Thank you BW

[omeru]

Thank you SWTOR dev. tream addding that retarded matchmaking system and never try to bother actually make it a matchmaking instead of a *********** RNG.

Thank you adding new map with instant death areas and never bother to fix them it adds a flavour to the game.

Thank you asking us if we want small but frequent class balance changes or big but less frequent ones and give us middle finger and choose not class balance at all option

Thank you forcing nonpvpers into pvp adding gear rewards and mats into pvp weeklies and make pvp even worse.

Thank you making dsync even worse and as always play 3 monkeys about it.

Thank you showing extreme tolerance to fly hacker and only ban him after he ruins his 1000th match since other mmo developers are short tempered and they ban hackers immediately you showed us you are backing your players

Thank you for letting wintraders and throwers get their gold this season too and special thanks for matchmaking that makes it much easier to wintrade for tanks and healers.

Thank you for not keeping your there wont be long pvp seasons promise and making very next pvp season longest one ever who needs shorter seasons anyways

Thank you keeping same class meta 3 years it would be too hard to adapt new changes.

Thank you putting gear behind boring pve grind we all needed a fresh content waiting between pops since getting a pop might take long now we wont be bored in that time.

Thank you adding a bug in new queue system so we can have upto 30 min wait times now we can watch game of thrones and some other series between pops.

Special tanks to new hutball map since now quesh hutball is not the worst map, you saved quesh hutball.

Thank you making gearing a grid and rng since who doesnt like rng.

 

But most impoprtan thing is your good run will continue in 6.0 too since class changes shows you still have no idea about pvp in this game.

Edited July 31, 2019 by omeru

[foxmob]

you're allowed to make a list (bullets or numbers). just a suggestion.

 

Thank you SWTOR dev. tream ...

Thank you asking us if we want small but frequent class balance changes or big but less frequent ones and give us middle finger and choose not class balance at all option.

 

many of your complaints, although mean spirited, are valid, imo. but the above is probably the most important from a pvp perspective.

[Floplag]

I think collectively we need to take a step back and realize that the game was resurrected and is only now starting to get renewed attention.

I believe they (meaning EA) had intended to let it die, but somewhere along the way something changed, resulting in a new expansion and renewed attention which, logically, should include these things from 6.0 onward.

Were not going to get these things pre 6.0 in any way shape or form, nor should we as there would be zero reason to make any effort to balance anything before the chances come into play.

I would suggest we perhaps try to adjust our attitudes for a short while, and try to be less toxic to encourage them to do all these things as we move ahead in 6.0 and beyond.

Just my 2 cents, which is probably all its worth.

[Rion_Starkiller]

Agree with Floplag. It's a game, if you don't have fun, then don't play. The best way to vote is with your wallet: unsubscribe. But to be fair, this game uses more than just some $****y reg warzones for balancing classes. I hate to have to tell you this, but "pure pvp'ers" are a minority in this game.

 

There will be a new class meta in 6.0. I believe there will be more changes than simply adding a few set bonuses, tacticals, and amps to the PTS.

Edited July 31, 2019 by Rion_Starkiller

[JediMasterAlex]

There will be a new class meta in 6.0. I believe there will be more changes than simply adding a few set bonuses, tacticals, and amps to the PTS.

 

I sincerely hope you're right. I'm normally an optimist when it comes to such things, but what they've revealed so far is extremely discouraging. It seems as if their combat team is completely out of touch with pvp balance.

Edited July 31, 2019 by JediMasterAlex

[DavidAtkinson]

Agree with Floplag. It's a game, if you don't have fun, then don't play. The best way to vote is with your wallet: unsubscribe. But to be fair, this game uses more than just some $****y reg warzones for balancing classes. I hate to have to tell you this, but "pure pvp'ers" are a minority in this game.

 

There will be a new class meta in 6.0. I believe there will be more changes than simply adding a few set bonuses, tacticals, and amps to the PTS.

