TrixxieTriss Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 I despise the idea of ratings decay. I'm cool with it if it only applies to top 3 titles, but to hold everyone else's high score hostage is fascist AF. What about tier brackets with rating decay and only the highest tier has decay. Ie top 100 or 200. Also, if you reach one of the below tiers, your ELO won’t go back below it. You have a starting tier, low tier, medium tier and high tier. Once you reach a tier, that is the bracket of players you should be mostly playing again. If you rise to the top of that bracket and get into the next one, that is the bracket of player you are mostly against and so on. If you reach the top tier, then you still stay in that bracket to play against those people, but your get rating decay against them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediMasterAlex Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 What about tier brackets with rating decay and only the highest tier has decay. Ie top 100 or 200. Also, if you reach one of the below tiers, your ELO won’t go back below it. You have a starting tier, low tier, medium tier and high tier. Once you reach a tier, that is the bracket of players you should be mostly playing again. If you rise to the top of that bracket and get into the next one, that is the bracket of player you are mostly against and so on. If you reach the top tier, then you still stay in that bracket to play against those people, but your get rating decay against them. Or, everyone decays, but you still get rewards for your highest earned rating. So if you get to 1500, then stop playing and decay down to 1200, you'd still get gold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrixxieTriss Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Or, everyone decays, but you still get rewards for your highest earned rating. So if you get to 1500, then stop playing and decay down to 1200, you'd still get gold. Or that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bladech Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Uh huh I queue on 4 or 5 toons (though I queue on my main the vast majority of the time), not 10-18, and none of them are below 1300. What you described is functionally indistinguishable from wintrading. You conspired with a group of people to queue sync and boost a certain player's rating. Even if the execution was slightly different from traditional wintrading, the intent and the results were the same. So even if you insist on saying it's not wintrading, which I would still classify it as, it is obviously just as odious. Qsync was never a wintrading or against rulles. Many just used fact that one of factions is low populated and queue together so what? In our case it is not even qsync because we could not predict that we 100% get in one team. Boosting one guy elo is not against rulles as soon as it is not wintrading and you again called this wintrading which makes me remind you every time that it is not WINTRADING. There are tonnes of abuses of poor matchmaking systems. Dot classes seeking to queue when tanks are queueing since their specs are good in tanks games and worse in heal games, marauders seeking heal games because their class is good with healer but squishy in full dps fights. Often they either monitor the queue or ask their skilled friends to queue healer or tanks even though they are not asking them to throw for them. Or they might ask their friends about info on who is queueing, is there any wintrader, hacker is playing etc. This poor solo ranked structure and its poor matchmaking based on elo allows players to cooperate even without wintrading. We continue to do what we do and iam more than sure such things are not punishable. It is time that occured long ago for highrated players to compensate dumb elo matchmaking system which unfairly punished us. And this is not wintrading. No matter how you will try to call cake as a chocolate bar, they will remain different even though intent is the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Qsync was never a wintrading or against rulles. Many just used fact that one of factions is low populated and queue together so what? In our case it is not even qsync because we could not predict that we 100% get in one team. Boosting one guy elo is not against rulles as soon as it is not wintrading and you again called this wintrading which makes me remind you every time that it is not WINTRADING. There are tonnes of abuses of poor matchmaking systems. Dot classes seeking to queue when tanks are queueing since their specs are good in tanks games and worse in heal games, marauders seeking heal games because their class is good with healer but squishy in full dps fights. Often they either monitor the queue or ask their skilled friends to queue healer or tanks even though they are not asking them to throw for them. Or they might ask their friends about info on who is queueing, is there any wintrader, hacker is playing etc. This poor solo ranked structure and its poor matchmaking based on elo allows players to cooperate even without wintrading. We continue to do what we do and iam more than sure such things are not punishable. It is time that occured long ago for highrated players to compensate dumb elo matchmaking system which unfairly punished us. And this is not wintrading. No matter how you will try to call cake as a chocolate bar, they will remain different even though intent is the same. Poor matchmaking is solely because of population. Matchmaking needs a good base to work properly, and we’ve never had that. Furthermore if you have to q sync to win, why not just do group? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediMasterAlex Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Boosting one guy elo is not against rulles Mike B, please investigate this person's account for wintrading. He shouldn't be allowed to play ranked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zurules Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Qsync was never a wintrading or against rulles. Many just used fact that one of factions is low populated and queue together so what? In our case it is not even qsync because we could not predict that we 100% get in one team. Boosting one guy elo is not against rulles as soon as it is not wintrading and you again called this wintrading which makes me remind you every time that it is not WINTRADING. Queuing on one faction or the other, even in the past when they were separate, is not cheating in anyway. As you said, in solo queue you cannot choose your team ever. But as soon as someone decides to "boost" any one other than themselves, then you are cheating as you are not trying to win for yourself , but are trying for someone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediMasterAlex Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 But as soon as someone decides to "boost" any one other than themselves, then you are cheating as you are not trying to win for yourself , but are trying for someone else. Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omeru Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 You let fly hacker do his hacking 7-8 months and finally perma banned him, great job so what about botter in DM is he untouchabke as he claims? Why didnt you perma banned him since he ruined thousands of games in DM. Resetting his rating is not enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxmob Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Or, everyone decays, but you still get rewards for your highest earned rating. So if you get to 1500, then stop playing and decay down to 1200, you'd still get gold. that's fine. brackets are already based on high score (unless something's changed since last I played), but my point is that if I go away for a month or 2 (in an impossibly long 6-12 month "season" in which maybe 30 players regularly play!), I don't want my rating to decay from like 1400 to 1300. I understand that if I'm in contention for a top 3 title, it should decay so that I cannot sit on a rating (top 3 is based on current rating rather than highest rating). but don't thrust that stipulation on 90% of the player base just to catch the 10% doing it. /2cents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediMasterAlex Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 that's fine. brackets are already based on high score (unless something's changed since last I played), but my point is that if I go away for a month or 2 (in an impossibly long 6-12 month "season" in which maybe 30 players regularly play!), I don't want my rating to decay from like 1400 to 1300. I understand that if I'm in contention for a top 3 title, it should decay so that I cannot sit on a rating (top 3 is based on current rating rather than highest rating). but don't thrust that stipulation on 90% of the player base just to catch the 10% doing it. /2cents A few things. First, they could make it so you only decay above a certain rating, such as 1200, or maybe 1300. That way if you get to 1400, then decay, the lowest you would go is 1300. Second, Overwatch has a system where when you decay, you retain your hidden elo. So if you get to 3400 and decay all the way to 3000, where it stops, your hidden elo is still 3400, and it still puts you into 3400 games. And because your actual rating is only 3000, you gain a lot more elo when you win in those 3400 games, so you can climb back close to where you were a lot faster than normal. I guess that wouldn't really work so well in swtor, because everyone is still in the same games, but perhaps they could have a mechanic that would increase your rating for a few games after you've decayed a lot. Generally, I can understand the objection, but rating decay would lead to far more accurate leaderboards, even beyond the top 3. So many people just get lucky in their first 30 games and end up with pretty high ratings. It would be nice if the leaderboards actually reflected who was playing the game well consistently instead. And really, what would be so bad about decaying from 1400 to 1300? You'd still retain silver, and if you were good enough to get to 1400 originally, you should be good enough to climb back to it. And if you were willing to not play long enough to decay that far, then I would guess that climbing can't really be that important to you anyway. I do agree that the seasons should be shorter as Musco promised. Anyway, many other games use rating decay. I think it would really help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxmob Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 I think a minimum games played requirement for any top 3 placements (top 20, imo) is all that is necessary. if you're super serious about it, then go nuts with 200 games. w/e. I'd like to see the number for tiers raised to a minimum of 50. and for the love of all that is good and holy, make the tokens legacy so ppl can ply their whole stable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediMasterAlex Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 I think a minimum games played requirement for any top 3 placements (top 20, imo) is all that is necessary. if you're super serious about it, then go nuts with 200 games. w/e. I'd like to see the number for tiers raised to a minimum of 50. They should do both, but I agree that a minimum number of games for different tiers is the more important of the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrixxieTriss Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 But as soon as someone decides to "boost" any one other than themselves, then you are cheating as you are not trying to win for yourself , but are trying for someone else. Exactly. Wether it’s wintading or not, it is still cheating Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrixxieTriss Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 that's fine. brackets are already based on high score (unless something's changed since last I played), but my point is that if I go away for a month or 2 (in an impossibly long 6-12 month "season" in which maybe 30 players regularly play!), I don't want my rating to decay from like 1400 to 1300. I understand that if I'm in contention for a top 3 title, it should decay so that I cannot sit on a rating (top 3 is based on current rating rather than highest rating). but don't thrust that stipulation on 90% of the player base just to catch the 10% doing it. /2cents I think the issue isn’t so much the decay, it’s the length of the seasons. Decay would be less of an issue in 3 month seasons with 1 month preseasons in-between to get new blood into ranked. (I like getting new people to try ranked or get old ones back and pre-season is the best way I can think of for doing that). I’m not the best ranked player, so I’m not sure if I’m right in my assessment of what’s best. But I do think that we need some sort of decay and a type of ELO with different brackets for people to work towards. Maybe it’s just enough for the top bracket to have decay or maybe with a shorter season, it wouldn’t be as detrimental for all