VelvetSanity Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Basically this. While a small group may have enjoyed the Alliance narrative, the rest of us were sat stuck with something we didn't like, waiting to go back to our factions or get back to the conflict that mattered. During the entirety of KotFE and KotET we didn't get any choice to go back to the Empire or Republic either, we didn't get a story that suited our playstyle. Some people say they're "forced" into a narrative they don't like. Well, welcome to our world, we had that for the entirety of KotFE and KotET. We were forced into the Alliance with absolutely no option or ability to escape it or go back to our factions. But the difference here is that more players felt that way than there were those who liked the Alliance. What do I base that on? The fact the devs are backtracking now and are returning to the Empire vs Republic narrative with the Alliance slowly disappearing. KotFE and KotET simply got so much criticism, that it became evident to the devs it wasn't the story that majority of the players wanted. As long as they can pull it off in a way that feels organic and works for the majority of characters with all their myriad potential motivations, I’m all for the alliance going away. But I have doubts that they can pull it off properly and maintain a cohesive narrative, given just how nonsensical KOTFE/KOTET is for the non force using characters. A quality, cohesive story regardless of the direction it takes is what I prefer, and to do that, they need a logical means of tying up all the loose ends that are present in the current situation. Unfortunately, they’ll most likely handwave away everything instead of giving us a proper transition that makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardrossan Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Basically this. While a small group may have enjoyed the Alliance narrative. A small group you say? But according to OP, half, or at least a third of the playerbase is with him! How can you both be right?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ylliarus Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 A small group you say? But according to OP, half, or at least a third of the playerbase is with him! How can you both be right?? I don't know what the OP is basing it on, but I am basing it on what I have seen people say on social media, Youtube channels, SWTOR's reddit forum, these forums, some of the Discord servers I am in and the fact the devs had deemed it more profitable to return to the Empire vs Republic narrative. Because if that wasn't what majority of the playerbase had wanted, they would have continued the Alliance narrative in KotFE and KotET. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerixy Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 A small group you say? But according to OP, half, or at least a third of the playerbase is with him! How can you both be right?? I didn't mind the story line to be honest, the only issue's I had is it was 1 story line for all and it was single player. I'm the leader of a large guild on the Malgus server and we took a big hit in memeber losses at the time of the first expansion, none of them where because of the story line it self, most was due to the command crate gearing, and some because they could no longer work through the story together as a team. The story was not bad but it did have little replayability for those with alts. I do like my alliance though but I understand why we are going back to the simpler side of things with Rep vs Imp and not adding a 3rd faction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Costello Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Well we had the traitor arc but that was just as bad if not worse than FE/ET. Yeah. Though they all suffered from the same issue where the player is just a hapless stooge, while the story revolves around others who are smarter and more capable. A single Horizon guard finds out more about the gravestone and manages to use it to its full potential to wipe out the eternal fleet in seconds in the same of what 6 months while the player spent chapter after chapter learning nothing about it and being lead around by SCORPIO in some failed attempt to find some way to counter the fleet. Though of course there is the being lead around by Valkorian, Theran and any number of others that make demands on the player such as planting bombs around Zakuul which didn't really seem to have any point or saving refugees which didn't seem to have any point, or capturing Gemini prime which didn't seem to have any point other than to help SCORPIO betray you. I imagine you could take out about half the chapters and it wouldn't overly change the narrative of the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarlegant Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 It’s been pointed out that many subs were lost during our Zakuul chapters, but’s it’s also save to say so many more were lost well before KotFE/ET. Using that analogy, we could say the pub vs imp storyline is fail too. For one little while there during KotFE i was playing an mmo, I was improving my main and my legacy alts, and building an alliance base, recruiting people, increasing various depts, and running raids. Suddenly it was all action, a side story of a little nutso girl abused by her daddy, and I ended up on a throne. Too bad so sad the eternal fleet was one shot... it was the eternal fleet, not the infinite fleet, there couldn’t be that much left of it anyway. But BEFORE that, on Iokath, it’s nonsense that either pub or imp would challenge the eternal throne. Timelines are important. At that point, I have no clue why Lana is sneaking around, like we’re some little alliance. We’ve already been there, captured, escaped, point is we don’t need recon, we take it or bombard it to dust. What’s this nonsense zakuul decides to be independent... maybe my light side toons give it up... my darksiders would get hand cramps from force choking those fools. It’s ok, we’re right back where we started... the Sith are once again destroying worlds, which turns out to be some little colony... which ever side you played, nothing is built, it’s just destroyed, As usual, the empire acts, and the pub reacts... The game shrinks because it’s the same story told repeatedly.. infinite empire, rakata, the star forge, gree, iokath,, all ancient empires... side stories, we need crystals from Ilum, isotopes from makeb, herbs from quesh, tech from iokath.. all good, I get it... so how did a little colony on ossus get a chapter... I just whipped the 3 most powerful force users ever known, dad, son, and daughter... I could take a shuttle to DK, sneak in the back door, again, and make short work of the sith council... really, you think a small colony on ossus is a problem. Flip the script, which core world is safe for senators to hide on. Sure sure,.. let’s play the little game again, because a hundred servers didn’t shrink down to a dozen the first time we played imp vs pub. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IoNonSoEVero Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) I don't know what the OP is basing it on, but I am basing it on what I have seen people say on social media, Youtube channels, SWTOR's reddit forum, these forums, some of the Discord servers I am in and the fact the devs had deemed it more profitable to return to the Empire vs Republic narrative. Because if that wasn't what majority of the playerbase had wanted, they would have continued the Alliance narrative in KotFE and KotET. I'll just respectfully point out that what the devs do does not necessarily reflect what the player base asks for or wants. Cases in point: 1. Conquest changes. 2. The new gearing system. 3. The NiM Gods from the Machine. The devs actually came right out and said that the only reason this exists is because one of the devs - not the playerbase - wanted it to exist. 4. Companions being bricked or otherwise leaving. 5. LIs not receiving screen time. 6. PCs not being able to openly support the other faction or switch. 7. Another ham-fisted attempt to get people to play Ops by tacking one onto Iokath and not letting it be abandoned for over a year. They did NOT have good feedback from their attempt to do this on Oricon, and I'm sure they also had the data from Yavin 4 on how many players chose the dailies vs. the Op to complete SoR, but they went for it again. The devs have listened to the playerbase in some cases (for instance the changes they made to the Rishi stronghold), but the fact that something is done in the game doesn't mean it's what most people want; it just reflects what they want to do. Edited January 17, 2019 by IoNonSoEVero Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AureliaSulis Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) And yet... Jedi Under Siege has been the most popular and most appreciated storyline since KotFE and KotET had been released. It is no secret that the storyline of 5.10 is widely considered to be a great new step in the overall SWTOR narrative. Time and time again you see it confirmed that a vast majority of players have really liked Jedi Under Siege. You see it on the social media sites, you see it on Reddit, you see it ingame, you see it on these forums. Yes, the gearing changes are heavily criticised, but the story is praised. So I am very sorry to say it, but evidently the people who have disliked Jedi Under Siege and the direction it introduces are the minority in this case. I am sorry that you did not like the story, but this is the direction that pleases most of the playerbase. You can call it stupid, you can call it unfair, but it is what it is. Bioware doesn't have the resources to cater to your specific story wishes, or that of a small group of players. It's the same how Bioware won't establish a canon choice in regards to Acina or Malcom, the group of people wanting that is too small to cater just to them. And yet again Ylliarus rushes in complete with her armoury of sweeping statements. Edited January 17, 2019 by AureliaSulis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majspuffen Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 The game shrinks because it’s the same story told repeatedly.. infinite empire, rakata, the star forge, gree, iokath,, all ancient empires... side stories, we need crystals from Ilum, isotopes from makeb, herbs from quesh, tech from iokath.. all good, I get it... so how did a little colony on ossus get a chapter... I just whipped the 3 most powerful force users ever known, dad, son, and daughter... I could take a shuttle to DK, sneak in the back door, again, and make short work of the sith council... really, you think a small colony on ossus is a problem. Flip the script, which core world is safe for senators to hide on. Don't you see how this is a problem? How could they continue to build on the narrative after they had us kill the most powerful person in the galaxy? In a single-player game, this would have been it. The game would have ended. But MMORPGs do not simply end. This reset is jarring, but not uncommon and, arguably, much needed. Where else could the story go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ylliarus Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 And yet again Ylliarus rushes in complete with her armoury of sweeping statements. Well, I'm just not blind to the commentary out there. Some people here have chosen to ignore the feedback that doesn't coincide with their own feelings towards Jedi Under Siege or the return to Empire vs Republic. But no matter how hard they may be in denial, the fact is the return to that narrative is widely appreciated by the playerbase. All it takes is looking at the media and forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MandFlurry Posted January 18, 2019 Author Share Posted January 18, 2019 It is definitely something i have seen on Reddit, where a lot of people do not see how it makes any sense, going from the most powerful to a another useless soldier for a faction to use as it's poster boy/girl. I usually never have gone to Reddit but i know the devs, have gotten the message from others to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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