Gearing in 6.0 (MM FPS farm....again.....)

[merovejec]

So it didnt take long and the fleet is full of people LFG for stealth run Red Reaper or Hammer Station. I mean, I am fine with that, but this is a lesson that Bioware has not learned. People will always find a way to grind their way to what they need. So the "play what you want" still doesnt work

[Dweessies]

So it didnt take long and the fleet is full of people LFG for stealth run Red Reaper or Hammer Station. I mean, I am fine with that, but this is a lesson that Bioware has not learned. People will always find a way to grind their way to what they need. So the "play what you want" still doesnt work

 

LOL exploit early, exploit often. I guess they're betting the Bioware can't afford to ban them all and reduce their playerbase any more than they already have.

[merovejec]

Its not exploit behaviour, what they do is fine with the game. It sucks that you can just get full 306 in 1-2 days with a stealther group.

[Pirana]

This is nowhere near an exploit, it's using the game mechanics.

 

What's probably gonna wind up happening is they tune the gear drops down more and more until they find a good safe window that appeases both its customers and them. Then once again, the customers will get upset at the gear change and make threads about leaving if that happens. Of course that's a hypothesis, but going off the history of this game, that's usually what happens. Gearing in this game has never been easier than it currently is.

 

EAWare simply can't get out of their own way when it comes to gearing, which is why it's always evolving, although devolving might be more appropriate. This is why if this game survives this latest iteration of gearing, somewhere down the road there will be another reworked gearing system. It's their M.O..

[Nemmar]

So it didnt take long and the fleet is full of people LFG for stealth run Red Reaper or Hammer Station. I mean, I am fine with that, but this is a lesson that Bioware has not learned. People will always find a way to grind their way to what they need. So the "play what you want" still doesnt work

 

Surely, they are doing that cause they want to.

 

They are not forced to do it to gear. They just want to go for the fast path. Wich again, it's their choice.

[TrixxieTriss]

LOL exploit early, exploit often. I guess they're betting the Bioware can't afford to ban them all and reduce their playerbase any more than they already have.

 

How is this an exploit?

[DawnAskham]

Not an exploit but the 'early and often' should be taken seriously as Bioware is know to lack the foresight to see this behavior occurring, and if it flies against their original goals to keep players occupied with the throw away grind for longer than a day, are likely to change the system to prevent grinding through FP farming.

[nepochop]

Not an exploit but the 'early and often' should be taken seriously as Bioware is know to lack the foresight to see this behavior occurring, and if it flies against their original goals to keep players occupied with the throw away grind for longer than a day, are likely to change the system to prevent grinding through FP farming.

 

Yeah I mean Keith said they have learned stuff from past and yet we see the same behavior than before when GC system came out. They really should make a system that will not allow a grind like this.

[Lhancelot]

This is nowhere near an exploit, it's using the game mechanics.

 

This could be true, but I seriously doubt the devs deliberately designed gearing so stealth group runs is the best way to get gears. Hope it gets "fixed." Also, a nice touch would be to strip all the gears people got from doing it this way.

Edited October 26, 2019 by Lhancelot

[CaptRogue]

This could be true, but I seriously doubt the devs deliberately designed gearing so stealth group runs is the best way to get gears. Hope it gets "fixed." Also, a nice touch would be to strip all the gears people got from doing it this way.

 

Why?! Just because they've figured out the fastest route to get the gear they want, by doing in game stuff, is NOT an exploit.

If that's how they want to play, that's their right.

Same as if you want to play & go slow on everything. Some people's main MMO thing is to be highest geared, doing the hardest content. Others have tons of alts that would like to gear them too. It's still a grind whether you go the slow route or just grind over & over FPs that get boring as heck.

But there should NOT be any punishment or gear removal from that. I mean really Lhance...that's just weird you'd say that.

[ZionHalcyon]

This could be true, but I seriously doubt the devs deliberately designed gearing so stealth group runs is the best way to get gears. Hope it gets "fixed." Also, a nice touch would be to strip all the gears people got from doing it this way.

 

in the past, they haven't done anything punitive to players who take advantage of the game's own systems for their benefit. They will simply make corrections so that the behavior cannot continue.

 

I believe that will be the best course of action here

Edited October 26, 2019 by ZionHalcyon

[arunav]

This has been the case since Galactic Command was introduced in 5.0.

 

We all did MM Hammer station and stealthed through any FP that made things faster with an all stealth group. This is true of other content as well, including solo content. Stealth is a basic feature of certain classes and specs. Anyone can play them.

 

In other words, this isn't new. It was this way almost 3 years ago for gearing in Galactic Command before tokens and UCs were introduced months after 5.0's launch, and it's the same now.

 

It's a non-issue, frankly. You get to 306 on one character, and have a basic legacy set to get set bonuses with on all your others that you enjoy playing - it makes playing the game much more enjoyable, since you can actually play all your characters. At that point, there's more grinding to do anyway in order to get the right mods for a given spec, but at least one character is good to go approximately running faster MM FPs and, in my experience, also playing GSF too. The players that do this tend to have many characters they play and stay subscribed. It would be counterproductive for BW to somehow nerf MM FPs, especially considering it's the same thing we all did to get gear with the initial version of Galactic Command.

 

GSF is a great source for Tech Fragments. Are you telling GSF'ers they are somehow playing wrong because they accumulate what's needed to buy set bonus shells faster? Anyone can play GSF if they want to, anyone can play a stealth class (or any class) and run MM FPs in an organized way.

 

You folks are complaining people found a way to gear their characters that makes it less painful playing the same old content just to get reasonable stats again to do so. If things change (which I don't think they will), players will just go to the new fastest method, or leave the game because it's too much of a grind to just get back what you had before the expansion.

 

Anyone else who doesn't care to gear quickly can simply do so at their pace, playing PVP, Ops, GSF, whatever. Very few players overall actually gear this way. Most players I'd guess never even try MM FPs, even though they are some of the most fun PVE content.

 

I'm really looking forward to having good enough gear to do the new Corellia FP in MM. The boss fights seem like they'd be a blast in a trinity group with a little more difficulty. Some people didn't enjoy Nathema Conspiracy, but the MM version of that was really fun, the first good FP since the SoR-prelude and SoR FPs.

 

In short, playing MM FPs quickly or on stealth characters isn't something nefarious or even new. There's two entire advanced classes designed around stealth, and for the entire life of the game they've sometimes had advantages getting around mobs. Stealth classes also have many drawbacks in both PVE and PVP content. To find out if you like playing them, I'd suggest doing so instead of complaining people are gearing up on their favored classes.

 

My main has been a Jedi Shadow since January 2012. It's fantastic - can dps, tank, has cool animations, and has stealth. That's why I picked it. I'm sure your favored class/AC has its own perks. I'd love to have ranged abilities on my Shadow, since ranged classes are generally easier to play in PVE (and sometimes PVP too).

 

Should rewards be nerfed for ranged classes? They are easier to get through content with often, and I find them less stressful to play as well, since you're generally moving at a distance from bosses and firing away.

 

Please start a thread where melee classes should get gear faster and better rewards than ranged. That makes about as much sense.

Edited October 26, 2019 by arunav

[cibacrome]

I've been doing stealth solo runs on FPs and Heroics for as long as I've been playing this game. How is that not playing content legitimately and how I like? Anyone is free to roll a stealth class and do the same, no exploit, just using class skills as intended.

[jedimasterjac]

"Given the opportunity, players will optimize the fun out of a game." - Soren Johnson, Civilization Designer.

[cibacrome]

Fun is entirely subjective. For me fun is running NiM ops. For that I need gear. Rest of the game is what I do immediately before & after raid.

 

OP is complaining about people who grind gear faster by rolling a stealth toon. Others are complaining about MM FP farming. You can get gear any way you want, some are better than others, that's not a surprise.

 

So... 1: level gear (not so fun) 2: get set bonus & tactical (a little more fun but meh) 3: run NiM ops (fun!!!!!!).

 

Took from Tuesday to Friday, got 306 and 4 out of my 6pc bonus set, plus a tactical. Ran group FP MM spam, ran stealth solo vet, stealth duo MM, and a bunch of SM ops. I play a bit harder than casual, don't consider SWTOR my job (unless BW is willing to pay my bills XD) but I admit I got a little obsessive yesterday as I was pushing for 306 and played way more than I should have lol.

 

This might be the easiest and fastest gearing in SWTOR yet, but here we are with thread after thread about how hard the game is and how much gearing sux.

[sharkfishman]

So it didnt take long and the fleet is full of people LFG for stealth run Red Reaper or Hammer Station. I mean, I am fine with that, but this is a lesson that Bioware has not learned. People will always find a way to grind their way to what they need. So the "play what you want" still doesnt work

 

I honestly don't understand why they decided to put the same rewards behind these low-level MM flashpoints.

 

I guess I misunderstood their goals. I thought they were going to give harder content a higher drop chance for rewards, but I guess they just painted everything with the same brush.

 

I mean, which is harder? Master Mode Hammer or Veteran Mode Depths of Manaan or Chiss or Umbara, etc.

 

In what universe should I get the same rewards per boss by taking on MM Korriban or Tython vs. Hammer Station?

 

It boggles my mind.

[Lhancelot]

"Given the opportunity, players will optimize the fun out of a game." - Soren Johnson, Civilization Designer.

 

This right here. ^

 

I don't care if people enjoy taking shortcuts to get pixels then by all means do it. I would just rather there not be loopholes in gearing systems that can be taken advantage of by certain classes whether it's stealth or not. it's lame.

[sharkfishman]

This right here. ^

 

I don't care if people enjoy taking shortcuts to get pixels then by all means do it. I would just rather there not be loopholes in gearing systems that can be taken advantage of by certain classes whether it's stealth or not. it's lame.

 

Totally agree.

 

Especially when these same players then turn around and comment on gameplay, saying "MM content isn't hard, the game is still super easy, there's no problems, everything is rosy." Well, yeah, I guess if you're running Hammer over and over, you're not really at a risk of ever dying, lol.

[juliushorst]

This adds an interesting point to the whole 'game too hard' discussion happening now. It appears most people are after nice rewards rather than after hardest content the game has to offer. Just check the fleet and compare how many people ask for MM Hammer Station compared to how many people ask for Duxun operation or Iokath operation.

[-Highsteel-]

I dont think they will nerf anything as far as lowering gear drops in these specific fp's. When they say they have learned from the past, I believe they mean they will allow it and not alter the drops like they did with KP adds, MM chapter 1, TFB hypergate adds of 5.0...

[Pirana]

This could be true, but I seriously doubt the devs deliberately designed gearing so stealth group runs is the best way to get gears. Hope it gets "fixed." Also, a nice touch would be to strip all the gears people got from doing it this way.

 

There is no 'could' be true. Stealthing to obtain gear among other things, is and always has been a faster way to do a number of things in game(s). If people don't like it, roll a stealth class. If the devs didn't realize or even understand that gearing favored a stealth class, then that's on them. Your last sentence, not happening. Their motto: "play your way" is in full effect.

[Rion_Starkiller]

Move all your gear to a stealth toon and join the RR fun. Don't tell me you don't have a stealth toon.

 

The real gearing challenge is going to be Amplifiers. It will cost hundreds of millions to re-roll the pieces you want across all gear.

Edited October 26, 2019 by Rion_Starkiller

[lord-angelus]

Move all your gear to a stealth toon and join the RR fun. Don't tell me you don't have a stealth toon.

 

The real gearing challenge is going to be Amplifiers. It will cost hundreds of millions to re-roll the pieces you want across all gear.

 

Actually not, you get so many mods and armouring I stopped rolling at 50k, got one bis for combat, and got several bis for crafting.

[merovejec]

The only issue now is that we are running out of people for farming FPS as most people are already geared

[Ahwassa]

Isn´t the gearing faster if you form a good group and run random master Fps? You get more gear at the end (gear boxes).

Maybe it takes longer (if you get Chiss or somthing like that) but it´s more fun than running Reaper 24/7.

 

I did that 4 evenings and I´m 306, with many tacticals and full set boni.

Edited October 30, 2019 by Ahwassa