MODDABLE "orange" quality gear ONLY for levels 1-49, very disapointed :-(

[Eliezer]

Ya they fail to have logic, Appearance tab is more immersion, not less.

 

Well, the trick is there are two competing definitions of "immersion" being represented in this thread.

 

Roleplayer Immersion means the game should look the way the Player envisions it - be it the clothes the Character wears, or even spell effects. You can find of tons of threads in the Consular forum alone complaining about Telekinetic Throw or that Sages should get Saber Toss or somesuch. This group wants an Appearance Tab but keep the stats from "ugly gear." That is immersion to them.

 

Gamist Immersion is the opposite. To this group, they want a spade to be a spade. That they see your ugly *** Robe and know instantly what it is... Not have to wonder or inspect everyone they see to know whether your Newb Robes are packing Op Tier Mods. They don't want customized Spell effects either, because for them immersion is that when they see a swarm of pebbles, they know it is a Sage, probably Balance spec, etc. Or whatever.

 

TL;DR - The definition of Immersion changes depending on whether you care about RP and Story or Game Mechanics.

[pinealogik]

wow, I didn't even realize that, f*&^ man I've been saving all the cool looking orange pieces that I've gotten throughout my leveling experience just so I could slot end game raid/pvp mods into em and not look like a freaking clone. This needs to be looked at by BW since if they keep it like this the whole point of mods post 50 is a mute one. If they are that worried about people farming the first few bosses then they should move those pieces to the end ones....mmm problem solving

 

 

I think that's pretty much why people are mad. I was also saving bunch of orange gear and stuff, now they are pretty much useless. I don't get it, why have this system and trash it at level 50? This make no *********** sens -_-

[Enako]

Well, the trick is there are two competing definitions of "immersion" being represented in this thread.

 

Roleplayer Immersion means the game should look the way the Player envisions it - be it the clothes the Character wears, or even spell effects. You can find of tons of threads in the Consular forum alone complaining about Telekinetic Throw or that Sages should get Saber Toss or somesuch. This group wants an Appearance Tab but keep the stats from "ugly gear." That is immersion to them.

 

Gamist Immersion is the opposite. To this group, they want a spade to be a spade. That they see your ugly *** Robe and know instantly what it is... Not have to wonder or inspect everyone they see to know whether your Newb Robes are packing Op Tier Mods. They don't want customized Spell effects either, because for them immersion is that when they see a swarm of pebbles, they know it is a Sage, probably Balance spec, etc. Or whatever.

 

TL;DR - The definition of Immersion changes depending on whether you care about RP and Story or Game Mechanics.

 

those two definitions do not contradict :

 

stuff should look the way they are designed to, and overall look of the toon should be modifiable by changing the stuff that looks different - ie, modding.

 

so, an appearance tab just breaks the immersion - it has NOTHING to do with the game mechanics. ie, basically you have not shoved in a better armor insert to an orange gear with a certain looks - it means you just ticked an interface utility and made your gear appear like ANOTHER gear.

 

it breaks immersion from both fronts.

[Enako]

why have this system and trash it at level 50? This make no *********** sens -_-

 

yeah i think its stupid too.

 

mod system has been an innovation of this game so far, in an unexpected fashion. something new. at least, in this format.

 

letting go of some good system that was just discovered in favor of imitating a wow clone even better would be insanely stupid.

 

for, they can be sure that some other game will take what they discovered here, and use it.

[kottonmouth]

Moddable gear system I think was one of the best things about this game. So it IS clone wars at lvl 50 eh? Ive supported this game allot but if this isn't rectified by the time im 50 i may take a break (with my subscription) until it is.

[OlBuzzard]

I think that's pretty much why people are mad. I was also saving bunch of orange gear and stuff, now they are pretty much useless. I don't get it, why have this system and trash it at level 50? This make no *********** sens -_-

 

I discovered that by accident. I had a blaster that went missing right after I purchased it .. pretty good too. I did not have enough of the comendations to purchase another one. Sooooo I started to looking at some of the specs more closely. I actually have sense picked up blasters that were better than the Orange one I lost. I have also done some more research to see if there were "better" Orange blasters available. Bottom line: who cares what color it is ... if it's better ... then it's better.