brackets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merovejec Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 Qsync was never a wintrading or against rulles. Many just used fact that one of factions is low populated and queue together so what? In our case it is not even qsync because we could not predict that we 100% get in one team. Boosting one guy elo is not against rulles as soon as it is not wintrading and you again called this wintrading which makes me remind you every time that it is not WINTRADING. There are tonnes of abuses of poor matchmaking systems. Dot classes seeking to queue when tanks are queueing since their specs are good in tanks games and worse in heal games, marauders seeking heal games because their class is good with healer but squishy in full dps fights. Often they either monitor the queue or ask their skilled friends to queue healer or tanks even though they are not asking them to throw for them. Or they might ask their friends about info on who is queueing, is there any wintrader, hacker is playing etc. rofl, I mean, you are saying you boost a player and its OK? You say you que all in one faction to be together??? This is clearly cheating, its people like you who make ranked what it is today, full of cheating and manipulation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merovejec Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 I think a minimum games played requirement for any top 3 placements (top 20, imo) is all that is necessary. if you're super serious about it, then go nuts with 200 games. w/e. I'd like to see the number for tiers raised to a minimum of 50. and for the love of all that is good and holy, make the tokens legacy so ppl can ply their whole stable Heh just check Group ranked ratings, if like gold tier will be 1750 its ridiculous that people will get top 3 reward with 1500 rating :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrixxieTriss Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 (edited) I just found this while reading reddit. Blizzard is trialing a system that shuts down pvp matches in Overwatch when cheating is detected. It apparently also looks at matches retroactively and if cheating is detected in those matches, it adjusts people ratings based on the fact the match would have been cancelled. Or https://www.pcgamesn.com/overwatch/new-anti-cheat-system?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app (If you don’t want to watch the YouTube) It also announces why the match was stopped. Edited July 16, 2019 by TrixxieTriss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merovejec Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 I just found this while reading reddit. Blizzard is trialing a system that shuts down pvp matches in Overwatch when cheating is detected. It apparently also looks at matches retroactively and if cheating is detected in those matches, it adjusts people ratings based on the fact the match would have been cancelled. It also announces why the match was stopped. One mechanism which I like from other games for example is that rated/ranked matches are not accesible at certain times. Like I cannot play rated matches in WoW when its morning in my timezone. This is a good way to avoid cheating as people cannot sync que or bot during times when noone else is in que. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrixxieTriss Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 One mechanism which I like from other games for example is that rated/ranked matches are not accesible at certain times. Like I cannot play rated matches in WoW when its morning in my timezone. This is a good way to avoid cheating as people cannot sync que or bot during times when noone else is in que. That works if you have regional servers, but for a global game in only two locations, it would exclude players because they don’t live in those regions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bladech Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 (edited) Queuing on one faction or the other, even in the past when they were separate, is not cheating in anyway. As you said, in solo queue you cannot choose your team ever. But as soon as someone decides to "boost" any one other than themselves, then you are cheating as you are not trying to win for yourself , but are trying for someone else. Indeed thats why i try to win in all cases. Either iam against my friend or in his team. We just queue on characters that we more get in one team rather than in separate. You can boost someone even by trying to win in all cases so it is not wintrading.Welcome to unfair matchmaking system based on elo. Something you can never prove or make to be against rulles ( in the end only player decides which character and when to play it as soon as he isn't loosing on purpose) Edited July 16, 2019 by bladech Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bladech Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 Mike B, please investigate this person's account for wintrading. He shouldn't be allowed to play ranked. Good luck. Wont happen ever since i did NOTHING against rulles. No wintrade no hack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki_ Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 (edited) You have been talking about these changes for months yet achieved nothing.. still only taking the same punishment actions that have been in place since launch. : Games still pop 3v4 : Traders still que tanks at early and later hours to win trade : Que still freezes when it decides it wants to wait for a tank or healer to be matched up against another while 20-30 dps wait in que and dont get pop Years of this .. and its still the same .. but at least you published some reports .. go u.. perhaps if you make it into some graphs and slide shows it will dazzle people a bit more while you still do nothing Edited July 16, 2019 by Loki_ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merovejec Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 So any words on this? Players will no longer be able to gain an extra, unintended 15 ranked rating in certain situations. I dont suppose you will remove that rating from players who have gotten it, or? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediMasterAlex Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 You can boost someone even by trying to win in all cases so it is not wintrading. You can boost someone even by trying to win You can boost someone boost someone(bold added for emphasis) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts