to pay a monthly $15 subscription fee in order to keep playing the game after the initial month. For example, one million paying subscribers could bring in up to $180M in annual revenue.

 

And the lie detector detected, that was a lie.

 

As far as your 3rd link, i cannot read it I get an error.

[SaerethDL]

For starters, Net Worth is not current income. All of the people you listed are former actors and actresses that made their money in one way or another through Hollywood (or on screen/on stage pursuits), thus they would be celebrities in that sense as well.

 

Nolan North was previously a soap opera actor (which is a pretty good paying profession), voices Smokescreen in Transformers Prime, Superboy in Young Justice, Tony Stark in Marvel's Avengers, The Penguin in Batman:Arkam series. That would seem to explain where he got his net worth.

 

David Hayter is a screen writer in addition to voice acting and wrote screenplays for X-Men, X-Men 2, and Watchmen. There's where his net worth came from

 

Mark Bazeley: another former actor with credits in The Queen, Bourne Ultamatim, and The Damned United. On screen acting would seem to be his main source of net worth. Also, I see his net worth as of 2021 as 14 million from this link https://networthpost.org/net-worth/mark-bazeley-net-worth/

 

Kari Wahlgren: another former on-screen actress. She has also done voice work for quite as few full feature animated titles. That would seem to be where her net worth came from.

 

I know what net worth is you don't have to explain, you don't get to be a millionaire making 10k per job my man. are they or are they not celebrities, please answer the question honestly.

Edited December 16, 2021 by SaerethDL

[DWho]

I know what net worth is you don't have to explain, you don't get to be a millionaire making 10k per job my man. are they or are they not celebrities, please answer the question honestly.

 

I did. They all made their money as on screen actors and actresses before they became voice actors (all except Kari Wahlgren are married to other successful actresses - which is also part of their net worth). You implied that net worth somehow determined how much they would get paid for voice acting and did so again in the quoted post ("you don't get to be a millionaire making 10K per job"). I'm not saying they are getting 10k per job, but they aren't getting hundreds of thousands either. They are all Hollywood celebrities, yes, if that is the answer you want..

[SaerethDL]

I'm sure there are plenty of reasons for why class storylines were shelved for example but voice acting is surely NOT one of them, nor it is as expensive as some people are led to believe.

 

Oh it was most definitely one of them. Whether is be schedule issues, money, effort, etc.. it was one of them if not the top reason they never added more class stories. To say otherwise is just ignorance.

[SaerethDL]

I did. They all made their money as on screen actors and actresses before they became voice actors (all except Kari Wahlgren are married to other successful actresses - which is also part of their net worth). You implied that net worth somehow determined how much they would get paid for voice acting and did so again in the quoted post ("you don't get to be a millionaire making 10K per job"). I'm not saying they are getting 10k per job, but they aren't getting hundreds of thousands either. They are all Hollywood celebrities, yes, if that is the answer you want..

 

No they didn't ALL do that, your quote proves that to be false. I'm not assuming how much they make, I'm giving you the facts that are presented, they are millionaires, they are celebrities, they aren't doing voice acting in swtor for the little amount you think they are.. thats not how they roll, they have agents getting them the max amount of money per gig. What that is we don't know, but I'm giving you an estimated guess, they aren't all millionaires for nothing.

[SaerethDL]

They already tried and there was pretty massive backlash.

 

That's why there are a few missions in the expansions where you just pick your line and nothing is said.

 

But you get a big HELL NO! from me.

 

I was here, didn't see the backlash at all. I enjoyed it as a call back to kotor and kotor II, I even made a thread back then about how much I enjoyed it. Nice try tho.

[kage_goomba]

The OP has yet to produce any valid proof of BW's budget let alone spending habits.

Making this a waste of time to argue.

Maybe its time to stop feeding the troll.

 

It's clear no one's interested in the "suggested" change as it is - regardless of cost.

[TrixxieTriss]

I know what net worth is you don't have to explain, you don't get to be a millionaire making 10k per job my man. are they or are they not celebrities, please answer the question honestly.

 

That’s a wild misconception right there. They could do a lot of jobs for $10k per job in a week or month. That would certainly help build towards being a millionaire.

 

VA are self employed. They are under contract the same as any self employed contractor in any industry. If you can earn $10k for doing a few hours work then that is significant. If you only got 10k for doing a 1000 hour’s of work, then you’d be correct and it would be a long climb to a million.

 

Unless you know specifically how many hours they put in and how much they are paid, this argument is pointless.

Edited December 16, 2021 by TrixxieTriss

[SaerethDL]

The OP has yet to produce any valid proof of BW's budget let alone spending habits.

Making this a waste of time to argue.

Maybe its time to stop feeding the troll.

 

It's clear no one's interested in the "suggested" change as it is - regardless of cost.

 

Anyways whom disagrees with you is a "troll".. gotcha.. move along if you cannot bring anything to the table.

[SaerethDL]

That’s a wild misconception right there. They could do a lot of jobs for $10k per job in a week or month. That would certainly help build towards being a millionaire.

 

VA are self employed. They are under contract the same as any self employed contractor in any industry. If you can earn $10k for doing a few hours work then that is significant. If you only got 10k for doing a 1000 hour’s of work, then you’d be correct and it would be a long climb to a million.

 

Unless you know specifically how many hours they put in and how much they are paid, this argument is pointless.

yadda yadda yadda all speculation and assumptions

[TrixxieTriss]

I was here, didn't see the backlash at all. I enjoyed it as a call back to kotor and kotor II, I even made a thread back then about how much I enjoyed it. Nice try tho.