 

BUT... the whole idea of the orange items was for it to last ???

 

Now I'm not so sure ! I'd love to get a set of epic? (nah ..... they'd probably all still look like WW-I stuff anyways. At least for the smuggler).

[Jairec]

Doublepostarrific! Edited January 5, 2012 by Jairec

[Jairec]

those two definitions do not contradict :

 

stuff should look the way they are designed to, and overall look of the toon should be modifiable by changing the stuff that looks different - ie, modding.

 

so, an appearance tab just breaks the immersion - it has NOTHING to do with the game mechanics. ie, basically you have not shoved in a better armor insert to an orange gear with a certain looks - it means you just ticked an interface utility and made your gear appear like ANOTHER gear.

 

it breaks immersion from both fronts.

The mod system just shoves stats into a user interface, too. It's just that you apparently consider "moddng" a magic word that creates immersion. If this game had an appearance tab, called modification, junctioned at a modification table, it would be just as immersive. Moreso given the specific locus for the activity.

 

Similarly, as clearly demonstrated by other games, you can have an appearance tab while ensuring light armor is light and a double saber is a double saber. False dilemma. Your refusal to accept that there can be various implementations and permutations of an appearance tab, even in the face of examples in other games, suggests that you're more interested in railing against straw men than having an actual discussion.

 

Of course, if the modification system didn't suck and fail out @ 50, it would be a serviceable replacement for an appearance tab. Making all gear orange would be a start. Ensuring that all top-tier best in slot statistical functions, including set bonuses, are available via mods would be another.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Jairec

[Tommyjc]

The mod system just shoves stats into a user interface, too. It's just that you apparently consider "moddng" a magic word that creates immersion. If this game had an appearance tab, called modification, junctioned at a modification table, it would be just as immersive. Moreso given the specific locus for the activity.

 

Similarly, as clearly demonstrated by other games, you can have an appearance tab while ensuring light armor is light and a double saber is a double saber. False dilemma. Your refusal to accept that there can be various implementations and permutations of an appearance tab, even in the face of examples in other games, suggests that you're more interested in railing against straw men than having an actual discussion.

 

Of course, if the modification system didn't suck and fail out @ 50, it would be a serviceable replacement for an appearance tab. Making all gear orange would be a start.

 

You gave his terrible logic more consideration than I have, I usually just shut down his walls of texts in 1 line. He clearly has no idea what immersion is. Just saw someone else talk about it now he won't stop blabbing it everywhere.

[OlBuzzard]

I use to play a game (recently) that had customizable "UNIFORMS" or outfits. The "gear" could be hidden at the flip of a switch. The "uniform" or other outfits were VERY appropriate for the genre of the entire series that the game represented. The player could chose wheather or not to "flip the switch" and cover the gear or not !

 

It was one of the things that was done right with that particular game.

Edited January 5, 2012 by OlBuzzard

[Eliezer]

The mod system just shoves stats into a user interface, too. It's just that you apparently consider moddng a magic word. Id this game had an appearance tab, called modification, functioned at a modification table, it would be just as immersive. Moreso given the specific locus for the activity.

 

Similarly, as clearly demonstrated other games, you can have an appearance tab while ensuring light armor is light and a double saber is a double saber. False dilemma.

 

Of course, if the modification system didn't suck and fail out @ 50, it would be a serviceable replacement for an appearance tab. Making all gear orange would be a start.

 

But it doesn't fail! With the possible exception of Set Bonuses.

 

They have locked ONE out of three mods on Tier Pieces and have stated that equivalent mods WILL drop. Orange Gear will function PERFECTLY FINE at 50.

 

The only possible thing you might not get is a 4 piece set bonus, and frankly, who cares? Most Set bonuses are pretty crappy in most games and LOTS of people don't bother with them.

[Therien]

Today is the first time i have heard about this. I have to say that this came as a huge dissapointment..

[Tommyjc]

yeah i think its stupid too.

 

mod system has been an innovation of this game so far, in an unexpected fashion. something new. at least, in this format.

 

letting go of some good system that was just discovered in favor of imitating a wow clone even better would be insanely stupid.

 

for, they can be sure that some other game will take what they discovered here, and use it.