 

I agree with your post but so far 6.0 doesn't look very promising in terms of class balance....

 

Sins look garbage, Sorcs look kinda meh, Maras are more or less the same, Jugg feels a tad stronger, while Sniper is getting some strong defenses as if they needed more. Looking forward to mercs with mass electronets and heal to full every 30 seconds....

 

So Floplag is right with his post too. The developer team doesn't seem to understand how to balance things.. If you give a class something OP, you should make sure some classes get abilities to counter them. It isn't the case with Bioware. Just look at sins... and what useless changes they are getting compared to snipers.

 

 

Honeslty I gave up long ago and just play for my own enjoyment. I have low expectations that we are going to see something "WOW" in this game, but I always give them benefit of the doubt and I'm anxiously awaiting to see what the final product will look like when it launches in septemeber.

 

To me the meta looks the same for 6.0 also so far....

 

OP, I loved your post a lot. A giggled while reading trough it.

Edited July 31, 2019 by DavidAtkinson

[Floplag]

I agree with your post but so far 6.0 doesn't look very promising in terms of class balance....

 

Sins look garbage, Sorcs look kinda meh, Maras are more or less the same, Jugg feels a tad stronger, while Sniper is getting some strong defenses as if they needed more. Looking forward to mercs with mass electronets and heal to full every 30 seconds....

 

So Floplag is right with his post too. The developer team doesn't seem to understand how to balance things.. If you give a class something OP, you should make sure some classes get abilities to counter them. It isn't the case with Bioware. Just look at sins... and what useless changes they are getting compared to snipers.

 

 

Honeslty I gave up long ago and just play for my own enjoyment. I have low expectations that we are going to see something "WOW" in this game, but I always give them benefit of the doubt and I'm anxiously awaiting to see what the final product will look like when it launches in septemeber.

 

To me the meta looks the same for 6.0 also so far....

 

OP, I loved your post a lot. A giggled while reading trough it.

 

I'm not sure why you would think that there are many changes coming with new skills and we do not yet have any idea how they will integrate or who will become stronger or weaker. WE are in fact completely guessing.

 

New expansions ALWAYS suck balance wise in the beginning, literally every game ive ever played regardless of the amount of testing done has issues at launch. Expecting proper balance at launch isnt realistic or practical as until its in the hands of the masses there is just no way to know.

 

Im excited for it myself, i think it will bring new life and energy to the game, but only if we go in with an open mind and proper expectations.

[JediMasterAlex]

I'm not sure why you would think that there are many changes coming with new skills and we do not yet have any idea how they will integrate or who will become stronger or weaker. WE are in fact completely guessing.

 

New expansions ALWAYS suck balance wise in the beginning, literally every game ive ever played regardless of the amount of testing done has issues at launch. Expecting proper balance at launch isnt realistic or practical as until its in the hands of the masses there is just no way to know.

 

Im excited for it myself, i think it will bring new life and energy to the game, but only if we go in with an open mind and proper expectations.

 

I'm not sure what you mean. We already know the new abilities, set bonuses and tacticals for 6 out of 8 classes. If you think those are going to significantly change between now and expansion launch...I think you're going to be disappointed. Furthermore, expecting them to do significant balance changes, or any balance changes really, post expansion is incredibly optimistic. Bioware has a very poor track record of listening to player feedback and making changes, especially where balance is concerned. They have also shown that they don't have any idea what proper pvp balance is like for the current game, and I don't see any reason why that should change in the next few weeks/months.

 

I was optimistic before they started releasing the new PTS stuff. I'd love to find a reason to remain optimistic, but I'm just not seeing one.

Edited July 31, 2019 by JediMasterAlex

[Rion_Starkiller]

We saw the most pvp content & changes late last year than we have ever seen in the 8 (ish) years of this game's existence, so I am not going to complain much about it. The worst thing thing that could happen, in my opinion, is if BW went back to ignoring pvp.