 

Can you please link that thread. I might be relevant to this argument

[TrixxieTriss]

yadda yadda yadda all speculation and assumptions

 

Exactly my point, 😂. Why are we even discussing it.

[SaerethDL]

Can you please link that thread. I might be relevant to this argument

 

not worth my time to look for it, if you wanna find it you can, i'm sure you know how.

[DWho]

No they didn't ALL do that, your quote proves that to be false. I'm not assuming how much they make, I'm giving you the facts that are presented, they are millionaires, they are celebrities, they aren't doing voice acting in swtor for the little amount you think they are.. thats not how they roll, they have agents getting them the max amount of money per gig. What that is we don't know, but I'm giving you an estimated guess, they aren't all millionaires for nothing.

 

Lets see

 

Nolan North = Hollywood actor married to a Hollywood actress are millionaires. Not much doubt there that is where their millions came from

 

David Hayter = Hollywood Screenwriter married to a Hollywood actress are millionaires. Not much doubt where their millions came from

 

Mark Bazeley = Hollywood Actor married to a Hollywood actress are millionaires. Not much doubt where their money came from.

 

Kari Wahlgren = Hollywood actress who also has voiced many full length animated titles (video games are not included here). No doubt where her money came from.

 

Certainly their agents are going to get the best deals for them but those deals are going to be no where as lucrative as their former/current occupations as actors and actresses. As you said, we don't know what they are getting paid but we don't know what the devs are getting paid, what the game producers are getting paid, what the royalty fees are, and numerous other costs associated with the production of a video game expansion. It is therefore impossible to back up with any degree of certainty the assertion that eliminating voice acting for the player characters is a significant cost and would result in "lots" of extra content.

[TrixxieTriss]

not worth my time to look for it, if you wanna find it you can, i'm sure you know how.

 

I don’t even know the title or have any idea of the date. You’re as a prolific poster as I am. I wouldn’t expect you to go find a thread I made 4-6 years ago with zero idea what your looking for. Why would you expect me to find yours.

If you don’t want to back up you’re own statement with your own thread to prove you’re correct in your assumptions, then so be it.

[SaerethDL]

I don’t even know the title or have any idea of the date. You’re as a prolific poster as I am. I wouldn’t expect you to go find a thread I made 4-6 years ago with zero idea what your looking for. Why would you expect me to find yours.

If you don’t want to back up you’re own statement with your own thread to prove you’re correct in your assumptions, then so be it.

 

I'm gonna warn you, bless you if you read all my old content, I was pretty wild back then. I did address the game is dying subs through each of the updates and expansions if you wanna look back and see how silly people are. I'd have to look through thousands of comments to find what you are looking for, its just not worth the effort lol.

Edited December 16, 2021 by SaerethDL

[DWho]

I don’t even know the title or have any idea of the date. You’re as a prolific poster as I am. I wouldn’t expect you to go find a thread I made 4-6 years ago with zero idea what your looking for. Why would you expect me to find yours.

If you don’t want to back up you’re own statement with your own thread to prove you’re correct in your assumptions, then so be it.

 

Doing a search on "voice acting" didn't turn up anything by him as the OP so it didn't have Voice Acting in the title whatever the name of the thread is. There are however, many posts very supportive of voice acting in the game.

[SaerethDL]

Doing a search on "voice acting" didn't turn up anything by him as the OP so it didn't have Voice Acting in the title whatever the name of the thread is. There are however, many posts very supportive of voice acting in the game.

 

I love the voice acting, but when it all comes down to it, I'd rather have more content and unvoiced player characters. New content is getting slimmer and slimmer, there is only so many times you can repeat old content in different ways. Consider I've been playing since one of the first waves of closed beta on and off. I understand what you guys are asking for but I don't think its possible at this stage.. 7.0 could literally be our last expansion if something doesn't change.

[TrixxieTriss]

I love the voice acting, but when it all comes down to it, I'd rather have more content and unvoiced player characters. New content is getting slimmer and slimmer, there is only so many times you can repeat old content in different ways. Consider I've been playing since one of the first waves of closed beta on and off. I understand what you guys are asking for but I don't think its possible at this stage.. 7.0 could literally be our last expansion if something doesn't change.

 

It probably will be our last expansion and not because of the VA’s using up too much development funds.

 

The issue as I see it is Bioware continually wasting funds by redesigning the wheel every bloody expansion. I get that each expansion has to have gear upgrades and grinds, but why does it need to be 100% redesigned every time from the ground up.

 

Any problems with a gearing system can just be tweaked unless it’s fundamentally broken. But Bioware don’t do that. They throw the baby out with the bath water and then need to gestate a brand new baby each time. How much time and money have they wasted just on doing that? I’d put hard money down that the VA budget wouldn’t even come close to that amount of cost and I dare say waste or money.

 

Then you have them redesigning other systems or things that aren’t broken and no one asks for. And unless a redesign drastically improves performance or QOL, then they should spend those resources squashing exiting bugs and making playable content.

 

Bioware have made some drastic changes for 7.0 and if they don’t start walking back on some of their announcements, this will indeed be the last expansion because a truck load of players are going to leave or stop paying to play.

[SaerethDL]

I don't remember what exactly I said, I remember saying how I enjoyed going back to the kotor like dialog.

 

I found this from 2015

 

This kotfe really makes me want a kotor 3, i believe they should just do a whole 40-100 hour game addon, and not just 6 hour dlc each "Expansion".. all the expansions are lame, but this one is the best so far, but short, did it twice in two days. Make it like old school kotor dialog where the player doesnt have a voice if that gives us more content so be it.