 

More showing of logic, he's not talking about appearance tab, he's talking about how they made the mod system useless at 50, *facepalm* No one ever said to throw it out either, we want a better mod system for those of us who actually raid and pvp, or we want an a-tab which would be even simpler. Just stop until you think of something coherent.

[Tommyjc]

But it doesn't fail! With the possible exception of Set Bonuses.

 

They have locked ONE out of three mods on Tier Pieces and have stated that equivalent mods WILL drop. Orange Gear will function PERFECTLY FINE at 50.

 

The only possible thing you might not get is a 4 piece set bonus, and frankly, who cares? Most Set bonuses are pretty crappy in most games and LOTS of people don't bother with them.

 

there's a big difference between oranges and hardmode set, and the set bonuses are in fact, pretty damn good. PS. Yet to see any of these mods drop from raids, just saying.

[Pravis]

wow, I didn't even realize that, f*&^ man I've been saving all the cool looking orange pieces that I've gotten throughout my leveling experience just so I could slot end game raid/pvp mods into em and not look like a freaking clone. This needs to be looked at by BW since if they keep it like this the whole point of mods post 50 is a mute one. If they are that worried about people farming the first few bosses then they should move those pieces to the end ones....mmm problem solving

 

 

People like you need to ignore uninformed posts that claim you can't mod orange fear to be comparable. You can, and because of the miss available you can even make up for the subpar set bonuses.

 

Please read the whole thread. Some good posts which are getting overlooked by the very few people arguing with each other rather than discussing the topic.

[Eliezer]

there's a big difference between oranges and hardmode set, and the set bonuses are in fact, pretty damn good. PS. Yet to see any of these mods drop from raids, just saying.

 

Since Bioware has said they will drop, I am taking them at their word they will be either added, or bug fixed soon. Set bonuses will always be a matter of some people love them other people less so. I imagine that if/when Combat Logs and other metrics become available it will be easier to judge the value of Set Bonuses.

[Enako]

The mod system just shoves stats into a user interface, too. It's just that you apparently consider "moddng" a magic word that creates immersion. If this game had an appearance tab, called modification, junctioned at a modification table, it would be just as immersive. Moreso given the specific locus for the activity.

 

the more stuff is handled via in-game mechanics, the more the immersion.

 

it doesnt matter whether that is stats, or looks. i have given stat editing as an example that would break immersion. people want to acquire better stats on their gear through in -game mechanics. not via clicking/editing a software user interface tab.

 

same goes for appearance.

 

you get some chestpiece, and then you go and click an interface tab, and what ? it looks totally like SOMETHING ELSE ?

 

there. immersion gone.

 

Similarly, as clearly demonstrated by other games, you can have an appearance tab while ensuring light armor is light and a double saber is a double saber. False dilemma. Your refusal to accept that there can be various implementations and permutations of an appearance tab, even in the face of examples in other games, suggests that you're more interested in railing against straw men than having an actual discussion.

 

there can be no way for appearance tab not to break immersion. only exception would be to have appearance tab only to change the color of the items - as if it was paint.

 

else, if you take chestpiece A and after clicking some stuff in software interface it looks like chestpiece B, it is immersion-breaking.

[Enako]

More showing of logic, he's not talking about appearance tab, he's talking about how they made the mod system useless at 50, *facepalm* No one ever said to throw it out either, we want a better mod system for those of us who actually raid and pvp, or we want an a-tab which would be even simpler. Just stop until you think of something coherent.

 

if you dont like my posts, stop reading/replying - you claim to ignoring them yet you keep replying. instead, you can just do what you are claiming, and shut up.

 

you not understanding something, or something being different in your perspective/taste, does not mean that others' perspectives are wrong.

[Pravis]

What's funny is that a lot of people crying over the gear claim they are forced to choose a horrible looking set or look how they want and be subpar or gimped by comparison.

 

You realize the minimal stat differences and set bonuses are so small that you won't even notice it. One piece will change your health/dps/heals/defense on the order of less than 0.5%...and even multiplying that out for each of the uber set drops makes a negligible impact.

 

So stop crying and posting for a change to a working game mechanic that will not impact you.