 

I just hope some of the stuff the devs introduced over the past year are considered to be a work-in-progress, and will continue to be improved and refined.

 

Whatever happens with set bonuses, amps, tac items... at least it will be *different*. Hopefully it is coupled with more class changes/abilities for dps shadows & all VG specs -- they could use some love.

Edited July 31, 2019 by Rion_Starkiller

[Floplag]

I'm not sure what you mean. We already know the new abilities, set bonuses and tacticals for 6 out of 8 classes. If you think those are going to significantly change between now and expansion launch...I think you're going to be disappointed. Furthermore, expecting them to do significant balance changes, or any balance changes really, post expansion is incredibly optimistic. Bioware has a very poor track record of listening to player feedback and making changes, especially where balance is concerned. They have also shown that they don't have any idea what proper pvp balance is like for the current game, and I don't see any reason why that should change in the next few weeks/months.

 

I was optimistic before they started releasing the new PTS stuff. I'd love to find a reason to remain optimistic, but I'm just not seeing one.

 

WE have zero clue how they will interact yet and i never expect balance at launch as noted. Its the difference between going in pessimistic or optimistic, im choosing the latter till i have a valid reason not to.

[JediMasterAlex]

WE have zero clue how they will interact yet and i never expect balance at launch as noted. Its the difference between going in pessimistic or optimistic, im choosing the latter till i have a valid reason not to.

 

Unless they make significant changes, which is unlikely, it's quite obvious how they will interact. Maras, snipers and ops will be even better than before, and sorcs and sins will be even worse. Juggs are the only class that got a real buff with grit teeth, assuming they fix ED to heal to full again.

 

My point is that we already have totally valid reasons to no longer be optimistic.

[alasamaya]

I would add thank you Bioware tu make my computer explode in a warzone because your amazing engine

[foxmob]

If you think those are going to significantly change between now and expansion launch...I think you're going to be disappointed.

sadly true. BW has a very bad history about making changes once the release gets to PTS.

[TrixxieTriss]

I believe they (meaning EA) had intended to let it die, but somewhere along the way something changed,

 

Just my 2 cents worth too, it was probably because Anthem was such a monumental flop

It makes you wonder what would have happened if it was a monumental success

 

Thanks Anthem for helping re-invigorate swtor

Edited August 1, 2019 by TrixxieTriss

[TrixxieTriss]

WE have zero clue how they will interact yet and i never expect balance at launch as noted. Its the difference between going in pessimistic or optimistic, im choosing the latter till i have a valid reason not to.

 

Agree, except the optimism part. I’m on the fence because of past experiences with swtor.

 

I would encourage every pvper who cares about balance to jump on the PTS to help test (when it’s back up).

If we don’t help do our part and only complain after the fact, we have no one else to blame but ourselves for not helping.

 

If we all help and they still F it up in a massive way because they don’t listen to that feed back, then that’s on them and we have every right to QQ till they fix it,

[Asaxor]

I also have 2 cents:

- the amount of new content will be pathetic, especially compared to other MMOs' expansions

- the content itself will be bugged to hell and back

- BW will take a long time to fix the most egregious bugs and not bother fixing others at all

- desync, lag, stuttering will get worse

- class imbalances will be so hilarious you will start to suspect that those devs are on drugs 24/7 , only to then remain like that for the next 4 years or until they switch off the servers

- after having "learned their lesson" that players hate rng grind, 6.0 will bring you one grind that will make all that other grind you've already brought behind you seem like child's play

- the servers will get emptier after a short resurgence to the point that both the NA servers and the 3 EU servers need to be merged to keep up any pretense of having an alive game

Edited August 1, 2019 by Asaxor

[merovejec]

Its nice to see that people DO realize the phases of the game that there was a big down time (lets call it maintanance mode) and the current phase which has a curve going up. I said it before and I will say it again, after we got Keith to lead the production things started to get much better.

