squads are a severe problem and need balancing.

[supertimtaf]

There is literarly nothing a single player can do agains premade squad. They must be forced to face their equals only. Stop random stomping or have an online worthy of soul series.

 

I'd like to know why you think that premades "are so powerfull they must be stopped". What makes them superior against random players, apart them being individually better than most single players.

[Warpreacher]

Is it too difficult for you to git gud?

you don't have valid points, just biased opinions based around your skill level.

 

if you are a cybersportsman earn money with it. or git gud

[Warpreacher]

I'd like to know why you think that premades "are so powerfull they must be stopped". What makes them superior against random players, apart them being individually better than most single players.

 

coordinated builds, ability to focus fire, ability to time CC,ability to call for help. In a scale that is impossimble for pugs.

Is it realy so hard to understand?

[phalczen]

This was inadvertently tried a few years ago. There was a bug that prevented groups from getting queue invites, so everyone had to queue solo to get a pvp match to pop. This was back during 4.x if i recall correctly. Subjectively, I felt the matches were a little more balanced. They popped more frequently, too. I think a lot more players tried pvp during that time because they knew they would be less likely to face a premade. Certainly nothing prevented people from queue-syncing and using voice comms, I'm sure it still occurred once the bug was widely realized. And if you didn't get matched on the same team as your friends, people would drop - there was no real deserter penalty back then. Nevertheless, my win rate queuing solo was closer to 50% then.

 

Of course my anecdotal evidence isn't to imply that premades can never be beaten, or conversely that groups should be in a separate queue and only matched against other groups. An MMORPG should never discourage people from grouping to play with friends. And, all other things being equal, a group of friends coordinating on voice ought to beat people who aren't making any other attempt at coordinating, even in text chat. That's just common sense. I just don't know what the best response is.

[Warpreacher]

Is it too difficult for you to git gud?

you don't have valid points, just biased opinions based around your skill level.

 

i see a premade player scared of facing other premades. Git gud!

[-Bob-]

i see a premade player scared of facing other premades. Git gud!

 

Again, no valid point from you. Now you're making assumptions, I solo Que and I have zero problem with premades that i go up against, sometimes they win and sometiimes they lose, sometimes i'm on the same team with a premade and we lose because they aren't that good.

You've gotten the idea into your thick skull that you're a victim and you're going to continue to live in that reality because you want everything handed to you, made easy. Maybe you live in a socialist country and you naturally expect things for free?

[supertimtaf]

coordinated builds, ability to focus fire, ability to time CC,ability to call for help. In a scale that is impossimble for pugs.

Is it realy so hard to understand?

 

Do you really need coordinated builds since 5.0 ? I mean, just play FOTM and here you go.

On a more serious note.

I already made an explanation in another thread on how to focus fire as well in solo, with the use of Focus Target keybinds, as it's basically the tool premades uses to swap targets.

 

Timing CC follows naturally with focus fire, meaning you keep your cc until your focus target uses his then follow up, you just have to watch your target's buff/debuff bar.

 

Calls for help on this is purely something that has been lost with time, like marking the enemy healers. So it's more an overall player skill issue rather than a "premade being too strong".

[Warpreacher]

Do you really need coordinated builds since 5.0 ? I mean, just play FOTM and here you go.

On a more serious note.

I already made an explanation in another thread on how to focus fire as well in solo, with the use of Focus Target keybinds, as it's basically the tool premades uses to swap targets.

 

Timing CC follows naturally with focus fire, meaning you keep your cc until your focus target uses his then follow up, you just have to watch your target's buff/debuff bar.

 

Calls for help on this is purely something that has been lost with time, like marking the enemy healers. So it's more an overall player skill issue rather than a "premade being too strong".

 

1. Have no doubt. Party of tank healer and 2 dd shall have far better chances than a party of 4 dd.

2. You reealy expect pug players to correctly use such mechanics?

3. not naturaly at all. i have seen ppl using stuns on an already stunned target.

4. if premade member is in trouble he cann ask with voice for guard and/or heal.

 

I feel a cringe for you. Are all that things not obviuos?

Edited February 11, 2021 by Warpreacher

[Warpreacher]

Maybe you live in a socialist country and you naturally expect things for free?

 

no i am not american, thanks God.

 

i expect to get a fair play and joy from the game i paid for. Not a clear balance oversights and moronic gitgud mantra mumblers.

[-Bob-]

no i am not american, thanks God.

 

i expect to get a fair play and joy from the game i paid for. Not a clear balance oversights and moronic gitgud mantra mumblers.

I knew thats the only thing you would take away from it.

[supertimtaf]

1. Have no doubt. Party of tank healer and 2 dd shall have far better chances than a party of 4 dd.

2. You reealy expect pug players to correctly use such mechanics?

3. not naturaly at all. i have seen ppl using stuns on an already stunned target.

4. if premade member is in trouble he cann ask with voice for guard and/or heal.

 

I feel a cringe for you. Are all that things not obviuos?

 

Those used to be basics things at the time. At least, peoples knew of them. Didn't mean that they'd do it everytime, but at least peoples were far more aware of what was happening around them.

 

And you summed it up pretty well with your point number 2

 

"You really expect pug players to correctly use such mechanics"

 

Here we have our issues. Said mechanic is just one button to press at the start of a game, and another one to swap target. It's just like tab-target swapping, instead you just press... G, or H, or whatever you assigned that keybind.

 

So we're basically at a point where "solo/pug players DO NOT want to get better, so then please get rid of experienced players instead of giving them a reason to learn". I thought that PvP by nature was made to be competitive. That you were supposed to play and have whoever is the strongest be the winner. I don't see how getting rid of the few players left who knows how to use their action will prove to be a benefit for everybody who doesn't want to improve. What will be next ? Banning solo players who do more than 2M damage in a game ? Banning peoples who uses stealth classes to cap objectives ? Surely you can see that this isn't the way to go.

 

 

 

However, you are right on one thing, which is your number 1 point. A balanced group will do better against an unbalanced one. This is why you should ask for a role-based matchmaking instead of the system we currently have. That would help a lot against having unbalanced teams.

[black_pyros]

So we're basically at a point where "solo/pug players DO NOT want to get better, so then please get rid of experienced players instead of giving them a reason to learn". I thought that PvP by nature was made to be competitive. That you were supposed to play and have whoever is the strongest be the winner. I don't see how getting rid of the few players left who knows how to use their action will prove to be a benefit for everybody who doesn't want to improve. What will be next ? Banning solo players who do more than 2M damage in a game ? Banning peoples who uses stealth classes to cap objectives ? Surely you can see that this isn't the way to go.

You are totally spot on. What premade blamers basically ask for repeatedly on these forums over and over can be summarized to:

 

#banskill

 

Edited February 11, 2021 by black_pyros

[Warpreacher]

Those used to be basics things at the time. At least, peoples knew of them. Didn't mean that they'd do it everytime, but at least peoples were far more aware of what was happening around them.

 

So we're basically at a point where "solo/pug players DO NOT want to get better, so then please get rid of experienced players instead of giving them a reason to learn". I thought that PvP by nature was made to be competitive.

 

 

Even your own logic works against you.

Matching premades against each other will get a PVP more competitive, you see. There will be no easy randomstomping this way. AND premade players WILL FINALY GET THEIR MOTIVE TO GITGUUD!!!!1111

Now they want just easy randomstomping.

Gitgud.

[Warpreacher]

Not at all. premade players are not neccesarily better than solo. Thay just want easystomping.

 

GITGUD

Edited February 11, 2021 by Warpreacher

[-Bob-]

Even your own logic works against you.

Matching premades against each other will get a PVP more competitive, you see. There will be no easy randomstomping this way. AND premade players WILL FINALY GET THEIR MOTIVE TO GITGUUD!!!!1111

Now they want just easy randomstomping.

Gitgud.

 

In the '74 Mr. Olympia when Arnold beat Lou, did everyone get together and say " Ok we need to change Arnolds workouts and diet to make it more fair for Lou"?

No they didn't, in fact Arnold came back and competed against Lou the following year and Beat him AGAIN!

 

When Tampa Bay just beat the Chiefs in the SuperBowl, did the NFL get together and say" Ok we need to remove the best players on this team to make it more fair for the other teams next year, these guys are just too good"?

No they didn't, Do you know why? (of course you don't)...because it's competitive. Both are examples of team and solo competition. Someone is supposed to get their *** handed to them and the other is supposed to win.

PVP is supposed to be the competitve aspect of this game, i mean...it's in the name..Player versus Player.

The biggest issue i see which many others have pointed out is class stacking/matchmaking, not premades.

You just want the win handed to you, you don't want to improve your skills and get better, you don't seem very introspective, you just finger point and blame others for your problems.

[Aricin]

In the '74 Mr. Olympia when Arnold beat Lou, did everyone get together and say " Ok we need to change Arnolds workouts and diet to make it more fair for Lou"?

No they didn't, in fact Arnold came back and competed against Lou the following year and Beat him AGAIN!

 

When Tampa Bay just beat the Chiefs in the SuperBowl, did the NFL get together and say" Ok we need to remove the best players on this team to make it more fair for the other teams next year, these guys are just too good"?

No they didn't, Do you know why? (of course you don't)...because it's competitive. Both are examples of team and solo competition. Someone is supposed to get their *** handed to them and the other is supposed to win.

PVP is supposed to be the competitve aspect of this game, i mean...it's in the name..Player versus Player.

The biggest issue i see which many others have pointed out is class stacking/matchmaking, not premades.

You just want the win handed to you, you don't want to improve your skills and get better, you don't seem very introspective, you just finger point and blame others for your problems.

 

wow, how long did it take for you to cook that non sense up. Chiefs vs Bucks is the equivalent of ranked - 2 competitive teams that trained all season and competing for the cup. Arnold vs Lou is again 2 athletes choosing to compete at the peak of the sport.

 

If you really want to make an anology, here you go, unranked PvP in SWtoR is the equivalent of intramural BBall at crappy university. And what we have here is all the has been high school players that didnt make to the next level group up together beating up the scrubs.

Edited February 11, 2021 by Aricin