[Tommyjc]

Since Bioware has said they will drop, I am taking them at their word they will be either added, or bug fixed soon. Set bonuses will always be a matter of some people love them other people less so. I imagine that if/when Combat Logs and other metrics become available it will be easier to judge the value of Set Bonuses.

 

There is no situation where gear with lets say equal stats, if you magically get one of these mods to drop, is equal to gear with a set bonus, it is literally impossible. Anything is better than nothing.

[CharagonIGN]

the more stuff is handled via in-game mechanics, the more the immersion.

 

it doesnt matter whether that is stats, or looks. i have given stat editing as an example that would break immersion. people want to acquire better stats on their gear through in -game mechanics. not via clicking/editing a software user interface tab.

 

same goes for appearance.

 

you get some chestpiece, and then you go and click an interface tab, and what ? it looks totally like SOMETHING ELSE ?

 

there. immersion gone.

 

 

 

there can be no way for appearance tab not to break immersion. only exception would be to have appearance tab only to change the color of the items - as if it was paint.

 

else, if you take chestpiece A and after clicking some stuff in software interface it looks like chestpiece B, it is immersion-breaking.

 

And it's NOT immersion breaking to have your character change his shirt so his blaster shoots harder?

[Tommyjc]

the more stuff is handled via in-game mechanics, the more the immersion.

 

it doesnt matter whether that is stats, or looks. i have given stat editing as an example that would break immersion. people want to acquire better stats on their gear through in -game mechanics. not via clicking/editing a software user interface tab.

 

same goes for appearance.

 

you get some chestpiece, and then you go and click an interface tab, and what ? it looks totally like SOMETHING ELSE ?

 

there. immersion gone.

 

 

 

there can be no way for appearance tab not to break immersion. only exception would be to have appearance tab only to change the color of the items - as if it was paint.

 

else, if you take chestpiece A and after clicking some stuff in software interface it looks like chestpiece B, it is immersion-breaking.

TLDR; Rethink the definition of Immersion, and how you're using it.

[Tommyjc]

And it's NOT immersion breaking to have your character change his shirt so his blaster shoots harder?

 

Magic stat changing robes and shirts obviously make sense. Haven't you seen them at (insert local clothes store here)?

[PANZERBUNNY]

So as some who made level 50 might know the raid gear has its Armor mod slots LOCKED down so you cannot take its mods out and slot it into your favorite orange quality cool looking armor.

 

Yes some equal quality "loose" armor mods was said by developers to be made avialable in raids , but we have not seen a single one yet at least.

 

What is worse for PVP gear there is no equvalent to this, or in other words no PVP armor mod vendor so your stuck with your champions etc gear exactly how it looks, as the juicy stats are on the armor mods which cannot be removed (and lets be honest the level 50 epic PVP gear has had so much negative feedback for its crappy looks)

 

In other words you will end up looking EXACTLY like all other players of the same class, the question then begs WHY then Bioware implemented the Orange moddable gear in the first place, if its practically not usable at endgame ?

 

Yes, some Bioware developer said they "had" to do this because otherwise some raiders would just farm the first couple bosses and remove the mods and by this make complete upgraded armor sets without having to kill the more difficult end- bosses.

 

I cant believe they just made this "cheap" bandaid solution, instead of, for example made the armor mods dependent on the piece it was removed from, ie chest piece armor mod only usable in chest piece orange armor etc.

 

Before anyone says why even care for looks or "only stats count" well in that case why even make the game graphically apeasing ? or even just make it text based like RPGs from the 80s :-)

 

Bandaid solutions like this from the game developers really make me worry for its future, and lets be CLEAR, i waited 5 years for this game and could be called a "fan" and do NOT want this game to fail, which is WHY stuff like this (and as you all know the "list" with urgent things for them to fix is getting longer every day already...) is really making me sad.

 

I'm sure it will be addressed when an adequate amount of the player base gets to 50.

 

P/S Immersion has to do with your environment and how the game "feels". Does the game act and feel like the star wars universe. The fact that magic clothes give me stat bonuses doesn't effect immersion at all.

 

Some dude running around with the name "SexyPokemon" sort of does.

Edited January 5, 2012 by PANZERBUNNY

[Ketinvik]

Solution = cosmetic slots.