 

Sure, PTS stuff is not what we might have expected, but it will bring changes to how we play the classes. The importnant thing is that they want to collect feedback and make changes. Sadly this comes in a time when many left and there is less people for this testing. I myself have a new laptop which only has a SSD drive and not enough space to download PTS so I cant even try out the stuff.

 

So anyway, I know things will get better and as it was said we somehow have to live through the time till 6.0 and provide as much feedback as possible so that the game is made in a way for us to enjoy.

[foxmob]

honestly, "how we play the classes" is the least important thing about any update or xpack to me.

 

I want new content and balance updates.

 

rearranging pyro and AP was just silly. there was a rationale to it (designated dot and burst/aoe specs clearly defined), but for me, learning how to play your class all over again is like making a movie with the camera on a red herring the whole time and then in the last scene, revealing the true villain as someone who received no characterization throughout the first 90 minutes of a 100-minute movie. I mean...ok. I guess you got me. I didn't see it coming, but then again, watching Finn and that new girl and Poe run around on hamster wheels that had literally zero impact on the plot of the movie for 75% of the screen time was ultimately deflating.

 

changing core game mechanics is just the least interesting thing in the world to me. it's not new content. it's just a transparent distraction or stall tactic that prevents you from jumping into new content. new maps, FPs, and Ops. more balance changes. don't rely on new abilities or core class mechanics for your "content." iunno. obviously others enjoy thinking through their class for the perfect roto. to me, it's just the last thing I want to do when I leave work and jump into a video game.

[Severith]

Its nice to see that people DO realize the phases of the game that there was a big down time (lets call it maintanance mode) and the current phase which has a curve going up. I said it before and I will say it again, after we got Keith to lead the production things started to get much better.

 

Sure, PTS stuff is not what we might have expected, but it will bring changes to how we play the classes. The importnant thing is that they want to collect feedback and make changes. Sadly this comes in a time when many left and there is less people for this testing. I myself have a new laptop which only has a SSD drive and not enough space to download PTS so I cant even try out the stuff.

 

So anyway, I know things will get better and as it was said we somehow have to live through the time till 6.0 and provide as much feedback as possible so that the game is made in a way for us to enjoy.

 

Saying they want to collect feedback and make changes is different than collecting feedback and making changes. What's on the PTS is what's going to be in 6.0, with hopefully some bug fixes.

 

I think the business model that's being used at Bioware is a 2 month sub expectation. They want people to sub for a few months, buy some cartel armor, and then move on after they realize this isn't a quality product. They rely on the Star Wars IP and the "Old Bioware Magic" to draw people in, and they require a "expansion" every now and again to prove to people that the game is still going. But it's not really going. It's just a corpse being poked at with a stick.

[Floplag]

Unless they make significant changes, which is unlikely, it's quite obvious how they will interact. Maras, snipers and ops will be even better than before, and sorcs and sins will be even worse. Juggs are the only class that got a real buff with grit teeth, assuming they fix ED to heal to full again.

 

My point is that we already have totally valid reasons to no longer be optimistic.

 

Until we see all of them, together, in all game modes, were guessing. Yes, we know what were getting, and yes we can make some educated inferences from it, but we all know the same skills in the hands of some players map very differently than others.

There are a million mercs out there right now, most arent very good. We will see a million maras and snipers in 6.0, most will again likely not be that great.

As said until i see the full width of it, im trying to maintain a sense of optimism. You are welcome to take whatever view you see fit but I play these games for fun and a bit of escapism, if i wanted super serious competition i would be playing the same garbage FOTM games as the cool kids... but im here.

[Floplag]

Agree, except the optimism part. I’m on the fence because of past experiences with swtor.

 

I would encourage every pvper who cares about balance to jump on the PTS to help test (when it’s back up).

If we don’t help do our part and only complain after the fact, we have no one else to blame but ourselves for not helping.

 

If we all help and they still F it up in a massive way because they don’t listen to that feed back, then that’s on them and we have every right to QQ till they fix it,

 

All I will say is dont expect balance day 1, you are literally kidding yourself. No game ever has ever had that with a new release, not one i can think of. 6.0 will have balance issues, accept that now and expect them to fix it for 6.1. Anything else simply isnt realistic in any game, let alone this one where balance passes have been slow at best. I think that will change with the renewed attention, but we all know the history.

[Floplag]

Just my 2 cents worth too, it was probably because Anthem was such a monumental flop

It makes you wonder what would have happened if it was a monumental success

 

Thanks Anthem for helping re-invigorate swtor

 

I think they were far too late to market for anthem to be anything but a failure. IF it had been, SWTOR would probably be shut down or left in maintenance mode Hades, but i for one never thought that was ever going to happen.

Frankly even if they were first to market, it would have probably already blown over. The shooter market is the worst kind of meme any more, look how fast these games change places these days, PUBG basically already dead and they are all waiting on whatever the next Fortnite clone will be.

Meanwhile, the MMO market is still strong as heck and being completely ignored by tthe big names in favor of quick bucks on a myriad of shooter clones and micro-transactions.

WoW BFA was a disaster but its still the market leader, Final Fantasy, ESO, Guild Wars... all doing well, but none will ever be what WoW was or what the rotating Fortnite clones are as they dont have as broad appeal. This game could still be huge if EA would only support it and make a few intelligent decisions.

[Rion_Starkiller]

I also have 2 cents:

- the amount of new content will be pathetic, especially compared to other MMOs' expansions

- the content itself will be bugged to hell and back

- BW will take a long time to fix the most egregious bugs and not bother fixing others at all

- desync, lag, stuttering will get worse

- class imbalances will be so hilarious you will start to suspect that those devs are on drugs 24/7 , only to then remain like that for the next 4 years or until they switch off the servers

- after having "learned their lesson" that players hate rng grind, 6.0 will bring you one grind that will make all that other grind you've already brought behind you seem like child's play

- the servers will get emptier after a short resurgence to the point that both the NA servers and the 3 EU servers need to be merged to keep up any pretense of having an alive game

 

This might be exactly how 6.0 goes down. SWTOR is like a wilted plant or flower. You can choose to give up and throw it away, or yell at it like "WHY AREN'T YOU GROWING YOU POS?", or you can try to nourish it and hope for it to bloom again.

 

Ultimately, I think the problem is getting EA to invest in an 8 year old game. I believe the devs are doing the best they can with the resources they have.

[Floplag]

I will never understand why people play a game or invest time in talking about something they clearly hate.

Plenty of fish in the sea so to speak, and life is just too darned short.

[TrixxieTriss]

All I will say is dont expect balance day 1, you are literally kidding yourself. No game ever has ever had that with a new release, not one i can think of. 6.0 will have balance issues, accept that now and expect them to fix it for 6.1. Anything else simply isnt realistic in any game, let alone this one where balance passes have been slow at best. I think that will change with the renewed attention, but we all know the history.

 

No, I don’t expect it to be perfect. But if things are tested and feed back given and they completely ignore it, then Bioware are fully to blame if it’s out of balance too much.

But if we totally leave it up to them and don’t test or provide feed back and they get it wrong, that’s partially on us.

We all know Bioware can’t do this by themselves, they literally have zero idea how to test balance in pvp on their own.

Only when pvpers play/test changes does it reveal weaknesses and strengths as tactics and strategy are developed.

Over the years Bioware haven’t used the PTS to test changes or ask for feed back on balancing. So all of those balance issues are on Bioware. We all QQ’d and raged at them for good reason because the changes went live and they still didn’t listen.

Now they are using the PTS and if pvpers are too lazy or don’t care enough to test it properly, then people who don’t test have less credibility if they QQ about balance. They need to be part of the solution and not part of the problem.

Edited August 2, 2019 by TrixxieTriss